Obama owns NYC

[yellowtail3]

Retired or disabled military are most definitely  not on any teat they earned what they are getting which is not that great.
Pat

Sure they are, retired, on the tit. 50% at 20, and 75% at 30? That's on the tit, alright. A sweet deal. NYC cops get it pretty sweet, too.

who says gov't service don't pay?

[Casull]

Sure they are, retired, on the tit. 50% at 20, and 75% at 30? That's on the tit, alright.

I find that response smarmy and completely disrespectful.      Given what a soldier earns and what they do, that is a barely adequate reward. 

[wreckhog]

I suspect that ironglow is the only NYS resident who believes that upstate taxes carry downstate.

[ironglow]

  Taxes are high enough here...and a good share of them go to the parasites in the big cities.  Much lower cost electricity is generated with the Robert Moses project up near Niagara Falls, but since the downstate politicians have the voting power..they have for years, sucked the electricity generated around the falls..down to the Big (rotten) apple..

  One thing I will give you is that the denisens of the big cities have less freedom, less options and more restrictions than we do in rural areas..     But hey!..they keep electing the liberal/socialist 'control freaks' into office !

  Biggest problem ois that these same jerks think we should all labor under leftist/communist ideaology...so they jam through some regrettable state-wide laws..

  I live about the same distance from NY City as is Richmond, VA,  Morgantown, WVA, or Augusta, Maine..and I don't like NY City's meddling any better  than those other two locations would !

[jimster]

Not hate TM, but surely some disgust..  I don't need to prove my contention to the residents of about 85% of NY State...those who don't live in the big cities.  What holds tyrue for NYC is true of most big cities in the north.  They have the numbers of voting bodies..so they bleed the rest of us !

  It is likely I don't have to prove that to;

  1) Michiganders living outside Detroit, Flint & Lansing

Absolutely correct...I lived in Michigan all my life, Detroit bled the entire state, out voted the entire state, and after more than 1/3 of it fell, we finally have the votes now to out vote them, at least we did last time. 

You don't need to prove anything Ironglow, it actually happened, we watched it happen for years. I'm sure it's the same everywhere.

Jim

[yellowtail3]

Sure they are, retired, on the tit. 50% at 20, and 75% at 30? That's on the tit, alright.

I find that response smarmy and completely disrespectful.      Given what a soldier earns and what they do, that is a barely adequate reward.

As a former military man who grew up in a military family and whose father was also a career officer, I find your finding my response disrespectful to be... unpersuasive.

Go in at 23, retire as an full Commander of 44 at 20 years, and tell me that's not some some gravy money... esp if you make O-6.

[Casull]

As a former military man who grew up in a military family and whose father was also a career officer, I find your finding my response disrespectful to be... unpersuasive.

Go in at 23, retire as an full Commander at 20, and tell me that's some some gravy money... esp if you make O-6.

Or how about this.  Go in at 23, retire at 24 . . . because you're dead.  BTW, I definitely find your response unpersuasive.

[powderman]

As a former military man who grew up in a military family and whose father was also a career officer, I find your finding my response disrespectful to be... unpersuasive.

Go in at 23, retire as an full Commander at 20, and tell me that's some some gravy money... esp if you make O-6.

Or how about this.  Go in at 23, retire at 24 . . . because you're dead.  BTW, I definitely find your response unpersuasive.

YEP, it happens. We owe our very lives to our brave warriors. Most of us are thankful, some appreciate nothing. POWDERMAN. 

[us920669]

Speaking of Obama in NY, I watched a little TV news coverage.  He was scoring some photo-ops with police and fire, milking the bin Laden hit.  All the fresh-faced recruits were tickled pink, at least those in the front row, but there was a guy in a suit standing beside him up front - big guy, about 60, kind of gruff looking.  Must have been a wheel, maybe a commissioner or something.  When Obama was finished yakking he turned to shake his hand.  The guy shook Obama's hand, but he never looked at him, just stared off into space with a very grim expression.  Hard to describe but it was just pure contempt.  Priceless.

[yellowtail3]

Or how about this.  Go in at 23, retire at 24 . . . because you're dead.  BTW, I definitely find your response unpersuasive.

YEP, it happens.

It does, and is very grim. I wish it weren't so. Let's keep our guys out of places they ought not be.

We owe our very lives to our brave warriors. Most of us are thankful, some appreciate nothing. POWDERMAN. 

No, actually we don't owe our lives to our brave warriors, laudable though their services may be (or sometimes, not laudable). The whole bit about of owing our freedom to military power is... just cliche. You can stretch real hard and make a tenuous argument for it, but it's mostly lame cliche. I am not in the least surprised that you buy it, Powderman.

[wreckhog]

Speaking of Obama in NY, I watched a little TV news coverage.  He was scoring some photo-ops with police and fire, milking the bin Laden hit.  All the fresh-faced recruits were tickled pink, at least those in the front row, but there was a guy in a suit standing beside him up front - big guy, about 60, kind of gruff looking.  Must have been a wheel, maybe a commissioner or something.  When Obama was finished yakking he turned to shake his hand.  The guy shook Obama's hand, but he never looked at him, just stared off into space with a very grim expression.  Hard to describe but it was just pure contempt.  Priceless.

Old guys can be like that about everything.

[ironglow]

Or how about this.  Go in at 23, retire at 24 . . . because you're dead.  BTW, I definitely find your response unpersuasive.

YEP, it happens.

It does, and is very grim. I wish it weren't so. Let's keep our guys out of places they ought not be.

We owe our very lives to our brave warriors. Most of us are thankful, some appreciate nothing. POWDERMAN. 

No, actually we don't owe our lives to our brave warriors, laudable though their services may be (or sometimes, not laudable). The whole bit about of owing our freedom to military power is... just cliche. You can stretch real hard and make a tenuous argument for it, but it's mostly lame cliche. I am not in the least surprised that you buy it, Powderman.

   Sure Yellow;
   The Britush just went ahgead and agreed to it in 1776, when we wanted our independence ..and they did it again in 1812.  Naturtally, the Nazis and the sons of the Samrai did not have any negative designs..
   So many of you lefties just don't understand 'deterrence'.  Gorbachev understood it in Rekyavik..easily enough. 
 
    Ronaldus Magnus had it right..." No nation was ever attacked because it was too strong..but only when it was perceived as too weak".

   Sometimes we have been tried in the past...when some aggressor considered us to be a "paper tiger".  It is those who cut military budgets and cut strength and development of advanced weapons systems such as the "Strategic Missle defense"..who bring us to the brink or actually into war !
   
    Aggressive personalities laugh at weakness !

     

[powderman]

The whole bit about of owing our freedom to military power is... just cliche. You can stretch real hard and make a tenuous argument for it, but it's mostly lame cliche.


yellow. You just proved my point, you seem to appreciate nothing. I'm sure our service men and women past, present, and future will be happy to know that they are not needed and that all those who gave their lives so you could disrespect them died in vain. POWDERMAN. 

[yellowtail3]

  Sure Yellow;
   The Britush just went ahgead and agreed to it in 1776, when we wanted our independence

that was in the 1700s....

..and they did it again in 1812. 

early 1800s. When was the last time this country's existence or our 'freedom' was imperiled? We live in a pretty safe neighborhood, unlike... the poor Poles, who are stuck on the highway between Russia and Germany.

Naturtally, the Nazis and the sons of the Samrai did not have any negative designs..

ah, our best war ever... played to all our strengths, and did no substantial damage to us.

   So many of you lefties just don't understand 'deterrence'.  Gorbachev understood it in Rekyavik..easily enough. 

I guess a lefty is someone who doesn't see the world through your eyeglasses? Something close to that, maybe?

It is those who cut military budgets and cut strength and development of advanced weapons systems such as the "Strategic Missle defense"..who bring us to the brink or actually into war !

Is that what President Eisenhower was doing, when he warned about the Military/Industrial complex? When he lamented the cost of a destroyer compared to xyz number of schools?

yellow. You just proved my point, you seem to appreciate nothing. I'm sure our service men and women past, present, and future will be happy to know that they are not needed and that all those who gave their lives so you could disrespect them died in vain. POWDERMAN. 

Maybe the really dumb or very young will think that, along with those who can't get beyond sloganeering and us vs them.

[Casull]

IG and PM, you both have it dead to rights.  Some people are just too ignorant or partisan to see and/or acknowledge the truth.

[yellowtail3]

IG and PM, you both have it dead to rights.  Some people are just too ignorant or partisan to see and/or acknowledge the truth.

Hey, Col. MacGregor says we should cut the military budget 40% - is he an ignorant partisan who hates America? Or maybe he's THINKING??

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/04/26/a_radical_plan_for_cutting_the_defense_budget_and_reconfiguring_the_us_military

And srsly... do you guys really think you owe your freedom to a 700 billion dollar defense budget?

[Casull]

Quote from: ironglow on Today at 11:38:04 AM
  Sure Yellow;
   The Britush just went ahgead and agreed to it in 1776, when we wanted our independencethat was in the 1700s....


Quote
..and they did it again in 1812.  early 1800s. When was the last time this country's existence or our 'freedom' was imperiled? We live in a pretty safe neighborhood, unlike... the poor Poles, who are stuck on the highway between Russia and Germany.


Quote
Naturtally, the Nazis and the sons of the Samrai did not have any negative designs..ah, our best war ever... played to all our strengths, and did no substantial damage to us.

I guess it's just coincidence that our "country's existence or our freedom" have not been imperiled since we became an acknowledged superpower.  Just remember that those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

[Casull]

Hey, Col. MacGregor says we should cut the military budget 40% - is he an ignorant partisan who hates America? Or maybe he's THINKING??

Oh my, you found A colonel that seems to agree with you.  Congratulations.  BTW, I wonder if he would agree with you that our military people have had no part in defending our freedom.   

[Casull]

And srsly... do you guys really think you owe your freedom to a 700 billion dollar defense budget?

No, you're right.  I must owe my freedom to the budgets for NPR, welfare, school lunch programs, the NEA. etc.

[yellowtail3]

I guess it's just coincidence that our "country's existence or our freedom" have not been imperiled since we became an acknowledged superpower.  Just remember that those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

Well, our actual existence and freedom hasn't been imperiled by external power since 1812, really, with exception of Cold War Russia. That's long gone. MAD remains in place.

You'll never catch me saying we should abolish the military - I'm not a pacifist - but the old slogans about owing our freedom to the sound of a F-15 on 'burner are just lame.

Read MacGregor's article. It is compelling. I'm going to guess you did not read it? IF you did... what did you find unpersuasive? What holes where there?

[yellowtail3]

Oh my, you found A colonel that seems to agree with you.  Congratulations.  BTW, I wonder if he would agree with you that our military people have had no part in defending our freedom.   

He probably wouldn't agree, but since I've not taken that position, it is a moot point.

[ironglow]

  So Yellow is showing his true colors..just another libbie who probably figures all the bad guys in the world would just leave us alone if we disarmed..became gullible fools and played kissy with the enemy.
  Again..you libbies have such a difficult time comprehending "deterrence"..why is that ?  You claim to be a veteran, why do you disrespect the military so much.   Is it because you were stuck in, ... or chose a "pussycat" outfit ?  I guess outfits like that do exist..
     When you say the Military doesn't serve us or deter the enemy;  at least just say you're only speaking for yourself !

    Truthfully, we have today the best trained, best conditioned, most professional military we ever had, despite the efforts of the PC crowd in Washington to destroy it's morale and drive out these finest ever troops.
  Though these troops are by and large much younger than you or I;  ...I at least have much respect for them, their abilities and how they are keeping the few million Osama wannabes off our back.
      Obviously there are some people so self-centered and jaded, they can't even muster a bit of gratitude.  But for those who can, here's a little reminder for all who can appreciate our fine, young troops:

  http://www.countrysavedeca.com/half.html


  Probably a bit more of a man than the average "community organizer" right ?

[yellowtail3]

  So Yerllow is showing his true colors..

who, me? What colors? You're colorblind...

just another libbie who probably figures all the bad guys in the world would just leave us alone if we disarmed..qnd played the gullible fool.

See? Colorblind (and willfully so)

You claim to be a veteran

I don't claim anything.. I yam what I yam.

, why do you disrespect the military so much.

just because one doesn't go with hokey slogans and jingoistic hero-worship doesn't make one disrespectful... but I understand how you might take that position. You've got to.

Is it because you were stuck in or chose a "pussycat" outfit  I guess outfits like that exist..

I don't know; multiple shore stations and three ships. Pussycat outfits? You'll have to tell me what those are. Did you experience one during your time in uniform?

When you say the Military doesn't serve us or deter the enemy;

never said that...

Truthfully, we have today the best trained, most professional military we ever had

we ought to, much money as we throw at it.

despite the efforts of the PC crowd in Washington to destroy it's morale and drive out these finest ever troops.

I didn't know there was such an effort - who is leading it? Do they have a website laying out their agenda for this destroy morale and drive 'em out! mission?

[powderman]

Naturtally, the Nazis and the sons of the Samrai did not have any negative designs..ah, our best war ever... played to all our strengths, and did no substantial damage to us.



yellow. What a totally ignorant unfeeling statement, even for you. Many thousands of American families would definitely disagree with you and did irrepairable damage with all the dead and wounded veterans. My Dad went through hell to give you the right to run your yap. POWDERMAN. 

[Casull]

the old slogans about owing our freedom to the sound of a F-15 on 'burner are just lame.

Please explain . . . or just post some contrarian glib retort (I'm betting on the latter).

[yellowtail3]

yellow. What a totally ignorant unfeeling statement, even for you. Many thousands of American families would definitely disagree with you and did irrepairable damage with all the dead and wounded veterans. My Dad went through hell to give you the right to run your yap. POWDERMAN. 

Let me explain, Grasshopper. When I say, did no substantial harm to us... that's the truth, compared to other countries. War wasn't fought here. England's cities (in the south, anyhow) were burned. They suffered huge material losses compared to us, and about the same number of people. We lost around 400K - a high and hard human toll, but compare to 10-20 MILLION Chinese, 5 million Poles, 7 or 8 million Germans, over 20 MILLION Russians (half military, roughly). No bombers flew over the US (oh, I know about the E14Y, it doesn't count). We started the war with something like 40% of the world's industrial capacity, with much slack in our economy due to depression; Japan had about 4%, Germany and Russia about 14% or so each.

No, as a country, World War 2 was a boon to us - left us infinitely more powerful than we began, and played to all our strengths.

Maybe you should take a little nap...

[ironglow]

  The link I provided in post #53 still stands..and here's another.    Patriots ..enjoy;

  http://www.mphpa.org/classic/VET_TRIBUTES/Thank-a-Veteran.htm

[yellowtail3]

  The link I provided in post #53 still stands..

Well, it's still there, so I guess it stands, sort of. Or just lays there.

[powderman]

yellow. Well shucks whats 400,000 American lives lost?? A mere pittance.  I can see why you would consider that no significant loss. I've got a pic of my Dad kneeling over the grave of a 1st cousin on one of the many islands he fought on. Lost several other family members too + friends of the family. My family thought it was significant. The church during the war asked a woman to teach Sunday school, she said no, it was a mans job. The preacher reminded her that there were no men left in the church. Darn right it was significant. POWDERMAN. 

[yellowtail3]

yellow. Well shucks whats 400,000 American lives lost?? A mere pittance.

If you say so. I wouldn't.

  I can see why you would consider that no significant loss.

Evidence in your posts is, you don't see clearly.

I've got a pic of my Dad kneeling over the grave of a 1st cousin on one of the many islands he fought on. Lost several other family members too + friends of the family.

You lost several family members in WW2? Immediate family? Sorry for you loss. How old were you in 1945?

The church during the war asked a woman to teach Sunday school, she said no, it was a mans job. The preacher reminded her that there were no men left in the church. Darn right it was significant.

I thought you said 400,000 lost was a mere pittance. Those were your words, right?