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TM7

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"Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« on: November 20, 2010, 11:52:09 AM »
Well, another year has come and many folks still wonder about the JFK assassination ...Nov.23, 1963...I was sitting in Science class when the school was shut down and we all went home.....the nation was in shock (and awe).

Now there is a book, "Lee and Me, How I came to Know, Love, and Lose Lee Harvey Oswald" by Judyth Vary Baker

Now here is a different take opn the whole sordid saga by Lee's girl friend living in exile, Judyth Vary Baker.

Her story told on video:    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJrCOXNWtdo

The Real Lee Harvey Oswald
November 18, 2010

 
by Rollin Stearns
for henrymakow.com
 
A remarkable new book sheds startling light on Lee Harvey Oswald and the JFK assassination Nov 22, 1963. 

The book is  "Lee and Me: How I came to Know, Love and Lose Lee Harvey Oswald"  by Oswald's girlfriend, Judyth Vary Baker.
 
Once you read it, you'll never think of Oswald the same way. Far from an assassin,  he sacrificed his life trying to protect the President: a President who tried to break free from the grip of the Illuminati.
 
BAKER'S STORY
 
Judyth Vary had a dream, to find a cure for cancer.  So when other kids in high school were going out for sports and cheer leading, she honed her biology skills with the help of a dedicated teacher.   Her research won her state-wide prizes and offers of prestigious scholarships.
 
It also brought her into contact with Dr. Alton Ochsner, head of the Ochsner Clinic in New Orleans. Unknown to Baker, Ochsner was working with the CIA on a plan to kill Castro. The plan was to develop a "galloping" cancer virus that would kill its victim within weeks. Under the guise of medical treatment, it would be injected into Castro.
 

In the spring of 1963 Judyth was in college, hoping to go on to medical school. Dr. Ochsner  invited her to work at his clinic under his assistant Dr. Mary Sherman. In the fall, she could go to Tulane Medical School, and her tuition paid in full.
 
She arrived in New Orleans in April 1963, alone and poor, but with high hopes.  It was then that -- seemingly by accident -- she met a young man named Lee Oswald, who was able to help her.

It's clear in retrospect that it was no accident. Oswald, a low-level asset of the intelligence community, had been assigned to contact her and to be her "control."
 
Once Judyth started working for Dr. Sherman, she learned she was part of the covert government program aimed at killing Castro.
 
By then she was emotionally dependent on Lee. They had much in common and soon their friendship turned into a love affair.
 
Oswald confided to her that he worked for U.S. intelligence. He was in New Orleans for the summer to pretend to be a pro-Castro activist, in order to gain credibility with the Cuban government.
 
He was part of the plan to assassinate Castro. His job would be to "defect" again, this time to Cuba, and take the fast-acting cancer cells with him. Once there, he would make contact with someone who would pass them on to a doctor who treated Castro.
 
All that summer the covert project went forward. Much of the work was done not at the Ochsner Clinic but at the apartment of a strange man named David Ferrie. Like Oswald, he was an intelligence asset working in the anti-Castro cause.
 
Through Ferrie and Oswald, Judyth got to meet many other strange people. including Jack Rubenstein ( aka Jack Ruby. )
 
By the end of the summer, they had developed a strain of "galloping" cancer and had tested it on monkeys as well as mice. All that remained was to test it on humans.
 
Judyth was told it would be tested on a terminally ill volunteer. But later she learned he was a healthy man, a mental patient who had no idea what would happen to him. He was injected with the virus and rapidly died. Judyth suspected there were others like him.
 
She was sickened. This was murder, not medicine. But summer was over and so was her part in the project. Oswald would now leave for Mexico, to make arrangements for carrying the cancer cells to Cuba. But instead of things coming to a close, they began to unravel.
 
Oswald became convinced that behind the plan to assassinate Castro was a plot to assassinate President Kennedy, a man he admired. He also realized his role in New Orleans -- pretending to be pro-Castro -- could set him up to be a patsy.
 
While he was in Mexico, he and Judyth remained in contact, through an elaborate phone arrangement with David Ferrie. When his mission fell through for mysterious reasons, Oswald became more convinced than ever that there was an anti-Kennedy plot.
 
He talked of divorcing Marina; he and Judyth would marry and live in Mexico once all this was over. But it was a forlorn hope. Oswald said he could not leave yet; he had to go on, in the hope that he could protect the President.
 
The rest is history. It's possible that Oswald was able to thwart an assassination planned to take place in Chicago, but in Dallas the story was different. When Kennedy was killed, Oswald was arrested almost immediately.
 
Denied a lawyer, held incommunicado except when he was moved from one location to another, he was shot by Ruby, the friend he had known since he was a boy. He was the first person to die live on TV. Judyth was watching.
 
She got a call from Ferrie. He told her to lie low, to be "a vanilla girl." She must forget about a career in science. Her name must never appear in the newspapers. With luck, she would escape with her life. We must never speak to each other again, he said, and hung up.
 
DENOUEMENT
 
A few months later, Dr. Mary Sherman was brutally murdered in her apartment, the day before she was scheduled to appear before the Warren Commission. The case was never solved.
 
Shortly after Jack Ruby won AN appeal for a retrial, he came down with cancer. He said he had recently been injected with something by the prison doctor. He was dead within weeks.
 
The next month -- just days after Jim Garrison's investigation was announced in the New Orleans papers -- Ferrie was found dead in his apartment. Also found were two different suicide notes, both typed, both unsigned.
 
Alton Ochsner, a man of strong convictions and perhaps an equally strong willingness to sacrifice others for them, died full of honors, in 1981, at the age of 85.
 
Judyth Vary Baker followed Ferrie's advice. She lay low. She stayed silent. She gave up any hope of a medical career. She raised a family and never told anyone about Lee or her life in New Orleans, until after her youngest daughter had married.
 
Her book, which is exhaustively documented and filled with fascinating detail, is unsparingly honest about herself and free of rancor or blame. She now lives (some say) somewhere in Scandinavia.

The world has been turned upside down. Good men are called assassins and murdered while the real assassins bask in glory.

Offline billy_56081

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2010, 12:07:13 PM »
The whole story.
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Offline Empty Quiver

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2010, 03:54:22 PM »
Is there any conspiracy you will not cheerlead, TM7?

I am working under the assumption you don't get paid to pimp all these theories. How do you find the time?
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Offline Dee

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2010, 02:17:25 AM »
I remember exactly where I was, and the friend's name that told me: The president has just been shot. A big deal? You bet it was! I also remember all the ceremony here just 50 miles north of Dallas that went on for the next several days, and the closed schools in respect of the event.
This is one of the biggest "whodunit" epics of known history, at least here in the United States,  and I doubt anyone will ever know the "real truth". Speculation has gone on in this part of the country for decades, and is now I suppose, dying out with those of us who lived the era, and actually lived in the area.
I can see the interest in such a book as this lady's, and looking at it from yet another angle, or direction. It is much like the UNCIVIL War. It is filled with fascinating stories, events, and theories. I have personally always felt that LBJ was involved, and remember what an arrogant, disrespecting SOB he was. I have listened to tapes of him trying to flirt with Jackie in a most crude way, over the phone years after the assassination. They were actually played on TV after his (LBJ's) death. LBJ was an ambitious, wealthy ass, that would run over anyone to get what he wanted. Thank him by the way, for the over 53,000 deaths in Vietnam.
Although TM and I disagree on many things, I can most certainly see how this particular book could be of interest to anyone, in regards to that event in 1963.
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Offline AtlLaw

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2010, 04:34:16 AM »
+1 on everything Dee said.

As an aside, there are events that everyone remembers exactly where they were when the event happened.  For an earlier generation it was Pearl Harbor.  For my generation it was JFK's assasination (I was home on leave and heard it on my car radio).  For this generation (and those of us still alive from the former) it is 9/11.

I also can see how this book could be of interest to some.
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Offline elhoward622

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2010, 08:05:30 AM »
Well, TM and I don't agree on much, but man do I like a good JFK conspiracy story.  I think it is possibly the most interesting topic in US History.  That is the best thing is that there are so many possibilities and so many loopholes in the JFK story.  I don't know about the iluminati thing, but it is hard to believe that Oswald did it by himself.  As much as I am a non conspiracy theorist the evidence against the lone gunman is just too, too much.  Like TM said, worn out military gun, moving target, two perfect shots...hard to believe.  IMHO the mob ties look pretty convincing considering Robert Kennedy's track against the mob.

Offline BBF

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2010, 09:40:29 AM »
I was stationed in Germany at that time. Everybody checked out their rifle from the Armory and packed our combat gear.
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Offline GatCat

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2010, 03:12:36 AM »
Guys, guys, guys.....
It is the most investigated crime in modern history. ALL evidence points to one conclusion. The shot was simple enough, I would think that 9 out of a random 10 who read GBO could duplicate the shooting, if they remained cool. It might be fun to "what if" the incident, but facts are facts.
Fact based books by Gerald Postum ( SP ?? ), Mark Fuhrman ( a good enough investigator to put a "Kennedy" in prison ), and Vince Bugliosi, all reach the same conclusion. Forensic duplication of the shooting shows it was simple enough. LHO shooting Officer Tibbits cannot be disputed. Etc. Etc. Etc. Facts just go on and on and on, ad nausium !!
To deny the facts is almost a mental illness, much like the "911 truthers" OUCH!!!
I'll duck, in preperation for the "incoming".
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Offline gypsyman

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2010, 04:11:59 AM »
I read a book years ago, and still have it. The title''Mortal Error'', by Bonar Menniger. He wrote it with a man, Howard Donahue, who had done research on the killing. A very interesting book, in that, it states that the bullet that hit Kennedy in the head, actually came from an ar-15 that was being held by a secret service agent in the car behind the limo. And, it was an accidental shooting, in that, the agent was reported to have stood up with the gun in hand, and when the cars speed up to get away, he slipped and fell over backwards, probably pulling the trigger by accident.
Seems in the Warren commission, that x-rays reveal, the hole in the back of Kennedy's head, were 6mm in size. Kind of hard for a 6.5mm bullet to have made a smaller hole, when all tests show a slightly larger hole is usual.(Hence, a .223 bullet, is much more likely to have made that size hole. Food for thought. gypsyman
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Offline Graybeard

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2010, 04:49:02 AM »
Oswald was behind the motorcade IF he was there at all (a fact not in my opinion ever proven). The shot that killed Kennedy came from in front NOT from behind.

I've watched the film at least a hundred times in both fast and slow motion and frame by frame. At the moment of impact with Kennedy's head the head is violently slammed BACK not forward as it would be if a centerfire rifle bullet came in from behind.

I have no real clue who killed him or with what firearm but the killer's shot hit the front of his head not the back. There is no doubt in my mind that Oswald did not kill him.


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Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2010, 06:58:58 AM »
There are three main conspiricy theories and all have merit.
1) The communists did it, because of the Cuban Missle Crisis and Russia having to remove missles from Cuba.  (maybe true, but we agreed to remove missles from Turkey).
2) The Mafia did it in response to failing at the Bay of Pigs.  (Mafia had several cassinos in Cuba and lost a lot of money when they went Communist.) 
3) The Illumaniti did it.  (A few months prior to his assination, he wanted the US to go back to the gold standard with the Treasury department printing the money and do away with the Federal Reserve). 

Offline lrs

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2010, 07:09:06 AM »
About the lone nut theory, that Owald was the lone gunman, I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.  I don't think the human has yet to be born that could do the shooting, Oswald was said to have done that day, with the rifle he was supposed to have used.
I believe I once read that Carlos Hatchcock tried to duplicate it, but was unable.
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Offline elhoward622

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2010, 09:07:05 AM »
OF ALL THE CONSPIRACIES:  IMO the Russians would not do it.  They were scared snot-less about a nuclear war and were not going to come close to starting one off.  I just feel that the mafia or some other organized crime ties have the most legitimacy.  This WAS the heyday of the mafia.  But, there is so much wiggle room that just about any theory can be given some amount of weight to it.  The question is: Is this assassination any different from assassinations or attempts on previous presidents.  There have been many attempts and they all involve someone who is somewhat mentally disturbed, mostly of foreign descent or a connection to another country, and feel some slight or rejection due to policies of the office.  Oswald's family and friends say no way, but Oswald did have many of the same characteristics. 

Offline jlwilliams

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2010, 09:18:36 AM »
  The grand daddy of all who-dunnit conspiracies. 

  I may read this book.  The JFK murder is among the most fascinating pages in US history. 

  One down side to all the conspiracy theories.  There are too many and can't all be true.  The God's honest Gospell Truth could be laid out before us and most wouldn't believe it because they already have a pet theory they believe in.

  We will never know, nor will we ever stop wanting to know.

Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2010, 09:18:53 AM »
From what I understand, Jack Ruby had ties with the mafia.  I don't believe the Russians would have done it either with the prospects of nuclear war. 

Offline Graybeard

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2010, 09:55:07 AM »
I certainly have no evidence but do have a theory. I developed the theory after much study of the situation in those days and for sure am not saying my theory is the right one it's just what I personally suspect took place.

During the missle crisis JFK ignored the advice of most all the Joint Chiefs and I am of the understanding that he was less than kind to the Generals such as I think it was Westmorland but don't hold me to that as I've not study anything other than the Zapruder film in years.

My personal pet theory is that Johnson and those generals conspired to have him killed. Now who specifically they had do it I dunno but my guess would be either CIA operatives or perhaps mafia contacts of the CIA as personally I think that the mafia like Alqueda is just a branch of the CIA.

Hey I told ya I had no proof only a theory.  :o


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Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2010, 10:13:08 AM »
Sounds like a good theory to me.  Johnson was on the presidential plane back to Washington calling the shots, waiting for Jackie after Kennedy was declared dead.  Strange Oswald spent only $12 on a rifle for such a job.  He had the money to buy something more accurate and better. 

Offline lrs

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2010, 10:38:47 AM »
My theory is that is was the people who bild hambergers  ;)
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Offline Matt

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2010, 04:28:01 PM »
Any fool can know. The point is to understand.”
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Offline Oldshooter

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2010, 04:44:00 PM »
I also dont know what happend, But dont think oswald did it! I also think Kennedy was shot from the front and that Johnson was involved!   ???  We may never know, Heck, if Kennedy was alive today, He'd be shot by his own party! He werent no obama democrat!
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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2010, 05:06:07 PM »
I forgot to mention that there is a confession in the videos... Part 2 and 3

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Offline JBlk

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2010, 02:46:08 AM »
I have always thought that the Warren commission was a complete farce in the opinion that they rendered in this investigation.The reaction of President Kennedys body upon being struck with the projectile is contrary to their conclusions and the events that followed when the body was flown back to Washington leave many unanswered questions.Then you add the convienent death of Oswald and the sudden death of Ruby, nothing adds up.The whole thing almost sounds like a death that occured during the Clinton administration when Vince Foster allegedly committed sucide in the park.Now is it any wonder that all of our politicans have law degrees. Who else could come up with these stories and expect the public to accept them without question.

Offline Range Rider

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2010, 03:26:46 AM »
Lady Bird and Ole Lyndon Johnson were haveing breakfast at  their ranch in the fall of 1963.  Lyndon says by hell Lady Bird  deer seasons opens next Saturday. Lady Bird responds, Yes Lyndon and by the way did Lee Harvey ever bring your rifle back???? :o

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Offline AtlLaw

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2010, 03:41:54 AM »
I have always thought that the Warren commission was a complete farce in the opinion that they rendered in this investigation.

My father thought the same thing.  He got the report as soon as it was published.

Then there was the rumor that Kennedy wasn't killed but lived for some time, albeit a vegitable, on an Island off Greece owned by Onasis.  Hence Jackie's marrage to Onasis, supposedly after Jack finally died.

And what about the document, sealed in the Kennedy Library I think, written by Jackie and maybe contributed to by others as I remember, to be opened 75 years after the assination.   ???

Oh well, I have my own problems, here and now, that I have to worry about...  :-\  Important stuff like; I only have one beer left in the fridge!   ;D
Richard
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Offline elhoward622

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2010, 03:52:24 AM »
Too bad every show on TruTV is fake LOL!  Yeah the CIA was extraordinarily powerful during that time period.  That theory definitely has allot of merit.  The interesting thing is, to my knowledge, the JFK assassination was the only long-range attempt in US history.  There have been many, many assassination attempts on presidents and I do not know of one that was not a close range assault.  Even then there were many shootings and mishaps where the president didn't die.  A long range shot on a moving target is a very low percentage shot.  If 9 out of 10 on this board can make that shot then I am hanging up my irons because I must not know which end of the guns shoots.  I wont speculate on the "who dunnit?" What do you guys make of this close up zapruder film? He seems to recoil backwards but the damage to the front of the head would normally suggest and exit wound.  I don't know about FMJ bullets so not sure how that factors in.  

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Offline powderman

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2010, 04:20:03 AM »
EH. That was not real clear but I've seen film where his head seemed to snap back at impact, not forward. POWDERMAN.  ??? ???
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Offline elhoward622

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2010, 04:31:32 AM »
Thats what I said.  I would say that his head does indeed snap backward.  However, there is a gaping wound to the front right temple exploding outward.  I would say that no one on this board is a forensic expert who has experience with high-powered round damage to the skull.  If you are on the grassy knoll does an entry wound to the skull create massive trauma?  Head shot from the front and back?  Who knows but it darn sure looks like his head snaps backwards from the impact but there is a gaping wound on the front of the head.  Maybe a glancing blow to the temple? Its all wild speculation but it is fun to think about.

Offline elhoward622

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2010, 04:51:47 AM »
In all seriousness I think that if there is indeed a conspiracy that most of us are a probably so far off the mark they would laugh about it.  Think about this, with all the technology and theorizing this topic has seen over the last 50 years the "lid", if there is one, is still on it.  The Russian's easily stole our atomic bomb tech while we were working on it; I dare say what would have been our nations most well guarded secret.  If this secret has survived this long I doubt there are records lying around with evidence somewhere waiting to be discovered.  Sources with credible information usually are not left lying around like the proverbial "squeaky wheel" for this many years.   

Offline AtlLaw

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2010, 05:09:02 AM »
between the first and second 'shots'......what is Jackie doing..?

I dunno...  :-\  Looks to me like she knew something happened but didn't know what and was asking Jack.  When the second shot hit there wasn't any doubt.   :(

I would say that no one on this board is a forensic expert who has experience with high-powered round damage to the skull.

Well, I 'm not a forensic expert, but I have a good bit of "experience with high-powered round damage to the skull."   :-\  I have seen everything from a person's whole brain laying a few feet from the body by a temple shot with an M16 to a neat hole by a bullet fired from an AK going inside one side of a flight helmet (and skull) and out the other.  What I have never seen is a body recoil into the direction of a bullet's momentum.

Looking at that film again I would say that a bullet entering the forehead and exiting the temple could create that damage.  But what do I know.  I'm done, this thread is getting depressing...
Richard
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Offline scootrd

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Re: "Lee and Me", Oswald's girlfriend tells her story...
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2010, 05:14:46 AM »
I've always believed Oswald was a patsy set up to take the fall. Yes he was there , Yes he took a shot , (Theee shot I don't know)  Researchers have proven time and time again the single bullet theory is impossible.

I truly believe it was a Mafia hit , with Oswald taking part and becoming the fall guy. I also believe not so much to eliminate John Kennedy as pres. But a way to severe Bobby as US attorney General from power, and the immense pressure he was applying with his Mafia investigations. He was the most successful US attorney at that time with 12 high profile successful prosecutions against the mob.

If I recollect , there was a overheard meeting in a bar where the discussion was how do you kill a tiger ?
And the response was you sever the head not the tail.

Here's an interesting Tidbit -

The rifle found on the 6th floor of the Book Depository building was a 7.65 Mauser. Oswald never owned a 7.65 Mauser. Oswald owned a 6.5 Italian Mannlicher-Carcano. Once that was revealed , the weapon in police custody mysteriously changed its caliber, make,  and nationality and the Warren Commission reported a 6.5 Mannlicher-Carcano, not a 7.65 German Mauser had been used in the shooting.

Another  Tidbit  -

Former U.S. Marine sniper Craig Roberts and Gunnery Sergeant Carlos Hathcock, who was the senior instructor for the U.S. Marine Corps Sniper Instructor School at Marine Corps Base Quantico in Quantico, Virginia, both said it could not be done as described by the FBI investigators. "Let me tell you what we did at Quantico," Hathcock said. "We reconstructed the whole thing: the angle, the range, the moving target, the time limit, the obstacles, everything. I don’t know how many times we tried it, but we couldn’t duplicate what the Warren Commission said Oswald did. Now if I can’t do it, how in the world could a guy who was a non-qual on the rifle range and later only qualified 'marksman' do it?

Another Tidbit
Jim Sutton in 1994 confessed to being the grassy Knoll shooter and stated the other shooter that day was Charles Nicoletti successful mob hit man under Giacanni. Nicoletti was scheduled to give sworn testimony before the House Select Committee on Assassinations when miraculously he was killed in 1977 before he was scheduled to appear.

Chauncey Holt a mob accountant also stated in 1991 that he drove Nicoletti  to Dallas on the morning of the JFK assassination. He was also one of the 3 tramps in the now famous Photograph.


  -  JMHO , it was a mob hit to neuter Bobby .

Will we ever know the real truth?
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