Bedding question

[jmayton]

I'm going to be bedding my sporterized 1917 Enfield that is currently being rebored to 338-06.  I was wondering how I should deal with the front action screw since it site right in the middle of the recoil lug and will have to pushed down into a bunch of bedding compound.  The instructions I received with my bedding kit (Miles Gilbert) only say that "extra care must be taken" on this type of rifle.  Please help me out here.

[ioni]

Some say that the bottom of the recoil lug should be taped before bedding. This makes sure that the bottom of the action (and the first inch of two of the barrel) rest on, or actually in the bedding and that there is a clear gap between the bedding and the bottom of the recoil lug. I bedded a .308 Win Howa this way and ended up with a 0.6 MOA rifle (or that is as good as I can shoot it on average). I used the same method for my .375 Ruger Howa but haven't fired it yet since the stock is unfinished. Pillar bedding is another story and I have no input there. I'm not 100% sure as to why it is necessary to "float" the bottom of the lug. I suppose the idea is that it is easier to have controlled contact over the years this way. I have bedded a Sako L46 without taping the bottom of the recoil lug and I can shoot that rifle just as well / badly as the other one.

I use electrical tape to attach and stabilize the action and the stock during the hardening. To avoid any tension in the action or stock, I don't use the action screws nor any clamps or vices for stabilization. I just use liberal amounts of tape. That's all the force that is needed.

Play dough is also useful in covering holes and such to protect them from the bedding compound.

[gunnut69]

When bedding a rifle the recoil lug only needs contact with the bedding at the rear. The bottom, sides and front are best left with a clearance to aid in removal of the barreled action from the stock. To aviod bedding material in the front screw hole I usually use a guide screw with plenty of release agent so the hole remains clear and there is no doubt the action and bottom metal are aligned.. If no guide screw is used() simply fill the hole with childrens modeling clay as with any recess.. Pillar bedding a mauser front screw is irrelavent as the front lug screw attachment enters and locks the front of the bottom metal. This is essentially what a pillar does! If the front bottom metal is changed or altered to eliminate contact I suppose a pillar could be inserted or pored in place as normal...

[ioni]

.. If no guide screw is used() simply fill the hole with childrens modeling clay as with any recess..

So far, I've only made three gunstocks. I've glassbedded them all. If the inletting is done accurately, there is no need for a guidescrew. The vertical end of the rear tang should be taped so as to leave some space between it and the bedded stock (to avoid splitting of the stock). That takes care of correct placement lengthwise. The inletting should be routed to correct depth and, when making space for the bedding compound, sufficient amount of stock material should be left for setting the action to the correct height. Sufficient amount of electrical tape around the barrel and accurate width of the inletting around the action center the action. Thus, no screws are necessary. The bottom metal has to be bedded separately, though.

That said, I am only a novice stock maker, not a bench rest shooter and agree that I do not know everything. The above written is how I do it. It's accurate enough for my hunting and practising needs.

[Hooker]

If it were me I'd pillar bed it first then glass bed it with a light skim bedding around the lug and first 2 inches of barrel.
As far as the front action screw goes pack the pillar hole and threaded hole with play doh apply a heavy coat of Kiwi neutral shoe polish.
torque the rear screw to 45 inch pounds then clamp the front with a padded clamp. this has always worked for me. One other thing filing a slight taper on the lug can be a big help and it beats finding out it wasn't straight or square after the bedding material has set

Pat

[chutesnreloads]

Jmayton ,may I ask where you are having your enfield rebored?And let us know how it turns out.I have one I'd like to have done.

[ioni]

... One other thing filing a slight taper on the lug can be a big help and it beats finding out it wasn't straight or square after the bedding material has set

Pat

A good point! I forgot to say that Howa has a strongly tapered lug. This, of course, makes several things easier for the D.I.Y gunsmith.

[Nobade]

Since you got 7 responses and none addressed your question, here goes:
On rifles like that I fill the hole with mould release agent (I use probed 2000 and it comes with release wax. You could use any other wax compounds like shoe polish if you don't have the real stuff) That allows you to place the action in the stock and the epoxy not get into the hole. When you put the screw in, the wax gets forced around the barrel shank threads and keeps any epoxy from sticking to them so you may remove the barrel in the future. It also keeps any epoxy in the hole to a bare minimum. Any that may be in the hole at the bottom of the screw is easily removed with a pick once it is cured, since everything in the hole is covered in release compound. Also use a toothpick to kind of clear out the epoxy in the stock that will get squeezed into the path of the screw before you put it in, to minimize how much gets forced into the hole.  BTW, this is pretty much the only way I have found to do Ruger 77s since you can't have a guide screw in the receiver and get it into the stock at the same time.

[jmayton]

Thanks for the responses guys.  I was thinking along those lines (filling the hole with clay or wax) but wanted some real-world experience.  I'm gonna bed my savage first just to give me some practice.  The enfield looks like a slightly more complex job.

chutes - the rebore is being done by Dan Pederson at Classic Barrel Works in Prescott, AZ.  I sent it off middle of December and haven't heard from him yet on the progress.  His prices seem reasonable and we'll see how good the work is.  He's got some old steel to work with so there may be some limitations.  I am keeping track of the progress in the custom gun forum.

[ioni]

I honestly thought my response addressed the question... Well, then, why is the guidescrew necessary? Why not get rid of the screw and avoid the problem altogether?

[jmayton]

ioni, I'm talking about dealing with a screw that attaches in the middle of the recoil lug instead of behind it like most commercial actions.  Mausers, 17 Enfields, and a few others have a recoil lug that is machined as part of the action rather than sandwiched between the barrel and action and the action screw screws right into the recoil lug itself.  Since the recoil lug has to be forced down into the bedding compound, a screw hole in the middle of it causes extra problems.  I simply wanted to know how others have kept bedding compound out of that screw hole, not necessarily the various bedding methods. . . but thanks for the extra info.

[gunnut69]

First the guide screw is used to keep the bottom metal and the barreled acton aligned as the action is being bedded. Since the enfield is basically a mauser and the front screw is totally surrounded by steel (action & front screw boss on nottom metal) pillar bedding the front screw is irrelavent,.,..  Unless custom bottom metal is being used.. Why use a guide screw and not just super accurate bedding? Well it's easier, faster and doesn't fail... even if the bedding is a tiny bit off. It even helps avoid action canting front to back as well as left and right.. What we're after is a totally dead action i.e. when the screws are tightened or loosened there is no movement of the action relative to the wood.  Also it should be noted using Nobade's technique or my modeling clay (oil based non-hardening works best) or the guide screw method the hole surrounding the metal sheath covering the front screw should be slightly enlarged to allow the recoil lug complete control of the recoil transfer to the stock.. Any type wax can be used as a release agent but the material that comes with Brownells kit that creates a 'skin' is not a good idea.. As to Ruger 77's I totally agree. Bedding with a filler in the front screw hole is the only way it can be accomplished but I still use a guide screw in the rear hole to keep everything alligned. Ruger 2 piece bottom metal also makes it necessary to use both screws and rubber tubing to liagn all the parts and keep the floorplate functioning. This is the reason (one anyway) most gunsmiths charge a premium to bed the M77.
Hope the guide screw or the plug the hole method works out for you. Either works..

[ioni]

This is all good discussion. A novice thanks you, gentlemen.

All three rifles I've bedded have integrated recoil lugs and the front screw is located in the middle of the lug in all of them. All three have stocks I made. So maybe I have already been paying attention to proper alignment of action and bottom metal. As I wrote above, my method requires separate beddings for the action and the bottom metal. That is an extra hassle, but not a problem for me since winter evenings are long and dark here in Finland.

Thanks, guys!

[gunnut69]

Thanks and glad to have you here.. Winters seem to be getting colder here and my arthritis worse.. The guide screws just make the job easier and keep things aligned soooooooo much better.. Of course the first couple I did were done without alignment but once you go there going back is difficult.. How far north are you, what's the daylength like there..

[ioni]

Thanks,

I live in Jyväskylä, latitude 62° 2` N, which is a little further up north than Anchorage, Alaska. The day is 7h 18 min long today and 5-6 min longer tomorrow! My hunting grounds are 150 miles up north. I moved here from the north and I call this “Southern Europe”. No palmtrees, though.

[gunnut69]

I live in the central USA in Missouri. If the winters continue the way this one is behaving we'll have to open a polar bear seasin here soon. They're calling for 18-20 inches of snow tomorrow(the ice came today). The day after -7 degrees F with a 40 mile per hour wind! The guide screw is a good idea and allows more of your time to be spent on things like filing out steel grip caps and such..