Author Topic: abortion  (Read 22500 times)

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Offline ironglow

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Re: abortion
« Reply #90 on: August 16, 2011, 01:29:33 PM »
  Swampy says;
  "   Personally I will never make myself subject to a man (or group of men) again.  If that means I burn in hell, then so be it.  Ichabod is over the door of every literal church IMO".
*************************************************************************************
  While I can relate to your frustration, there is a flaw in your statement above.  As a born again, blood-bought Christian..you should never be "subject" to  any other man in spiritual things.  That is exactly why when Jesus gave up the ghost, the veil ripped from top to bottom..opening the Holy of Holies.  As a born-again Christian, you have as direct access to God as any man.
     Yes , you can worship on your own and still be heaven bound, but the fellowship does help most of us.
  We are biblicists, we can search the New Testament and find many places where we are advised to gather together...if you can find one verse that tells us not to do so, please bring it to my attention.  Just my $ .02  .
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline dukkillr

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Re: abortion
« Reply #91 on: August 16, 2011, 01:50:27 PM »
To return to the subject of this thread, I believe we as Christians need to mind our own business, and quit judging those who live lives we do not approve of.
You're kidding right??!?!?!???  The self esteem boost some get from judging others is the only reason they continue to go to church.  It seems I read some where that people will, "judged by their actions", so look for yourself.  See how much energy some of these, "Christians" spent spewing hatred and ignorance towards those who have had absolutely no impact on their life.  Then figure out for yourself why they do it...
 
 My wife and I had a tragic loss in our family about 2 weeks ago.  We spent some time with a hospital chaplin we'd never met.  Honestly, I'd forgotten how different true Christians are from those have a different agenda, even if they don't know it themselves.

Offline andy1300

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Re: abortion
« Reply #92 on: August 16, 2011, 01:57:19 PM »
Man, religion is surely brain washing you guys,  You guys talk of the bible and god like you even know him.
The bible is made by a man many many years ago and has been change many many times by some other men.
all looking to control someone.
and you guys are doing the same thing, thinking you know the faxes better then someone else and trying to
control someone else, I guess you don,t what your wifes to get a abortion or something.
 
The less religion we have in our government, the better *

Offline Dee

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Re: abortion
« Reply #93 on: August 16, 2011, 02:03:10 PM »
And to think this thread started out about abortion. ???
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline powderman

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Re: abortion
« Reply #94 on: August 16, 2011, 02:04:01 PM »
andy. Do you have any idea what you think you said?? POWDERMAN.  ??? ???
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
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Offline dukkillr

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Re: abortion
« Reply #95 on: August 16, 2011, 02:07:49 PM »
andy. Do you have any idea what you think you said?? POWDERMAN.  ??? ???
I struggled to decode it as well.  I think it was the lack of a coherent policy on punctuation.

Offline andy1300

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Re: abortion
« Reply #96 on: August 16, 2011, 02:35:46 PM »
Yea, I know right from wrong without the need for a bible, some people don,t know how to use their brains so
I guess they need something to tell them what to do, even if its hundreds of years old news.
The less religion we have in our government, the better *

Offline Shu

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Re: abortion
« Reply #97 on: August 16, 2011, 02:44:30 PM »
Without bringing up the religous argument - Abortion is taking the life of an unborn child. The child has no rights and therefore it is tatamount to murder. Notice the phrase unborn child. Notice the law doesn't say tumorous growth or cluster of cells. In California if you cause malicious harm to a pregnant woman and the yet unborn child dies you will be charged with murder of that unborn child. If both the woman and the unborn child die you will be charged with two murders not one. Think about that for a moment the law recognizes the unborn child as a living human being and it is protected under the law with the same rights you and I have. I am sure a liberal state like California can't be the only one with this law on the books. How can anyone claim an unborn is just a mass of cells without life when you can be charged with murder. Is this to much of a jump or does it need to be broke down further. This is just not the religous right speaking this is codified law. Unfortunately the law contradicts itself and allows abortion.
I just think there are bettter ways to deal with the issue. Adoption is a good way, of course an ounce of prevention is more important.
 
I do speak of God as I know Him and I speak with Him as I know him. I know what He has done for me and my family.

Offline andy1300

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Re: abortion
« Reply #98 on: August 16, 2011, 02:56:42 PM »
I,m a blue collar worker , not a secretary like some here.
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Offline andy1300

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Re: abortion
« Reply #99 on: August 16, 2011, 03:21:17 PM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.
The less religion we have in our government, the better *

Offline andy1300

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Re: abortion
« Reply #100 on: August 16, 2011, 04:30:59 PM »
Powderman, don,t you think its hard enough for a young gal or woman that is going though something bad or is'nt right.
Its not a perfect world we live in.
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Offline Dee

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Re: abortion
« Reply #101 on: August 16, 2011, 04:31:46 PM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.

I know two things about chickens. #1. You can eat them before, or after their born. #2. A chicken is involved in breakfast, but a hog is totally committed to breakfast.

Now let's see here. This thread was originally about ABORTION, but has drifted into individual Christian, or no Christian doctrine, and some remarks about personal character, and education, where abortion seems to be taking a back seat. Instead we are talking about poultry, and grammar, and yes, I confess, I have even introduced swine into the mix, but my info is indisputably factual, regardless of Christian, or non Christian beliefs. But alas, I also drift.

Back to the topic of the thread. The heart starts beating 18 days after conception. Is this a human heart, or just a heart that doesn't really have anything to do with a soul, a spirit, humanity, ect....  Any Opinions?[/color][/font]
 
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline nw_hunter

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Re: abortion
« Reply #102 on: August 16, 2011, 05:14:10 PM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.

I know two things about chickens. #1. You can eat them before, or after their born. #2. A chicken is involved in breakfast, but a hog is totally committed to breakfast.

Now let's see here. This thread was originally about ABORTION, but has drifted into individual Christian, or no Christian doctrine, and some remarks about personal character, and education, where abortion seems to be taking a back seat. Instead we are talking about poultry, and grammar, and yes, I confess, I have even introduced swine into the mix, but my info is indisputably factual, regardless of Christian, or non Christian beliefs. But alas, I also drift.

 
Back to the topic of the thread. The heart starts beating 18 days after conception. Is this a human heart, or just a heart that doesn't really have anything to do with a soul, a spirit, humanity, ect....  Any Opinions?


LOL! I like the  chicken, pig description, and I agree.........What does Swamp's problem with going to church have to do with abortion? Please Folks........ Keep it on topic.

I feel so strongly against abortion, that I have a hard time even talking about it.I've heard people talk about Ron Paul being for abortion because he's a Libertarian. Nothing could be further from the truth! When he is asked about his stand on abortion, his response is............As a Dr. I have delivered over 4,000 babies.

I bring up Paul's name because, I feel if we don't get more people like him elected to office, the issues like abortion will never be resolved. We can talk about it on forums , and in coffee shops, but the D's and R's we keep electing will only  tell you what you want to hear to get elected, and once in, all those promises will soon be forgotten.
Freedom Of Speech.....Once we lose it, every other freedom will follow.

Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: abortion
« Reply #103 on: August 16, 2011, 05:41:39 PM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.

 
Mine are eggs. I know they are eggs because I do not have a rooster with my hens. My eggs are unfertilized. If you buy the factory farmed eggs in the stores, they are eggs too. No factory egg farm will wast feed on a rooster. Just wanted you egg eaters out there to know you are not guilty of committing chicken abortions.
A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.   John F. Kennedy

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Offline DDZ

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Re: abortion
« Reply #104 on: August 17, 2011, 12:54:34 AM »
In California if you cause malicious harm to a pregnant woman and the yet unborn child dies you will be charged with murder of that unborn child. If both the woman and the unborn child die you will be charged with two murders not one. Think about that for a moment the law recognizes the unborn child as a living human being and it is protected under the law with the same rights you and I have. I am sure a liberal state like California can't be the only one with this law on the books. How can anyone claim an unborn is just a mass of cells without life when you can be charged with murder. Is this to much of a jump or does it need to be broke down further. This is just not the religous right speaking this is codified law. Unfortunately the law contradicts itself and allows abortion.
I just think there are bettter ways to deal with the issue. Adoption is a good way, of course an ounce of prevention is more important.
 
I do speak of God as I know Him and I speak with Him as I know him. I know what He has done for me and my family.

I believe if someone causes malicious harm to a pregnant women anywhere in the US and the baby dies it is considered murder, and the person that caused the harm is charged with murder.
The way things are is that if a doctor murders the baby with the mothers consent the baby is just a fetus. If the baby is killed by someone else other than an abortion doctor then its called a baby. Makes lots of sense, doesn't it. I guess if its called a fetus, then it doesn't really appear to be murder.
Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.    Wm. Penn

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: abortion
« Reply #105 on: August 17, 2011, 02:23:32 AM »
  Honestly, I'd forgotten how different true Christians are from those have a different agenda, even if they don't know it themselves.

 
First sorry for your troubles , You hit the nail on the head with this statement . It can be difficult to be a true christian. To be one you can't judge. You can offer what is right and the guide we find in the Bible but not use religion as a means to force your way.
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Shu

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Re: abortion
« Reply #106 on: August 17, 2011, 02:56:16 AM »
I know for me and mine we will pass on an abortion.
 
 

Offline Swampman

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Re: abortion
« Reply #107 on: August 17, 2011, 05:51:52 AM »
I once whould have said the same thing.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983
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"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~

Offline ironglow

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Re: abortion
« Reply #108 on: August 17, 2011, 05:18:14 PM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.
**********************************************************************
   Some eggs..Huh Andy ?
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline DDZ

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Re: abortion
« Reply #109 on: August 18, 2011, 12:52:24 AM »
My daughter-in-law just went to the doctor to have a sonogram. She is six weeks along and a heart beat of 149 beats per minute was detected. I didn't know eggs had a heart beat. I'll have to listen next time I crack one open.   
Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.    Wm. Penn

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: abortion
« Reply #110 on: August 18, 2011, 02:04:28 AM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.
**********************************************************************
   Some eggs..Huh Andy ?

Eggs or chickens , That's about as dunb as it gets . Both are stages of LIFE for one not two different things . Like child or adult . When does God add the soul ? At conception or as it leaves the mother ?
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Dee

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Re: abortion
« Reply #111 on: August 18, 2011, 03:11:51 AM »
Jeremiah Chapter 1, verse 5. Before I formed you in the womb, "I knew you".


I thought I had cleared that up on the first page of this thread SHOOTER, but one has to believe the Bible to believe God's claim. So here it is, one last time.
You may all go to hell, I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett

Offline Swampman

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Re: abortion
« Reply #112 on: August 18, 2011, 03:13:11 AM »
I don't believe a baby can be aborted if God doesn't want it to be.  If it can be then he isn't God.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983
919th Special Operations Wing  1983-1985 1993-1994

"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~

Offline nw_hunter

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Re: abortion
« Reply #113 on: August 18, 2011, 04:48:49 AM »
I don't believe a baby can be aborted if God doesn't want it to be.  If it can be then he isn't God.


PLEASE!! Don't respond to this one................It would be a waste of finger movement.
Freedom Of Speech.....Once we lose it, every other freedom will follow.

Offline ironglow

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Re: abortion
« Reply #114 on: August 18, 2011, 05:18:58 AM »
I have to ask, when you having eggs for breakfast, do you call them eggs or do you call them chickens ?
Maybe then you should start calling them chickens.
**********************************************************************
   Some eggs..Huh Andy ?

Eggs or chickens , That's about as dunb as it gets . Both are stages of LIFE for one not two different things . Like child or adult . When does God add the soul ? At conception or as it leaves the mother ?
**************************************************************************
    God has already explained that one..Dee beat me to it..but here it is anyway;
 
   American King James Version
 
     "Before I formed you in the belly I knew you; and before you came forth out of the womb I sanctified you, and I ordained you a prophet to the nations"..  (Jeremiah 1:5)
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: abortion
« Reply #115 on: August 18, 2011, 05:34:30 AM »
I don't believe a baby can be aborted if God doesn't want it to be.  If it can be then he isn't God.

Please explain this as it applies to this thread please. God has allowed man to gain knowlege since Adan and Eve at the expence of much hardship to man. He allowes evil to exist . It is at the hand of man babies die not God. It would appear God allows man choice and the choice may be with or with out Gods blessing.
 
Dee yep .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Swampman

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Re: abortion
« Reply #116 on: August 18, 2011, 05:47:06 AM »
Everything that happens is God's will.  If it isn't, then he isn't God.
 
Man has never had a choice.
 
2 Timothy 2:19 "Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his."
 
God isn't concerned with those that aren't his.
 
 
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983
919th Special Operations Wing  1983-1985 1993-1994

"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~

Offline dukkillr

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Re: abortion
« Reply #117 on: August 18, 2011, 05:51:53 AM »
It is not surprising to me that so many of you use biblical reasoning for your opposition to abortion, indeed that makes perfect sense.  That many of you use your religious beliefs and teachings to arrive at a personal decision that abortion is ethically wrong is, however, precisely the point. 
 
I respect what each of you is saying.  I respect that you have the right to look at science, faith, and conscious, and arrive at your own decision.  My concern is that you don't show that same respect of others. 
 
To me the logic of Roe v. Wade is flawed in that it was decided in the line of cases dealing with personal privacy.  It should have been decided as an issue of freedom of religion.  Indeed one of the core parts of faith is the idea of soul and when life begins.  As a country that claims we do not establish religion, it has always seemed to me that being anti-choice is un-Constitutional.  Individuals can be pro-life in the sense that they believe abortion is wrong and would advocate against it, but not be anti-choice in that they would legally require that their beliefs be the only ones allowed in this country.
 
In short, I respect your opinion about when life begins, what constitutes murder, and how you arrive at the belief.  Indeed, I may even share it.  But I also respect the rights of those who do not agree, have different faith, or for whatever reason make a decision contrary to what I would.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: abortion
« Reply #118 on: August 18, 2011, 06:07:26 AM »
Everything that happens is God's will.  If it isn't, then he isn't God.
 
Man has never had a choice.
 
2 Timothy 2:19 "Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his."
 
God isn't concerned with those that aren't his.

Then why offer forgivness and salvation ?
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: abortion
« Reply #119 on: August 18, 2011, 06:11:42 AM »
Therein lies the answer based on our constitution.  It is a states rights issue.  Same as alcohol.  Many counties in Alabama are "dry" not allowing alcoholic beverages to be sold.  Many are "wet" allowing it.  I believe abortion is wrong but, the supreme court should have ruled that it is a states rights issue, then the pro-choice crowd would have had to get it legal in various areas they could.  We are supposed to be a majority rule democratic republic.  Let the majority rule.