Author Topic: 1894 for deer ? (Read 8434 times)

tanoose · « **on:** October 25, 2011, 06:03:37 AM »

hey guys over the years i have used the 35, 30/06 and my favorite the 45/70. i have been wanting a new close range deer rifle 75 yards max with most shots 30-50 and i am looking for a light handi rifle. i am thinking on the marlin 1894 ss in 44 rem. mag and wanted some opinions on this rifle for deer and black bear. was also wondering if anyone hear uses the same rifle in 357 mag is the 357 enough gun at those ranges.

Flynmoose · « **Reply #1 on:** October 25, 2011, 11:53:48 AM »

The 357 is enough for deer with a well placed short range shot. The 44 would be be better for bear. I don't know how I would survive without both, it's a sickness.
FM

yukondog · « **Reply #2 on:** October 25, 2011, 02:33:28 PM »

I have both but only have taken deer with the 44 mag., at the ranges you are shooting either one would work but the 44 will give you much more punch at different angles.

BBF · « **Reply #3 on:** October 25, 2011, 07:55:46 PM »

Going bigger is seldom wrong.

mannyrock · « **Reply #4 on:** October 26, 2011, 01:15:05 PM »

The .357 mag is fine for deer out to 100 yards (only). But forget it for black bear. too much potential for a terrible wound, by hitting a heavy shoulder or hip bone. Do yourself (and a bear) a favor, and go with the .44 mag.

Regards, Mannyrock

Graybeard · « **Reply #5 on:** October 26, 2011, 01:36:44 PM »

I've shot a bunch of deer with .44 magnum handguns but not in a rifle. Faye used a Marlin 336 .44 magnum on a couple of rams in Texas on her first big game hunt.

In a rifle the .357 is plenty for deer at the ranges you mention and folks who've used it on deer from a handgun seem to feel it fine in a handgun as well. I love my .357s handguns and rifle but have guns better suited to the chore so don't personally use them for deer.

Duke0313 · « **Reply #6 on:** October 26, 2011, 11:17:44 PM »

If bear is on the agenda, you have to go .44. .357 just makes 'em mad.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #7 on:** October 27, 2011, 01:11:21 AM »

If you know that shots wont be much past a 100 yards a 44 mag carbine is hard to beat in the whitetail woods. Im not a fan of the 357 in handguns but have a buddy who guides bear hunting with dogs and has killed more bear with a 357 smith then most have seen. Believe me if it didnt work he wouldnt trust his dogs lives to it. Key to it is most of these bear are treed and close and good shot placement is fairly easy to make. Would i hunt bear or deer with a 357 handgun? Probably not unless it was all i had but i would not feel undergunned with a 357 carbine hunting deer.

ironglow · « **Reply #8 on:** October 27, 2011, 01:53:12 AM »

I have shot 3 deer with an H&R .44 mag, It is an excellent round for shorter ranges. My grandson has the same rifle today and harvested a deer with it last season. I live at the northern tip of the Allegany mountains, and the .44 mag is great for the short ranges and thick woods normally found here.
I would welcome a chance at black bear with a .44 mag. Not having used one on big game,I cannot comment on the .357.

Thebear_78 · « **Reply #9 on:** October 28, 2011, 09:01:17 PM »

My dad has a 1894 in 357 that has killed as many deer as any other rifle in the house. a well places 158-180gr bullet at 125 yards or less will kill a deer every time. I have used it for hunting standing corn and swamps where the compact size was a definite advantage. As to the 357 working for bear, there isn't a black bear alive that will soak up a 180gr Hard cast load out of a 357 rifle and live. The trick is using a bullet thats up to the task. Bigger is always better but don't count out the 357 so quickly. When it first came out in a revolver they killed about everything with it claiming it be be the most powerful thing ever made. Anything that will kill a whitetail will kill a black bear.

T.R. · « **Reply #10 on:** October 30, 2011, 03:23:40 AM »

Every buck I nailed with my 44 MAG carbine went down fast. Great cartridge for deer.

TR

Rolandedwinjohnson · « **Reply #11 on:** October 30, 2011, 10:17:31 AM »

I've had both the 357and 44 versions. My older sons claimed them after killing their first deer.

I gave my youngest son a M94 Winnie to keep him from stealing one from me.

YES, the Marlin 1894's in either 357 or 44 will kill deer.

Don't discount the 357 from a carbine, id does a real good job with 158 grain bullets behind a decent load of unique or 2400. With 2400 it approaches the power of the original 30-30 (160 grains and 1800 fps). Of course, the ballistics don't quite match. The blunt bullet looses velocity faster than the slim pencil like 150 or 170 grain 30 cal bullets in the 30-30.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #12 on:** October 30, 2011, 01:04:43 PM »

If it doesn't work, no body told me!!

I have been shooting deer with marlin 1894s for over twenty years!!! IN ALMOST all the calibers its chambered for!!! I haven't shot one with the 218 or the 25-20 or the 44-40. (Not from a lack of trying mind you!

)

My 32-20, 357 Maggie's, 41Mag 44 mag and 45 Colts are especially my favorites! All have accounted for multiple deer. My 357 was used by my buddie for his kids first deer! He used 180Gr Black Talons and they worked perfectly! HELL YEA they will work!!!

I have never been a 44 Fan, not for any reason but everyone seems to have one. I like different stuff. So I gravitate to the 41 and 45 calibers for hunting. But the 357 mag outta a long rifle barrel (With good bullets) is close to the 30-30 and we all know the 30-30. I would not hesitate one second in choosing one if the range was within 100 yards.

CW

tanoose · « **Reply #13 on:** October 30, 2011, 04:44:53 PM »

thanks for all the replies i think i will go with the marlin 1894ss i never thought on the 357 but was curious as to your opinions on it. even though my shots will be close i need to use a scope i have two that would work well , a leupold vx-3 1.5x5 and a fixed leupold 2x the only other rifle i am thinking about is the puma m92 in 454 using a scout scope but i am not sure if i could get used to it,so i am leaning to the marlin right now. thanks again.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #14 on:** October 30, 2011, 05:36:30 PM »

Quote from: Duke0313 on October 26, 2011, 11:17:44 PM

If bear is on the agenda, you have to go .44. .357 just makes 'em mad.

When the 357 Mag was intorduced in 1927. A gentleman from S&W went around the country with a Registered model (pre Model 27) and hunted all classes of North American big game with it, including brown(grizzley) bear, Black bear, elk, and bison. If the 357 out of a revolver is enough for Bison, and Brown bear why would it not be enough for a Black bear? Granted shot placement is going to be primary, and bullet construction and weight being secondary.
Of the two, 44 Mag would be better. Bigger heavier bullets are always better.

Graybeard · « **Reply #15 on:** October 30, 2011, 06:13:16 PM »

Yeah he did do that but what most often isn't mentioned is not all the critters he shot with it were killed cleanly by him. Shooting dangerous game with the .357 then was as it is now a stunt and not real smart.

Same thing happened when the .220 Swift came out folks went out and shot about everything with it and claimed it worked. I'd not want to piss off a grizzly with a .220 Swift or a .357 either. Ya gotta trust your back up man real well to do that.

Also the .357 of today is NOT the same as the .357 of long ago. Back then the specs were a 158 at 1550 fps. I shot a lot of that in factory ammo and it is a whole different critter than what you buy these days.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #16 on:** October 30, 2011, 11:14:10 PM »

yup the same kind of stunt hunting for advertisment went on with the 22 high power the 17 rem and then there was roy weatherby running around the world shooting everything on the planet with the 257 wby. Bottom line is a 22 lr in the brain buck will kill about anything but most of those who pulled these stunts later admitted they just werent enough gun. I hear all the time that a 357 in a carbine is everything a 3030 is. Well it may be if your in a virtual world with and are hunting with a calculator but in the real world a 3030 is hands down a better game killer. Dont get me wrong, im not saying a 357 rifle isnt a decent deer gun. It is if range is kept to 50 yards, 75 max and deer is the absolute biggest aniamal on the agenda. the 3030 will do the same and do it at double the yardage and do it on even bigger animals. Comparing the two with real world chrono readings ive gotten myself the 357 will push a 150 to about 1800 fps with good hanloads in a rifle and the 3030 will push a 150 to about 2100. thats about the same differnce between a 308 and a 300 mag. The 3030 bullet also has a much better bc and will fly flatter longer. Hardly in the same league. Ive taken deer out to 200 yards with a 3030 and wouldnt dream of trying that with a 357. Comparing the 44 out of a rifle with a 3030 is a much fairer comparison again as long as the range is kept to a 100 yards or less or the 3030 again will come out on top. to me comparing those two is about a toss up.

ironglow · « **Reply #17 on:** October 30, 2011, 11:46:00 PM »

Quote from: T.R. on October 30, 2011, 03:23:40 AM

Every buck I nailed with my 44 MAG carbine went down fast. Great cartridge for deer.

TR

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
TR;
That looks like an H&R "Shikari"..if it is , it is the same model my grandson and I have collected 4 deer with..
Checked it again in the gravel pit yesterday, still shooting 1" high at 50 yds and shots touching..
It wears a 2.5 X 20 Tasco....

billy_56081 · « **Reply #18 on:** October 31, 2011, 01:07:21 AM »

With good bullets and handloading, the 357 is very potent out of a rifle. I would not hesitate to use it on deer ot black bear.

pastorp · « **Reply #19 on:** November 17, 2011, 01:41:33 AM »

Used to be a guy around here named JJerry Lester that was the expert on what a 357mag in a revolver or rifle would do.

He seemed to think it was enough for deer with 158gr softpoint bullets.

Haven't seen him post in a long time.. But he sure seemed to know what he was talking about..

Regards,

Flip G · « **Reply #20 on:** November 17, 2011, 06:09:13 AM »

Took my first deer with a 1894 .44mag and many more after that. It is a fine deer rifle and fun to shoot as well.
Flip G

Graybeard · « **Reply #21 on:** November 17, 2011, 10:51:30 AM »

I miss Jerry's posts too. The economy got the best of him. He lost his job and might have lost his home. I know he lost the internet shortly after my last contact with him. I dunno how he is doing now but I hope things have improved for him. I'd like to see him return one day. He had a lot of experience with the .357 in both handgun and rifle.

Winter Hawk · « **Reply #22 on:** November 28, 2011, 03:52:24 PM »

Quote from: ironglow on October 30, 2011, 11:46:00 PM

Quote from: T.R. on October 30, 2011, 03:23:40 AM

Every buck I nailed with my 44 MAG carbine went down fast. Great cartridge for deer.

TR
''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
TR;
That looks like an H&R "Shikari"..

I don't think the Shikari has a magazine tube, nor a loading gate on the side of the receiver....

-WH-

dpe.ahoy · « **Reply #23 on:** November 28, 2011, 06:11:46 PM »

Quote from: Graybeard on November 17, 2011, 10:51:30 AM

I miss Jerry's posts too. The economy got the best of him. He lost his job and might have lost his home. I know he lost the internet shortly after my last contact with him. I dunno how he is doing now but I hope things have improved for him. I'd like to see him return one day. He had a lot of experience with the .357 in both handgun and rifle.

I'm with ya on that Bill. I picked up a lot of information from his posts, miss hearing more of his experiences. Hope things get better and he comes back on line with those of us who miss him. DP

greenrivers · « **Reply #24 on:** November 29, 2011, 02:58:19 AM »

I had always considered the .357 as being a self defence caliber until this summer. A friend who had owned an 1894 for many years asked me to help develope a load suitable for deer with him. After finally settling on XTP's over a charge of H110 I changed my mind. I still think the caliber is at the bottom of the ladder for ethical taking of deer sized game. But do not overlook the Italion market. The Puma's you mention in .454 are a long way above the .357. His Marlin has an occasional jamming problem that my Puma has never had, and it is not due to OAL of loads.

Rangr44 · « **Reply #25 on:** November 29, 2011, 02:35:29 PM »

Quote from: tanoose on October 25, 2011, 06:03:37 AM

hey guys i have been wanting a new close range deer rifle 75 yards max with most shots 30-50 and i am looking for a light handi rifle. i am thinking on the marlin 1894 ss in 44 rem. mag and wanted some opinions on this rifle for deer and black bear. was also wondering if anyone hear uses the same rifle in 357 mag is the 357 enough gun at those ranges.

There's a BIG diference between 110lb Southern Whitetail bucks and 250lb-300lb Northern Whitetail bucks, plus Black Bear usually need some extra "convincing" - SO:

If Northern deer and/or Black Bear were on the agenda, i'd recommend sticking with the .44 Mag.

If only smaller deer are being targeted, a .357 will do just as well.

Actually, after using over 20 different cartridges/chamberings over the last 40 years, I've now returned to the tried/true .30-30 - in a 16" Winchester 94 Trapper - for ease of carrying with more than ample power for anything I'm likely to run across.

.

oldyardog · « **Reply #26 on:** November 30, 2011, 08:57:23 AM »

I have killed two bucks this year with my .357 1894. The small one (@100 dressed) was shot at 50 yards head on in the chest. 158 gr. ended up in the back leg. Larger one hit broad side behind front leg. Heart and one lung busted up. Both deer ran about 25-30 yards and went to sleep. Deer were taken to two differant processors. they both said that the deer were hardly dead enough to process. Said to make them deader next time I bring one in. I am thinking of trading the 1894 off and getting a 7mm----not.

Oldyardog

greenrivers · « **Reply #27 on:** December 01, 2011, 12:55:22 AM »

oldyarddog, well put. The key here is part of the name. Old. Under the right circumstance, with the right amount of restraint and with the right amount of marksmanship, even a .22 Long rifle will do the job. But how many have those skills and restraint. Enough gun can make the difference between an ethical shot and a wounded animal. Having found deer with shot off lower jaws, ganggreen in hind quarters etc., makes one think.

animal · « **Reply #28 on:** December 23, 2011, 09:38:35 AM »

The 44 Marlin lays em out real fast.

Gene R · « **Reply #29 on:** January 05, 2012, 04:29:54 PM »

Quote from: Duke0313 on October 26, 2011, 11:17:44 PM

If bear is on the agenda, you have to go .44. .357 just makes 'em mad.

I would like to hear about all the actual experiences with anyone actually P_ _ _ ING a bear off with a .357 mag rifle. Out of a rifle it is close to a 30-30 in performance, and the ole 30-30 has killed way more than it's share of bears.

I live in Charleston, SC. and we have NO BEARS, but if we did a .357mag rifle would not be out of the question. The only question would be if I would spent as much time in the woods as I do now

?