Danger; Danger !!

[ironglow]

   There is great error slithering into some hitherto totally Christian churches. Some "churches" are starting to accept Islam as a co-equal
 
  http://www.plaintruth.com/the_plain_truth/2010/11/chrislam-spreads-throughout-america.html

   Read especially, the fourth paragraph...   Are these guys being swept into gross error ? We better watch them and warn others...

   "I am the way, the truth, and the life, noone comes tro the Father but by me".     (Jesus of Nazareth)  John 14:6

  The first commandment declares the REAL God to be a "jealous God"..


            Danger...Danger !!

[ironglow]

  More danger announcements;

  http://wholetruthhelp.com/content/view/102/1/

[powderman]

IRONGLOW. Further proof that satan is alive and well. Seems that false prophets abound. These churches will send a lot of people to hell. Satans days are numbered and he will take as many with him as he can. This was really saddening news. POWDERMAN. 

[FourBee]

More prophesy in the making ironglow.  Thanks for the post....

2 Timothy 4:3  For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

[Pat/Rick]

Just great.

[SwampThing762]

Islam does not corner the market on errant individuals.  Islam just has the most killers among those errant individuals. 

ST762

[saddlebum]

It seems to me that the Chrislamites would be ostrasized and dismissed by more people in the world than any other. Real Christians won't have any of it and Muslims will consider them infidels and backsliders and want to kill them.............go figure.

Somehow I'm not surprised that Warren and Shuller are in this. I'm surprised that Shuller is still in business since his "church" is millions of dollars in the red and publicly begging for money. Warren, (what little I know of him), always seemed to me to take "love thy neighbor" to the point of compromise. JMOs

[ironglow]

  Perhaps I am wrong, but I have long considered those type guys as using faith as a money making enterprise.  Warren's book about 'purpose driven life' was recommended to me, so I bought a copy. At about the 3/4 mark I tossed it, wondering just where the 'inspiration' was hiding.
      Seems like these guys who preach just to fill 'itching ears' either don't know  Scripture, or are simply ignoring it's warnings ! It would seem more a case of the latter.
  Scripture says; " Can two walk together, except they be agreed " (Amos 3:3)
       Can one who truly believes the Bible go hand in hand with those whoi claim that Jesus is LESS than God ?
   Can a Christian break bread with those who at best, consider Jesus simply a co-equal with Muhammad ?

    Personally, it looks to me that Powderman may be spot on, in his above statement !  
  
  These churches large as they are, coukld be simply a case of "the blind leading the blind" ! Have they just now, fallen into their ditch ?

   Ever since Muhammad died, the Sunnis and Shiites have been butchering each other. How do these blind guides think they can be spiritual brothers of a faith where they are even TODAY, killing each other off in the name of their god ? (see Genesis 16:11,12)

   http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/11/28/AR2010112802485.html

[ironglow]

  From First Corinthians, chapter five:

  3) For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,

 4) In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,

 5) To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

 6) Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?


    Second thought...Guess I better drop this now, or risk being shut down..

 

[powderman]

It seems to me that the Chrislamites would be ostrasized and dismissed by more people in the world than any other. Real Christians won't have any of it and Muslims will consider them infidels and backsliders and want to kill them.............go figure.



 SADDLEBUM. TRUE, but satans goal is still fulfilled. The muslims he already has, it's the Christians he must deceive. By convincing Christians that islam is ok and that mohamed is equal to Jesus Christ they will falsely believe that they are saved. By putting Jesus only as equal to mohamed they are in essence denying that Jesus Christ is Lord and Saviour and sealing their doom, for salvation is ONLY through Jesus Christ. This new cult will win a lot of souls to satan. POWDERMAN. 

[goofyoldfart]

Ironglow: OK, I have a question and REALLY would appreciate an answer. In reply #1, which was a 2nd post by you---were you saying that this essay was a DANGER? After reading that essay(sermon?) all I can see that it was a truly Christian answer to a BLATANT proposal. If I have misunderstood you, I sincerely apologize. I admit that I am still a child when it comes to the Word and am slow to understand sometimes,but it seems that your second post was a rebuttal Against Chrislam. I am confused by that posting God Bless to all.

ETA: spelling errors corrected.  oooops.
ETAA: it's the "more danger announcements" thing that I don't understand. how is this more dangerous?

[FourBee]

goofy;  I don't see that he means it's more dangerous, but rather more, or additional, dangers infiltrating the churches.   Note; I said churches, meaning the buildings where the people ( called the church ) congregate.   So, in actuality, he is alerting the church to remember the scriptures pointing to the last days, and to be aware that they are upon us, that we should draw nigh (as close as we can) to God, and He will draw nigh (to give us comfort) to us.

forgive me ironglow, for jumping in ahead of you.  That's a bad habit I need to control.....

[goofyoldfart]

Ok, fourbee, I gitcha I think it was just the way I read the warning part. 'cause when I read the essay-- he was definitely against Cristlam. from my point of view I don't see how there can be unification of the two. Just my .02 cents worth.

[ironglow]

Goofy;
  Sorry I didn't get right back, but Fourbee covered it quite well. I just added the second warning by posting another to reinforce the first. I see not way Islam and Christianity can mix their doctrines (oil & water anology).  After all, Islam cannot even get along with itself...(Shiites vs Sunnis).
  A few thoughts come to mind;

 A) Can two walk together except they be agreed (diety of Christ)

 B) A little leaven, leavens the whole lump.

 C) No man can serve two masters.

 D) If anyone comes to you, bringing 'another gospel'....show them the door!

            "Nature abhors a vacuum"  Many prominent folks today are fighting Christ..tooth and nail, while coddling up to Islam. Now taking Muhammad's part may be "cool" in their circles, perhaps they have not taken the long view.
   While Christ will never be defeated, they would like to think they can do so. Now just suppose Christianity were abolished.."nature abhors a vacuum", so the most logical force to move into the vacuum today, would be Islam. Would these celebrities and politicians truly enjoy living under Sharia law ?
  Would they like Burkas, Hajibs, homosexuals executed, theives disarmed (literally), gossips de-tongued, adulterers stoned, women beaten and relegated to subordinate status ?
  Sheesh ! adulterers being stoned..there may be few celebrities remaining..but getting stoned shouldn't be anything new to them !

[goofyoldfart]

?
  Sheesh ! adulterers being stoned..there may be few celebrities remaining..but getting stoned shouldn't be anything new to them !
[/quote] Ironglow: I'm sorry, that last line cracked me up. I was laughing so hard, tears came. Don't mean to be irreverent, but it was funny. I have no problem with 4/B jumping in. when I read your reply #1 I was tired and sentence structure wasn't clicking in my tire old brain. I read the essay and understood exactly what he was saying and I agree 100%. I am a speed reader (ruins my relaxation reading) and when sentences start turning in circles for me then I know it's time to go to bed. I apologize if I sound ignorant (sometimes I am) but I am in the learning stage. In Bible studies, when I walk through the door, I sometimes think that I can hear the Preacher groan and roll his eyes. Hey, we gotta start somewhere

totally ot: is that the 4th Armored patch and if so where were you? I was with the 4th/68th in waldorf/mannheim back in the dark ages.

ETA: spelling.                                                   Goofy

[ironglow]

  I was with the 4th armored in likely darker ages..1955-1956, Fort Hood, TX.  I transferred to Fort Sam Houston when they gyroscoped to Europe in 1957, because i was too much a "short timer" to go with them.  But alas, 5 years later I re-enlisted (patriotic fervor ).

[powderman]

tm#1, I believe. If your godless friends revere Christ so much why are they doing everything they can to destroy everything he ever taught or built??? That is the goal of islam. POWDERMAN. 

[ironglow]

   TM;
   Did you forget your meds again ? If you read my posts on this subject you will find I did not speak of any religious superiority, war..anti peace and certainly not anti-Christ.
  Interesting that you should accuse me of being "anti Christ"..  Indeed, I firmly believe Jesus is God, come in the flesh. The question was asked in the Bible..   "Who is anti Christ" (that is, against Christ) ?   The answer is given in ..  (1 John 2:21-26) and again in (2 John 1:6-8).
    There it says that he who does not believe Jesus is the son of God and ..God the son..  is anti Christ, obviously..
  
            Tell me now, does Islam say that Jesus is "the Son of God and God in the flesh", or does it say "God has no son" ?

  I have no problem with people following Islam, as long as they don't attack others or try to invoke Sharia law into our culture. I also felt like that 50-60 years ago...but then SOME of the Muslims started getting riled up and started attacking the rest of us, we did not attack them.

   The gist of my post was not that one religion is superior or inferior, but that they will not mix. I used the old analogy of "oil and water".
   Now, I don't believe oil is superior to water...or vice-versa, but it is obvious the two will not stay mixed, even if well shaken...perhaps especially so in that case.  


   I suppose you are quite disappointed that Christian schools here in the US are not promoting love, peace and friendship in the same way some Muslim schools in the UK are...  http://www.tnr.com/blog/the-spine/79452/lessons-hate-islamic-schools-in-britain

[FourBee]

ironglow ~ I have no problem with people following Islam, as long as they don't attack others or try to invoke Sharia law into our culture.

Last night on TV was a report about SUDAN, Africa.  Northern half is Muslim.  Southern is Christian.  The Muslims are rallying to attack the Christians to what may be the greatest bloodbath in the history of the world.  An attempt to bring world attention to this is being made in hopes to quell such an onslaught.

[powderman]

tm#1. You claim you take no meds, your last several posts indicate to me that you should strongly consider taking some.
FOURBEE. there will be no peace in the world as long as the godless ones exist. They live for blood. POWDERMAN. 

[ironglow]

  TM;
        I fully realize you never said Islam accepts Jesus Christ as God, and they never have either....and therein is the base of the problem. As I said in the same post...I don't hate either oil or water...but they still won't mix.
     When I spoke of the Triune God, I was referring to ORTHODOX CHRISTIANITY...not some kind of cult or something put out by a "website theologian".  I am referring to the Christianity which all the great preachers and universities say are the very basic fundamentals of the faith.. Jesus himself made the fact clear that he is indeed the second person of a triune God.   ..."I and my Father are one"..among others.
      To say that Christianity and Islam "mixed" in the 7th century...is a stretch.  Others might say that Christianity was "polluted" by desperate   tribesmen, trying to weave their polygamist ways in with a respectable narrative.

[powderman]

To say that Christianity and Islam "mixed" in the 7th century...is a stretch.  Others might say that Christianity was "polluted" by desperate   tribesmen, trying to weave their polygamist ways in with a respectable narrative.



YEP. poluted is a kind word. POWDERMAN. 

[saddlebum]

Just wanted to say thanks for the link Ironglow.
I just used it in a response to an article I read on The Blaze.
An actor in the movies, "The Chronicles of Narnia", (by CS Lewis), claims the character, Aslan, the lion can and does symbolize Mohammed or Budda in the stories instead of Jesus.
I thought that this Chrislam story was relevant to the compromise we see to Christianity in our culture today.


http://www.theblaze.com/stories/film-furor-narnia-star-says-aslan-can-symbolize-mohammed/

[ironglow]

Just wanted to say thanks for the link Ironglow.
I just used it in a response to an article I read on The Blaze.
An actor in the movies, "The Chronicles of Narnia", (by CS Lewis), claims the character, Aslan, the lion can and does symbolize Mohammed or Budda in the stories instead of Jesus.
I thought that this Chrislam story was relevant to the compromise we see to Christianity in our culture today.


http://www.theblaze.com/stories/film-furor-narnia-star-says-aslan-can-symbolize-mohammed/

      Thanks for the heads up Saddlebum;
  I must admit (somewhat redfaced) that I have never read the Chronicles of Narnia. Although I have often employed the wisdom of C S Lewis by utilizing his quotes. It's a quirk of my own in that I cannot enjoy fiction greatly, especially that which uses replacement figures for the actual intended..a lion for Christ for instance.  I am hung up enough on this idea, I couldn't even stick with "Pilgrims Progress" by Bunyan, probably the largest selling book, right behind the Bible.
  Now, I know they are great stories and millions upon millions enjoy them...but just not for me; guess I'm too much a "tell it like it is" guy!

     ..But no matter..the idea of posing the Lion as any other figure is totally inept...obviously just another case of a "puffed up" actor believing his opinion is worth more than others..

    There is only one..LION OF THE TRIBE OF JUDAH
              

[FourBee]

ironglow ~ Now, I know they are great stories and millions upon millions enjoy them...but just not for me; guess I'm too much a "tell it like it is" guy!  

  ironglow; I thought it was just me.   I own books that were highly recommended, that I couldn't finish. To much hypothesis.  

[powderman]

ironglow ~ Now, I know they are great stories and millions upon millions enjoy them...but just not for me; guess I'm too much a "tell it like it is" guy!  

  ironglow; I thought it was just me.   I own books that were highly recommended, that I couldn't finish. To much hypothesis.  

FOURBEE. Yep, me too.
tm#1, yawwwwwwwnnnnnn. Samosamo. POWDERMAN. 

[saddlebum]

Ironglow,
I fully apreciate and understand your opinion about such stories.
If given the choice to read "Mere Christianity" or " The Chronicles of Narnia", I would choose the former.
I do think the "Chronicles" are nice for children. I assume that's who they were written for. I admit I liked the first movie.

I have a limited edition copy of "Pilgrim's Progress" in a collection of Christian classics and I have never got around to reading it. I really should give it a try.

The thing about the actor making those statements that got me was how they are trying to portray Mohammed and Budda as the same as Jesus. Almost trying to blend the religions all together. I haven't heard the term New Age for a long time but that's what it sounds like to me.
I felt the statement the actor made was out of ignorance, political correctness and trying to draw a bigger audience to the movie and make more money.
I put up the link you gave us as an example of how people are being decieved into mixing Christianity with something else. Still pretty shocking to me.

[saddlebum]

ironglow ~ I have no problem with people following Islam, as long as they don't attack others or try to invoke Sharia law into our culture.

Last night on TV was a report about SUDAN, Africa.  Northern half is Muslim.  Southern is Christian.  The Muslims are rallying to attack the Christians to what may be the greatest bloodbath in the history of the world.  An attempt to bring world attention to this is being made in hopes to quell such an onslaught.

Sudan used to be a Christian country and it started in the northern most part on the Egyptian border. Started around 300 AD. Somehow there is at least a small community of Christians living in Sudan all the time since, despite the worst of persecution by Muslims. Now they are mostly in the south. They have been living more peacfully in the last few years because of a very fragile peace treaty. Missionaries I help with a little money there in Sudan say it could get genocidal there again just about anytime. Very unpredictable and dangerous for everyone.
The people are suffering greatly already from a drought and food shortages. Life Outreach Int. feeds thousands in Sudan, (and other places), every day.
The south has already seen genocide as bad as Darfur. They hit the south before they went to Darfur. That was the first time I ever heard of the Janjaweed raping women and cutting the breasts off of nursing mothers so their babies would die a slow death of starvation while the mothers watched, helplessly. That is if the mother survived the rape and breast amputation. There is a real shortage of men in the south because the Janjaweed killed the men and kidnapped or killed the boys. They forced the boys into service and made them killers right along with them. The south really has no defenses. I think it was just a matter of time before they went on another Christian killing spree in the south. Whenever the south gets a good leader, the Muslim leader in Khartoum has him killed. Whenever they start getting established from the last war, then the Muslims come back and rape, kill, and pillage all over again. I've read stories about some of the bravest most faithful Christians ever in Sudan. My heart has been broken for them for a long time. I think it will stay that way.
I don't expect anymore help from the UN than they have given in the past. Which was never any more then "mopping up" after the Janjaweed killed or rapped everyone and destroyed their homes and chased them into Chad or Ethiopia. Even all the celebrities and a few politicians couldn't get the UN or anybody else to help in Darfur. I think Southern Sudan means even less to everyone than Darfur. The Muslim rulling class in Kartoum is supported by China, and everyone knows you don't rub them the wrong way. I have little hope for my brothers and sisters in Sudan, but lots of heartache.

Sorry for getting off topic.

[DDZ]

Jesus Christ is God, and if that is not believed, does that not diminish his deity? He is the standard and if that standard is lowered or diminished, it moves man up on the pedestal. Not only is it Chrislam that is destroying  the Christian faith, but pastors in other churches across America that do not preach from the Bible. Its more of mans words than God’s word.
   These pastors would not be standing at the pulpit preaching deceiving sermons if Christians demanded different. To many Christians today want to feel comfortable in church. They don’t want to hear the truth, they want to feel good about themselves. They don’t want to hear about their sin. They want to feel ok about their homosexuality, adultery, fornication, arrogance, or whatever sin they continue. 
They want a church where they can be entertained, and socialize. They want a place where their kids can play, with endless youth programs. They would rather have constant entertainment then hear God’s word.
Instead they listen to drivel that will give them a positive mental attitude, or how to feel better about yourself.
    Compare the preaching and philosophy of the prophets or the Apostles, or John the Baptist, or Paul, and you can clearly see how unbiblical many of our churches have become. Seldom if at all do many hear honest, straight forward, fearless, telling like it is-hell-fire preaching anymore.  I think it’s the reason America is in the shape its in today. I think nations will always take the form of its preachers and churches.
    When Paul sent Titus to Crete to bring the church in order. Paul said for there are many rebellious men, empty talkers and deceivers, especially of the circumcision. Who must be silenced because they are upsetting whole families, teaching things they should not teach, for the sake of sordid gain. Titus 1:10-11.
   Its no different then what is going on here in many of America’s churches. Of coarse if people don’t read and get to know the Bible. How could they ever know they are being deceived? Christians have got to be able to separate the wheat from the chaff.         

[ironglow]

BTW...IG......

Self-deception is the widespread legal narcotic lubricating the slide of American society into the toilet that other once great nations ended up in....wars, decay, dialectics, deceit, economic disparity, rivalry and vainity, etc.  Maybe this old Arab proverb warrants some respect:

People who lie to others have merely hidden away the truth, but people who lie to themselves have forgotten where they put it.


..TM7
.

   Not being a devotee of Arab culture, I'll take your proverb for what it is worth...and in turn furnish you a bit of wisdom from the book of books , from the King of Kings.
   You may want to check on your sourtces for spiritual enlightenment:


2 Peter 2
 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.