Democratic senators bail ship

[Cabin4]

TM&Scoot,
You guys never answer any questions. You just spout your big government tax & spend polices that are failing as the continued course for solution. No union worker in Wisconsin make a contribution to the long term or short term sustainability of our economy. If they do, you should be able to site one example out the thousands of workers. Do it, just once.

[billy_56081]

Of course the court challenges have started. The old liberal parasite way. Can't win it on the ballot take it to court or regulate it.

Now scoot so why ya avoiding the question?

BTW 22% of the needed signatures and only 78% to go. Doesn't sound like the recall is happening.

[Cabin4]

This temporary court order is excellant. Keeps the issue fresh in the minds of the tax payers around the country. Eventually the bill will go through and the parasites will lose. In the meantime, more and more Americans will see the greed of the state union workers.

[Gary G]

Governmnet, directly or indirectly, is the biggest employer around.  1 out of 7 employed persons derive a paycheck from a government contract or direct employment by the gov in the USA, be it highway system, or lucrative defense contracts (about 53% of the US economy) That's why drastic government cutbacks in programms and gov employment in times of depression or high unemployment only deepens the depression and further wrecks the community and economy.

...TM7

+1
The U.S. Government is the largest employer in the United States, hiring about 2.0 percent of the nation's work force.
For those that claim the Govt doesn't create Jobs .. They are living in a fantasy world and not In touch with reality.
Since some believe the Govt doesnt create Jobs lets just cancel all the defense contracts so the fake jobs will go away. and we can let go 700,000 federal postal workers while were at it.

Aand then of course there are our service men and women themselves  - yep Govt Paychecks FAKE jOBS, gotta go.

Oh wait we can't Cancel the non job creating contracts , if do that , Boehner would lose the additional extra engine contract in Ohio , you know,  the one the military doesn't want.  but hey since they are just fake jobs anyways??

in 2006 ,
NASA Langley, in Hampton, generated $2.3 billion in economic output and 21,000 FAKE jobs in the United States. In Virginia, the economic output of Langley was $1 billion with a FAKE 10,500 jobs created.

 
If you are working and draw a paycheck  , you have a Job irregardless of the sector.
Jobs are Jobs. there is no such thing as a Fake Job.. (unless you are being paid with monopoly money)


I could go on , but why bother , as we all know apparently the GOVT doesn't create Jobs. so silly

Well, that is good to know. I won't worry so much now. After all the businesses is driven out of the country, then the government can hire all the private sector workers. Why don't they just go ahead and hire all the presently unemployed and our unemployment would go to zero? They could easily print the needed money. We don't have to produce anything; get it from China.

If three of us lived on an island and shared the work: then one said, I will be government and make your life easier. Would he do the work or would the two have to do the work of all three plus feed government? The wealth of an economy is what is produced, and one isn't producing.

[Cabin4]

Yes, according to Scoot & TM, we don't need to export anything, produce anything or service anything. We just all can collect a check from Uncle Sam and life will be good. And your right, unemployment really should always be zero. The Gov can just hire you on and print the money to pay you.

[carbineman]

The minimum wage causes unemployment, mainly with young people. Employers sometimes would hire another worker if the cost was a little less, when it may not profitable at the current wage. A young unemployed person might be more happy with that than not working at all and they would be getting work experience that would help them later. Minimum wage laws take that choice away from them.

Lesson over for sure this time scootrd.

You go for it ..try to live of minimum wage in this country. Lets face it the country has become I got mine Jack , to heck with the rest of ya. (the problem is they are quickly learning the rest of us are the majority and were tired of taking it.

And I fully expect if you guys ever get laid off , stick to your morals and don't accept a fake public sector Job. Remember it will be Far better to feed your family through soup kitchens and rely on charity to house you. of course you could always take that lowered minimum wage job in Missouri. 

Fake jobs - how ridiculously silly

The far right Republican nut jobs are going to pay a very high political price for their over reach very soon.

Scoot, To fix the minimum wage so one can live comfortably, why don't we make the minimum wage $100 per hour? Wouldn't that fix all the woes of the underemployed?

Also the Republicrat/dummykin nut jobs should be held accountable to the voters. Either Yea or Nay, that is the way it should be. The last goobenor we had skipped town fairly fast if I recall. If the voters dislike the present majority they can fix it in '12 or '14 and again thanks for the warning as I'm sure these politicians didn't know that.

[ironglow]

Scootrd says;
 
   " You go for it ..try to live of minimum wage in this country. Lets face it the country has become I got mine Jack , to heck with the rest of ya. (the problem is they are quickly learning the rest of us are the majority and were tired of taking it. "

   


  Ironglow says;
          You have a point there;   That's exactly what I thought when I saw those public service employees rioting because they didn't get their way...and may have to actually pay something towards their health insurance (like McDonald's employees do)... adn cover some of their retirement plan (as the checkouts at the supermarket do)....
    But despite those state employees all whining about how they were "suffering", pleas weren't heard from them about being willing to pay more at McDonald's or at the supermarket...for people who work just as hard for longer hours and many more days per year..for much less pay and perhaps no bennies:  So much for their "grand compassion" !
     Of course, such as live high on the hog at public expense, may be slipping the McDonald's worker or the grocery store checkout an extra $10 here and there...but if they do, I haven't seen or heard of it !   
  As far as I'm concerned, I have as much sympathy for the public employees aboard the gravy train as I do for the NFL when they go on strike....pleading poverty in both cases, I guess ! 

[scootrd]

Yes, according to Scoot & TM, we don't need to export anything, produce anything or service anything. We just all can collect a check from Uncle Sam and life will be good. And your right, unemployment really should always be zero. The Gov can just hire you on and print the money to pay you.

That is not at all what I said.

I stated  - I disagree -
Government policies support the creation of private sector jobs. In many instances, GOVERNMENT is the catalyst.
In many cases, it’s government that HIRES the private sector!!

The republicans ran on the platform  - we learned our lesson , vote us back in and we will pass legislation to help make this happen. Since they have been in office only ting they have concentrated on is legislating social issues, which the majority of the country could care less about.

Then billy in his infinite wisdom he always brings to every discussion if you can read past the word parasite every other sentence stated  -  And not ONE of those jobs pays real taxes into the economy of the United States of America. Now yes there are some public jobs that are NEEDS, problem is, most of the parasites do not know what a NEED is compared to a WANT.

and my response is  - NASA Langley, in Hampton, generated $2.3 billion in economic output and 21,000 FAKE jobs in the United States. In Virginia, the economic output of Langley was $1 billion with a FAKE 10,500 jobs created.

and postal workers ,
and servicemen ,
and defense contracts,

and on a much much smaller scale,  for those who don't believe the Govt can't create Jobs has never lived around a military base, or seen what happens to a local economy when one closes down. As I said  In many instances, GOVERNMENT is the catalyst.

....and I could go on and on but it would be pointless cause those like Billy are set in their minds and believe the Govt cannot create jobs. They occupy a different dimension than the reality I live in.

I dismiss this whole notion or premise Governments don't create real as I guess as opposed to C4's Fake (whatever that means) JOBS.

[scootrd]

C4  - 
you like to speak about Big govt and big liberals overreaching , and this new republican party is all for small govt etc..

well how do we explain tMichigan:

Republicans pass a bill that allows EMF to step in and take over whole cities and towns , replace its publicly ELECTED officials with a private CZAR hand picked by a governor who has the power to fire all selectman , town or city board officials , mayors and all elected officials etc.., bust unions,  and dole the jobs out to their cronies...

Wow, tones of the old USSR , Yep small Govt at work!!! Here's the republican party nobody remembers .. this is the exact BS why I have walked away from these new Rep wingnuts...

They do not represent the republican views I grew up with anymore. They have all sold out to big corps and lobbyists. these paid for politicians provide huge tax breaks for them and then try and balance budgets off the little guys back. The corps say thank you very much - my bought and paid for little buddy Governor , then continue on their merry way outsourcing overseas.

American Jobs are never coming back, I don't care how many tax breaks you give these guys. (what's less than 0?) 
Big business is playing these Gov's as puppets and the little guys footing the bill once again.

[Buckskin]

Come on Scoot, you throw out a couple thousand jobs in the federal government as an example??? How many federal jobs are there??? You don't think a good percentage of those could be eliminated without a blip in their sector??

Yes we need our military, and a strong one at that!  Defense contracts???  How are they government jobs?  That's like saying McDonald's is created by government because Charlie working in the state department likes Big Mac's....

Postal service, not needed.  Privatize it.  FedEx would do a much better job at it than the government.

I don't think anyone here thinks we need to get rid of government jobs completely.  Just get rid of the waste and make people accountable for their work, like in the private sector.  But the unions don't want that... It is a fact that most public sector jobs contribute zero to the tax base and output of the country.  Although some are needed, plenty are not.  Most are overpaid, few if any are not...

[Cabin4]

Scoot...+1 on the governmnet haters.

Without a doubt...if government did not promote business, if government did not stimulate/regulate the economic cycle, if governmnet did not employ people or provide contracts, if governmnet did not educate, or set standards, law, and conduct .... it would not exist as we know it.....The TPTB would change that out immediately....

"Money doesn't talk...it swears"...Bob Dylan

..TM7
.

What a joke. Only government can create jobs...lol.... Now TM wants government in bed with corporations.

Again, I'll ask. If government can actually create real GDP jobs and its so good for our economy, then why don't hire everyone thats unemployed? Scoot and TM7.....government is the answer!!! lol lol. We know who you work for.

[billy_56081]

Where's the recall at??

[scootrd]

Where's the recall at??

Billy , You obviously haven't been looking at latest headlines. It's well on it's way, full steam ahead.

And C4 you keep trying to generalize ...no one said only Govt can create Jobs. They are however the #2 employer in America.  That's a cold stone hard fact. And private sector growth is stimulated by policies  Govt puts in place.

Without GOVT investment , GDP would suffer greatly as new innovation and private sector businesses would stall.
If you noticed most large corps have pulled back on their own R&D budgets.

And Buckskin your a grown adult as I am , I am not going to do the research for you and list every single JOB created or stimulated  by Govt. However when I do have more time this weekend I will be happy to list a few more. Fact is just as I pointed out with the Langley example. They contribute to economic growth and impact local economies  and support many many spinoff private sector businesses. 

BTW reminds me I need to go by some Tang.

[billy_56081]

22% of needed signatures isn't full steam ahead Scoot. Aint happening!

[scootrd]

ok ...Buckskin Just for you I had 2 minutes to do a search , and for the first post we will just limit it to NASA. Nope no private sectors jobs created here that contribute to GDP growth in this country where GOVT was the catalyst . Out of trillion dollar budgets, less than 0.8% is spent on the entire space program and stimulates and functions as a catalyst for the following privates sector advancements. I could go on but again as we have all been told  on this thread - the GOVT doesn't create Jobs, and only Fake JOBS if any.  Ridiculous 

For our GOVT and our economy and our GDP ..I'd say this is a pretty good return on GOVT investment  -  don't you.


Ground Processing Systems
Semiconductor Cubing
Structural Analysis machines
Windows visual Readers
Air quality Monitor systems
Virtual Reality
Advanced keyboards,
Customer Service Software,
Database Management System,
Laser Surveying,
Aircraft controls,
Lightweight Compact Disc,
Expert System Software,
Microcomputers,
Design Graphics.
enriched baby foods
Water purification systems
scratch resistant lenses
Pool purification
Portable coolers and warmers
weather forecasting systems
wind monitors
telemetry systems
Fire resistant materials
Digital imaging heathcare systems
Pacemakers
Gas anaylizers
Micro lazers
Gasoline vapor recovery
self-locking fasteners
machine tool software
laser wire stripper
lubricant coating process
wireless communications
engine coatings
engine design
Storm warning services (Doppler radar),
firefighters' radios
lead poison detection
fire detector
flame detector
corrosion protection coating
protective clothing
and robotic hands

[scootrd]

22% of needed signatures isn't full steam ahead Scoot. Aint happening!

Again your misleading  -  they only need 25% of each districts voters, and they are over 1/2 way home.

[billy_56081]

22% of needed signatures isn't full steam ahead Scoot. Aint happening!

Again your misleading  -  they only need 25% of each districts voters, and they are over 1/2 way home.

And they only have 22% of the 25% needed. Aint happening!

[scootrd]

22% of needed signatures isn't full steam ahead Scoot. Aint happening!

Again your misleading  -  they only need 25% of each districts voters, and they are over 1/2 way home.

And they only have 22% of the 25% needed. Aint happening!

OHHHH NOOOOO ...Time running out whats left over a month and a half to obtain that 3% .
And you need to break it down district by district. some districts only need a relativity small amount of additional signatures required (this is to ensure if some signatures are challenged and over ruled thay still have enough).
_______________________________________________________
In what may be the result of one of the great political miscalculations of our time, Scott Walker’s popularity in his home state is fast going down the tubes.

A Rasmussen poll out today reveals that almost 60% of likely Wisconsin voters now disapprove of their aggressive governor’s performance, with 48% strongly disapproving.

[scootrd]

Cool ,
Here's one I didn't know , NASA R&D -thank you

Transportation
STUDLESS WINTER TIRES - Viking Lander parachute shroud material is adapted and used to manufacture radial tires, increasing the tire material's chainlike molecular structure to five times the strength of steel should increase tread life by 10,000 miles.

Wonder if the Tire rack guys know their private sector paycheck and the companies profitability is tied to NASA and all those Fake GOVT Jobs? 

in the next installment we'll take a look at defense contracts. Dick Cheney and GOVT contracts to Haliburton should be able to help us with GDP growth there.

Hmm I wonder if the admin people in Washington who actually craft the written words of the contracts themselves know they are working a fake job as well.  We should privatize those folks , that way we could streamline effectiveness and have the private sector Haliburton Admin folks craft their own contracts for GOVT spending. You know,  cut out the middle guy Govt watch dogs and all that because obviously these admin Washington folks probably bring no value.

And just think of the enormous gains -  it would help with future deregulation issues BP and others face , cause they could write their own deregulation clauses to help further along more gulf oil spills. I think were on to something here with eliminating all this GOVT worker fake Jobs stuff.

[billy_56081]

Scoot, are you mathematically challenged? Here I'll type real slow what they have at this time is 22% of the NEEDED signatures for a recall. They still need to get the other 78% of the NEEDED signatures for the recall to proceed.

Oh wait now I understand why the liberal parasites are up in arms, simple math.

[Cabin4]

The federal goverment is a consumer of goods and services. It does not produce anything. This thread started becasue of whats going on in Wisconsin. There is no correlation to government spending into the provate sector for goods and services it needs to operate as a government.Working for the government, being employed directly for them is the subject at hand. TM, you and Scoot are being dishonest. You damn well, you cannot find one single state worker who makes a thing. Their salaries are a pure drain on the economy and over paying them hurts jobs creation in the private sector. You cannot argue this so YOU two keep changing the subject and you never answer any pointed questions except to play word games.

[ironglow]

Scootrd says;
  " Cool ,
Here's one I didn't know , NASA R&D -thank you

Transportation
STUDLESS WINTER TIRES - Viking Lander parachute shroud material is adapted and used to manufacture radial tires, increasing the tire material's chainlike molecular structure to five times the strength of steel should increase tread life by 10,000 miles.

Wonder if the Tire rack guys know their private sector paycheck and the companies profitability is tied to NASA and all those Fake GOVT Jobs ?"




   Hey Scoot;
  That is perhaps the way it used to be...but don't forget, B Hussein Obama has changed NASA's mission !  Nasa is now a "MUSLIM SELF- ESTEEM SOCIETY"...


   See the boss at NASA tell the world so...right on AL JAZEERA !
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tB3v10hoDu4&feature=related

[Gary G]

Here is an audio that discusses what we have been debating along with the coming financial collapse.
 
Don't listen to it Scoot. It's a happier place over in la la land. But, if you do, these guys are not Republicans.

It is long,(about 30 min. I guess) but thought provoking.

http://www.financialsense.com/financial-sense-newshour/in-depth/2011/03/16/thomas-e-woods/rollback-repealing-big-government-before-the-coming-fiscal-collapse

[Buckskin]

And how many of those products does government produce???  Sure it consumes, but it doesn't produce.... Even tang....

[carbineman]

And how many of those products does government produce???  Sure it consumes, but it doesn't produce.... Even tang....

If the government produced tang, it would have so many warnings on it,  no one would drink it anyway!  Government tang would have no orange die and it would leave a bitter aftertaste like other government sponcored things!

[Cabin4]

Its hopeless. But when your dealing with people that are on the government dole for a living, what do you expect? Nancy Pelosi said that food stamps and unemployment pay extensions are a "job creator". These people are sick.

[Buckskin]

And I'm always amazed at the liberal idea of redistribution.  Take from those who earned it and give to those who have no work ethic whatsoever, thereby creating an entire generation of worthlessness.

Cripple businesses with taxes, environmental regulation, frivolous lawsuits, unemployment costs, insurance, unreasonable unions, etc.  Then when they are still able to make a profit, libs act like business is the great evil in the country. 

I wonder if TM7 had the same opinions when he owned his company???  And now that he's on easy street, done paying taxes... To hell with the country, as long as he's comfortable...

[Cabin4]

Here is an audio that discusses what we have been debating along with the coming financial collapse.
 
Don't listen to it Scoot. It's a happier place over in la la land. But, if you do, these guys are not Republicans.

It is long,(about 30 min. I guess) but thought provoking.

http://www.financialsense.com/financial-sense-newshour/in-depth/2011/03/16/thomas-e-woods/rollback-repealing-big-government-before-the-coming-fiscal-collapse

.
.
GOPer and DEMs, too need to create a TOTALITARIAN STATE asap pending financial collapse,,,this is what Walker/Koch/Synder are doing under cover of financial doom with their neo-centrism ....i.e. if they want to keep their skin. American trend forecaster Gerald Celente, of the Trends Research Institute,  states it best: “When the money stops flowing down to the man in the street, the blood starts flowing in the streets.”
And notice....Walker/Koch didn't meddle with the police and fireman's unions much if at all...geeee...

Thus the need for immense propaganda, democratic short circuiting, organized labor busting, financial doom scenarios, dialectics...to protect consolidated capital....this is what Wisconsin is all about...but there is a a good body of intelligencia in Wisconsin that have figured this crap out, and good amount of sheeple used in the dialectics.

I'm always amazed at how TPTD gets the common man to cut of his nose despite his face when it comes to what benifts himself and family..

..TM7
.

But of course! Makes complete sense to me After years and years of massive overspending and the financial abyss looming for the state, the action of Walker have nothing to do with pulling back on spending to try and help realign a $3trillion dollor deficit. No corporations involved here, just cutting compensation for over paid workers, that is a clear sign of a Totalitarian tactic. ::

Police & Fire, they are next. But of course, that will be further sign that this has nothing to do with pulling back spending even know, you just critisized him for not.

Sounds like global warming.

[Cabin4]

Well, there ya go. Our country at both the state levels and federal level has no financial issues. Everything is just fine. All the financial ruin that we see is just fake. Raise government worker pay and increase government spending . And we thought Houdini was dead.

[scootrd]

22% of needed signatures isn't full steam ahead Scoot. Aint happening!

Apparently some more in the know disagree  -

Mark Graul, a Republican public affairs consultant who ran the 2006 gubernatorial campaign of Rep. Mark Green of Green Bay, conceded that the enthusiasm and organization of the people trying to recall Republicans might force elections in all eight districts.