Author Topic: The book: H&R Arms Company 1871-1986 (Read 11184 times)

Tommie D · « **on:** November 29, 2010, 07:33:58 PM »

H&R Arms Company 1871-1986 by William Goforth
Does anyone know if this book is available yet, or when it will be out ?
I was doing some internet research on a Model 258 Handi-Gun II as I was offered one in .22 Hornet/20ga. I came across a forum where someone was asking about their's and found this information by the author of the above mentioned book.

"the H&R Model 258 handi-Gun II was manufactured between 1982 and 1986. your gun with the BA letter code was manufactured in 1984. the finish is what H&R called Electroless Nickel, it is a very durable finish. most model 258 handi-guns came with a fitted canvas carring case and was sometimes advertise as a survival rifle/shotgun combo. the 357 max caliber is very collectible but not to good as a shooter (because of price of ammo). the model 258 handi-gun was also offered in 30-30, 22 hornet, 357 magnum and 44 magnum. all paired with a 20 gauge shotgun barrel.

value in 60% about $135 and 99% about $245
bill"

And another post for a different person asking about their model 258.

"H&R used the AY letter code in 1982.

MODEL 258 HANDY GUN II COMBO-----------------------------1982-1986
Single Shot Side Lever Break Action, 22 inch barrel drilled and tapped for Scope Mount, Blade Front Sight, adjustable Folding Rear, Finish Electro-Less Nickel , Walnut Stained hardwood Pistol Grip Butt Stock, Weight 6½ Pounds, Overall length 37 inches, combo comes with one Rifled Barrel and one 20 Gauge Smooth Bore Barrel, choked Modified, in a fitted Canvas Carrying Case, Rifled Barrel available
In 30-30 Winchester, 22 Hornet, 357 Magnum, 357 Maximun & 44 Magnum
VALUE: 100%=$245 60%=$135"

I noticed in both posts that the years of manufacture differ from the list posted here on GBO by two years. He states AY is 1982, GBO has it as 1984. Same with the BA letter code, 1984 vs GBO as 1986.
I'm not saying anyone is wrong here, I just want to know the correct years of Mfg.
Maybe the model 258 was different ? I know one thing, I don't have a clue. I do know i'm going over to a storage unit I have and dig out some old Gun Digest books I have boxed up somewhere. If anyone can add more information on the model 258 Handi-Gun II I would appreciate it.
Thanks.

32 Magnum · « **Reply #1 on:** November 30, 2010, 06:54:39 AM »

The H&R Book is not yet published - it is in the hands of the Publisher. I was lucky enough to collaborate with Bill Goforth on this book, for the last 12 years - yeah, that's how long it takes to get correct information - and things kept changing. Bill did the historical research, using H&R catalogues and interviews with former employees, collectors, etc. I had the pleasure of collecting the "hardware" - at one time or another I have owned over 600 different H&R firearms. Between the historical software and the hardware, Bill's gotten a pretty good knowledge of the H&R firearms from the mid 1870s thru 1986. With any luck (I just recently provided another set of pics that the publisher requested) the book should be on the shelves by Spring of 2011. We've already acquired information that has to be included in a 2nd Edition - I've found a few previously unknown (to us) guns and more serial number info comes up all the time from postings on forums such as this one.
As to the serial numbers - H&R started with 'A' in 1940, they skipped 'O' and 'Q' because of the confusion possible in using them. Thus 'Z' was 1963. 1964 was 'AA', again, skipping 'AO' and 'AQ', 'AY' would be 1982, 'AZ' would be 1983, 'BA' would be 1984 and 1986 (H&R Inc. ceased production in January 1986) would be 'BC'.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #2 on:** November 30, 2010, 06:59:40 AM »

Thanks Jim!!!

But something is still not right.

Tim

1964 AA
1965 AB
1966 AC
1967 AD
1968 AE
1969 AF
1970 AG
1971 AH(snap on foecap)
1972 AI
1973 AJ
1974 AK
1975 AL
1976 AM
1977 AN
1978 AP
1979 AR
1980 AS
1981 AT
1982 AU
1983 AV
1984 AW
1985 AX
Y ?
Z?
1986 B

Tommie D · « **Reply #3 on:** November 30, 2010, 07:25:17 AM »

It's missing AI and AK, I think thats where the two year difference might have been comming from.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #4 on:** November 30, 2010, 07:26:38 AM »

I added AI and AK, it still doesn't work out right.

Tim

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #5 on:** November 30, 2010, 01:16:37 PM »

I have a BA and a BB serial # gun and have seen one other BB posted here.Kurt

jim ritchie · « **Reply #6 on:** November 30, 2010, 05:16:52 PM »

Try this one.

This is just through 1982.
Keep going with the alphabet through 1986.
Also Jim can explain it much better, but there are some letters that were used twice.
A,S,U, were all used earlier to identify different models of revolvers, then used again when H&R started the alphabet thing.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #7 on:** November 30, 2010, 06:19:55 PM »

Thanks Jim, that makes more sense, they did skip AI and AK as well as AW and AV, I made the corrections in the FAQs.

Tim

Tommie D · « **Reply #8 on:** November 30, 2010, 09:00:30 PM »

That makes me feel better now as when I noticed AI & AK missing I thought I found the two year difference but then noticed it was off FOUR and I was ready to pull my hair out.
Thanks to all for their help in this matter.

32 Magnum · « **Reply #9 on:** December 01, 2010, 04:25:27 AM »

Thanks Jim Ritchie - you covered my 6, again. According to Bill, it is unknown why those letter prefixes were skipped - he thinks, possibly they were used for special editions or issues?

We'll probably never know - unless I can pry the info out of the one person I know who has ALL the production records in H&R's records as of 1986 - and up to now - I've not been able to access that info.

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #10 on:** December 01, 2010, 04:42:23 AM »

Jim do you happen to know if they are going to publish any Special Editions. Like signed copies and such or if they are doing any pre orders ? Kurt

jim ritchie · « **Reply #11 on:** December 01, 2010, 07:34:58 AM »

I think you can get your name on a waiting list?
Jim Hauff, do you know anything about this?
Seems I read one of Bill's posts somewhere, and he mentioned it.

Tommie D · « **Reply #12 on:** December 01, 2010, 05:14:01 PM »

Over the last few days I have tried to contact a few of the Model 258 Handy-Gun II owners about the serial number prefixes so far I have got two responces back.
"AZ" and "AV"

I will see if I can get a picture of the "AV" prefix.

32 Magnum · « **Reply #13 on:** December 02, 2010, 02:54:53 PM »

I just looked back into my copy for editing of the rough draft of Bill's book, 'AK' was used for a special series to Commemorate the Kansas Centennial. Jim Ritchie, what is/are the serial number(s) on your Nebraska Centennial pieces?

As to 'special edition', signed copies and waiting lists - I don't know/remember right now. I'll try to get the information from Bill and post it here. I know the publisher is "Gun Show Books." enquire here: www.gunshowbooks.com

jim ritchie · « **Reply #14 on:** December 03, 2010, 09:12:28 AM »

Jim,
The prefix on my Centennial pieces is NC.

H&R Model 949 Nebraska Centennial commemorative 1967, # 100, and 118 of 300pcs.
100 is mine, # 118, is my brother's
Just a guess, but I am thinking that H&R didn't use the normal alphabet serial #'s because they were a commisioned run from some private parties?

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #15 on:** December 06, 2010, 05:28:26 AM »

You guys are great I am gonna need 2 of these books one to vacuum seal and one to get my greasy little fingers in as it will be hard read. Kurt

jim ritchie · « **Reply #16 on:** December 06, 2010, 06:15:56 AM »

Yep,
I'll be one of the first in line also!
Maybe then I can give 32 magnum a break, and find some answers for myself!!

32 Magnum · « **Reply #17 on:** December 09, 2010, 07:40:45 AM »

Jim,
Don't get too comfortable - I've already come up with two pieces that won't be in the 1st Edition. Gotta stay one step ahead of you young whipper snappers. ROFL!!

Winter Hawk · « **Reply #18 on:** January 21, 2011, 05:09:10 PM »

With the passing of Bill, will the book still be published? It would be a shame if it isn't after all the work he put into it!

-WH-

32 Magnum · « **Reply #19 on:** January 22, 2011, 03:42:30 AM »

It WILL be published. It's in final stage - cover art is only thing holding up printing. That should be done this coming week.

Old Fart · « **Reply #20 on:** January 23, 2011, 02:11:41 AM »

Great news. Now the wait....... $:-\$

pmeisel · « **Reply #21 on:** January 23, 2011, 04:45:29 AM »

RIP Bill. It's too bad he didn't get to enjoy seeing us all compliment his fine work, at least on earth.

jim ritchie · « **Reply #22 on:** January 23, 2011, 04:57:33 PM »

I had been hoping to get a signed copy from Bill.
Now that this will not happen, I broke down and contacted Gun Show Books.
I got put on the contact list so I will know as soon as the book is available.
Just a heads up for you guys that may want to do the same.

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #23 on:** January 24, 2011, 06:51:08 AM »

Jim I wanted to do the same . I thought about contacting them about the book but I figure you ain't gonna keep it a secret once they contact you

Kurt

32 Magnum · « **Reply #24 on:** January 24, 2011, 06:52:13 AM »

Several weeks before Bill passed - he asked me to take over the final stages in the event something should happen to him, working with the publisher - not expecting and not knowing that he would be gone less than three weeks later - I agreed. Subsequent to his passing, I have been in contact with his family and they have authorized me to work with the publisher to finalize the project. I need to take a suitable hi-def picture for the cover - which I'm having a bit of trouble accomplishing - they want perfection - can't blame them. When I get more detail, assuming I will, from the publisher, I will post here what the story is.

LeftieD · « **Reply #25 on:** September 26, 2011, 09:07:30 AM »

Jim, thanks for picking up on this book. Any new news as to when it will be published?

32 Magnum · « **Reply #26 on:** September 27, 2011, 10:08:49 AM »

LeftieD,
Not yet, my friend. I'll post a notice as soon as I hear anything.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #27 on:** July 07, 2012, 07:04:52 AM »

Quote from: 32 Magnum on January 24, 2011, 06:52:13 AM

Several weeks before Bill passed - he asked me to take over the final stages in the event something should happen to him, working with the publisher - not expecting and not knowing that he would be gone less than three weeks later - I agreed. Subsequent to his passing, I have been in contact with his family and they have authorized me to work with the publisher to finalize the project. I need to take a suitable hi-def picture for the cover - which I'm having a bit of trouble accomplishing - they want perfection - can't blame them. When I get more detail, assuming I will, from the publisher, I will post here what the story is.

Any update on the book Jim?

Thanks,

Tim

knight0334 · « **Reply #28 on:** July 16, 2012, 05:54:00 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on July 07, 2012, 07:04:52 AM

Quote from: 32 Magnum on January 24, 2011, 06:52:13 AM
Several weeks before Bill passed - he asked me to take over the final stages in the event something should happen to him, working with the publisher - not expecting and not knowing that he would be gone less than three weeks later - I agreed. Subsequent to his passing, I have been in contact with his family and they have authorized me to work with the publisher to finalize the project. I need to take a suitable hi-def picture for the cover - which I'm having a bit of trouble accomplishing - they want perfection - can't blame them. When I get more detail, assuming I will, from the publisher, I will post here what the story is.

Any update on the book Jim?

Thanks,

Tim

I haven't seen really anything of 32 Magnum online since Jim Ritchie passed away.

I moderate over at pafoa.org and 32 Magnum's last post/activity was June 29th.

Hopefully Jim will bless us all with his knowledge soon.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #29 on:** July 16, 2012, 10:22:01 AM »

He hasn't been here since March!

Tim