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Author Topic: Adventures with the 25-35  (Read 726 times)

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Offline gcrank1

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Adventures with the 25-35
« on: April 27, 2011, 01:15:38 PM »
Some time back I acquired a custom stub heavy barrel 25-35 to test the fast twist theory for subsonic and heavy cast bullet loads. Previously I have had 22Hornet and 25-20 rifles with the standard twist rates. Both calibers worked OK with the short, blunt bullets common to them, but I have read of Schuetzen shooters of long ago who had custom fast twist barrels made to use the better ballistic coefficient longer, heavier bullets for the typical 200 yd. matches. I had poor luck with an H&R Hornet and 60gr. bullets (max 45 gr. was normal) so I decided to go to .25 cal. The typical twist in a 25-20 (1:14?) is not likely to stabilize more than an 87gr. bullet, especially at cast lead,plain base bullet velocities. I wanted to use 100 gr. or more bullets and still accurately shoot the 87s. Also, departing from my 'frugal' bullet casting past, I wanted to be able to try these new fangled jacketed bullets and see if they may have any future.

Another forum member offered up the custom barrel about the time I had determined my parameters. I have not verified it, but he told me it is a 1:10 twist, the current standard for .25 caliber rifles. I fit it up to one of my frames and right off it showed promise with lead bullets on my 50 yd. range. Then other obligations set in, winter came, etc., you know how it goes.
Last week I pulled it out again and did scope swap (old El Paso Weaver 2.5-8 with ext. adj) and made some jacketed 90 gr. Hornady loads to -0- it. They all plopped into the same spot at 50 so I tried them on the neighbors pumpkin field out to about 140 ish and they look like crow busters.
Next I tried the 87gr. Cast PB I have on hand at 50. It took 30 clicks to change elevation to 10x 50 yd. -0- but they too are dropping into each other with a chrono'ed 1423 fps charge of Trail Boss. That velocity surprised me as it is faster than their data would indicate (I expected about 1300). I like to find the 'leading limit' of my lead bullet loads and back off for my top load, and don't mind 1050 to 1100 ish for target loads. Even duplicating the 22LR HV load at about 1250 is usually a happy place.
I am liking Trail Boss the more I use it!

All in all, this experiment is working out nicely, and proving theory. I love it when that happens!
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Offline Spanky

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2011, 03:55:11 PM »
Good report and I agree 100% about the Trail Boss. I've been using TB in my 500 and it shoots great.



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Offline bikerbeans

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2011, 03:57:17 PM »
I don't believe it.  gcrank shooting jacketed bullets?!? :o  Next thing you know Pete will be selling his 445SM. ::) 

Sounds like it is working well for you.  How about some pics of the gun and a target or two?

You keep pushing that TB powder and I am going to have to buy a can.

BB
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Offline Spanky

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2011, 04:15:45 PM »
I really like the TB in my 500. There is no recoil to speak of and it burns clean. I did load up some pretty stiff loads using H110 and the difference was amazing. The 500 went from being a pussycat to a tiger. It surprised me how much recoil it had. I'm gonna stick to the TB powder. :)



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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2011, 05:44:22 PM »
I am going to have to chrono other calibers, I suspect the subjective recoil/ velocity impressions may be off, that is, the loads I have trialed may be faster than I have estimated.
BB, I tried holding the borrowed I-Pad up toward the target, like I see folks do on TV with their phones, but it didn't seem to take a picture.......I don't know.....
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2011, 12:50:54 AM »
Quote from: gcrank1 on April 27, 2011, 05:44:22 PM
BB, I tried holding the borrowed I-Pad up toward the target, like I see folks do on TV with their phones, but it didn't seem to take a picture.......I don't know.....

LOL....

I too have a 25/35,(Trotter special) so far I have only fired 117G and a couple 100G bullets. Its a good shooter. The barrel is slender, but of unknown history. Eskimo got it for me in a trade. Of coarse Larry assembled the barrel for me.

I also have a 32-20 (Trotter special) with a slow twist barrel and its a MARVELOUS 125g bullet shooter!! It REALLY woke up once I started loading 7.62x39 bullets in it! I have some 150 and 174g bullets too, but haven't tried them yet. I'll have to create my own loads for them...
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2011, 05:20:08 AM »
I do always look at the Greenhill charts for twist, it's not perfect, but a good starting point, then err to the fast side.
With a marginal twist for a given bullet length you can sometimes overcome a deficit of twist with velocity, but don't count on it (or be prepared for disappointment). Of course, jacketed bullets allow this in a better way than lead, and don't expect to make a big heavy bullet do it lest you find your recoil limit long before bullet stability.
The 25-35 is a cartridge with an interesting history, worth looking up if you haven't read about it. It is not a 250-3000, but is a classic for a single shot. Without the limitations of a lever gun tube magazine the better BC pointy bullets can stretch the range.
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Offline garbhead

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2011, 06:22:05 AM »
Trail Boss is looking very interesting to me...must be fluffy because a 1# sized jug has only 9 oz in it...probably be good to fill up those large cases more....
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Offline Spanky

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2011, 06:55:17 AM »
Quote from: garbhead on April 28, 2011, 06:22:05 AM
Trail Boss is looking very interesting to me...must be fluffy because a 1# sized jug has only 9 oz in it...probably be good to fill up those large cases more....

Give it a try, it's good stuff. ;)
It's kinda funny looking powder though, each flake has a hole in the middle like a donut. ???
Burns real clean too.



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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2011, 11:37:52 AM »
It's so fluffy it is hard to believe. The little 6.5 gr. weighed load in the 25-35 case looks to be about 2/3 s full or better. No worries about powder position at all. It does have a distinctive aroma,too.
I ran through some other forums on it and am not the first one to notice more velocity that the data would indicate, usually it's the other way around.
For my jacketed loads I started with Little Gun, but think a slower powder should be better, so I switched to AA2520 (in the realm of 4895, 4320 and 4064, IIRC). Im getting 2530fps with the Hornady 90gr. SP.
Weather here is back to drizzle and 41 today, no chrono test.
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"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
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We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline bikerbeans

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Re: Adventures with the 25-35
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2011, 02:43:29 PM »
Quote from: gcrank1 on April 28, 2011, 11:37:52 AM
Weather here is back to drizzle and 41 today, no chrono test.

drive over to my place tomorrow, Sunny & 60.  I am headed to the gun club with 4 or 5 rifles and a boatload of ammo.  If I pull the trigger often enough I may just hit something. ;D

BB
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RIP Tom: Tom Nolan, ( bikerbeans) passed away this afternoon (02-04-2021).

Why be difficult, when with a little extra effort you can be impossible?

Wife's Handis;  300 BLKOUT

MINE:  270W, 308x444, 44 Bodeen, 410 shorty rifled slug gun, 445 SuperMag Shikari, 45 ACP shorty,  45-70 Shikari, 45 Cal Smokeless MZ, 50cal 24" SS Sidekick, 50 cal 24" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Huntsman, 50 cal 26" Sidekick, 50-70 Govt Shikari, Tracker II 20 ga shorty, 20 ga VR Pardner, 20ga USH, 12ga VR NWTF, 12ga Tracker II shorty WITHOUT scope, 12ga USH, 10 ga  Pardner Smoothbore slug gun & 24ga Profino Custom rifled slug gun.
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