Author Topic: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis  (Read 3964 times)

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Offline GGaskill

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #60 on: December 15, 2010, 08:09:37 PM »
Is the recovered ball going to be viewable at the CBC2 II?

 
GG
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Offline Victor3

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #61 on: December 16, 2010, 02:38:32 AM »
    Here at Seacoast Artillery we have always believed in putting all the information out on the table and then standing back and letting all the interested parties discuss it and then make up their own minds where the truth lies.  

 Is that a dichotomy, or is it a paradox?

 Hmmm...
"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly, one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

Sherlock Holmes

Offline Double D

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #62 on: December 16, 2010, 03:53:42 AM »
Is the recovered ball going to be viewable at the CBC2 II?

 


No one said the ball was recovered, there is only an anecdotal report of one observed......

Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #63 on: December 16, 2010, 06:02:35 AM »
     Here at Seacoast Artillery we have always believed in putting all the information out on the table and then standing back and letting all the interested parties discuss it and then make up their own minds where the truth lies
Is that a dichotomy, or is it a paradox?
 Hmmm...

     Neither, this statement simply means that we have no preconceived notions.  It merely belies our state of mind, that of complete and utter openness.

                  T&M
Smokin' my pipe on the mountings, sniffin' the mornin'-cool,
I walks in my old brown gaiters along o' my old brown mule,
With seventy gunners be'ind me, an' never a beggar forgets
It's only the pick of the Army that handles the dear little pets - 'Tss! 'Tss!

From the poem  Screw-Guns  by Rudyard Kipling

Offline Double D

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #64 on: December 16, 2010, 09:36:52 AM »
If it had soot on it it would be because it rolled out of the truck through the exhaust smoke...

     That's probably the most intelligent thing that you've said all year Double D.  Well I guess THAT pretty much wraps up all this needless speculation!
Glad to see all that put to rest.     ;) ;)

Tracy and Mike

It took me a while....A very high compliment or a very subtle insult!!!!!  ;D

Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #65 on: December 16, 2010, 10:40:28 AM »
     I just wanted to bring some attention to your very creative explanation of an alternative soot making scenario.  There was no offense meant.  Actually I was happy to put this whole thing to rest, that is, until Dr. Gallagher's email arrived.

Tracy
Smokin' my pipe on the mountings, sniffin' the mornin'-cool,
I walks in my old brown gaiters along o' my old brown mule,
With seventy gunners be'ind me, an' never a beggar forgets
It's only the pick of the Army that handles the dear little pets - 'Tss! 'Tss!

From the poem  Screw-Guns  by Rudyard Kipling

Offline Double D

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #66 on: December 16, 2010, 10:47:29 AM »
     I just wanted to bring some attention to your very creative explanation of an alternative soot making scenario.  There was no offense meant.  Actually I was happy to put this whole thing to rest, that is, until Dr. Gallagher's email arrived.

Tracy

I am a student of science and never miss a CSI program on TV...

Offline Cat Whisperer

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #67 on: December 16, 2010, 12:41:04 PM »
Wind direction compared to azimuth of gun-target line?
Tim K                 www.GBOCANNONS.COM
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Chief of Smoke, Pulaski Coehorn Works & Winery
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N 37.05224  W 80.78133 (front door +/- 15 feet)

Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #68 on: December 16, 2010, 01:04:52 PM »
Wind direction compared to azimuth of gun-target line?

     Since the axis of the camera is 55 degs. off the gun-target line, and the smoke was blowing at 90 degs to the camera's axis, then the remainder angle should define the wind direction as being down range AND 35 degs off the gun-target azimuth.  According to John's calculations with this data and also that of the 20 MPH average wind speed, a distance increase of only 200 yards resulted.  I would have guessed more, but at least the sideways drift is interesting.

Mike and Tracy
Smokin' my pipe on the mountings, sniffin' the mornin'-cool,
I walks in my old brown gaiters along o' my old brown mule,
With seventy gunners be'ind me, an' never a beggar forgets
It's only the pick of the Army that handles the dear little pets - 'Tss! 'Tss!

From the poem  Screw-Guns  by Rudyard Kipling

Offline Double D

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #69 on: December 16, 2010, 01:08:50 PM »
Wind direction compared to azimuth of gun-target line?


is this not the same effect said differently?

Doc John,

Some variables for you to consider if they are relevant in this theoretical bowling ball firing.  They may be irrelevant or not significantly relevant.

Direction of travel of the ball 180 degrees

Direction of travel of the  wind  45 degrees

 

Offline Double D

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #70 on: December 16, 2010, 01:14:02 PM »
Wind direction compared to azimuth of gun-target line?

     Since the axis of the camera is 55 degs. off the gun-target line, and the smoke was blowing at 90 degs to the camera's axis, then the remainder angle should define the wind direction as being down range AND 35 degs off the gun-target azimuth.  According to John's calculations with this data and also that of the 20 MPH average wind speed, a distance increase of only 200 yards resulted.  I would have guessed more, but at least the sideways drift is interesting.

Mike and Tracy

These are the actual numbers for the theoretical event.


Doc John,

Some variables for you to consider if they are relevant in this theoretical bowling ball firing.  They may be irrelevant or not significantly relevant.

Direction of travel of the ball 180 degrees

Direction of travel of the  wind  45 degrees

Average wind speed during the theoretical time frame of firing 14.6 mph

Average high wind gust speed during the theoretical time frame of firing 23.033 mph

Average Temperature  during the theoretical time frame of firing  78.3

Average dewpoint  during the theoretical time frame of firing 46.3

Average humidity  during the theoretical time frame of firing 34





Offline GGaskill

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #71 on: December 16, 2010, 01:18:45 PM »
No one said the ball was recovered, there is only an anecdotal report of one observed......

Someone saw a ball sitting on the ground and did not recover it? ??? ??? ???
GG
“If you're not a liberal at 20, you have no heart; if you're not a conservative at 40, you have no brain.”
--Winston Churchill

Offline Victor3

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #72 on: December 17, 2010, 02:23:48 AM »
     Here at Seacoast Artillery we have always believed in putting all the information out on the table and then standing back and letting all the interested parties discuss it and then make up their own minds where the truth lies
Is that a dichotomy, or is it a paradox?
 Hmmm...

     Neither, this statement simply means that we have no preconceived notions.  It merely belies our state of mind, that of complete and utter openness.

                  T&M

 Oh. In that case, you might should become "open" to the possibility that you forgot to load the ball, or maybe it rolled up the bbl and fell out before the charge went off. ;)

 After all, nobody seen it in the air...
"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly, one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

Sherlock Holmes

Offline Double D

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #73 on: December 17, 2010, 02:49:24 AM »
No one said the ball was recovered, there is only an anecdotal report of one observed......

Someone saw a ball sitting on the ground and did not recover it? ??? ??? ???

This is Montana, not El Aye...if it ain't yours leave it alone...

Up here it's not unusual to see a $300,000 farm tractor sitting in a field unattended for months with the keys in it...of course it's sitting where it broke down and will sit there until the day before it's needed again and then it will be fixed. ;D

Offline seacoastartillery

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #74 on: December 17, 2010, 05:06:26 AM »
    Here at Seacoast Artillery we have always believed in putting all the information out on the table and then standing back and letting all the interested parties discuss it and then make up their own minds where the truth lies.  
Is that a dichotomy, or is it a paradox?
 Hmmm...
    Neither, this statement simply means that we have no preconceived notions.  It merely belies our state of mind, that of complete and utter openness.
                  T&M
Oh. In that case, you might should become "open" to the possibility that you forgot to load the ball, or maybe it rolled up the bbl and fell out before the charge went off. ;)

 After all, nobody seen it in the air...

  
     Victor, your astuteness is absolutely astounding!  Even though I hit you over the head with one of those laughable caveman clubs seen in cartoons, everyone else with similarly hit too, and no one got it.  You did!  That fairly heavy hint that I gave out about the fact that not one of the 49 or so people present actually saw the projectile depart terra firma, should have caused some comment, but, incredibly, it didn't, until now.

     The question, most certainly, is, "WHY?"  We are open to all reasons except that we may have forgot to load the ball.  When you stare down into that giant maw of the Monster Mortar and see the big, shiny cartridge of black powder staring right back at you, you're not likely to forget that experience, especially as you lower that 16 pounder down on top of it and roll the ball around so the finger holes are DOWN.  The only thing worse, that I can imagine, would be loading a shell into the 8-Inch Seige and Garrison Howitzer, the one shaped like one of General Grant's cigar stubs.  I bet that Artilleryman could tell all of us why THAT is so Spooky!

     As for the ball rolling up the barrel and falling out before the charge went off, all I can say is this:  "We ain't in Canada you know.  We are nowhere near Moncton and the "Magnetic Hill" where my father drove the ole '49 Plymouth to the bottom of the hill when I was seven years old, turned off the engine, took his foot off the brakes and we rolled backward all the way back to the top of the hill!"  Anyway, with the tube at 60 degs.,the ball did not roll out.

    The really big question is still WHY did no one see that ball fly skyward???  Come on now, if you have ever bowled, even once in your life, you know how Big and Heavy those balls are!!  It was a dark colored ball with orange highlights, one of those swirly designs, but mostly dark.  Against the bright blue Montana sky it should have been simple to pick up and track.  Not one person was able to do that.  Why??

Tracy & Mike



Proof the ball was loaded.  I just bought the quicktime everything software package so this flick better show.   Please double click on the image.

Smokin' my pipe on the mountings, sniffin' the mornin'-cool,
I walks in my old brown gaiters along o' my old brown mule,
With seventy gunners be'ind me, an' never a beggar forgets
It's only the pick of the Army that handles the dear little pets - 'Tss! 'Tss!

From the poem  Screw-Guns  by Rudyard Kipling

Offline GGaskill

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #75 on: December 17, 2010, 09:17:33 AM »
I have found from shooting my bowling ball mortar that it is virtually impossible to track the ball in flight unless you are looking in the direction it is going from the beginning.  Since everyone was watching the muzzle of the MM, the ball was gone (way gone) before anyone could catch up with it.
GG
“If you're not a liberal at 20, you have no heart; if you're not a conservative at 40, you have no brain.”
--Winston Churchill

Offline Victor3

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Re: Slow Motion and Frame Capture Cannon fire with some analysis
« Reply #76 on: December 17, 2010, 10:02:38 PM »
 When you stare down into that giant maw of the Monster Mortar and see the big, shiny cartridge of black powder staring right back at you, you're not likely to forget that experience, especially as you lower that 16 pounder down on top of it and roll the ball around so the finger holes are DOWN. 

 You mean you didn't use shepherd's crook tongs to load the charge, and that handy crane thing to load the ball? Yikes. Where was the EH&S department while all this was going on? ;D

 Mebbie they was downrange, makin' sure nobody got clobbered by a theoretical bowling ball meteor...

 Meanwhile, with all this talk of moving heavy things miles away, I'm wanting to revive my theoretical gallon paint can thunder mug idea. You guys got all that range with enough windage to drive a truck through. I'm thinking that by machining a stubby 4" long barrel ahead of a powder chamber in 7" stock, I might could get a cement filled paint can to launch pretty good.
"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly, one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

Sherlock Holmes