Remington firearms

[pastorp]

Anyone know the story on the current owners of Remington?
 
How's their quality, I know the new Marlins quality has sure gone down since remington bought them out. That's my opinion at least.

It seems like all the oldtime American gun makers are in trouble in one way or another. Sure hope they can survive.

Whats your take on all this, Do you think the american made firearms industry is doomed?

Regards,

[BBF]

If they keep sending the manufacturing process overseas and sell out to huge Corps. I would say "Yes".

[Graybeard]

If they keep sending the manufacturing process overseas and sell out to huge Corps. I would say "Yes".

What are you talking about? What in the current line up of Remington Firearms are made overseas?

As to the OP's question I hear a lot of pissing and moaning but question how many of them have actually bought NEW Remington firearms lately. I have and other than the fact I prefer the older triggers to the new I really don't see a problem with the quality of those I have personally purchased nor those I have handled in the process of deciding.

I own at least seven or eight M700 and Model Seven's purchased within the last few years and have seen no deterioration in quality of those I own. I do not like the X Mark Pro trigger. Loved the X Mark but not the Pro version.

So far I have two rifles with it both M700s both I think made in 2010. The first was an XHR and the latest a limited edition with CDL stock and stainless metal and fluted barrel in .280 Remington. On the XHR I tried to adjust the trigger and the pull got heavier not lighter and no amount of adjusting will now change the pull weight so it really wasn't adjustable at all. On the newer one I've made no attempt to adjust and won't bother since the adjustment screw is about to fall out now and the pull as I got it was from 4.25 to 4.5 pounds for three pulls with my RCBS gage.

So other than the trigger change which I think was a mistake I just haven't seen a problem with the guns I'm getting. I definitely will be buying fewer new Remington rifles tho if they don't do something about that X Mark Pro trigger.

[Squib]

if you're poor like me start liking H&R because they're cheap and accurate, and remington gets a cut for ownership/royalties.  everyone wins! 

[pastorp]

Bill, I bought a new marlin guide gun after remington bought them out and it was terrible. I took it to my gunsmith and he got it working. You could not even load through the loading gate or cycle ammo. After he fixed it I was so discusted I just sold it.

I also bought a new remington 700 cdl last fall. It seems ok so far but I had surgery right after I bought it so I still have not finished sighting it in. Don't yet know how it will shoot.

I think the overseas observation is valad, What with winchester being made in japan, & browning as well. Arn't some parts sourced out overseas? Most optics seem to be any more........... 

Regards,

[Lloyd Smale]

some of it probably came from the sps line. They were made to be competive in price and the fit and finish isnt the best on them. That been said ive got one in 3006 that will shoot 3/4 inch 5 shot groups at a 100 yards. Not bad for a sporter weight 06 at any price level.

[BBF]

Isn't Winchester getting their rifles build in Japan? There may be others that at least bring some of their stuff in from overseas.

[pastorp]

Lloyd, I haven't even looked in the box stores at their remingtons. But your probably right, if they have a cheeper line that could be the problem. Graybeard says he has not noticed a decline in quality but the one bolt gun he mentioned was a cdl which I'm thinking is their better, more expensive, line. The 257bob I bought last year was a cdl as well and its fit & finish looks ok. I believe I'm close to being recovered enough to start shooting it some now.

I know the Marlin boys were sure upset about the QC right after the sell out to rimington. Marlinowners still has a rant forum to adress that issue.

I know their express shotgun line is not as nice as the older wingmasters. The one my kids gave me years ago worked ok though. 

Regards,

[Lloyd Smale]

Heck pastorp ive noticed marlins going downhill well before remington took them over.

[OldSchoolRanger]

What are you talking about? What in the current line up of Remington Firearms are made overseas?

[/quote]
GB - I think that scatterbrain is talking about the "Spartan" line of guns by Remington.  They are made by Baikal and imported from Russia, by Remington.   Also the Remington Genesis BP rifle was made for Remington, by I believe, Traditions, a Spanish company.  Both lines have the Remington name rollmarked on the guns.

[Lloyd Smale]

all of the spartan shotguns and the mauser actioned rilfles and there newest bolt 22 are all made oversees

[Graybeard]

You guys are talking ancient history I believe. The Spartan line is no longer being imported to my knowledge. That failed experiment only last a couple years I think. The Mauser rifles were also dropped after a short run. I dunno about the muzzle loader you mention. I've never seen one and for sure am not looking for one.

Let's discuss what they are doing not what they once upon a short time did.

[Swampman]

Cerberus Capital Management, L.P. is one of the largest private equity investment firms in the United States. The firm is based in New York City and among other things they own Remington.

Remington quality and accuracy has never been better.  None of their current products are made overseas.

It's pretty clear that the average gun owner knows very little about what's going on with the American firearms industry.

[Swampman]

Heck pastorp ive noticed marlins going downhill well before remington took them over.

A very true statement.  I've even owned 1970s and 1980s Marlins that were very poorly fit and finished.

[Swampman]

I know their express shotgun line is not as nice as the older wingmasters.

They still make Wingmasters.  The Express model is to compete with overseas junk and Mossberg.  It does that well for a very reasonable price.  Mine functions as well as any of my Wingmasters.

[OldSchoolRanger]

Traditions Yukon muzzle loader (photo's 1, 2, 3) & Remington Genesis muzzle loader (4).

[Swampman]

Remington quit importing them several years ago because of all the problems they had with them.

[ironglow]

  I'm going to Savage..getting the accutrigger as a free bonus !

[Swampman]

Not sure why anyone would want an "accutrigger' but it's your choice.

[Lloyd Smale]

bill im guilty of not keeping up with the manufactures. I based my statement of the fact that my local dealer has new examples of each of them on the shelf still. I just took for granted they had been aquired recently and may have been as im sure the suppliers still have them

You guys are talking ancient history I believe. The Spartan line is no longer being imported to my knowledge. That failed experiment only last a couple years I think. The Mauser rifles were also dropped after a short run. I dunno about the muzzle loader you mention. I've never seen one and for sure am not looking for one.

Let's discuss what they are doing not what they once upon a short time did.

[pastorp]

Seems to me that it was only 3-4 years ago that Remington was importing the Russian made double rifles. And they are owned by a investment Corp. I could be wrong but I believe ruger is the only gun mfg. Not owned by one of these investment corp. in the USA.

S&W is owned by one I believe and there has been a lot of weeping & gnashing of teeth over their built in gunlocks and air weight models. Seems anything new is resited. Personally I think the new S&W guns are fitted better and are more accurate than the old models ever were. I like them so much that I own about 6 and have not had any problems with the dreaded lock. I just never use it. Treat it like it's not there.

Too bad about Thompson center & Winchester though. I for one hope they survive.

Regards,

[Swampman]

Winchester is doing fine in South Carolina.  T/C wasted too much money on TV shows, advertising, and boltaction rifles that nobody wanted.

[Harry Snippe]

Heck pastorp ive noticed marlins going downhill well before remington took them over.

A very true statement.  I've even owned 1970s and 1980s Marlins that were very poorly fit and finished.

So that new Guide gun is the  greatest thing you just bought ? I mean why waste one's time if it were not up to parr .
If you read your posts over the years I see many times were you have said one thing , then turned around to say another . So it shows your just a trol in my book .

[ironglow]

Not sure why anyone would want an "accutrigger' but it's your choice.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
  One of the reasons Savages have a great reputation for accuracy..
  How much do some guys pay for a Timney or rifle basix ? 

[Lloyd Smale]

Harry ill go to his defense. Personaly i dont think i know that marlins quality has come down over the last 10 years. I also know that quality control at ruger is about non existant. Does it keep me from buying them. Hell no! There still making guns that nobody else will make in chamberings nobody else will do. What other choise does a guy have for a reasonable priced 4570 levergun or a 44 mag single action. I buy them with open eyes. Knowing that im not buying some jewel and that those companys dont have the sun rising and setting on them like some think. I know theres a good chance that about a 1/3 of them will need a trip back to the factory and about every one of them will need me to spend some more money to get it to where it pleases me. It just angers me that with about a 2 minute inspection about half these problems would be caught and corrected. It isnt the way these companys think though. They ship them all out knowing that about half of them wont be ever shot or will maybe have a box or two of ammo shot out of them by inexperiecned gun owners that wouldnt know a mistake if it bit them on the nose.  Then the 1/2 that get sent back are sent to service reps that are schooled in giving excuses as to why its not bad enough to fix and they ship it right back hopping you will give up. They probably figure that fixing the few guns that come from guys that wont give up is cheaper then improving there quality control to the point these guns dont exist. These companys are run by bean counters not gun people. I talked to a servicer rep at ruger just the other day. Now this is a many who makes his living fixing rugers. Youd think hed be a gun nut? Nope. He told me he had never handloaded a single round of ammo in his life.  Now how many gunsmiths do you know that havent handloaded?  Like i said i dont bitch. Ill send them back as long as they do fix them and ill put a few more dollars into a gun to get what i like but i wont sit here and brag on manufactures that put out products like that. They get away with it where no one else can. Just look at the bashing toyota took lately because of a few flaws. Heck if that was the case ruger, marlin and even remington and a few more would be on tv every night.

Heck pastorp ive noticed marlins going downhill well before remington took them over.

A very true statement.  I've even owned 1970s and 1980s Marlins that were very poorly fit and finished.

So that new Guide gun is the  greatest thing you just bought ? I mean why waste one's time if it were not up to parr .
If you read your posts over the years I see many times were you have said one thing , then turned around to say another . So it shows your just a trol in my book .

[mcwoodduck]

Isn't Winchester getting their rifles build in Japan? There may be others that at least bring some of their stuff in from overseas.

Some are being made at the FN facility in the south  either GA or SC.  I forget where FN makes all the Machine guns for the Army.
FN owns Winchester and Browning

[parkergunshop]

Gunsmiths who have used Remington actions to build benchrest rifles have related that Remingtons quality control has gone down over the past 10 years.   

The are having to do more precision machining and accuracy work than before when building super accurate rifles useing the 700 action as a basis.

[Swampman]

If you read your posts over the years I see many times were you have said one thing , then turned around to say another .

It just means you have poor comprehension skills.

[Swampman]

The are having to do more precision machining and accuracy work than before when building super accurate rifles useing the 700 action as a basis.

Like mount a scope, and pull the trigger.

[mcwoodduck]

The are having to do more precision machining and accuracy work than before when building super accurate rifles useing the 700 action as a basis.

Like mount a scope, and pull the trigger.

As technology advances and production tequiniques are changed to use less materials or time in production to make a gun accurate enough to get the job done.
As far as hunting rifles 1" groups tat 100 yards are more than accurate enough for hunting.
sub 1" groups are accurate enough for police snipers who shoot under 60 yards on average.
The bench rest shooters want a sub .25" group at 100 yards.  The construction of those guns are differnt than your basic hunting rifle.
Reminton products are strong and accurate, but not stronger or more accurate than needs to be. 
Much like race cars are completly different than your standard coup or SUV and only share a few componets and a name.