Author Topic: Long Cecil (Read 12983 times)

GGaskill · « **Reply #60 on:** January 31, 2012, 02:13:06 PM »

That .384 thickness sounds like you could cut them from bald tire treads. They need to be only a little squishy and you would have an infinite supply.

Double D · « **Reply #61 on:** February 01, 2012, 03:58:37 AM »

Quote from: GGaskill on January 31, 2012, 02:13:06 PM

That .384 thickness sounds like you could cut them from bald tire treads. They need to be only a little squishy and you would have an infinite supply.

George, bald tires are for making sandles.....

jamesfrom180 · « **Reply #62 on:** February 01, 2012, 08:12:14 AM »

Looking at silicone rubber prices will make your pockets hurt.

I use red silicone gasket material for flange joints often. It appears they are punch cut so that leaves the questions about what does a manufacturer due with the "holes". A source might be asking around at a company like this
http://www.advancedgasket.com/pages/foam/silsponge.htm#silsponge
about floor waste. It appears that the thickest you can find will be .25" material. The temp. range is listed as
-65 to +500 on some material but that also doesn't list what pressures that is at. I have a small stock pile of EPDM I got from a roofer. Great material for gaskets, have no idea how it would work on a pressure vessel.

shred · « **Reply #63 on:** February 01, 2012, 09:30:14 AM »

You can get sheets of uncut gasket material at auto parts places. Exhaust manifold gasket should take the temperatures and pressures. Most of it comes with an internal wire mesh which is a real pain to deal with however. RTV or some such might be called for.

Another thought is silicone hot-pads for cooking-- even if it doesn't last as long, it would be cheap to replace.

None of it is 3/8" thick, but several sheets could be stacked. IIRC most silicones are pretty similar and good to 400+ F. I've used "100% silicone" caulk from the hardware store up to 300'F continuous and it does fine. BP temperatures will be higher, but very short.

moose53 · « **Reply #64 on:** February 01, 2012, 10:21:57 AM »

When using regular rubber , I found no evidence that it was burned on the leading edge toward the powder charge . The aluminum foil powder container and the time duration of the shot keep the rubber temp down.

KABAR2 · « **Reply #65 on:** February 02, 2012, 09:53:59 AM »

Well I got things packaged up for my boss yesterday.... So they will probably go out today........
When it gets there Douglas may cuss me a little..... once you get all the tape off there are
4 screws you'll have to take out so you can remove the wood end plug....... So far I have
never had someone complain they didn't get their item because of packageing...........
Have fun with this......

Allen <><

Double D · « **Reply #66 on:** February 02, 2012, 10:05:47 AM »

Quote from: KABAR2 on February 02, 2012, 09:53:59 AM

Well I got things packaged up for my boss yesterday.... So they will probably go out today........
When it gets there Douglas may cuss me a little..... once you get all the tape off there are
4 screws you'll have to take out so you can remove the wood end plug....... So far I have
never had someone complain they didn't get their item because of packageing...........
Have fun with this......

Allen <><

Is it here yet?!?!

Double D · « **Reply #67 on:** February 03, 2012, 08:16:45 AM »

If it went out yesterday, its only gotta travel 2400 miles to get here...should be here next week...woo-wie it will be Christmas next week!

Lets see Long Cecil had a barrel that was 10 feet long and about 20 inches in diameter over the breech. Using the bore to scale 4.2" = 20mm that means my barrel will be 23.2 inch long by 3.8 inches diameter over the breech. The chamber dameter of this gun will be .816"diameter x 2.3" long. This isn't going to be a little gun.

That by the way exceeds the breech wall = or > than chamber diameter rule. Gee, what did those mining engineers know?

jamesfrom180 · « **Reply #68 on:** February 03, 2012, 08:23:10 AM »

My assumption is you are going to build the gun from one complete billet, right?

The alternative would be to build a two piece barrel. As I am new here has anyone tried to build a built up gun?

Double D · « **Reply #69 on:** February 03, 2012, 08:28:10 AM »

The 20mm barrel by itself will not be large enough to profile to the Long Cecil profile. I will have to add metal to get the diameter.

I will make the breech, barrel and trunnion rings and either light press fit them or just epoxy them in place with Devcon steel.

The rings on Long Cecil were shrink fit on the barrel and the bore was rifle. I have thought about shrink fitting. I don't really see the need in the build. Besides, I will be working with a pre-rifled barrel and don't want to compress the bore.

Here is a bit of amazing trivia. The De Beers engineers considered the possibility of recoil dislodging the trunnion ring, so they made shoulder on the barrel for the trunnion ring to abut. The shoulder was 1/8 of an inch.

I enjoy doing project like this. I have to do a lot of research and I learn a great deal-history and engineering.

GGaskill · « **Reply #70 on:** February 03, 2012, 09:04:11 AM »

As I am new here has anyone tried to build a built up gun?

Although not as complex as the British guns of Armstrong, et al, the golf ball mortars built for our contest of several years ago (2005, quite several) were assembled for multiple pieces. Here is my entry. Here, here, and here are the other entries.

jamesfrom180 · « **Reply #71 on:** February 03, 2012, 09:34:53 AM »

The whole story is fascinating to me since the DeBeer's engineers re-tooled under very harsh circumstances. I belive I read that the rings were forged, meaning a billet of steel was split and then formed by forging into a ring. This eliminates the somewhat unpredictable hammer welding.

Looking around at obutrators I found this site. http://www.victorianshipmodels.com/colossus/gunconstruction.html
I really like the rendered model the site shows.

On your model DoubleD I would think you could press fit the trunnion ring and breach band and pin or key the parts in place. My understanding is this would not be acceptable on a breach because the slight gap may be fouled under firing pressures and promote corrosion but with a one piece barrel I do not see a problem. Am I correct? So wouldn't pinning assure that the parts do not move and with welding the pins in you could turn and profile the barrel?

Double D · « **Reply #72 on:** February 03, 2012, 03:33:04 PM »

Quote from: jamesfrom180 on February 03, 2012, 09:34:53 AM

The whole story is fascinating to me since the DeBeer's engineers re-tooled under very harsh circumstances. I belive I read that the rings were forged, meaning a billet of steel was split and then formed by forging into a ring. This eliminates the somewhat unpredictable hammer welding.

Looking around at obutrators I found this site. http://www.victorianshipmodels.com/colossus/gunconstruction.html
I really like the rendered model the site shows.

On your model DoubleD I would think you could press fit the trunnion ring and breach band and pin or key the parts in place. My understanding is this would not be acceptable on a breach because the slight gap may be fouled under firing pressures and promote corrosion but with a one piece barrel I do not see a problem. Am I correct? So wouldn't pinning assure that the parts do not move and with welding the pins in you could turn and profile the barrel?

Take a look again at how the De Beers engineers built the barrel. This is how I am going to build my gun. The only difference will be the technique

Long Cecil-Williams-727 [Public domain or Public domain], by Book: Williams, Gardner Fred, 1842-1922, Photos not attributed, from Wikimedia Commons.

The barrel I am using, by itself because of the type steel it is made from, is strong enough for a cannon barrel. To get the Long Cecil profile I have to add rings and of course trunnions. The trunnions and trunnion ring will have to be secure and I have a couple of ideas for that. How, will have to wait until I get the actual barrel and taken some measurements.

The rest of the rings are just decorative at this point and can be epoxied in place.

GGaskill · « **Reply #73 on:** February 03, 2012, 04:40:29 PM »

The rest of the rings are just decorative at this point and can be epoxied in place.

That is true, and you really don't want them tight as that would constrict the barrel and swage the projectile down so that it was loose in the unconstricted part of the barrel.

Cannon Cocker · « **Reply #74 on:** February 03, 2012, 06:10:24 PM »

In looking for a rubber plug for the obturating system in the gun I am planning I found this. http://www.mcmaster.com/#tapered-rubber-plugs/=g3hf7z. I would think that one of the stock sizes offered could be very close to what you need. Also note that they are offered in rubber and silicone of different hardnesses, and also give heat resistance temperatures. Cheap too! Hope this helps.

Double D · « **Reply #75 on:** February 04, 2012, 04:39:29 AM »

I looked at those rubber corks before and will hold that source in reserve. The corks will require machining to fit. Punching out rubber sheets will be easier.....I hope

KABAR2 · « **Reply #76 on:** February 04, 2012, 04:47:31 AM »

Quote from: Double D on February 04, 2012, 04:39:29 AM

I looked at those rubber corks before and will hold that source in reserve. The corks will require machining to fit. Punching out rubber sheets will be easier.....I hope

Machining rubber is a pain..... the best way is to freeze it and use carbide cutter..... though in the tire industry they use Stelite cutters ... less wear.... punching should work better.

Double D · « **Reply #77 on:** February 04, 2012, 05:15:55 AM »

Progress to report on this project also. My check for payment for barrel and projectiles was received and the shipment should go out Monday...I hope the shipping department considers this a high priority shipment and get this out first thing Monday morning...hint hint Shipping department!!!

KABAR2 · « **Reply #78 on:** February 06, 2012, 05:50:03 AM »

Quote from: Double D on February 04, 2012, 05:15:55 AM

Progress to report on this project also. My check for payment for barrel and projectiles was received and the shipment should go out Monday...I hope the shipping department considers this a high priority shipment and get this out first thing Monday morning...hint hint Shipping department!!!

DD,
Will send tracking number as soon as the Acme Stage & Overland Express send it to me,From what I understand it will first be shipped by packet steamer around the tip of South America to their offices in Sanfansisco, from there it would be loaded on stage or freight wagon and sent on to your address in Wyoming, barring Indian attack it should arrive by the spring thaw......

Allen <><

Double D · « **Reply #79 on:** February 06, 2012, 08:13:37 AM »

I know that Allen is yanking my chain and having a good time doing it...none of that stuff bothers me, all good reliable methods of shipment. What does worry me, he is sending it to Wyoming...I am in Montana!

KABAR2 · « **Reply #80 on:** February 06, 2012, 08:37:28 AM »

Quote from: Double D on February 06, 2012, 08:13:37 AM

I know that Allen is yanking my chain and having a good time doing it...none of that stuff bothers me, all good reliable methods of shipment. What does worry me, he is sending it to Wyoming...I am in Montana!

Oh! Montana??

.
.
.
I thought you might catch that.......

You have no worries I am not doing the actual shipping and address is as you gave it.
As you can see I have a vivid imagination as to senarios of what could have been...... At least I didn't send it east around the horn of Africa and end up with it in Alaska......

Allen <><

Double D · « **Reply #81 on:** February 06, 2012, 06:12:38 PM »

Scheduled Delivery:
Monday, 13/02/2012, By End of Day

Last Location:
Departed - Virginia Beach, VA, United States, Monday, 06/02/2012

Double D · « **Reply #82 on:** February 07, 2012, 04:25:00 AM »

Scheduled Delivery:
Monday, 13/02/2012, By End of Day

Last Location:
Departed - Laurel, MD, United States, Tuesday, 07/02/2012

Getting closer!

KABAR2 · « **Reply #83 on:** February 07, 2012, 05:10:32 AM »

Quote from: Double D on February 07, 2012, 04:25:00 AM

Scheduled Delivery:
Monday, 13/02/2012, By End of Day

Last Location:
Departed - Laurel, MD, United States, Tuesday, 07/02/2012

Getting closer!

It's funny how it had to go east before it can go west....... I see they use the European way
of putting the day before the month when giving a date.....

Double D · « **Reply #84 on:** February 08, 2012, 05:14:06 AM »

Westward ho!!

Scheduled Delivery:
Monday, 13/02/2012, By End of Day

Last Location:
Arrived - Hodgkins, IL, United States, Wednesday, 08/02/2012

KABAR2 · « **Reply #85 on:** February 10, 2012, 05:18:47 AM »

Two days and no update ?
where has the cannon barrel been since leaving Hodgkins, IL?........

Has the truck been attacked by Indians and the driver is lying in a ditch somewhere on the plain?......
Will Double D have his barrel in time to defend against the boer's?........
will timmy get a new pair of shoes?
Tune in next time ........

Double D · « **Reply #86 on:** February 10, 2012, 06:34:16 AM »

I am suspicious!!! Did the gang of three in Broomfield hijack this shipment!!!

Commerce City, CO, United States 02/10/2012 12:52 A.M. Arrival Scan

No wait it's moving again,

Scheduled Delivery:
Monday, 02/13/2012, By End of Day

Last Location:
Departed - Commerce City, CO, United States, Friday, 02/10/2012 1:39 A.M.

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #87 on:** February 10, 2012, 07:10:32 PM »

A mystery package arrived today at Mike's house in Broomfield, Colorado, Seacoast Artillery World Headquarters. Delivered by one of those package delivery services in the late afternoon, I barely had time to check it out, because I left early today. The heft of it was about 15-25 pounds, my SWAG. The address label was mostly gone, well completely, I guess you could say. Just a little of the return addy was still there. It read: "each, VA". Torn off by surplus USPS equipment they bought to save $, I suppose. Sorry, I didn't get a chance to open it. Who knows what's inside. Mike glanced at it and said, "Not mine".

Tracy

Double D · « **Reply #88 on:** February 11, 2012, 04:18:17 AM »

waaaaahhhhhhhh!!!!!!!

BoomLover · « **Reply #89 on:** February 11, 2012, 09:18:08 PM »

Hang in there, Double D, I'm sure if it is going thru the USPS, it will arrive.............question is, when, and in what condition?

This being Saturday evening, I'm sure the suspense of waiting till Monday is killing you! Remember the old adage, ..."Neither Rain, nor Sleet, nor Snow, or the Dark of Night will prevent the Mail from getting thru, (On time and intact is another story...)"....I take liberties with their motto, but it goes something like that!