new to cast bullet reloading help

[wileynet]

i have been reloading for more than 30 years but never messed with cast bullets, but have been thinking of using cast in my 45LC, 45ACP, 357/38 and 45 70, lee manual goes into great detail about cast bullets but can someone simplify for me,


1.can 230 grain .451 RN  be used in both the 45ACP and Long colt
2. when do you use gas checks or not
3. is there a velocity for cast bullets
4. do I have to slug each barrel for the correct diameter
5. what about leading
6. how about cast for 308 or 303 british

[luckydawg13]

the first thing you need to do is join castboolits the secend thing is to buy
a Lyman reloading handbook 49 edition is a good one to get

[Bob J]

Second the recommendation to join Cast Boolits.....  Great site and a great resource if you are loading/shooting cast....


As for your questions:


1.can 230 grain .451 RN  be used in both the 45ACP and Long colt
Yes, this bullet can be used for both 45ACP and 45LC....


2. when do you use gas checks or not
All my magnum and rifle bullets are gas checked.....  All my regular pistol rounds are plain base.....


3. is there a velocity for cast bullets
My experience tops out at 1800 FPS with no leading and great accuracy.....  You can probably go higher but that is my experience....


4. do I have to slug each barrel for the correct diameter
It's a good idea to slug each of your guns so you know what you have so you can size appropriately.....  This does not mean that you are sizing differently for each gun but more that you know what you have so you don't take the chance to have your bullets undersized (which will dramatically impact accuracy and the tendency to lead the barrel....  What I've found is most commercial barrels for a particular caliber are fine with one size.....  Milsups can be different since you will typically have more wear erosion etc and older grades of steel.....  I typically size .002 over bore but a bit bigger usually is not a problem.....

5. what about leading
This is one of those areas where every caster has their opinion so take this with a grain of salt.....  My experience with leading is primarily associated with undersized bullets....  Anything that is say 1500 fps or higher that I load is gas checked and that also helps a lot....  As far as alloy, there is a lot of different opinions but I have found that a properly sized bullet and gas checked for more aggressive velocities works great for me....    Also be aware that you need a good clean (no copper fouling) barrel before you shoot lead since lead likes to bond to copper (think solder)..... 

6. how about cast for 308 or 303 british
I cast/load for both and each takes a different bullet.....  The 308 is a standard 30 caliber bullet and my go to is the Lyman 311291 (170 grain gas checked)......  The 303 british is what is known as a "fat 30" and needs to have a larger diameter.....  For 303 brit I cast/load the 314299 (200 grain gas checked).....


Hopefully this will help you make sense of it all.....;- )

i have been reloading for more than 30 years but never messed with cast bullets, but have been thinking of using cast in my 45LC, 45ACP, 357/38 and 45 70, lee manual goes into great detail about cast bullets but can someone simplify for me,


1.can 230 grain .451 RN  be used in both the 45ACP and Long colt
2. when do you use gas checks or not
3. is there a velocity for cast bullets
4. do I have to slug each barrel for the correct diameter
5. what about leading
6. how about cast for 308 or 303 british

[hornady]

Luckydawg gave you very good advice, it may seem he was blowing you off with his answer, Casting and shooting cast bullets is not difficult, but learn the right way to start.
I have said for years that Lee is the Best and worst in the reloading industry, their teaching and equipment, for reloading and casting. Are both geared to open the door too guys that would never have if not for Lee, but these cut backs and simplifications , can also be frustrating. If you want to shoot average cast bullets with a chance of leading and so so accuracy, Lee will suffice. But if you want the Best accuracy and minimal leading, do more research on the subject.

[luckydawg13]

Luckydawg gave you very good advice, it may seem he was blowing you off with his answer,
sorry i didn't mean to come off that way

[hornady]

I to am guilty of the one liner, and I did not mean that you posted in a degrading way to the OP. Your advice was to the point, and as I said very good. I have seen some on forums take offence to short answers, even if it is the best advice. Here again I should have explained myself better in my opening reply.

[luckydawg13]

i type with one finger im slow 

[hornady]

You are not alone, and now I am using my ring finger. First two on my right hand got a little too close to the blade on the table saw, I still have them, but too sore to type with.

[Larry Gibson]

Wileynet
 
The 49th Lyman is a good one but for cast bullets the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, 3rd edition is the best.  The 4th edition is ok and has more data but the 3rd edition has better information up front for the newbie to cast bullets to learn from.  If you can get both the 3rd & 4th editions.  The more you get into cast bullets the more you will refer to and use both.
 
Larry Gibson

[Graybeard]

I've been casting and shooting cast bullets for around 40 years. I've never joined this other site folks seem to bent on hyping here and don't think I've ever even visited it.

I've also never slugged a bore and do not get leading with my cast bullets nor those commercial cast bullets I've used over this time.

I wonder about the agenda of folks who can't seem to answer a question asked without the response being go somewhere else to seek your answer. It gets old real fast. We have folks on this site who likely have cast and shot as many cast bullets as anyone at this other site.

[Flash]

i have been reloading for more than 30 years but never messed with cast bullets, but have been thinking of using cast in my 45LC, 45ACP, 357/38 and 45 70, lee manual goes into great detail about cast bullets but can someone simplify for me,


1.can 230 grain .451 RN  be used in both the 45ACP and Long colt
2. when do you use gas checks or not
3. is there a velocity for cast bullets
4. do I have to slug each barrel for the correct diameter
5. what about leading
6. how about cast for 308 or 303 british

Casting your own bullets is quite easy and loading them in handgun ammunition is as easy but the real science begins with using them in rifle ammunition.
There really is no magic velocity for preventing bore leading since different lead hardness can either cause leading or prevent it. The real secret is to get all the copper fouling out of your barrel, if you're going to start shooting lead. The 30 calibers and 32 calibers are fine for cast bullets and the longer the neck, the better they hold your bullet. If you keep your cast loads under 1,200 fps, you'll do fine without leading. I shoot my bullets as they drop from the mould and they shoot fine. Some rifles are chambered in the 7.62x39 and experience should tell you that the bore should be .311 but often, you'll find it to be .308 instead. So, slugging might be necessary under these circumstances but otherwise useless.
Gas checks will provide better accuracy but plain base bullets will shoot fine too.
I must side with Graybeard here on the CastBoolit site. They are rude and seem to have little respect for members outside of their "Click". I personally have attempted to buy items there when someone secretly bought them out from under me with that broad reply, "PM Sent".
Save yourself some grief and avoid the CastBoolit site. The guy who runs it is an a$$. There is a wealth of knowledge right here and if you must go to another site, there is a Marlin forum that has a member that goes by the name of 35Remington. He is EXTREMELY knowledgable and shares it without hesitation. The Marlin forum too has a cast bullet arena.

[bilmac]

I agree that slugging your barrel is not that necessary unless you have a problem gun. Most guns are made to close tolerances today, and dimensions are usually right on. Also there is a possibility that you could damage your barrel.

[JustaShooter]

I'm with Graybeard, I don't understand why people are trying to send you away to another board when we have our very own Cast Bullet forum right here.  Even more surprised nobody's yet pointed you that way, since it's just right over there, next forum down in the list --> http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/board,45.0.html

Good folks and good advice, too.

Just a Shooter

[wileynet]

thanks for the info, just to make things clear i am not ready to jump in molten lead and start casting yet, but  price wise i can buy 500 cast bullets for about the same price as a box of 100 jacketed bullets give or take 5 or 10.00, thats my primary interest, i have never loaded a full lead bullet except in my 58 and thats a round ball.

[Bob J]

My apologies if I offended anyone......  Was just trying to give the best answer I could to the original question.....

[hornady]

I really don’t think anyone was putting down this forum or sending the OP to another forum. Because opinions over there are better, Like every forum on the net and every discussion, all are opinion based.
 I receive three shooting magazines, Handloader, Guns & Ammo, and Predator hunter. In these Magazines I read articles on a specific reloading step, by three supposed experts. The three different authors had three different views on this step. It was primer pocket uniforming, One said it was a waste of time, one that it was very necessary, and the third indifferent.  I have yet to find one subject on reloading or casting forums were there is total agreement on a practice or tool.
I also started casting 40 years ago. And like many had some self-taught bad habits to brake that I had picked up over the years, as well as practices that were excepted for years as fact that were later proven false.
 I do not think anyone would disagree the Lyman cast bullet book would be an excellent place for the OP to start. But I also believe everything you read on any Forum should be verified. And some times this means looking in other places.
The OP had already found this forum which is a good one. But the more research you do on a subject the better informed you will be once you started. Reloading or casting.

[jlchucker]

the first thing you need to do is join castboolits the secend thing is to buy
a Lyman reloading handbook 49 edition is a good one to get

absolutely!  The Lyman Reloading Handbook belongs near every reloading bench!  It contains good data for both jacketed as well as cast bullets, and the front part, covering the basis of reloading both types of projectiles, can answer a lot of questions.

[jhalcott]

  MY biggest worry is TOO MUCH info will scare the OP away from casting. I do agree that he NEEDS a lot of info to begin, though! I often read some thread on line that I feel is VERY wrong and occassionally dangerous. I ALWAYS verify ANY DATA I GET ON THE WEB. It's safer that way. Even the best magazines have an occassionaal typo that is some times corrected in a later edition

[cwlongshot]

I had a pretty long and detailed rundown of what I do and how I go about starting cast bullet loads... But I was concerned about exactly the same as you  Jhalcott....
 
SO I saved it and will mirror others who suggested you buy a LYMAN CAST BULLET MANUEL!!! Once you have read this, you will have a far better understanding to the hows and whys of cast bullet shooting. THEN come back and ask your  specific questions. We will be here!!
You have a  or should have a very good "base" to build upon. With 30 years behind the bench. You likely already "know" the things your gonna read. Just hearing them or reading them will give you the confidence to move forward with confidence.
 
Bill is spot on, there is a wealth of information from our members right here!!!  All one need do is ask...
 
CW

[wileynet]

thanks for all the info, i have used lee and rcbs info since i started reloading 30 + years ago, i have noticed there are a few nuances to placing a cast bullet in case, i have also noticed that most cast bullets come in decimal equivelents, that are not the standard ie 45 cal .451 or .452 or .458, 30 cal 308  etc and also read somewhere about different crimp groves etc. Even though i ve read everything written, an on the web. i guess i was looking for a simplified version of loading cast bullets into a shell. does it require expanding the case more or less, different bullet seating step to keep from deforming the bullet, etc

[cwlongshot]

Thanks for all the info, I have used lee and RCBS info since I started reloading 30 + years ago, I have noticed there are a few nuances to placing a cast bullet in case, I have also noticed that most cast bullets come in decimal equivalents, that are not the standard IE 45 cal .451 or .452 or .458, 30 cal .308  etc and also read somewhere about different crimp groves etc. Even though I've read everything written, an on the web. I guess I was looking for a simplified version of loading cast bullets into a shell.
Does it require expanding the case more or less, different bullet seating step to keep from deforming the bullet,? etc

I to have used RCBS as a source. (I am NO LEE fan) At the risk of sounding like a broken record... This is all covered in the LYMAN manual..
 
If you shooting softer lead, YES flaring the case mouth will be most helpful. With a gas check bullet, or a hard cast bullet its your choice. Generally speaking I will always flair the case mouth at least a bit.
 
For bullet diameter, I always slug the bore OR in my revolvers check the cylinders. In my mind, why play with a bullet that's too small??? I would rather KNOW what I have then GUESS.. follow me? GENERALLY speaking a lead slug will be .001-.002 larger then its copper and lead cousin.
 
CW

[wileynet]

no place to get a Lyman manual here but will try in albq. just your short paragraph about bullet diameter made more since than anything ive read

[cwlongshot]

no place to get a Lyman manual here but will try in albq. just your short paragraph about bullet diameter made more since than anything Ive read

I am more than happy to help. Was simply concerned about overwhelming you... It can be daunting looking at everything at once... taken one piece at a time I like the challenge and am rewarded with the accuracy.
 
Let me go see if I have an extra copy...
 
CW

[wileynet]

thanks for all your help

[bilmac]

When I load lead bullets into bottleneck cartridges I just give the cases an extra strong campher, I cut it until there is almost a knife edge on the outside of the case mouth. When the mouth is prepared this way they will usually take a bullet without shaving it. Belling the mouth of a bottleneck cartridge  takes an extra step, and then you have to close the bell down again to make sure it doesn't hang up when feeding.

[.22-5-40]

Hello, wileynet.  There is a better forum than Cast Boolits..thats the original Cast Bullet Association (CBA).
   Better yet, if you join..you'll get a very nice "Fouling Shot" journal every two months..color pictures too!
Plus..new members will recieve the very excellent Cast Bullets For Beginers And Experts..a very large and highly informative book that covers EVERYTHING you need to know about lead-alloy from pistols/revolvers to single-shots.  The information you will find here is first hand ..kind of makes any Lyman manual look like a joke.

[wileynet]

i know there are a lot of other sites out there, but i am somewhat of a loyalist, the members here donated parts to help me customize a handi for son that was burned, so he could shoot a donated buffalo, they have sent sights without asking for anything in return, and just like most of this advice is this post no condescending tone or post regardless of the topic, even though ill admit I am no expert in any one topic. i only use lee equipment, Nosler bullets, and hodgons powder, watch Dallas Cowboys, Notre Dame or the Rangers. what im trying to say is if its not on Greybeards in my opinion its probably not worth my time, i have lost track of the personal prayers, and posts ending with god bless,

[sidewinder319]

Most hand gun loads are not improved by using gas checks. The gas checks are effective when shooting bullets over 1,500 fps.  I like to push rifle loads to the outter limits. The 30-30 and .300 Savage can match jacketed bullets with hard cast. I use 100% Linotype and gas checks sized to .311 in these rifles to get very accurate target loads. These bullets cast from Lyman molds are run up to 2200 fps. with a very clean bore.

[Bob J]

thanks for all the info, i have used lee and rcbs info since i started reloading 30 + years ago, i have noticed there are a few nuances to placing a cast bullet in case, i have also noticed that most cast bullets come in decimal equivelents, that are not the standard ie 45 cal .451 or .452 or .458, 30 cal 308  etc and also read somewhere about different crimp groves etc. Even though i ve read everything written, an on the web. i guess i was looking for a simplified version of loading cast bullets into a shell. does it require expanding the case more or less, different bullet seating step to keep from deforming the bullet, etc

Softer alloys can actually be resized when loaded resulting in an undersized bullet when shot.....   In that case I would recommend using a Lyman M die to flare the case before loading.....  Otherwise agree a small flare or good chamfer will do the trick....

[sidewinder319]

Lee makes a very good inexpensive expanding die that fits everything from .22 thru .50 for about $12 bucks. Midway USA has this product.