Author Topic: Duracoating in Chamber and Bore?? (Read 2034 times)

Dinny · « **on:** June 04, 2011, 06:42:39 PM »

I finally got my three rifles back from the coater. Overall, they look fine but I have a few concerns. Neither the chamber nor the muzzles were plugged for the coating application. On all three barrels, the Duracoat is in the chamber and last 1" of the barrel from the muzzle. I carefully used a 45 cal brass cleaning brush to clean the Maxi chamber and muzzle. There's still coating in there but it is thin.
Is this barrel safe to shoot? Could shooting a lead bullet or two clean the remaining coating out of the barrel? What else should I do to clean the chamber? Brass chambers fine as is.

I plan to clean the other two barrels once I get to Ft. Sill and find a house. The Maxi was a gift to my mother and I want to ensure she is set-up and ready for deer season.

Thanks, Dinny

rebel49 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 04, 2011, 07:25:07 PM »

Well you didn't tell me about this when we talked today. That's meesed up!!!!
Try some acetone and a tight fitting brush and try scubbing it out. Just keep soaking it with acetone and scubbing. Watch the exterior finish so you don't damage that. This maybe tough removal.
Rebel49

Dinny · « **Reply #2 on:** June 05, 2011, 05:11:53 AM »

I had this same problem before when my first Handi was coated, kinda. The coating was just a fine overspray that was easily cleaned with just a pull through of a boresnake. Not the case this time... Thanks for the advice, I'll give it a try.

Thanks, Dinny

knight0334 · « **Reply #3 on:** June 05, 2011, 06:00:28 AM »

Clean up the chamber completely for sure. And as much of the bore as possible, bullets will get the rest of the bore.

jason045 · « **Reply #4 on:** June 05, 2011, 06:15:39 AM »

If the bore and chamber area was thoroughly degreased as everything else should have been pre-application, you are going to have a tough time. I got a little overspray in the muzzle of my slug gun unknowingly. I let it cure a full three weeks before I shot it. After 25 rounds of 3" brenneke black magics I can still see a little in there. Doesnt eseem to be affecting accuracy but this is a shotgun. Probably would cause you some problems in a rifle bore. You should try applying the duracoat yourself dinny. The shake and spray kit they have is amazingly easy to use and results are beautiful. This duracoat is some extremely tough stuff. If you follow the surface prep procedure. I have it on four handis and it has yet to come off the breech face of any of them. My .500 shorty has about 200 rounds downrange and some rugged use throughout last deer season.

Dinny · « **Reply #5 on:** June 05, 2011, 06:32:34 AM »

I'm gonna scrub them like crazy and then shoot away. Who knows maybe I'm making something out of nothing.

Thanks, Dinny

quickdtoo · « **Reply #6 on:** June 05, 2011, 06:45:12 AM »

It's just paint Dinny, remove it where ya don't want it.

Tim

https://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2539343

Dinny · « **Reply #7 on:** June 05, 2011, 07:30:10 AM »

More dismal news, I got the 30-30 barrel here on GBO from a member that clearly identified it as having some surface rust with a spotless bore. I thought, no problem, it will get coated. Yesterday when I got this barrel, I could see where the rusty spots were. It appears as if the barrel wasn't blasted before coating. In the coater's defense, there's blast media down in the ejector mechanism. It is easily cleaned from this area with air or a high-pressure cleaner/degreaser. I removed the sights today just to learn that they did not remove them for coating. There's rust and bluing under there...

I believe this will be the last time this coater gets my business. I think I'll take Jason's advice and do it myself.

Thanks, Dinny

Dinny · « **Reply #8 on:** June 05, 2011, 08:01:55 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on June 05, 2011, 06:45:12 AM

It's just paint Dinny, remove it where ya don't want it.

I will try, but it may not be all that easy. We'll see. $:-\$

Thanks, Dinny

bikerbeans · « **Reply #9 on:** June 05, 2011, 08:50:09 AM »

Dinny,

All 3 of your barrels are now worthless, I will be over later to dispose of them for you.

Sorry about you luck with the coater, is he related to the smith who chopped your BC barrel?

I have zero experience with Duracoat but I ain't afraid to spray paint a barrel and I know you can get enough material on the barrel breech to prevent good lockup. Also same issue with the underlug pivot and latch shelf. I would check as it sounds like the fellow wasn't very careful.

BB

quickdtoo · « **Reply #10 on:** June 05, 2011, 08:59:16 AM »

BB makes a good point, there's a warning in the FAQs on that exact problem that Dale had when he did a paint job.

Here's some more help, since the bore and chamber obviously(hopefully!

) weren't blasted, the coating should come right off with a solvent(MEK or laquer thinner) or a good epoxy paint remover which seems to work to remove DC.

Tim

http://www.ar15.com/lite/topic.html?b=6&f=19&t=239839

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1346078
http://www.lastnlast.com/Zip-Strip_Products.php

parkergunshop · « **Reply #11 on:** June 05, 2011, 09:35:41 AM »

Brownells has bore and chamber plugs for rifle and pistol, and shotguns, six sets for around ten bucks.

They can be used when Parkerizing or coating barrels and actions. This keeps the gunk out of the inside of the part being treated.

However, I have Parkerized dozens of barrelled actions without using bore and chamber plugs without any impact on accuracy that I could tell, two or three shots clears any Parkerizing solution effect out of the bore. I only degrease the outside not the inside of the barrelled receiver being treated.

Warning, Bore plugs can blow out in a Parkerizing or Blueing solution when heated and blow the solution all over the place, care must be taken if used, wear eye protection at the least.

I do remove all sights or scope bases and treat them separately otherwise you get a crummy job as noted earlier. I also Parkerize the scope rings/bases if they are with the rifle to be Parkerized and are made of steel. It is best to have a completely stripped receiver with no parts attached if possible.

You would be amazed at the folks who bring in a rifle with a aluminum trigger guard assembly and think that it will Parkerize.

I any case two or three shots should clear the bore unless the build up is to the point of creating excessive unsafe pressures. It normally only takes 15 minutes or so to Parkerize in the heated stainless steel tank solution.

thejanitor · « **Reply #12 on:** June 05, 2011, 09:57:11 AM »

Dinny- would the crown be less crisp from this if that edge isn't coated perfectly even? If the rest is no big deal you may just have to clean up the very edge of the crown.?. I have no experience with it but as much as it can mess with accuracy maybe it's the only "big" deal..... Hope you figure it out. thejanitor

Dinny · « **Reply #13 on:** June 05, 2011, 10:17:52 AM »

I cleaned most of it from the chambers with acetone. It wasn't easy, but I wasn't as ginger there as I am with the muzzle. As Brent mentioned, I don't want to booger-up the crown any. Another thing has become painfully obvious, they were not parkerized before being coated. I believe I would have one of two things. If the sights were left on, they would be parkerized. If they were removed, I would have parkerizing under them. Neither is the case, the sights are OEM finish and so is the barrel under them...

From the coater's website:

Application Process
KCC will refinish your weapon in a one color finish to camouflage patterns. We offer over 68 colors and over 22 camouflage patterns. We can custom match your color or help you with your camo pattern design. All ferrous metals parts are Parkerized before the application of the DuraCoat product.
KCC will Parkerize your firearm from shades of gray to black.

DuraCoat Application Process

1 - Disassemble the firearm
2 - Aluminum Oxide blasting of the original finish off parts of the firearm.
3 - Parkerize any ferrous metal parts
4 - Apply basecoat of DuraCoat to firearm and accessories
5 - Bake the DuraCoat basecoat finish onto the firearm and accessories
6 - Reassemble the firearm
7 - If chosen apply camouflage patterns as chosen by the client
8 - Bake the Patterned DuraCoat finish again.
9 - Clear Coat is then applied; A Satin Finish, Gloss Finish, or Matte Finish is available
10 - Return of firearm to customer.

Blah, Blah, Blah....no parkerizing!

Thanks, Dinny

Dinny · « **Reply #14 on:** June 05, 2011, 10:26:12 AM »

Quote from: bikerbeans on June 05, 2011, 08:50:09 AM

Dinny,

All 3 of your barrels are now worthless, I will be over later to dispose of them for you.

BB

BB,
I'm starting to think that it may just be easier (and cheaper) to start over with new barrels. I once read online, from another coater, that DC is the only finish that he charges more to remove than apply. My mother's rifle is fine, but mine need to be refinished. I'll try to strip them using the tips here, then send it off to be parkerized and then spray it myself. What a pain!! And all this after a 6 month wait. 3 months ago I took my .357 Max Encore barrel back from him and sold it. Now I'm glad I did, it would be worth half now if he coated it just as well as the others.

Thanks, Dinny

oldsoldja · « **Reply #15 on:** June 05, 2011, 01:48:10 PM »

sherwin williams used to sell, and may still, the actual chemical that they put in paint remover in a thin liquid state. We used this as a booster for hard to remove coatings. the paint remover has a gel that acts as a carrier for this and we would add a pint to the original gallon. we always sand scratch the coating to allow the stuff to seap in. This thin stuff would be perfect, note its very caustic and will burn the crap out of your skin. ( we used to put paint remover on handgrenades when we would play war, lets see them throw them back,hehe) so a bore scrub with wire brush, and plug one end of the barrel, then funnel pour the stuff in and fill it up. then let it sit over night. if its on the outside your going to not let it sit overnight, it will harden and be a pain in the ass to then remove. paint stripper has an agent in it that forms a coating on the outer layer to keep the gel from hardening, so dont rebrush. then one thick gobbed on coating of stripper, then let it sit and penetrate, testing after 5 minutes to see if the coating is lifting. Some paint stripper also stops working as soon as it hits metal, so it cant be scraped off and reused. Good luck.

Spanky · « **Reply #16 on:** June 05, 2011, 04:25:09 PM »

Dinny,

Have you talked to your coater about the issues? It sounds like he halfassed the job and hoped you wouldn't notice. It really sucks to think that some folks work that way but it's the truth.

It'd be interesting to see what he has to say about the lack of parkerizing. He owes you some sort of refund if you ask me.

I hope you can get it all sorted out.

Spanky

Dinny · « **Reply #17 on:** June 05, 2011, 04:43:18 PM »

Spanky,
I plan to call him after we get our stock bolt back. Somehow he ended up with extra parts and couldn't remember that it was screwed into my receiver when he got it. His computer crashed sometime in between when I dropped off my barrels last Nov and when I picked them up yesterday. I contribute that and his poor record keeping to my mother's rifle being coated in a color other than what was requested.

I wish for a happy Handi ending, but it's not looking good...

Thanks, Dinny

Spanky · « **Reply #18 on:** June 05, 2011, 04:52:45 PM »

I really hope you can get it straightened out Dinny. Duracoat is pretty good stuff if it's applied properly... I had two Pardner frames that were rusty and pitted when I got them so I sent them to a local gunsmith. He took them apart, smoothed and polished them and then parkerized them before duracoat. I've been using them for over a year now and they still look perfect.

Spanky

Dinny · « **Reply #19 on:** June 05, 2011, 05:01:22 PM »

I hear ya, but I'm not sure I want him fixing anything else of mine. I, too, have a fine shotgun that was coated by Oakridge Custom Finishing and was pitted and rusty. It looks better now than it did 50 years ago when my grandfather bought it. We'll see how this DIY shake and spray kit works, I may be doing all my own in the future.

Thanks, Dinny

bikerbeans · « **Reply #20 on:** June 05, 2011, 05:09:19 PM »

Quote from: Dinny on June 04, 2011, 06:42:39 PM

once I get to Ft. Sill and find a house.

I can't believe your wife would want you to waste time looking for a house instead of fixing your firearms!

You stayin' put at your new post or does Uncle Sam have plans for you?

BB

Dinny · « **Reply #21 on:** June 05, 2011, 05:12:06 PM »

He has plans...

Thanks, Dinny

Winter Hawk · « **Reply #22 on:** June 05, 2011, 05:57:52 PM »

I dunno who did your work for you, Dinny. This is the fellow I used before, and he did very nice work:

http://gunblue.homestead.com/

It didn't take a month of Sundays either!

-Kees-

Troyboy · « **Reply #23 on:** June 06, 2011, 02:00:06 PM »

I did a pistol and a handi frame. I bought the stuff that gets mixed and applied with a gun. Worked just fine. Took more time to prep the metal and clean the spray gun than painting. I think an airbrush would be just the ticket.

trotterlg · « **Reply #24 on:** June 07, 2011, 02:37:14 PM »

parkergunshop : To keep your bore plugs from blowing out in the parkerizing tank, fill the bore with plain water, the put in the plugs and then into the tank. First few barrels I had the same problem, now about a hundred later not a single blow out. I use wood plugs in mine. Larry

parkergunshop · « **Reply #25 on:** June 07, 2011, 03:20:54 PM »

Trotterlg,

Thanks for the tip, I'm going to Parkerize a couple of rifles next week and will try your trick. Makes sense, Air expands more than water when heated, hence the plugs blowing out.

Another point, if the person who did the Parkerizing for Dinny did not remove the sights, then it is likely that the solution may not have gotten underneath the sights to Parkerize the metal under there.

Sounds like also that Dinny's problems could have been avoid through the use of bore and chamber plugs. It would have only cost $1.50 to use plugs and avoid the internals from getting cruded up.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #26 on:** June 07, 2011, 05:19:45 PM »

Im wondering if the DC in the muzzle will actually be somewhat like a choked muzzle and that few thou' be good for accuracy. We've lapped bores except for the last couple inches to achieve just that.

Dinny · « **Reply #27 on:** June 08, 2011, 12:57:05 PM »

The coater told me to shoot a few bullets through to clean the DC from the muzzle. He said barrel plugging takes too much time. If the brass doesn't chamber then I need to take a bore mop and wrap it with 0000 steel wool and polish the chamber. When asked about the barrel not being coated under the sights, he stated that they didn't remove them because I didn't want the sights coated. I was angered and didn't ask how the barrel was parkerized without the sights being removed. I truly suspect that it wasn't parkerized at all. Is there a way to tape off iron sights and dip the entire barrel for parkerizing without the tape leaking and the sights getting some of the solution on them?

Thanks, Dinny

parkergunshop · « **Reply #28 on:** June 08, 2011, 01:27:39 PM »

Dinny,

It appears that the coater did no Parkerizing at all, taping parts off to not be coated will not work during the process. Fifteen minutes or so in the bath at 180-185 degrees will make short work of any tape I know of. How do you tape off an irregular surface like a sight in the first place?

Your coater was out to make a quick buck, taking short cuts and ending up with mediocre results. Installing bore plugs should be less than a five minute job at the most, time is not an excuse.

Dinny · « **Reply #29 on:** June 08, 2011, 06:34:29 PM »

Thanks PGS, I suspected the same but have no experience with parkerizing. He did tape off the sights from the DC. When looking closely, I can see a line about 1/16" around the sights and scope base where the tape was not properly lined-up. I see, from my research, that DC holds-on better when laid over parkerized steel. That will keep me from spraying any DC myself without having something parkerized first.

Thanks, Dinny