muzzel loader safety

[ratdog]

one year ago i bought an old  black powder rifle from a pawn shop for  100 dollars. it needed  finishing which i like to do . thought i would clean the barrel i did it looked good so i  laid it on my ottoman. well i put cap on it to blow out the nipple. when i dropped the hammer bang blew hole threw book shelf in my room went threw wall and my wheel barrel out side.i have  been  playing with these  rifles for 40 years.so if   you buy one test fire it outside pointed at the ground. the new ones pull the breach plug.this gun was old it was  a kit gun  l bet it had been setting loaded for years. i have had at least 25  BLACK POWDER rifles over the years it takes only one to get you.BE SAFE. ILL TELL YOU NOW WHEN  I GET MY GUNS OUT OF SAFE MY DOGS  GO HIDE.

[Czech_too]

OUCH!  Just so the only thing that was really hurt was your pride   We may have been at this for years but we can all use a reminder now and then.

[Ron 1]

  the smell of black powder in the house  my ol lady would have beat me
glad that no one was hurt just another reminder to check all gun to make sure it is not loaded
rw

[coyotejoe]

Man, you were lucky! By all means check a new gun to see if it is loaded and if it is, pull the load, do not fire it! Peple will stick all sorts of things down a muzzleloader and for all you know that thing could have been loaded with dynamite!

[pastorp]

I bet that got your attention, truth told a lot of us has done dumb things. At least it was pointed away from anyone    you get extra points for that............Smart dogs, quick learners.

Regards,

[Rangr44]

Congradulations on your good fortune, that nobody was injured, or worse.

FWIW, I wouldn't recommend firing or working on ANY old/strange gun, without FIRST dropping the ramrod downbore, marking it at the muzzle, then withdrawing it and holding it alongside the barrel to the mark, to see if it's loaded.   

Even if it WAS loaded, I still wouldn't fire it, even outside - since the charge is unknown, and may be a double load or even smokeless powder.   

I would mechanically pull the bullet from the muzzle, or blow it out from the rear with compressed air, then dig out whatever powder was in there with a worm or jag.

.

[The Hermit]

ratdog, thank you for sharing. We all can use a safety reminder every once and a while.
I found an old single barrel shotgun a few years ago, rusted solid. Most of the stock is gone. I put a ram rod down the bore and discovered that it still has a shell in it. I have it soaking in kerosene in one of my tool sheds. Hopefully, I can get the action open to render it safe. Its rusted so bad that the action won't open. Wish it could talk. 

 The Hermit

[Semisane]

It's not at all unusual to end up with a loaded muzzle loader ratdog.  It's happened to me twice over the years.  One was a vintage 1800's double shotgun.  The other was a Remington 700ML.  The first thing I do when looking at used muzzle loaders is drop the ranrod down the bore and check it's depth against the outside of the barrel.  If it doesn't go down as far as where you figure the face of the breech plug is you know it's got something in the bore.  I've also run across loaded ones in pawn shops.

[Winter Hawk]

Ratdog,

Thanks for telling that and not being to proud to admit messing up.  I pulled a similar stunt 40+ years ago.  I was going to look at a friend's 1911.  I had stood lots of watches as petty officer of the watch on board ship where we carried a .45.  First thing when you changed watch sections, you pulled it out and pulled the slide back, then checked for a round.  Unfortunately, we never had the chance to become more familiar with using one other than field stripping. 

So I pick up my friend's pistol , pull the slide back and see nothing in the chamber, let the slide fall and pull the trigger.  I (stupidly) had not noticed a loaded clip was in it and we had a .45 slug bouncing around all over in the cabin we were in!  Talk about feeling dumb!  I have always preached to check for a loaded condition and to practice muzzle control since then.  That goes for ML guns also.

-WH-

[Ladobe]

Also glad to hear there were no injuries.   Thanks for manning up and admitting your error.   Few would do so, so thanks for the reminder to all shooters again.    That kind of warning can never be passed on too many times.

To add to Ranger44's excellent advice... NEVER just assume anything with any forearm; ALWAYS check yourself that it is unloaded the very first and everytime you pick it up; and NEVER fire any firearm discovered with ANYTHING in the barrel or chamber.    FWIW, no dealer can hand me a firearm I am interested in until they first check and show me the chamber is empty.

Years ago when I was a gunsmith with a shop my supposedly more experienced partner forgot those simple rules.   A little old lady brought in a Astra Cub still in its factory box and wanted him to show her how to use it.   He promptly picked it up, worked the slide, pointed it at the counter and pulled the trigger.   Shot the lady in the leg.   Luckily the 22 Short just grazed her leg, and she was very forgiving.    Our partnership ended a short time later when he shot himself test firing a customers Colt 1911A1 he had worked on.   Too much firearm familiarity had become dangerours for him and anyone around him.

[mechanic]

It's always the unloaded guns that get us.......glad you were not injured.

Ben

[PA-Joe]

In PA this year we had one lady shoot two of her children while removing a ML for her car. They were standing in front of the barrel while she was pulling the guns out of the back seat. Both kids ok but wounded. We also had one gent shoot and kill himself also by pulling a ML out from the back seat of his car. According to the reports both guns were unprimed but they still went off.

[Ron T.]

Ratdog...........

THANK YOU for being brave enough to post and share your experience with what most of us would have figured was an UNLOADED muzzle loader.  Your experience just goes to show we can NEVER be too careful with any type of firearm... muzzle loaders included.

We should all remember that for a few HUNDRED YEARS, flintlock and percussion cap rifles and shotguns fired lethal rounds and killed or wounded hundreds of thousands of human beings in wars and in battles which were fought with attackers (Indians or evil whites) who attempted to take the lives of our ancestors or the lives of our ancestor's loved ones.

Like any powerful tool, firearms can be lethal any time we get careless with them, so it pays to be cautious at ALL TIMES when handling them.


Strength & Honor...

Ron T.

[Winter Hawk]

Another thing to watch is that most states consider a flintlock unloaded if the priming charge is out of the pan.  However, I have had powder dribble out of the touch hole while the rifle was jiggling around in the truck.  I can see an accidental firing if the frizzen is down and the hammer catches on something while the gun is being taken out of the vehicle.  Be aware of where the muzzle points at all times!

-Kees-

[Charcoal]

Glad nobody was injured.Maybe a good time for da rules.

RULE I: ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED

RULE II: NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO DESTROY

RULE III: KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET

RULE IV: BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET

Muzzle loader/BP shooters need all the little tools that are needed for safe and efficient muzzle loading.Breach wrench,nipple wrench,ball puller,worm,using the ram rod properly, etc etc to make our sport as safe as possible.

[keith44]

Words to live by Charcoal

[mechanic]

Glad nobody was injured.Maybe a good time for da rules.

RULE I: ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED

RULE II: NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO DESTROY

RULE III: KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET

RULE IV: BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET

Muzzle loader/BP shooters need all the little tools that are needed for safe and efficient muzzle loading.Breach wrench,nipple wrench,ball puller,worm,using the ram rod properly, etc etc to make our sport as safe as possible.

When I teach firearm safety, my #1 rule is:  Be sure the gun is unloaded.  Always treat it like it is loaded.  You can't kill someone, accidentally or on purpose unless you point the gun at them.

I passed around a 38 spc. with an spent round in it once, under the hammer.  Out of 15 or so boy scouts, not one realized it, or checked it as they passed it around, even though I had just told them to do so.  When it came back to me, I asked if it was unloaded, and all agreed it was.  Then I shucked the spent round.  Just goes to show.....unloaded guns can kill......

Ben