Fail To Fire Question

[thirdbase]

I have been hand loading for rifles several years (but still somewhat of a novice) and never had a FTF.  I loaded 20 rounds of  7mm-08 new Winchester brass, FL sized, all same length, CCI primers from same lot I have used before, and used my Lee Auto Prime.  These are for shooting in a Handi Youth model.  Went to the range to shoot.  First one FTF.  Actually I was shocked since I had never had one before.  Opened it up and the primer had a very small dent in it.  Closed it up, cocked it and pulled the trigger.  Again nothing.  Repeated again and it fired.  Second case FTF on first attempt but fired on second try.  Third case, fired on second try.  The remaining 17 rounds fired on first attempt.  I had fired two boxes of factory rounds in it without any problems before, and these 20 rounds  were my first handloads  thru it.  Anyone have ideas why the first three rounds failed but the other 17 rounds were flawless?

[anachronism]

Check your Auto Prime first. They are famous for wearing the little link between the thumb pirce and the primer ram. This would mean that your primers aren't fully seated, so the firing pin fully seated the primer for you on the first shot attempt, then the second firing attempt was able to fire the primer. I've worn out a number of Auto-Primes, and won't buy them, or pretty much any Lee product any more. RCBS & Hornady make hand primers that will seemingly work forever.

You may also have a slightly loose chamber, coupled with factory brass that is right at the minimum as far as headspace goes. You may have also pushed the shsuspecoulder back a bit since you full-length sized the new brass before loading. Since most of your shots fired on the second attempt, I'm blaming the Auto-Prime first.

Actually, "FTF" is the abbreviation for "Failure To Feed", but we all know what you mean. I'm just channeling my inner "abbreviation Nazi".

[necchi]

With the Handi rifle there a couple of issues that can cause this, all are usually an easy fix.
 
 Your in luck because Grey Beards has the premeire place for info on the Handi Rifle. You really should check this section of the Forum and read/post there; http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/board,126.0.html
 
Pay particular attention to this sticky on that forum; [/color][/size]http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,26264.0.html[/u]
Reading through several times,,book marking the page and reading again is invaluble for getting the most from the Handi Rifle/NEF guns.

[max1138]

welcome to the curse of the handi rifle with rimless bottleneck cartridges.
over generous chamber dimensions with the action that may or may not have .002-.008 clearance on lockup
and you get the occasional FTF due to poor headspacing. seems to be more prevalent using remington factory ammo but thats just my observation, not backed up by any real research that Im aware of.
 
I would back off the full legenth sizer half a turn and size one case at a time  measuring the case head protrusion
in the chamber till I got .001 or less below the chamber face.  It will give you a partial full legenth resize fitted to your chamber. 


the downside is that setting only works for your rifle and may not fit any other, pretty much dedicating that die set to that rifle only which is fine if thats the only weapon you have in that caliber, if theres more than one either itll work or you have to reset the dies every time you swap.


I have a whelen barrel for a handi I have to do this to.  altho I have a cheat, lee presses with the interchangeable bushings let you lock the setting in and swap bushings/ dies as a unit without loosing the settings. hornady L-N-L presses have this feature also.
 

[thirdbase]

Check your Auto Prime first. They are famous for wearing the little link between the thumb pirce and the primer ram. This would mean that your primers aren't fully seated, so the firing pin fully seated the primer for you on the first shot attempt, then the second firing attempt was able to fire the primer. I've worn out a number of Auto-Primes, and won't buy them, or pretty much any Lee product any more. RCBS & Hornady make hand primers that will seemingly work forever.

You may also have a slightly loose chamber, coupled with factory brass that is right at the minimum as far as headspace goes. You may have also pushed the shsuspecoulder back a bit since you full-length sized the new brass before loading. Since most of your shots fired on the second attempt, I'm blaming the Auto-Prime first.

Actually, "FTF" is the abbreviation for "Failure To Feed", but we all know what you mean. I'm just channeling my inner "abbreviation Nazi".

Thanks,  I'll look at my Auto Prime.  I proved to you that I was a novice because "fail to fire" was the only thing I could think of the FTF acltually stood  for;  didn't think about "feed."

[Savage]

A high primer should be easily spotted. I betting there's no problem with the auto prime. I agree with other posters, it's a head space problem inherent to the handi action.
Savage

[thirdbase]

With the Handi rifle there a couple of issues that can cause this, all are usually an easy fix.
 
 Your in luck because Grey Beards has the premeire place for info on the Handi Rifle. You really should check this section of the Forum and read/post there; http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/board,126.0.html
 
Pay particular attention to this sticky on that forum; http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,26264.0.html
Reading through several times,,book marking the page and reading again is invaluble for getting the most from the Handi Rifle/NEF guns.

Thanks.  I had read a lot of the threads in the links you posted before I ever shot the gun or handloaded any of the ammo; however, I went back over some because of your posts.  I actually forgot simple things like failing to pull the trigger all of the way back, etc.  Another item in your links was a post about off centered firing pin indents.  I just looked at the cases and all were off center but I don't know what normal would be.  I'll keep reading the threads.

[thirdbase]

A high primer should be easily spotted. I betting there's no problem with the auto prime. I agree with other posters, it's a head space problem inherent to the handi action.
Savage

During my first handloading leason, the guy that was teaching me told me that when you remove your primed case from the shell holder, hold the case with your thumb and two or three fingers and slide your little finger across the primer and you should feel a recessed primer.  I do this with every case, however, that is not to say that every primer is seated all the way, but I do know that there was a recess.  Thanks for your reply.

[necchi]

Yeah,
 That trigger pull thing nailed me when I 1st got Handis. For years I was use too a very light trigger with a crisp break, the .223 was givng me fit's till I realized I need too complete the pull, and as you explain, I was geting light hit's on the primer,,and they'd go off the second or third time.
 
 The "Faqs"  for handis in the link is such a HUGE compilation of info it's very easy to overlook things, or just plain get lost while looking at other stuff

[OleFreak]

An easy an accurate way to make a size die accommodate the needs of different chambers is to use Redding’s Competition shell holder set of five in .002” steps thicker than normal.  Like backing out the die .010” with the thickest one.  Ain’t cheap at $45 but a precise and repeatable way to adjust your die.

[Lloyd Smale]

when im loading ammo for hunting in a single shot i allways use brass that was once fired in that particular gun and then neck sized. Its to easy to set the shoulder back to far when full lenght sizing.

[flashhole]

I agree the first place to look is the headspacing.  Using fireformed brass that has bee neck sized only for the reload should do the trick.  A second place to look for the problem is primers seated too deep.  I've seen folks get overly aggressive with uniformers and the primers go in too deep to fire with a light impact from the firing pin.