Author Topic: If you can stand....  (Read 1353 times)

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Offline Buckethead

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If you can stand....
« on: February 18, 2011, 10:08:42 AM »
....one more question about the Versa Pack, I would ask you indulge a newbie. I've read the sticky posted above and a few of the other posts but still have some confusion. Here's the deal; the other day, I worked out a trade for my well used lyman flinter for a youth .22/410 combo I initially was told was a Rossi. I'm familiar with Rossi's reputation but the guy was also offering to kick in $100 on top of the deal. He told me the .22 had a total of 10 rounds through it and the .410 none. He said he had gotten it for his grandson several years prior and the boy never had any interest in shooting or hunting. Like I said, my deerstalker was well used and I have other flinters so I thought, "what the heck." I've been wanting to get my 5 1/2 year old boy a rifle for his upcoming birthday. I met with the guy after work the other day at a business which was half way for both of us. We were in the parking lot and it was a little dark outside. I took a quick look at the rifle and saw it looked new and didn't really feel the need to examine it real closely. I had chatted with the guy many times in the past knew him to be a pretty straight forward and a trust worthy guy, and took him at his word. I did noticed it didn't quite fit my recollection of what the Rossi looked like but didn't think much of it at the time. He liked my muzzy so we did the trade and went our separate ways. When I got the rifle home and into good light, imagine my suprise to find it wasn't a Rossi but an NEF versa pack! And it was as nice or nicer than he described. I don't believe the .410 bbl has ever been mounted. My experience with NEF and all things H&R is extremely limited to the occasional shotgun I had encountered along the way. So, I've been doing some research and found this place. From what I gather so far, it looks like I may have made out on this deal. I bought that muzzy new about 12 years ago for less than $240 so I got this interesting little rifle/shotgun combo plus $100 in trade. My question is, is there any other barrells, specificall centerfire, from different models that will work on this frame? Like I said, I read the sticky but that may has well been written in chinese. I've seen mention of SB1 and SB2 frames but have no clue what that means. (to be honest, I thought people were talking about Benelli Super Black Eagles  ;D ) From what I gather so far, the versa pack is built on a shotgun frame? Sorry for the long winded post but I must admit I got a bit tickled when I started reading some of the threads about Versa Packs. The boy doesn't know its sitting in the safe right now. I was going to wait until his b-day in July but I'm thinking our trip to our hunting camp next weekend would be a good time to spring it on him.  Thanks for any help you can offer.

Offline JimG

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2011, 12:36:20 PM »
Quickdtoo is the resident expert on H-R matters but I'll add this. I own a Versa-Pack. Mine came as a youth gun with a Choate synthetic youth stock set. I sold the youth stock set and rounded up a 'pallet wood' adult stock set. I did the o-ring trick on the forend (consult the stickies on this). I cut down the factory scope base so that it would clear the rear sight. I simply used a hacksaw with the base wrapped in leather and chucked up in my vise. I then draw filled it straight and smooth. Degreased it and sprayed it with flat black paint. Mounted a fixed 4 power rimfire Tasco scope with a set of Weaver high and extended 4x4 rings. I'm NOT a fan of Tasco and prefer either Nikon or Bushnell but someone gave me this new Tasco so I thought I'd try it. Also added a factory hammer extender. Took it to the range and fell in love. With Fed Champion or CCI Small Game Bullet and off a rest it will put 5 shots into .25" CTC at 25 yards. And with the same ammo at 50 yards I can reliably put 5 shots into .5" or LESS. That's no BS. It is the most accurate .22lr I have EVER owned. It put's the CZ's I owned to shame. And what's better is this- the first shot hits where the last shot does meaning there's none of this nonsense where the first shot hit's to a different POI than the rest of the shots like a lot of rifles do. The POI never changes form shooting session to shooting session either. Now the .410 barrel came in horrible shape from the factory. Looked like a sewer pipe. I burnished the bore with steel wool and it cleaned up well. It shoots about a foot higher than it should at 20-25 yards. I need to find a taller bead but I have a H-R .410 shotgun that I use and it patterns very well so I have not tried to find a bead for the Versa-Pack. I cannot be happier with the .22lr barrel. I placed third out of more than 20 shooters at a contest this past summer and I'm no marksman trust me! Shot at targets at 15, 25, 50, 75 yards both standing and seated at a bench in this contest. There were some high end guns there and nothing felt better than beating most of 'em with this little 'junk' H-R!

Offline JimG

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2011, 12:41:08 PM »
Oh and to answer your question (sorry got off on a tangent! ;D) I think that other shotgun barrels could be fitted to that frame but I'm not sure if H-R will do it. The rimfire bore is off center in the barrel. If you pull the rear sight off (be carefull it's partly plastic, look for the screw under the metal sight leaf) you will see the odd step down in barrel diameter.

Offline Buckethead

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2011, 12:53:26 PM »
The rifle I picked up has the black synthetic youth stock as well. Like I said, I picked this up for my son. Here in Pennsylvania, we have a mentored youth hunt for kids under 12. Legally, my son can shoot a buck, squirrels, groundhogs and a spring turkey at any age. Then to obtain a general hunting license, he has to take and pass the hunter safety course. He's too young for hunting right now but I was wondering about any compatible center fire barrels. That way, when I feel he's ready in the next few years, he would be able to hunt deer with a rifle he was comfortable shooting. I read on here somewhere someone mentioning .44 mag and .357 mag barrels from a particular model fitting but there was no mention of them actually shooting them.

Offline JimG

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2011, 01:03:36 PM »
Well I just got done looking at the stickies myself and from what I can tell,  H-R will not fit any barrel to a Versa-Pack frame.  I would keep the Versa-Pack and buy another H-R chambered in the caliber you want for centerfire shooting. That Versa in .22lr would be perfect for him for squirrel and cans, not to mention marksmanship skills. Heck I'm jealous you found one!

Offline Buckethead

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2011, 03:30:59 PM »
I have a couple different rifles I can have him use for deer but since this will be his first "real" rifle, I thought it would be nice to be able to convert it to something he could deer hunt with. Even a .44 mag bbl would make a very serviceable, short range deer rifle. I'm really anxious to shoot it. I highly doubt it will remain a secret past next Saturday when we're at camp. I have an aimpoint laying around somewhere I'll probably throw on it. It will do well for him to plink with and for me to wage war against the dreaded red squirrel nation that has been attacking my camp the past few years. (Destructive little boogers, they are!) I may have to try out that .410 on the grouse hanging around my camp as well. I've never owned an H&R or NEF. I was supposed to trade a .22 rifle for an H&R .45/70 but the guy never showed up and the deal fell through. I've been kicking around grabbing a varmint rig in .223 for coyotes and whistle pigs. From everything I've read they are great rifles for the price. I'm a firm believer inexpensive doesn't always mean "cheap". This may turn into a new addiction. The more I research this versa pack, the more excited I get. It seems I stumbled upon a real gem!

Offline gcrank1

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2011, 01:37:05 PM »
Nice little set-up you got for him! His loss, your gain.

JimG, have you considered the mild barrel bending procedure to get the 410 to hit where you want? It used to be quite commonly done. You do need to really know just how much correction you need at a given distance, shot offhand as in the field.
"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
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We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
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45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline JimG

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2011, 05:18:15 AM »
I've never bent a barrell before, how is it best done???

Offline Spanky

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2011, 05:43:25 AM »
I've got a 22 versa barrel on a shotgun frame with adult stocks on it. It's hands down the most accurate 22 I've ever seen. ;)
You did REAL GOOD with the trade my friend.



Spanky

Offline gcrank1

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2011, 05:54:00 AM »
Before I try to answer that, first I should say that I have read about 'correcting' POI  in several articles through the years, and also seen reference to a factory doing such. Unfortunately I do not have such readily available to document or refer you to. I have also done this myself, so I do know it can work.
The best way is to have three 'half blocks', wood is OK, two to support the barrel and one to apply pressure. A large hydrolic press is convienent, but a heavy benchtop and a large c-clamp is enough. Some forethought about how much correction left/right/up/down is required; for instance, if you need 6" right and 3" up it would be best to do both right and up with one corrective bend rather than two separate corrections.
It is also worthwhile to look the barrel over carefully to ensure if it has been already bent. The best way to do this to to view down a clean, bright bore to a reflected light (say, off a white wall); you will be able to define the 'concentric circles of light' within the bore and see if it veers off to a side. If you think you see such, rotate the barrel to see if the concentric circles follow the rotation.
Once you determine a bend, consider if straightening it will agree with your correction or aggravate it. Think this well through!!!
When sure of making a correction, set a half block at either end of the barrel, one centered up (or, if a previously bent barrel, at the bent location; think of straightening a nail) and use the c-clamp to apply pressure, one end over the half block, the other under the benchtop lip. Be advised that the steel has a memory and will wat to return to its 'original' state, so you need to apply more bend than you think neccessary to achieve a 'take'.
You can measure before and after, and a masking tape reference point might be useful on the barrel pressure point; but the real proof is in the shooting, so dont go nuts trying to keep track of 'the measurements' unless you just cant resist.
"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2011, 06:58:47 AM »
I've never bent a barrell before, how is it best done???

Been there, done that!!  ;D

Tim

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,88522.msg534848.html#msg534848

Since I took the time to write this up in a pm to one$$shot, I'll post it for anyone interested in a controlled bending/straightening method.

Tim

Quote
Subject: Re: Bending the barrel? 
I made some cradles for each end of the barrel by drilling a barrel diameter hole in a piece of oak, then cutting the piece in half bisecting the hole. Place a half under each end of the barrel, then use a large C-clamp near the middle with another cradle positioned on top of the barrel to protect it from the clamp. Tighten the clamp until the barrel bends some, it will flex back some, so you'll need to bend it past what it will eventually stay at. You'll need a very stout work surface, I used a steel I-beam used for straightening car frames, but a sturdy work bench or maybe a 4x4 would work, too. I used shims under one end of the barrel cradles so I could control the exact amount of bend, tightened the clamp so the barrel touched the work surface each time. For shims I used pieces of ¼" plywood, veneer and then sheet metal until I got the amount of bend in the barrel that I wanted. I just used a 4' steel ruler on top of the barrel when checking the bend, you can see the gap the bend creates.
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Offline JimG

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2011, 09:27:49 AM »
EXCELLENT replies! Thanks guys! I'll get to making some cradles and when it warms up a bit I'll try it out! Thanks again!

Offline c1skout

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2011, 03:20:08 PM »
 I got a versa-pack for my boy and fit a 44mag barrel that I bought off the classifieds here.  He is almost 11 now and can make good hits from a simple rest out past 100 yds with the 44, but he hasn't got a shot at any deer yet. He prefers  his Marlin 15ym in 22lr for hunting so I keep the versa-pak 22 for my huntsman frame.

Offline mechanic

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Re: If you can stand....
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2011, 05:08:05 PM »
Dittos on  the versa barrel.  I have a BUNCH of 22's, and the versa outshoots them all.  If I were to get a wild notion to sell my guns, t he versa would never go.

Ben
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