impossible primer seating?????

[stxhunter]

I recently started gearing up to load for the 223 Rem. Got this, got that, and got started. Everthing was fine until I started to seat primers. I am using a RCBS bench priming tool. Could not the get primers seated anything below flush with the case head. If you really leaned on it you might get .001in. below flush but I think thats just because I was flattening out the primer. I used my digital caliper to measure the primer pocket depth and they averaged around .116in. to .117in. in depth. Primers ran around .120. So then I purchased a Redding primer pocket uniformer thinking that was the big fix. Not so! The pocket uniformer will take the primer pocket to .120in. max. How can you expect to get primers around .003 to .004in. below flush when the average primer is .120 and the max you can get a primer pocket down is .120in.?? I realize the primer will compress down on the primer anvil some but I can hardley get them down maybe .001 and thats it. I have tried Hornady brass, Winchester, and Lapua with same results with all. I have also tried Federal small rifle Match, Remington 7 1/2, and CCI 400 primers which as best I can measure are all about .120in. overall. I am loading for an AR type rifle so I am being cautious to get my primers down. I have no ideah what to try next short of giving up and buying factory loads. Never ran into this problem loading pistol or larger rifles. Guess I'm not holding my tongue right!  LOL... HELP PLEASE!!!!! 

[norman]

Are you using military cases i.e. Lc, wcc or commercial brass?
 

[stxhunter]

All commercial brass. All new Hornady, Wichester and Lapua.

[necchi]

Uhm, Primers only need to be flush with the case.
 I've never needed to seat primers below flush, where'd you get the idea?
 
 I prime with a Lee hand held, when the lever stops moving, I pull the primed case and set it on the flat table, If the case doesn't rock, I'm good, 

[norman]

Dont know now.  I use the Lee Ram-Prime and use cci and winchester primers and the only trouble I have had was with military cases and either not getting all the crimp out or getting too much.  Can you prime on your press?  Might give that a try.  HTH

[stxhunter]

The Lyman and Sierra loading manuals I have say to seat the primer .003 to .004 below flush. They say it is important for a semi auto to prevent slam fires when the bolt slams shut as the RA type rifles have floating fireing pins. Most of the factory ammo I have measured have primers set around .004 below flush.

[OR-E-Gun Bill]

Have you tried using a different priming tool?
After just looking at the RCBS instructions for the Benchtop Primer and seeing the problem you are experiencing, I have to wonder if maybe the priming tool is not adjusted properly or possibly you are using the wrong priming pin. All just shots in the dark but with your trying all the different brands of primers and brass it sounds like it boils down to the priming tool you are using is the culprit.
 
 
Bill

[stxhunter]

I have not tried another primeing tool. I have tried a smaller plunger which would fit inside the primer pocket. May still need to try another priming tool. Maybe the one that came on the Redding press I bought.

[necchi]

The Lyman and Sierra loading manuals I have say to seat the primer .003 to .004 below flush.

 I'll be darned, your right, I found it in my Lyman book. It's actually .003-.005 with a nominal of .004,,
 
Like I say I guess I've always just gone flush, never gave it a second thought, and ain't had trouble yet,
(knock on wood)
, I wonder if it's another rule like, "never exceed max loads"??
 
 Don't know about the Redding, but my Lyman pocket uniforming tools are adjustable. Never messed with'm, I just left'm at the factory setting

[stxhunter]

I never worried a whole lot when loading for a bolt rifle long as they were below flush. Sure would hate to damage my new Bushmaster though by havin primers too high!

[Land_Owner]

REMOVED...Post didn't respond to question asked. sorry.

[mdi]

I would try the priming arm on your Redding press. If you are successful with that then you know the brass and primers are ok. Perhaps the wrong primer rod (large instead of small)?

[stxhunter]

I have tried the primer setup on my Redding press with the same results. I have used a priming rod that would fit up into the primer pocket and the standard small rifle rod with same results. The primers feel as if they bottom out like they should but are still just flush with the case. Like I said, primer pocket depth .120in. and primers overall profile running around .120in. makes it hard to get the primer depth needed. Not sure what to try next.

[necchi]

Not sure what to try next.

How bout just loading an shooting?
FWIW,
Talked to two trusted gents today about this topic (they're both AR shooters) and said flush has been good for them, 
Good Luck,,

[Old Syko]

First of all, there must be a problem with your measuring technique.  Reference the following link for correct measurements.    http://www.jamescalhoon.com/primers_and_pressure.php   


Secondly, if these rounds are to be used in an AR or similar platform with a floating firing pin the proper primers must be used.  A harder cup is called for such as the CCI#41 although other CCI primers work just as well for most of us.  Some of the other brands have softer cups and can possibly cause a slamfire as the action cycles but this is a rare occurrence unless the gun has been modified.


Necchi's "trusted gents" are correct.  Flush is fine.  I burnt up 3,300 of them last weekend alone, through 2 ARs, that were loaded just that way without a hiccup.     

[stxhunter]

Good info necchi and Old Syko. I was concerned about shallow primers because of the slam fire possibility with the AR. I have some CCI 41 primers also. I have been measuring the primers overall which includes the small amount that the primer anvil protrudes from the base of the cup. I know it will press into the cup when compressed into the primer pocket but I did not know if it would go all the way to the dottom of the primer cup. . Guess maybe I am making to big a deal of it but now I am wondering how the factory loads are getting their primers down like they are. The site you gave me is very interesting Old guy. Maybe I just need to shoot for consistancy on my primeing and as long as it is at least flush not worry about it! Guess that will be better than loosing my mind. What little of it I have left! Thanks guys.  

[revbc]

Lube the primer pocket edges with a #2 pencil, makes life easier.  I'll bet it will seat a little further too.

Bobby