Author Topic: gas checks-are they cost effective?  (Read 1308 times)

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Offline hansg/Ups

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gas checks-are they cost effective?
« on: July 21, 2011, 03:16:54 PM »
Are gas checks and their equipment[sizer,lubricator] cost effective with cast bullets,
or is one just as far ahead just using jacketed projectiles??
I'm referring to pistol calibers:357Mag,44Mag,45Colt,rifle calibers:30/30Win,358Win,38/55,45/70Govt.
Thanks.

Offline kbstenberg

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2011, 04:30:05 PM »
  I'm new to casting (2 years) But those with much more knowledge say that with a pistol a GC isn't needed till the upper edge of hot loads. But with rifles when you are pushing over 14 to 16 fps. a check is needed.  As to a sizer I started with the Lee push through an recently got an RCBS lube-sizer. I could live with just the Lee's. But I only shoot 2-300 rounds a month in all my guns.

Offline dakotashooter2

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2011, 11:42:39 AM »
1000 gas checks will cost you about the same as 200 small caliber jacketed bullets. They are actually about the same cost as the lead for the bullet you will cast. A finished cast bullet should still be 1/3-1/4 the cost of a jacketed one.
Just another worthless opinion!!

Offline 45-70.gov

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2011, 01:56:19 PM »
i  find  my lead.....free


my labor  is worth.......i like to cast  so.....free


i was given  2 kegs   of powder  .......free........ minimal  cost for the rest of you


I  HAVE TO PAY FOR PRIMERS


gas checks  cost   about the same as  primers...i have to buy  them  too


GAS CHECKS  DOUBLE THE COST  OF MY AMMO........[3 cents  to  6 cents]


not  using gas checks  gives  me  twice as many rounds per  DOLLAR


will GC  ammo be twice  as good???????????



when drugs are outlawed only out laws will have drugs
DO WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO STOP A DEMOCRAT
OBAMACARE....the biggest tax hike in the  history of mankind
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AFTER THE LIBYAN COVER-UP... remind any  democrat voters ''they sat and  watched them die''...they  told help to ''stand down''

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Offline mechanic

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2011, 03:42:52 PM »
Years ago my Dad went on a casting craze, casting bullets for everything he owned.  By his own admission some time later, the only thing he needed checks on were super fast bullets, like 22-250 and 243, etc.
 
He was pushing larger dia. bullets from his Thompson's over 2000fps without issue.  Just be sure the bullet is sized for the bore, and if you see leading, use a  little tin and harden them up a bit.
 
I have several thousand .35 checks, and I'm using them because my 168 gr. mold requires them.  I also have a 148 gr. flat base mold that I've used to cast #2 alloy for my 357 max without issue.
 
Ben
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Offline Tom W.

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2011, 05:24:57 PM »
Having just sold my Encore today, the only thing that I put gas checks on are my .44 mag with some loads,  my .357, and I have a few that I shoot in my .45 Colt, but no longer have that mold. I Also use them on my .30 cal loads. My handguns all shoot my home made cast bullets.
Tom
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Offline Graybeard

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2011, 07:30:52 PM »
I love gas checked bullets and most of my moulds are for GC bullets. But to answer your question honestly no they are not cost effective these days. Checks for the over .40 cal bullets are running a nickel each. I can remember when I could cast my GC bullets and load ammo for that.

Any new moulds I get will likely be plain base due to cost.


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Offline Lloyd Smale

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2011, 03:33:10 AM »
heres my take on it. I have well over 50 guns i cast for. I dont think theres a single one that doesnt do its best with a gas checked bullet. Through the years ive found them hands down easier to find good loads for in about every gun when compared to plain based bullets. Now this isnt wrote in stone as ive run across a couple gas checked bullet designs that were just crap but its rare and happens much more with plain based molds. Sure they cost a bit more but for my hunting ammo im not shy about bucking up the cost. I tend to go more toward plain based bullets for rolling  beer cans or general plinking but that isnt allways the case either as accuracy is a desiease with me and it just bothers me that my guns arent shooting as well as they can. Now i shoot a 1000 rounds a week on a good week but when you figure how long it takes the average guy to use up a 1000 checks the cost is pretty minor. Biggest problem i have with gas checks isnt the cost its that it seems like everytime i need a specific caliber im out of them and have to wait a few days to get more.
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Offline 45-70.gov

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2011, 05:05:36 AM »
heres my take on it. ................ Biggest problem i have with gas checks isnt the cost its that it seems like everytime i need a specific caliber im out of them and have to wait a few days to get more.


i meant to say that  toooooo
been there  too
when drugs are outlawed only out laws will have drugs
DO WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO STOP A DEMOCRAT
OBAMACARE....the biggest tax hike in the  history of mankind
free choice and equality  can't co-exist
AFTER THE LIBYAN COVER-UP... remind any  democrat voters ''they sat and  watched them die''...they  told help to ''stand down''

many statements made here are fiction and are for entertainment purposes only and are in no way to be construed as a description of actual events.
no one is encouraged to do anything dangerous or break any laws.

Offline anachronism

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2011, 10:21:28 AM »
Gas checks average two to three cents each. Comparable jacketed bullets are running around twenty to thirty cents each. There are cheaper jacketed bullets out there, but they're usually pretty low on the performance scale, especially when compared to properly designed cast bullets. Cast Performance bullets run from thirty to forty cents each, ready to load, which is considerably higher than jacketed bullets. The economics are there for gaschecks, even at todays outrageous prices.

Offline manatee1947

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2011, 12:21:44 PM »
In a word- no. If you need jacketed performance, ie- speed, get jacketed. I stay below 1500 fps, I have never had a leading problem, and the accuracy is more than adequate. I do not load cast for anything below 30 caliber though. It is possible to get excellent performance to 200+ yards without a great deal of trouble, and unless you are antelope hunting in Wyoming, 200 yards will cover 90% or more of all hunting situations.If you need a 400 yard shot, a gas check is not what you need.
remember the starfish

Offline res45

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Re: gas checks-are they cost effective?
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2011, 06:17:17 AM »
I think it depends on many variable as to where gas checks are cost effective for an individual or not,your type of shooting,hunting and economics will most likely dictate where it's cost effective or not.  The equipment plays a big part in cost,you can buy the more expensive custom or iron molds or you can buy the less expensive Lee molds. 
 
 I have all three,one custom two crimp groove 38 cal. GC HP mold on order for NOE,two Lyman 38 cal. molds I bought at a yard sale for $25 each one set of blocks had the handles with it and I also have ten Lee molds from various pistols and rifles some are GC and some are not.  Of the one's that I currently own all have produced good quality and accurate bullets,on a side note just because the mold is designed to cast bullets that take a GC doesn't mean you have to use one on the bullet.  Several of my plinking and med velocity loads shoot just as accurately with the GC left off and no leading. 
 
 What the GC allows me to do is shoot a much softer alloy such as a HP or FP for expansion purposes at a much higher pressure and velocity than I normally could if it were a plain base bullet of the same alloy,leading can be caused by many variables but when it comes to high pressure and high velocity loads combined is where the GC comes into play,it helps seal the bore and protects the bullets base.  My 7.62 x 39mm cast loads I run in my SKS rifles run at an average MV of around 1900+ fps. my 30-30 170 gr. RNPF hunting load 30:1 Lead/Tin alloy run up close to 2100 fps.
 
 As far as a sizer,lubricators go you have several options for lubing and sizing bullets,the Lyman,RCBS,Star lube size are more convenient and less time consuming if time is an issue but they cost more.  For me personally I find tumble lubing or ranch dip lubing my bullets,applying gas check and sizing bullet using the Lee sizing equipment suits my needs.  I make my own lube using Alox and Johnson's paste wax and it works great and I've had no leading issues at any pressure and velocities I shot my cast bullets at.  Some individuals pan lube there bullets,I've done that as well with excellent results. My budget pretty much dictates the process and equipment I use but I feel like I turn out some good quality accurate bullets.
 
 Here are three GC bullets I ranch dip size and GC using the Lee sizers.
 
 
 On the cost of GC bullets vs. jacketed in my case there is no comparison.  To be fair I've pretty much have gotten all my lead alloys for free just by scrounging around over the years and being blessed with good friends that know I cast that bring me lead which I return the favor by casting them some bullets.  So if you throw in the cost of the check and other materials on average you could say my GC bullets any caliber cost me about 5 cent each to make.  If I add up the component cost of say my 30-30 hunting loads it cost me about $2.60 cents for a box of 20 rds. of 170 gr. RNFP GC ammo that will so the same thing as the cheapest 30-30 factory ammo will at $13 per 20 rds.  Of course you have to invest in the necessary equipment to produce ammo that cheap but at some point you will realize the saving especially if your paying $20 to $30+  per box of 100 J bullets.
 
 For the ranges and game I hunt and shoots at seldom over 200 yds. usualy 100 or less mainly due to geographic J bullets are just not needed,I have jacketed bullets in all caliber I shoot but they just sit in there boxes for a rainy day.
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