Sarah Palin; better than some realize ...or admit

[ironglow]

      During the crafting of the Obamacare mess, done by a 'select few', somewhere deep in the innards and secret compartments in the capitol building, Sarah Palin warned us that it would include "death panels".  These death panels would be composed of people who are paid to 'counsel' the elderly or disabled concerning 'end-it-all' ideas. She said these "counselling sessions" would be nothing more than efforts to get these folks to..'take a powder' so to speak.  Kinda wonder if that will include those military recently disabled in action ?
   The Democrats said such was not the case, but recent disclosures seem to indicate otherwise:
  http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/08/end-life-counseling-intensifies-health-care-debate/

   Now; either Mrs Palin is a prophet, or she is much smarter..or more honest, that all the Dermocrats, at least those few who read the bill before they voted it into law.

   The administration and some of it's most obedient, Kool-aid 'spinners' say otherwise..but most of the media, including the NY Times says the death panel idea is part & parcel of Obamacare....or is it Obama-don't-care ?


  BTW: The Lord has not created any new prophets in the last 2,000 years...

[DDZ]

She is smarter, and definitely more honest than all the Dems. She also loves America and what it stands for, far more than the whole pack of Dems that feel they have to apologize for America. 

[myronman3]

liberals and the conservative powers that exist are terrified of her.   that is because she can beat them both.   

[Cheesehead]

She would be a great choice to defeat obama in 2012.

Cheese.

[SHOOTALL]

She would be as good of a president if not better as anyone since Regan . She had far more experince than Obama in running a Govt.

[beerbelly]

If she runs I'll vote for her. She is far better than any of the RINO'S they are talking up!

[magooch]

I'd vote for Sarah in an instant, but I have to wonder if she really will run.  She just might be too smart to want to put herself and her family through that ringer.  On the other hand, she might be too patriotic to let it go.

The really great thing if she were to run and win--a whole bunch of libs might pack up and leave the country.  We should be so lucky.

[ironglow]

  Those sneaky Democrats...pulled the 'death panels' so as to get the moderates among them to sign onto the bill they voted for....you know, the one they didn't read..
    So now, to start off the new year, they write the death panels back in.  Don't know if it is legal to just "write in" changes like that...so now we face a test for the Republicans....let's see if they have the cohones to stop it !

  http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/26/us/politics/26death.html

[SHOOTALL]

I voted for her last time 

[Sourdough]

To figure out the Death Panels was not too hard.  Sarah got a copy of the bill and read it.  It discussed the priority list of who got the best care, and who was to be denied, or recieve minimul care.  It also gave methods on how to go about deiying care.  That priority list was buried about one third of the way back as I remember.  Things like obessity, disabilities (mental and physical), and age were used as determining factors.  During an interview Sarah gave page and paragraph how to find it in the bill.

Wheather she will run or not is still up in the air.  I think she will test the waters first, then depending on how it feels she will then make a decission.

[ironglow]

  I find it very interesting that so many of the Democrats tried their best to demonize Sarah over her opinion of the Obamacare bill.  Then when the truth becomes known, we find that Sarah was one of the few who actually read the bill...while most all the Democrats voted for the bill WITHOUT even reading it !!!
   Adding insult to injury, the meekly folowed Nazi Pelosi's advice and voted FOR IT...just so they could at last, find out what was in it !!


    YA JUST CAN'T FIX STUPID !!!

[SHOOTALL]

To figure out the Death Panels was not too hard.  Sarah got a copy of the bill and read it. 

What a great idea , read a bill before voting on it . One has to wonder why the rest insisted that it be passed to see what's in it . She must surely be ahead of her time .

[DDZ]

The death panels have been part of the Democrats plan for a number of years. Denying old people health care, when a bureaucrat deems them no longer useful to society, was written in the fine print in Hillary care. You could bet the ranch though that when one of our elite politicians get old and sick, there would be plenty of health care available for them.  

What I like most about Sarah is that she is not a liar, and because of her character, and faith, I don't think she would ever become one.

[nw_hunter]

She would be as good of a president if not better as anyone since Regan . She had far more experince than Obama in running a Govt.

What if Ron Paul decides to run again! Would you pick Sarah over a Constitutional minded, voice with experience like him?
If so.........Why? "just curious"

[SHOOTALL]

That would be tuff to decide . Put them on the ticket togather . They both express honesty . Ron as pres.  her as VP. He could teach her the finer points and we could have 16 years of responsible govt. 

[Sourdough]

nw_hunter:  While many people like Ron Paul, and his constatutional views, far too many consider him a radical.  He could not get the votes himself. 

[crustylicious]

The new Medicare rule pays for voluntary annual consultations on end-of-life care along with the usual physical exam. It pays your doctor for the three minutes he spends answering the question, “So, Doc, what are my options if some crazy stuff happens to me?” That’s it. That’s all. That’s the only thing it does.
Of course someone with a vivid imagination, weak reading comprehension skills or a desire to discredit and distort could make the "death panel" connection

[SwampThing762]

Sarah Palin has the support base necessary for a victory.  However,  I see greater advantage in engaging her to do fundraisers for the GOP as she is very popular with the Tea Party movement.   She could serve the GOP well and be spared the media nightmare.  As a reward, give her a Cabinet position like Secretary of energy.

ST762

[SwampThing762]

Crustafarian,

Can you start a new thread posting the text of this new rule, please?  I just googled this new Medicare rule and found no responses to direct to the Department of HHS and Centers for Medicare and Medicaid.   We will then see about your claims regarding the "death panel" connection.

ST762

[crustylicious]

SwampThing, here you go. I posted here even though I realize that this thread is about fear mongering and confusion not discussing the merits of advance care planning.

SEC. 1233. ADVANCE CARE PLANNING CONSULTATION.

(a) Medicare-

(1) IN GENERAL- Section 1861 of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 1395x) is amended--

(A) in subsection (s)(2)--

(i) by striking `and' at the end of subparagraph (DD);

(ii) by adding `and' at the end of subparagraph (EE); and

(iii) by adding at the end the following new subparagraph:

`(FF) advance care planning consultation (as defined in subsection (hhh)(1));'; and

(B) by adding at the end the following new subsection:

`Advance Care Planning Consultation

`(hhh)(1) Subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), the term `advance care planning consultation' means a consultation between the individual and a practitioner described in paragraph (2) regarding advance care planning, if, subject to paragraph (3), the individual involved has not had such a consultation within the last 5 years. Such consultation shall include the following:

`(A) An explanation by the practitioner of advance care planning, including key questions and considerations, important steps, and suggested people to talk to.

`(B) An explanation by the practitioner of advance directives, including living wills and durable powers of attorney, and their uses.

`(C) An explanation by the practitioner of the role and responsibilities of a health care proxy.

`(D) The provision by the practitioner of a list of national and State-specific resources to assist consumers and their families with advance care planning, including the national toll-free hotline, the advance care planning clearinghouses, and State legal service organizations (including those funded through the Older Americans Act of 1965).

`(E) An explanation by the practitioner of the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice, and benefits for such services and supports that are available under this title.

`(F)(i) Subject to clause (ii), an explanation of orders regarding life sustaining treatment or similar orders, which shall include--

`(I) the reasons why the development of such an order is beneficial to the individual and the individual's family and the reasons why such an order should be updated periodically as the health of the individual changes;

`(II) the information needed for an individual or legal surrogate to make informed decisions regarding the completion of such an order; and

`(III) the identification of resources that an individual may use to determine the requirements of the State in which such individual resides so that the treatment wishes of that individual will be carried out if the individual is unable to communicate those wishes, including requirements regarding the designation of a surrogate decisionmaker (also known as a health care proxy).

`(ii) The Secretary shall limit the requirement for explanations under clause (i) to consultations furnished in a State--

`(I) in which all legal barriers have been addressed for enabling orders for life sustaining treatment to constitute a set of medical orders respected across all care settings; and

`(II) that has in effect a program for orders for life sustaining treatment described in clause (iii).

`(iii) A program for orders for life sustaining treatment for a States described in this clause is a program that--

`(I) ensures such orders are standardized and uniquely identifiable throughout the State;

`(II) distributes or makes accessible such orders to physicians and other health professionals that (acting within the scope of the professional's authority under State law) may sign orders for life sustaining treatment;

`(III) provides training for health care professionals across the continuum of care about the goals and use of orders for life sustaining treatment; and

`(IV) is guided by a coalition of stakeholders includes representatives from emergency medical services, emergency department physicians or nurses, state long-term care association, state medical association, state surveyors, agency responsible for senior services, state department of health, state hospital association, home health association, state bar association, and state hospice association.

`(2) A practitioner described in this paragraph is--

`(A) a physician (as defined in subsection (r)(1)); and

`(B) a nurse practitioner or physician's assistant who has the authority under State law to sign orders for life sustaining treatments.

`(3)(A) An initial preventive physical examination under subsection (WW), including any related discussion during such examination, shall not be considered an advance care planning consultation for purposes of applying the 5-year limitation under paragraph (1).

`(B) An advance care planning consultation with respect to an individual may be conducted more frequently than provided under paragraph (1) if there is a significant change in the health condition of the individual, including diagnosis of a chronic, progressive, life-limiting disease, a life-threatening or terminal diagnosis or life-threatening injury, or upon admission to a skilled nursing facility, a long-term care facility (as defined by the Secretary), or a hospice program.

`(4) A consultation under this subsection may include the formulation of an order regarding life sustaining treatment or a similar order.

`(5)(A) For purposes of this section, the term `order regarding life sustaining treatment' means, with respect to an individual, an actionable medical order relating to the treatment of that individual that--

`(i) is signed and dated by a physician (as defined in subsection (r)(1)) or another health care professional (as specified by the Secretary and who is acting within the scope of the professional's authority under State law in signing such an order, including a nurse practitioner or physician assistant) and is in a form that permits it to stay with the individual and be followed by health care professionals and providers across the continuum of care;

`(ii) effectively communicates the individual's preferences regarding life sustaining treatment, including an indication of the treatment and care desired by the individual;

`(iii) is uniquely identifiable and standardized within a given locality, region, or State (as identified by the Secretary); and

`(iv) may incorporate any advance directive (as defined in section 1866(f)(3)) if executed by the individual.

`(B) The level of treatment indicated under subparagraph (A)(ii) may range from an indication for full treatment to an indication to limit some or all or specified interventions. Such indicated levels of treatment may include indications respecting, among other items--

`(i) the intensity of medical intervention if the patient is pulse less, apneic, or has serious cardiac or pulmonary problems;

`(ii) the individual's desire regarding transfer to a hospital or remaining at the current care setting;

`(iii) the use of antibiotics; and

`(iv) the use of artificially administered nutrition and hydration.'.

(2) PAYMENT- Section 1848(j)(3) of such Act (42 U.S.C. 1395w-4(j)(3)) is amended by inserting `(2)(FF),' after `(2)(EE),'.

(3) FREQUENCY LIMITATION- Section 1862(a) of such Act (42 U.S.C. 1395y(a)) is amended--

(A) in paragraph (1)--

(i) in subparagraph (N), by striking `and' at the end;

(ii) in subparagraph (O) by striking the semicolon at the end and inserting `, and'; and

(iii) by adding at the end the following new subparagraph:

`(P) in the case of advance care planning consultations (as defined in section 1861(hhh)(1)), which are performed more frequently than is covered under such section;'; and

(B) in paragraph (7), by striking `or (K)' and inserting `(K), or (P)'.

(4) EFFECTIVE DATE- The amendments made by this subsection shall apply to consultations furnished on or after January 1, 2011.

(b) Expansion of Physician Quality Reporting Initiative for End of Life Care-

(1) Physician'S QUALITY REPORTING INITIATIVE- Section 1848(k)(2) of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 1395w-4(k)(2)) is amended by adding at the end the following new paragraphs:

`(3) Physician'S QUALITY REPORTING INITIATIVE-

`(A) IN GENERAL- For purposes of reporting data on quality measures for covered professional services furnished during 2011 and any subsequent year, to the extent that measures are available, the Secretary shall include quality measures on end of life care and advanced care planning that have been adopted or endorsed by a consensus-based organization, if appropriate. Such measures shall measure both the creation of and adherence to orders for life-sustaining treatment.

`(B) PROPOSED SET OF MEASURES- The Secretary shall publish in the Federal Register proposed quality measures on end of life care and advanced care planning that the Secretary determines are described in subparagraph (A) and would be appropriate for eligible professionals to use to submit data to the Secretary. The Secretary shall provide for a period of public comment on such set of measures before finalizing such proposed measures.'.

(c) Inclusion of Information in Medicare & You Handbook-

(1) MEDICARE & YOU HANDBOOK-

(A) IN GENERAL- Not later than 1 year after the date of the enactment of this Act, the Secretary of Health and Human Services shall update the online version of the Medicare & You Handbook to include the following:

(i) An explanation of advance care planning and advance directives, including--

(I) living wills;

(II) durable power of attorney;

(III) orders of life-sustaining treatment; and

(IV) health care proxies.

(ii) A description of Federal and State resources available to assist individuals and their families with advance care planning and advance directives, including--

(I) available State legal service organizations to assist individuals with advance care planning, including those organizations that receive funding pursuant to the Older Americans Act of 1965 (42 U.S.C. 93001 et seq.);

(II) website links or addresses for State-specific advance directive forms; and

(III) any additional information, as determined by the Secretary.

(B) UPDATE OF PAPER AND SUBSEQUENT VERSIONS- The Secretary shall include the information described in subparagraph (A) in all paper and electronic versions of the Medicare & You Handbook that are published on or after the date that is 1 year after the date of the enactment of this Act.

[nw_hunter]

nw_hunter:  While many people like Ron Paul, and his constatutional views, far too many consider him a radical.  He could not get the votes himself. 

Shamefully true, and what we need to do is keep informing the voters of the need to elect more people like him to positions of authority, instead of people that play leaders on the tube.I don't understand how people can like someone like Paul, and his Constitutional views and then vote for a McCain type slick, just because they are electable.

IMO...... we will not change the direction we are headed, until we change that mentality.As a voter, it took me many years to see that voting for the  electable, lesser of two evil's was still voting for evil. Not saying Palin is evil! I just don't think that being a nice looking,spokes person, saying patriotic things should be enough to land the highest office in the land.I think doing what she's doing now would serve the country better.  Speaking of Radicals! The founders of this Nation were considered RADICALS.

[bigMikeA]

SwampThing, here you go. I posted here even though I realize that this thread is about fear mongering and confusion not discussing the merits of advance care planning.

yeah, thanks.   Just where would we all be without you enlightened, so obviously smarter than all the rest of us, progressives or whatever you choose to call yourselves taking the time to try and explain to us why you know better that we do what is best for us, you, the rest of the country, and the world.   

[powderman]

BIGMIKEA. Sarah scares crusty and the other dims because  she has high morals and family values, bad news for dims, thats 2 things they will not tolerate. POWDERMAN. 

[bigMikeA]

agree with you 110% Pman

[SHOOTALL]

BIGMIKEA. Sarah scares crusty and the other dims because  she has high morals and family values, bad news for dims, thats 2 things they will not tolerate. POWDERMAN. 

The libs have used elected officals to replace God and the church. The average person with liberal leanings will say if the president can fool around so can I. If speaker of the house lies its ok for me to do so. So yes they can't tolerate it , it would destory all they have worked for.
It is like the kid growing up in a poor neighborhood. He watches his parents work themselves to death and have nothing in his mind or the drug dealer with cash, cars and women. Like voters kids don't always see past today and doom themselves for the future.

[gypsyman]

Crustafarian, I noticed that the first 6-7 lines were just telling us to add/subtract/move/ the word ''and''. THIS, is why this country is going down the tubes. You've got a bunch of college educated idiot lawyers writing crap like this. Lets make this bill 500 pages longer by adding/subtracting things like, who's gonna pay for this crap. Oh yea, I forgot, it won't be the politicians, it'll be the tax payer. Hell, lets add 500 more pages and give everbody a car and big screen tv. Obama can pay for that out of his stash money.

[magooch]

It looks like a whole new line of law practice could spring up around the new rules for kicking the bucket.

[slim rem 7]

 dieing,an the care given you,shouldn t be govt buisiness.. it is your families buisiness.jmo..slim rem 7

[dukkillr]

dieing,an the care given you,shouldn t be govt buisiness.. it is your families buisiness.jmo..slim rem 7

You are absolutely right.  And everyone should have the discussion with their family about what they want to have happen in the various situations that can arise.  Keep the government out of the discussion, keep your family in the discussion, or you could end up the next Terri Schivo (sp).

Life is ultimately the only thing we are given unconditionally.  It should not be up to anyone by me what care I do or don't receive at the end of my life or should I become permanently incapacitated. 

[Conan The Librarian]

Palin is very good in her current role of "energizing the base". She should be the head of the RNC instead of Steele. I don't consider her a viable presidential candidate. However, the stars have aligned in such a way that Gingrich could be an excellent candidate, especially if there are several public debates. I think the public may not be in the mood for designer candidates in 2012 (i.e., black or female for their own sake). I think the country will want an old white guy with serious experience and accomplishments in dealing with fiscal problems,  and an excellent communicator. There aren't a lot of those around, and Gingrich is the most prominent of them all.