Author Topic: single action for c /c (Read 2454 times)

Mike in Virginia · « **on:** September 18, 2011, 03:11:37 PM »

It's dumb, perhaps, but I just got a Ruger flattop in .44 Special, and I intend to carry it. It's the best handling handgun I've ever owned. I know for sure that I can get off the first shot faster than any other handgun. A .44 Special loaded to its real life capability would not be surviable by any antagonist. I have a Charter Arms in .44 Special, but the Ruger is the ultimate in drawing and firing.

Follow up shots, or double taps, would be slower than an auto or double action revolver, but still, I love the Ruger .44 and I know heavy bullets would go where they should.

What say you? I was a cop for many years, retired from that, receiving a pension, required to qualify with Smiths and Sigs, yet I could never place that first shot so precisely as I could withy a perfectly hand fitting single action. The new Ruger, to me, is an immediate end to any confrontation. Opinons welcome.

Brett · « **Reply #1 on:** September 18, 2011, 05:00:21 PM »

As a civilian you are unlikely to find yourself in a running gun battle with multiple armed perp's, and one well placed shot trumps several misses any day of the week. So I say if it works for you go with it. A SA would not be my personal first choice in a CC sidearm but with a little more trigger time with one I think I could become comfortable with it.

Being alert to who is near you and being aware of your surroundings and intentionally avoiding places and circumstances where you are likely to find trouble should be your first line of defense.

t-reg · « **Reply #2 on:** September 18, 2011, 05:01:24 PM »

I too pack / CCW my flattop .44 Special whenever possible.

It ain't dumb.

Spirithawk · « **Reply #3 on:** September 18, 2011, 05:07:14 PM »

Ya know? When I first got out of the Air Force my wife and I came home to find our house had been burlarized. I didn't have much money, and no firearm of any kind, so I went out and bought a cap & ball colt .44. I was sitting at home cleaning and loading it when detectives arived to talk to me about the break in. They thought it was funny my having the percusion revolver untill I put it like this. There's hundreds of graveyards throughout the Country that are full of people killed by just such a revolver and not one of them is laughing about it. A single action in the right hand is deadly pure and simple. My only advice, which you probably already know, is practice, practice, practice.

LocnLod · « **Reply #4 on:** September 19, 2011, 04:28:59 AM »

Carrying a gun to protect yourself and your family is a matter of practicality, not of nostalgia. There is a proper tool for the job. I know from your previous posts, that you have many more suitable firearms to use.

In the case of Spirithawk and I'm sure many others, where that was the only thing they could get at the time, it's better than nothing.

There are also a lot of people dead in the ground from arrows, spears and knives. But there are better choices available now.

Spirithawk · « **Reply #5 on:** September 19, 2011, 05:59:53 AM »

Quote from: LocnLod on September 19, 2011, 04:28:59 AM

Carrying a gun to protect yourself and your family is a matter of practicality, not of nostalgia. There is a proper tool for the job. I know from your previous posts, that you have many more suitable firearms to use.

In the case of Spirithawk and I'm sure many others, where that was the only thing they could get at the time, it's better than nothing.

There are also a lot of people dead in the ground from arrows, spears and knives. But there are better choices available now.

True, but if you've seen a single action in the hand of someone proficient with it you'd know what I mean.

LocnLod · « **Reply #6 on:** September 19, 2011, 09:16:44 AM »

Well of course. The shooters in SASS can fire their SA guns very quickly two handed.

If they practiced to that extent with a more modern handgun, think how much more effective they'd be. Especially if you take into consideration reloading and/or firing one handed.

I don't see a practical advantage (other than 'it's all I got') that would make an SA preferable over a DA for personal protection. If one is a proponent of "anything that starts with a 4" there are many DA .44 and .45 cal revolvers available from Ruger and S&W that can be fired single or double action, one handed or 2.

williamlayton · « **Reply #7 on:** September 19, 2011, 02:03:43 PM »

The onliest thing thati have against any revolver is concealment and comfort.
I wear a belt & holster on occasion but for day in/out wear a flat semi is much easier.
Blessings

Spirithawk · « **Reply #8 on:** September 19, 2011, 05:48:51 PM »

Quote from: williamlayton on September 19, 2011, 02:03:43 PM

The onliest thing thati have against any revolver is concealment and comfort.
I wear a belt & holster on occasion but for day in/out wear a flat semi is much easier.
Blessings

Yep, hard to argue with that. Just one of the reasons I love my PF-9. Thinnest 9mm made.

rawhidekid · « **Reply #9 on:** September 20, 2011, 03:46:42 AM »

If you carry an extra cylinder, a single action Ruger can be fired and the cylinder swapped as fast as a standard revolver can be speedloaded. I've done it, and you can to with practice.

With practice, I've seen a single action fired six times , shells ejected and loaded in 26 seconds without changing the cylinder. How fast do you need to shoot?

flintlock · « **Reply #10 on:** September 20, 2011, 06:18:26 AM »

I dang sure wouldn't mess with a fellow pointing a .44 Special at me...

Spirithawk · « **Reply #11 on:** September 20, 2011, 01:54:46 PM »

Quote from: rawhidekid on September 20, 2011, 03:46:42 AM

If you carry an extra cylinder, a single action Ruger can be fired and the cylinder swapped as fast as a standard revolver can be speedloaded. I've done it, and you can to with practice. With practice, I've seen a single action fired six times , shells ejected and loaded in 26 seconds without changing the cylinder. How fast do you need to shoot?

My point exactly. The only draw back would be the size and how hard to conceal.

jimster · « **Reply #12 on:** September 21, 2011, 10:52:37 AM »

Not a thing wrong with packing a single action, as already mentioned some people are VERY good with them and what feels comfortable to you will probably work under stress too. Are there better choices for hitting a target multiple times faster, yes....but I been to a few cowboy shoots and I can tell you now there are people who can shoot a single action better than some other people with an auto. I carry single actions, 1911's, and double actions, you just have to practice with them all. Depends on the time of year, and the places I'm going, but I have no problem at all packing my 44 spl flattop in colder weather to most places I go. Single actions were the very first handguns I cut my teeth on, they feel comfy to me. Being alert to your surroundings will give you the edge no matter what you have with you.

Wyo. Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #13 on:** September 21, 2011, 02:33:11 PM »

as jimster says what I carry depends on the place, time of year, etc...as for the single action, Elmer said it was the fastest of all pistols to get into action for the first shot...I remember and article by Skeeter, as a cop he was called into a fray when he had been hunting with his old Ruger 44 mag. flat top....he chanced to be the first cop to confront the criminal, when he leved the .44 the crook dropped his weapon and quickly gave up....he told the other cops later, that man in the cowboy hat have the biggest pistol I ever see.....he had planned on using force until he looked down the bore of the .44....

John R. · « **Reply #14 on:** September 22, 2011, 03:33:36 AM »

I'm all for carrying what you want, as long as you are proficient with it. I will say this I don't think you can reload a Ruger with a spare cylinder as fast as you can a DA revolver with a speedloader (especially if the guy is trained with the speedloader, and you sure can't do it if he's using moonclips). As for the 26 second reload, it takes me 1.5 to 2 seconds to reload a semi-auto. All that being said, if you use awareness of your surroundings as your first defense, you should have no problems with your Flattop 44 special. By the way I have one of those also, in a 4 5/8ths bbl. I love it. Maybe I should clarify just a bit. I didn't mean that Rawhide could not personally load the Ruger faster, just that most people can't do it.

myronman3 · « **Reply #15 on:** September 22, 2011, 05:08:48 AM »

first rule of a gunfight is to have a gun.

the only two things i would be concerned about is how to conceal the gun; i dont think it would be comfortable to carry and not easy to conceal (at least on my frame). and, when it comes to drawing from a concealed carry, that hammer might snag easy.

StrawHat · « **Reply #16 on:** October 11, 2011, 02:30:16 AM »

I have used and gotten fairly good with a lot of firearms. There are worse choices for a self defense handgun than a SA revolver but if that is what you are comfortable with, have at it. My preference is a S&W N frame but that is because it has been a part of me for nearly 40 years. And yes, the first shot has been right where I want it to land. SA are okay but not as okay as DAs.

handi243 · « **Reply #17 on:** October 11, 2011, 03:44:28 AM »

I think it was Skeeter that said when LEO went to semi autos someone said that they had more rounds. Skeeter asked them "you plan on missing alot?"

Lonegun1894 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 27, 2011, 10:31:24 PM »

Not dumb at all. I carry a Ruger (old) Vaquero 4 5/8 in .45 Colt and dont feel naked at all. But I have to agree with the when and where comment made in a pevious post. I carry the Ruger Vaquero in cold weather, but a 5" 1911 .45 or a 4" Ruger Security Six .357 in warmer weather.

m-g Willy · « **Reply #19 on:** December 03, 2011, 10:46:22 AM »

Single Action for c/c
It would be ok -IF-!
1. You never get in a hand to hand encounter where you are surprised by one or more perps who more than likely are bigger than you( most perps don't attack someone bigger or stronger than they themselves are)
Might be a bit hard to pull a gun and cock it while rolling around on the ground wrestling.

2. You are never caught seated in your car in a parking lot when someone comes up to your window or the passenger window.
(HARD TO PULL GUN FROM STRONG SIDE HOLSTER AND COCK IT WHILE SEATED)

3. Never wear loose cloths or anything covering your gun that could catck on the hammer or front sight.( John Harding was arrested on a train by being busted over the head while he tried to free his gun after getting it tangled in his suspenders while drawing it.!

4. Never get into a confrontation with more than 1 per.

5. Be sure you can always get BOTH hands on gun(see no. 1..2..3 and 4)

Cowboy action shooters are good at shooting SAA fast .
But they are drawing from an open holster , standing , most are using sqib loads (no recoil )and---- no one is shooting back !

The best gun for C/C is from the KISS school of thought.
KISS= KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID
For me that means a double action revolver.
One of the best is those with internal hammers that can be carried in a coat pocket and even fired through the pocket if need be.
No safety buttons or levers to flip off before firing and no adjustable sights to snag on clothing.
These are just my opinions from the little exp. I have learned so far.
Good luck with whatever you choose to carry.

dougk · « **Reply #20 on:** December 03, 2011, 03:18:48 PM »

Quote from: Mike in Virginia on September 18, 2011, 03:11:37 PM

It's dumb, perhaps, but I just got a Ruger flattop in .44 Special, and I intend to carry it. It's the best handling handgun I've ever owned. I know for sure that I can get off the first shot faster than any other handgun. A .44 Special loaded to its real life capability would not be surviable by any antagonist. I have a Charter Arms in .44 Special, but the Ruger is the ultimate in drawing and firing.

Hey Mike

Carry what your most comfortable with. In my mind its that simple. Now there is a lot of logic behind that comment.

Doug

bubba15301 · « **Reply #21 on:** December 05, 2011, 09:45:39 AM »

i carry a ruger vaquero in 44/40 caliber

Mike in Virginia · « **Reply #22 on:** December 05, 2011, 10:09:50 AM »

Yep, I know it's not the best choice, but I'm glad to see there are others out there who think a little bit like me. It's difficult to find a civilian concealed carry occurrence wherein the person defending himself had to reload. I've personally never heard of such an event, although it's probably happened.

I carry a gun to protect me, or me and my wife if she's present. I don't carry one anymore to enforce the law. Policemen must get involved in other people's problems, protect the innocent, etc., but I've been there done that. I don't believe I'll ever again intervene in a non-family member's troubles. Certainly not with a single action revolver. But, if I'm protecting just me, that first shot is critical, and for me, it can't come any quicker or any better centered than with a single action.

Lots of reasons NOT to carry a single action, as many of you stated. Real life concerns, to be sure. For some folks, the feel and balance of a 1911 offers the best first shot choice, with the huge advantage of 7 more big bore bullets without cocking. And the double action revolver leaves little to chance.

But for me, being raised on Colts and Rugers, I think I'd rather have the .44 flattop with me if I really needed to defend myself. I've other guns, including some of the plastic ones, that are powerful, accurate, visible sights, reliable, and can be put into action "right now." I like such guns. I have a gun within reach anywhere in my home, and they are all something other than a single action. Still, weirdly enough, I get the most confidence away from home with that .44 single action. When it is drawn from the belt, getting cocked as it comes out, the barrel is always naturally pointing exactly where I need the round to go. I can't say that with any other pistol/revolver. But again, that's just me.

dougk · « **Reply #23 on:** December 05, 2011, 02:58:34 PM »

Quote from: Mike in Virginia on December 05, 2011, 10:09:50 AM

When it is drawn from the belt, getting cocked as it comes out, the barrel is always naturally pointing exactly where I need the round to go. I can't say that with any other pistol/revolver. But again, that's just me.

Hey Mike

that is what matters....

Doug

45-70.gov · « **Reply #24 on:** December 05, 2011, 03:24:34 PM »

is a single actione the best c/c?.........generally NO
is it the best c/c for you?............i don't know....MAYBE

is a single action good for c/c?............YES....most are a little big tho

as far as reloading speed.............autos are for those that can't hit or watch too much TV

m-g Willy · « **Reply #25 on:** December 05, 2011, 07:14:14 PM »

[quote author=45-70.gov link=topic=241221.msg1099425317#msg1099425317

autos are for those that can't hit or watch too much TV

Ever see the aftermath of a gun fight involving trained LEO or even military ?
Check out % of shots fired and hits.
Most gun fights involve a lot of moving from both parties.
At one time I was young and dumb and bragged that if my gun fired there would be a kill.
And it was true!
Till one time that I DIDN'T FIRE!
I was asked what went wrong.
Others thought my gun must have jammed.
I told them I didn't have a good shot so I didn't fire .
WELLLLLLLLL---all hell broke loose and I was informed that I better shoot no matter if I $#$#@$#%$#% had a good shot or not.
It's a lesson I took to heart .Because they were right.
I still don't believe in the (spray and pray) tactics ,,,but you can bet that if I happen to have a 15-16 round auto on me I'll let go with some "maybe shots" where I would hold a tad longer if I was low on round count.

jimster · « **Reply #26 on:** December 06, 2011, 02:11:25 PM »

Quote

I still don't believe in the (spray and pray) tactics ,,,but you can bet that
if I happen to have a 15-16 round auto on me I'll let go with some "maybe shots"
where I would hold a tad longer if I was low on round count.

Well your probably right if your working in a situation as you describe, but it's possible to get a little carried away as well. Some years back back there was a drunk vet walking around a church parking lot with a shot gun, a .410 single shot, lots of cops went there all pointing at him with their hi cap 9mm's....to make the story short, they all decided to do what you describe...start shooting. They all shot a whole bunch of times at this drunk vet with a single shot .410...holes in houses, holes in the church, holes all over this little town. Lucky they didn't kill anyone else. A few got lucky and got a couple into this big bad threat....a drunk with a .410 single shot. He never did fire a shot...but he would not put it down. They were all behind their patrol cars using them as cover.

Hell...one guy with a blackhawk could have taken just one shot easy enough

...better yet, someone with some brains could have probably just walked up there and taken this guys shotgun or talked him out of it. Looked to me like these cops figured it was their one time in life to empty their mags and reload and empty them again. Not sayin it's always like that....just sayin...it's what happened. Maybe it was protocol, who knows. Embarrassing is what it seemed like to me. But I've never been a cop...so I have no clue on what they are supposed to do.
I realize that this is probably a rare deal, small town, and most cops would think of something better, or at least be able to hit something without shooting up the town. Or better yet...talk him out of his single shot .410 somehow.
Anyways...back to the single action...is a 1911 or a high cap auto better for defense in bad situations, nobody is arguing on that. A single action will work pretty well in a lot of situations...and no matter what anyone tells you, if you don't hit your target they still a threat no matter what, so every round counts, and accuracy will outweigh almost anything when it comes down to it.

myronman3 · « **Reply #27 on:** December 07, 2011, 01:23:40 PM »

laugh all you want at a 410, but a guy killed a grizzy bear that was in his chicken coupe with a 410 and shot. i'd shot him too if he didnt put it down or would have pointed it at me.

jimster · « **Reply #28 on:** December 07, 2011, 03:01:22 PM »

Well I wasn't laughin at all...and I would have no problem with you shooting him. Would have been better than a whole bunch of people shooting up the town. The whole town was pretty mad about this deal. Just sayin. I totally understand the thing about federal agents shooting it out with some very bad people and everyone throwing a lot of lead around, this just didn't seem to be one of those deals, and nobody else in that town thought so either.

JustaShooter · « **Reply #29 on:** December 07, 2011, 03:52:47 PM »

Quote from: jimster on December 06, 2011, 02:11:25 PM

Hell...one guy with a blackhawk could have taken just one shot easy enough

Same guys that missed with semi's would have likely missed with a Blackhawk, and the same guy that would have hit them with the Blackhawk would likely have hit them with a semi. It's not the tool, it's the craftsman.

Just a Shooter