Iowa to ban lead shot for doves.

[powderman]

http://capwiz.com/iowacarry/issues/alert/?alertid=51571526
 
 
If they can't get the gun they want to take away the ammo. Goldarn liberals. POWDERMAN. 

[GRIMJIM]

The place I go for doves has been requiring steel for a few years now.

[BUGEYE]

if I had to switch to steel, it would require a new shotgun.  so if I still hunted doves, it would force me out of the dove field.

[hunt-m-up]

It's the first dove season we've had, they are calling for steel shot right out of the gate. It's their way of caving to the liberals a little after they blew it through the legislature in a quick vote.

[BUGEYE]

off topic, hunt-m-up,  I've watched a few deer hunting shows filmed in Iowa and that looks like the coldest place in the world to deer hunt.  you guys must be tough

[hunt-m-up]

When it's 10-20 degrees and the wind is blowing down your neck it sometimes seems more crazy than anything, but the deer usually get easier to pattern around food. The worst part is what it does to equipment sometimes. I don't bring bows, mz, guns inside when it's cold like that, the condensation/moisture is a killer when you take it back out in those temps.

[LunaticFringeInc]

I wonder how much longer it will be before we have to use non lead slugs and 00 buck for Deer hunting and shooting things that go bump in the night?  I imagine it wont be too long before we have to use non lead shot for skeet and trap shooting as well.

[Conan The Librarian]

 I've never understood the notion that a gun must last forever. If you need to get a new dove gun, just go buy one. Sell the old one. Somebody will want it.  How old does a shotgun today need to be to be unusable for steel, 30 years old maybe? Except maybe a few low grade or very high grade guns? My Browning BPS pump gun works with steel and it's about 30 years old. Just about anything with interchangeable chokes should be OK.
 
But when you do switch to steel, test your ammo well. Using the cheapo ammo is not the way to go, unless it has improved dramatically in the past few years. I tried steel on pheasants and it was totally unsatisfactory. I never had a clean kill with one. Switching back to lead made a big difference. Almost all clean instant kills.
 
My question about lead for doves is whether it's suitable at all. The pattern density is OK for big birds, but I have a hard time believing that most of the steel loads available will be adequate against these small birds.
 
I'd like to know what non-lead loads might work for doves. If you've got any info, will you please post it?   As it is, this doesn't appear to be a case where the guns and ammo are taken away, it's a case where the targets are taken away because there is no gun or ammo that can legally be used to take them effectively.

[BUGEYE]

conan, I can tell by your post that you're not disabled on a fixed income. I can't just go buy a new shotgun and I would guess that there's a lot of folks out there just like me.
this is nothing but liberal politics as was already stated.  if people keep quietly accepting this crap, we'll soon be restricted to plastic shot and bullets.

[Conan The Librarian]

I'm on a tight budget. If you can afford to hunt, you can afford a new shotgun. If you can't afford a new shotgun, you are probably best off selling your hunting stuff. Especially today, it's one of the cheapest pieces of gear, and the quality is fantastic. The new Mossberg pumps are fabulous values for the money.

[BUGEYE]

conan, I've read a lot of your stuff here and always respected your opinions  but this is some pretty hateful stuff you're saying.  there's a lot of people in the same situation as me and you would have us sell our guns and quit.  I hope your words don't come back to bite you someday.

[Dixie Dude]

My mother is on a SS and gets about $900 a month.  It takes every bit to pay her $325 house payment, groceries, power, water, and a little gasoline for her to drive her 5 year old car.  She can't or couldn't afford anything else.  If she wants or needs something, the family gets it for her by combining their money and buying it for Christmas, her birthday or mother's day.  She has me and my brother but combined there are 8 grandchildren, mostly adults now.  Her wood privacy fence rotted down, so, my son-in-law has his own construction business.  We all chipped in and he rebuilt her fence.  Stuff like that.  A good Mossburg new will cost about $300, used maybe $200.  However, some can't afford that.  If people have a computer, maybe their children or grandchildren bought it for them to keep in touch via email.  Things are tight right now.  My mother hasn't had a COLA raise since Obama has been in office, and he really cares.  Also, if you get Hevishot or bismith shot, it will cost more than lead or steel.  Bismith clumps together when it gets wet or damp too long.  If libs can't outlaw guns, they are going after lead ammo.  I bought my first Browing Auto 5 in 1971 when I turned 18, and kept it for about 15 years.  I sold it because if was fixed choke and couldn't shoot steel, but I was in my 30's so I had a job and good income.  It is not easy to buy things, even today.  I haven't had a good raise in 2-3 years because of the economy and it was less than inflation.  I have had to cut things out and cut back.  It isn't easy and I am still working with the same company for 36 years.  Economy is BAD and getting WORSE.  I can understand fixed income.  I wanted to retire early but can't, because it would eat up my 401(k) too fast. 

[BUGEYE]

Dixie Dude, well said.  I could have bought a mossberg shotgun for what my little netbook cost.
but instead of spending time on the internet (I can't get out much) intertaining myself, I could have sat here and fondled my shotgun.
my wife and I helped my folks and her mother when I was working.  good family on both sides made a big difference in their lives.

[Conan The Librarian]

It's certainly not intended to be hateful. I've given up hunting and target shooting, and really limited my fishing because I need money for putting kids through college. Other things are just cheaper to do, and they're at least as satisfying.

[Conan The Librarian]

I looked it up, and find quite a bit out there related to dove shooting with steel. Some prefer 7s, but others say 6s work a lot better than 7s. This would mean pretty close shots. 1 1/4 ounce loads seem popular. That's quite a stiff load at normal steel velocities.
 
Looks like the motivation for this was from EPA because hawks and eagles eat doves and they are trying to protect the hawks and eagles. Next obvious step is for EPA to outlaw lead for everything, right? Ridiculous premise too. This can't be much of a problem.
 
But all that aside, and I'm no inveterate greeny, the dove fields I've been on are a lot like the duck ponds that motivated the use of steel shot for ducks. These fields get a lot of shooting in a relatively small area, and it's nothing for a shooter to drop about five pounds of lead per day in the area. That's not good.
 
Most uses of lead shot and bullets (and fishing sinkers) aren't as concentrated as these duck ponds and dove fields, so there's no reason to regulate lead out of them.
 
My guess is that a lot of doves are dying slow deaths from the steel, rather than quick deaths.

[S.S.]

looks like we may be stuck with only steel fishing weights before long too.

[1marty]

It's just another end run by the libs. Where I go skeet shooting the state wanted to close it because the lead was "probably" contaminating a lake about one mile away. One of the members of the club who is a chemist ran tests on the lake water-at his expense-and found no lead contamination. The state backed off.

[manatee1947]

I find it hard to accept that the world has left many of us so far behind. I have hunted for a lifetime, most of it to save money, because the game is free. Dove are actually expensive,  because they cost the same as a deer or more usually, one rifle shell vs 4-5 shotgun shells. Last year 3 deer cost me about $20 in freezer paper and ziploc bags. The problem is that states are using the game that is supposed to "belong" to everyone as a big moneymaker with rich guys looking for a trophy. Just like the "Kings deer" in England really, only the rich will e able to afford it, and the free source of food for the poor has disappeared, except for the $ menu @ McD.

[Dixie Dude]

I was in a hunting club that charged $300 a year and we had to do one workday a month.  This was building and repairing shoot houses over fields or shooting lanes, cut grass around two fish ponds, repair fences and gates.  We had 30 members, which included spouses and children under 18.  We only had 800 acres.  Too many people in too small a space.  No drinking while hunting or you would be kicked out.  No illegal hunting either.  We divided the land and numbered the shoot houses and tree stands.  You had to sign in on one and stay there and sign out when you left.  No stalking.
 
However, if I hunt the nearby national forest.  I do not know who will be hunting, if they are drinking.  I cannot use any kind of permanent shooting house or tree stand.  I can stalk, but is it safe?  I can also travel to a one of several large state operated game management areas.  Costs about $30 to hunt.  Only certain days are used for deer hunting.  There are seperate bow, blackpowder, and rifle hunting days.  Distance to the two largest from my house is about 70-75 miles.  They charge $15-20 to camp.  Now if I went during the hunting days they offer, gasoline, camping, and the cost to hunt at 2-3 of these game management areas, I am out the $300.  I do not have to work, and I can stalk, or use a pop up blind, or a tree climber stand.  Don't know which would be better. 
 
My old hunting club started out with only 12-15 members several years ago, but the landowner went up on his price per acre, so instead of raising prices, they allowed more members.  We once could stalk which I preferred, so I left. 
 
There are lots more fishing lakes available and I have a boat, but gasoline is expensive to travel to them and use the boat.  Costs me about $50 just to travel to a large lake and use my boat.  My boat is really too big for just fishing.  It is a fish & ski with inboard engine. 

[BUGEYE]

at one time I belonged to a great club.  didn't deer hunt there but had it all to myself for squirrels during mid-week.  but the property owner started getting offers from other groups and that ran me off.
I think that's the future of hunting, money.

[MGMorden]

My boat is really too big for just fishing.  It is a fish & ski with inboard engine.

This is going a bit off topic, but by all means I'd look into a more appropriate smaller boat.  If you look at the used markets there are a lot of Bass Trackers and similar aluminum boats for sale, which don't take much of a engine to push them along.  My boat is a 16' aluminum Triton Storm.  It's not a speed demon, but it's got plenty of storage space and a large livewell - everything I need for fishing.  It's got a 40HP 4-stroke Mercury on it and on a 12 gallon tank I can usually go fishing 6 to 8 times before I need to put more gas in it. 


As to the hunting club woes, realistically the population is growing.  There is absolutely no way to avoid crowding and a slowly decreasing standard of living as the amount of people living in a given area keeps going up.  It doesn' t mean you have to give up on everything - I still hunt on public lands and I still fish a ton (and I'll be trying my hand at shrimping later this year too - used to do that as a kid with my dad).


Change is inevitable.