Author Topic: abortion (Read 21329 times)

Dixie Dude · « **Reply #300 on:** August 31, 2011, 03:23:55 AM »

Ironglow, your post 296 should be enough scripture to convince any Christian of the sin of abortion. Sin can be forgiven, but sin must be shown to the world so that people can repent of their sins. We do not know who will or will not be saved, but we have to be the Salt of the earth to show people their sins and a Savior from their sins.

ironglow · « **Reply #301 on:** August 31, 2011, 04:10:43 AM »

Dixie Dude;
All Bible believing Christians would have no other avenue...if we are to believe the Bible. Someday we will each face Jesus;
my condolences for those who have read and still do not believe.

When Jesus said this;
But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. (Mark 10:14)

.....Somehow he was not asking for an abortionist to speed up the process. I can see where an unbeliever may not care, but I find it hard to have empathy for one who claims Jesus as Lord..and believes that Jesus would approve of this holocaust !

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #302 on:** August 31, 2011, 05:45:31 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on August 30, 2011, 11:49:56 AM

A baby has a soul. A fetus doesn't.
Webster's says a fetus is a human in the third mo. to birth . So since you enjoy pointing out the Bible and Gods rules please provide where God tells us when the soul is added , note not your idea but Gods words .

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #303 on:** August 31, 2011, 05:51:20 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on August 31, 2011, 02:33:15 AM

Quote
Are you still going to stubbornly deny the life which God says is in there ?

Yep, the mother's life.

I'm not guessing about this and you are. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Both are live ? No guessing if not there is a still birth .

Swampman · « **Reply #304 on:** August 31, 2011, 06:06:09 AM »

My arm is alive, but it's not a life. Webster's is wrong.

Until a being takes the "breath of life", it doesn't have a soul. It's just part of the mother.

It's all moot since it's none of our business anyway.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #305 on:** August 31, 2011, 07:09:55 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on August 31, 2011, 06:06:09 AM

My arm is alive, but it's not a life. Webster's is wrong.

Until a being takes the "breath of life", it doesn't have a soul. It's just part of the mother.

It's all moot since it's none of our business anyway.

This sounds phyco.

Why are you comparing a limb to a life?

Since when is a fetus not breathing? They receive breath/life through the mother.

Swampman · « **Reply #306 on:** August 31, 2011, 07:15:45 AM »

No, the fetus receives oxygenated blood from the mother just like her arm does.

It hasn't taken it's "breath of life."

The arm is alive, but it's not a life.

Questions?

Shu · « **Reply #307 on:** August 31, 2011, 08:26:13 AM »

I tried to stay out but just wanted to ask why would Jesus say "For God so loved the world, that He gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever should believe in Him shall have ever lasting life."
John 3:16 This puts the onus of belief on the individual. Therefore there is a choice.
The argument of God killed everybody but Noah and his family is invalid, he did it becuase of their sin. He told the children of Israel you sin and cuase those around you to sin, you are constantly looking for new ways to sin. This also signifies a choice made by people. Sodom and Gommarah were wiped of the face of the earth becuase of the choice of sin. Lot's wife chose to look back after being told not to and was turned into a pilar of salt for her sin.
If God knows us before we are in the womb, and if the baby in Mary's womb leaps for joy how is it this baby is not alive? A mother cannot tell the baby in her womb to do anything. Ask any woman who has tried to stop the baby from moving to an uncomfortable position in the womb. You can control your arm from being in an uncomfortable position, but yet not the child in the womb.
I am done with this topic, I think those that want to have an abortion will have it and those that don't want one won't.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #308 on:** August 31, 2011, 08:39:36 AM »

that life began at conception Matthew 1:20-21

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #309 on:** August 31, 2011, 08:49:59 AM »

In an effort to see swampman's side the best example I could come up with would be a tick . It lives off the host while attached. It is alive from beginning to end . This is a better example than an arm . And it dosen't support his claim.

Swampman · « **Reply #310 on:** August 31, 2011, 09:30:09 AM »

Once again, "alive" and "a life" are not the same thing.

A frog leg leaps in a hot skillet.

Quote

I think those that want to have an abortion will have it and those that don't want one won't.

And that the way it should be here in America.

The rest of us need to mind our own business and live a life that doesn't require t-shirts and bumper stickers to let others know that we are Christians.

Dixie Dude · « **Reply #311 on:** August 31, 2011, 09:36:08 AM »

Swampman is so far into predistination that he can't see the other side of the coin, our choices like Shu said. Our CHOICES determine our outcome from OUR perspective. One side - God knows - Our side, we don't know, so He gave us choices. Yes we are called, but we have to answer the call.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #312 on:** August 31, 2011, 09:38:36 AM »

A dead man jerks and moves as does a snake whats your point ?
alive , having life not dead per webster
life that quality that distingquishes a vital and functional beaing from a dead one again per webster .
I'm sure you will say webster is dead wrong but I think his definition is accepted by far more than yours.
Go write a dictonary and get it accredited then maybe your argument about definitions could hold water.

Swampman · « **Reply #313 on:** August 31, 2011, 10:52:41 AM »

Quote from: Dixie Dude on August 31, 2011, 09:36:08 AM

Swampman is so far into predistination that he can't see the other side of the coin, our choices like Shu said. Our CHOICES determine our outcome from OUR perspective. One side - God knows - Our side, we don't know, so He gave us choices. Yes we are called, but we have to answer the call.

Nope, like Jonah we have no choice. There is no other side of the coin. God is God and we are not.

Ephesians 1:11 "In him we were also chosen, having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will,"

dukkillr · « **Reply #314 on:** August 31, 2011, 11:10:39 AM »

Some of you obviously care about this topic a great deal. Strangely, some of you are the same people who are going to cause it to get locked.

If you write something about another poster, it's going to get deleted. If you can't follow that rule, you are going to get deleted.

Please, talk about the topic, not each other.

ironglow · « **Reply #315 on:** August 31, 2011, 11:54:22 AM »

Quote from: -Shaggy- on August 30, 2011, 05:10:40 PM

Just wondering...If I stop breathing, am I dead? (Serious question)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Nope..Shaggy;
I stop breathing when I swim underwater and when I approach a very hot fire....
Of course a pre-born boy or girl breathes amniotic fluid..

ironglow · « **Reply #316 on:** August 31, 2011, 12:01:00 PM »

Swampy says;
Ephesians 6:12
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
If I were to take the "predestinationist" point of view... I would be forced to ask:

Why bother wrestling..it won't change anything ?

Cabin4 · « **Reply #317 on:** August 31, 2011, 12:50:39 PM »

I think there is room to debate if abortion should be legal or not regardless of your faith. But to say you are a Christian and you don't believe a fetus is life, that is diametrically opposed to the Christian faith and it cannot be reconciled with any logic, word from above or Biblical reference.

powderman · « **Reply #318 on:** August 31, 2011, 01:19:15 PM »

Quote from: Cabin4 on August 31, 2011, 12:50:39 PM

I think there is room to debate if abortion should be legal or not regardless of your faith. But to say you are a Christian and you don't believe a fetus is life, that is diametrically opposed to the Christian faith and it cannot be reconciled with any logic, word from above or Biblical reference.

YEP, Amen. POWDERMAN.

ironglow · « **Reply #319 on:** August 31, 2011, 01:33:53 PM »

Quote from: powderman on August 31, 2011, 01:19:15 PM

Quote from: Cabin4 on August 31, 2011, 12:50:39 PM
I think there is room to debate if abortion should be legal or not regardless of your faith. But to say you are a Christian and you don't believe a fetus is life, that is diametrically opposed to the Christian faith and it cannot be reconciled with any logic, word from above or Biblical reference.

YEP, Amen. POWDERMAN.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Agreed... My debate here is with those whoclaim Christ..and then pay no heed to His words. Non believers will have to deal later with their decisions..whether one way or the other...

Swampman · « **Reply #320 on:** August 31, 2011, 03:57:08 PM »

Quote from: Cabin4 on August 31, 2011, 12:50:39 PM

I think there is room to debate if abortion should be legal or not regardless of your faith. But to say you are a Christian and you don't believe a fetus is life, that is diametrically opposed to the Christian faith and it cannot be reconciled with any logic, word from above or Biblical reference.

Total nonsense....You're just following the teachings of men.

Cabin4 · « **Reply #321 on:** August 31, 2011, 05:13:03 PM »

Quote from: Swampman on August 31, 2011, 03:57:08 PM

Quote from: Cabin4 on August 31, 2011, 12:50:39 PM
I think there is room to debate if abortion should be legal or not regardless of your faith. But to say you are a Christian and you don't believe a fetus is life, that is diametrically opposed to the Christian faith and it cannot be reconciled with any logic, word from above or Biblical reference.
Total nonsense....You're just following the teachings of men.

What men?

Lost Farmboy · « **Reply #322 on:** August 31, 2011, 09:52:42 PM »

I stopped following this thread a few pages ago. I really thought it would be locked by now. I cannot comprehend how a person claiming to be a Christian can claim an unborn baby is not alive and doesn't have a soul.

20 to 30 years ago when I was a missionary and deeply involved in ministry I had the opportunity to talk to several people that died and came back. I have seen interviews of others that died and came back. Most reported seeing relatives that pass away before them. The similarities of the stories of the people I talked to lead me to believe they were telling the truth.

Recently a young boy wrote a book about his near death experience. The book is Jesus is Real. I have not read the book yet. I have seen interviews of him on TBN. He claims to have seen lost relatives, including his sister who died BEFORE BIRTH. I would consider this pretty strong evidence that the fetus is an unborn child with a soul.

20 years ago I was trying to write some Christian books, My dream of becoming an author never came true. Looking over my old notes I am glad some things were never published. The bible has never changed, but my understanding of a few things has. There are limitations on how much you can learn or understand by reading the bible. You really need to be taught by the Holy Spirit.

SHOOTALL · « **Reply #323 on:** September 01, 2011, 04:13:26 AM »

swampman explain Matthew 1:20-21 , John 1:14 , Luke 1:39-44 Hebrews 4:15 all apply in one way or another .

powderman · « **Reply #324 on:** September 01, 2011, 04:28:02 AM »

You really need to be taught by the Holy Spirit.

LOST. Excellent post. THe above statement is true. Sometimes folks really believe that they are spirit lead and in reality, are not. God speaks to us daily, but so does satan. Some folks don't know the difference. I too have talked with folks with after life experiences. Satan is alive and well and deceives many every day, after all, it's his job. A dear friend had an unoperable tumor and even though saved and a Christian still had a fear of the unknown and of death. One morning she awoke smiling and told Tank, her husband, last night God showed me where I'm going, I'm not afraid anymore. Ol satan has even convinced some folks that unborn babies are just blobs of tissue and that the Bible is wrong about homosexuality, he's very busy cause his days are numbered and he knows it. He will take as many with him as he can. Satan is powerful, but only as powerful as we allow him to be. POWDERMAN.

nw_hunter · « **Reply #325 on:** September 01, 2011, 05:07:32 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on August 31, 2011, 03:57:08 PM

Quote from: Cabin4 on August 31, 2011, 12:50:39 PM
I think there is room to debate if abortion should be legal or not regardless of your faith. But to say you are a Christian and you don't believe a fetus is life, that is diametrically opposed to the Christian faith and it cannot be reconciled with any logic, word from above or Biblical reference.
Total nonsense....You're just following the teachings of men.

It's obvious! This thread has become.........Lets change Swampman's mind about abortion, and we all know (That ain't gonna happen). It's gone on long enough!

Several want to keep the thread going, so OK! Lets see if it can continue without getting off topic or flaming.

ironglow · « **Reply #326 on:** September 01, 2011, 01:33:55 PM »

I think much of the misunderstanding is because some look at abortion from a "legal" point of view...while others see it from a moral perspective. Each places their motivator as foremost.
Then there are some who can't sort out the difference...

BUGEYE · « **Reply #327 on:** September 01, 2011, 01:52:47 PM »

I've always thought abortion was murder and I've learned some good scripture since this thread got going. I'm a 2 issue voter, abortion and guns. some say leave it to the states but that won't work since we have so many liberal states, and abortion would continue on. it needs to be stopped on the federal level.

Swampman · « **Reply #328 on:** September 01, 2011, 02:48:17 PM »

A lot of people think abortion is murder....but it isn't. None of the scriptures posted have anything to do with a fetus. They address predestination.

BUGEYE · « **Reply #329 on:** September 01, 2011, 02:53:15 PM »

Quote from: Swampman on September 01, 2011, 02:48:17 PM

A lot of people think abortion is murder....but it isn't. None of the scriptures posted have anything to do with a fetus. They address predestination.

I wasn't talking about yours. I was talking about abortion.