Imam obama secretly arming yet another muslim nation??

[powderman]

U.S. Reportedly Planning Bomb Sales in Gulf to Counter Iran


Published November 10, 2011
| The Wall Street Journal
WASHINGTON – The Obama administration has quietly drawn up plans to provide a key Persian Gulf ally with thousands of advanced "bunker-buster" bombs and other munitions, part of a stepped-up U.S. effort to build a regional coalition to counter Iran.
The proposed sale to the United Arab Emirates would vastly expand the existing capabilities of the country's air force to target fixed structures, which could include bunkers and tunnels-the kind of installations where Iran is believed to be developing weapons.

The move represents one way the Obama administration intends to keep Iran in check, as it struggles to find adequate backing for new United Nations sanctions-even after a report by the U.N. nuclear watchdog concluded this week that Tehran has been developing the technologies needed to produce a nuclear weapon.
The oil-rich U.A.E. traditionally has had strong trade relations with Iran. But the ruling al Nahyan family in Abu Dhabi, the Emerati capital, is seen as one of the most hawkish against Iran among the monarchies in the Persian Gulf, and the country's leadership has openly expressed fear of an Iranian nuclear weapon.
Tehran also has regularly claimed sovereignty over three of the U.A.E.'s Persian Gulf islands, though it denies its nuclear program is for anything but peaceful purposes.
The proposed package for U.A.E. is expected to be formally presented to Congress in the coming days and would authorize the sale of up to 4,900 joint direct attack munitions, or JDAMs, along with other weapons systems.
The sale reflects the Obama administration's focus on curbing Iranian influence as it pulls the last U.S. troops out of Iraq by the end of the year. U.S. defense officials say the U.S. will have an estimated 40,000 troops in the region after the pullout.
The U.N.'s International Atomic Energy Agency in a report this week concluded Iran has conducted research on developing nuclear weapons, a finding putting pressure on the Obama administration to take new steps against the country's rulers.



Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011...#ixzz1dOa97k3l 
 

[BBF]

4900 of those things? How are they going to get them dropped? Who is going to do the dropping? Are there that many Sites in Iran? What if they are dropped on somebody else accidental on purpose?
 
It sounds like a lucrative arms sale if the Arabs actually pay for them.

[powderman]

The u.a.e. bomb iran?? I doubt it. If they get these bunker busters I fear they will be sold to other nations with no god to use against Israel. Obummer has armed too many of our enemies already. POWDERMAN. 

[Shu]

The Arab community sticks together pretty well, that is until someone looks like they may have an advantage. If Iran can actually test a nuke the rest of the middle east will denounce them. Remember when Iraq invaded Kuwait, the rest of the Arab community asked for help. The Saudi's allowed use of military facilities, Yemen and Qatar built bigger runways for US jets.
 
All is good in the sand box until one kid gets bigger then the rest. Then the rest call for help from outside so they don't look bad.

[yellowtail3]

Obummer has armed too many of our enemies already. POWDERMAN. 

President Obama - you know, the guy elected by a substantial majority of your fellow citizens, and the electoral college? - has it under control, Powderman. Don't worry about it.

[BBF]

YT3
His handlers certainly know how and where to steer him,  Nice hat by the way.
 
BTW his supposedly overheard remarks in reference to Bibi N is one of the few true words out of his mouth that I've read/heard. It shows you who runs the whole Circus.

[lakota]

Yeah! you tell powderman yellow! The Obama was elected by a majority so how dare PM question or disagree with the Obama! The mob has spoken so you will not question or disagree with the Obama! You will kneel before the Obama!

[yellowtail3]

Yeah! you tell powderman yellow! The Obama was elected by a majority so how dare PM question or disagree with the Obama! The mob has spoken so you will not question or disagree with the Obama! You will kneel before the Obama!

I see you're a fan of the strawman, Lakota.
 
 
Hey, PM or anyone can question or disagree all they want; it's done daily,has nothing to do with legitimacy (which isn't questioned by anyone of consequence). So far as the mob goes... I thought they voted for the other guy, didn't they?

[BBF]

............................
........................................

.
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............................ The problem with BHO and Sarkozy yaking about Bibi is that they aren't doing enough of it above water in the open air.
 

They'd both be gone/silenced if they dared................ you knew that

[mdwest]

the US has been selling weapons and providing training to the UAE and several other arab nations for decades.. this is nothing new at all..
 
the Kuwaiti's have M1 tanks, F15 eagles, etc.. as do the Saudi's..
 
the Jordanians have spent A LOT of time with our special operations people..
 
We have sold tons of weapons to Qatar, Bahrain, etc..
 
typically the weapons systems we sell are downgraded from what we keep for our own armed forces.. for example, the M1's we sold the Kuwaitis are hardware driven rather than software.. when our tanks need an "upgrade", you litterally plug it in.. when the Kuwati tanks need an upgrade, you have to yank out the entire system and replace it with a new one.. we control the "new" systems.. so we get to decide whether or not they get improved targeting capability, improved navigational systems, etc.. in a nutshell we normally sell the "basic" model of weapons systems (to include bunker busters) to our "friends" with little or no advanced capability.. over time as our version of the system improves, we will sell additional upgrades to our "friends" that are still a couple of generations behind our own capability..
 
soooo.. while we might think it is in our own best interest for the UAE (and other countries) to have access to these weapons systems, and hope that they would use them for defensive (or offensive) operations.. and it is highly probable that we would also be there providing training and/or advisement during a conflict to ensure they would be using them "correctly" (to their maximum potential).. we arent selling these things to the UAE with the intent of pre-positioning them for our own use.. what they are getting their hands on is generations behind what we have in our own stockpiles and generations behind what our planes, tanks, etc.. are programmed to carry/drop/use...
 
we dont need to sell the UAE (or anyone else in the region) munitions for us to use..
 
we have tons and tons of ordnance stored at our own facilities in Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Afghanistan, Qatar, and a few other places to arm up our planes if we want to do the job ourselves..
 
 

[ironglow]

  We already know Obama doesn't like Israel...
   Can we really be absolutely assured that those missles will not be used on Israel ?

[BBF]

TM7 I think that Obama thought Israel would dance to his tune, then found out it is the other way around. Made him a bit sour.

[Junior1942]

  We already know Obama doesn't like Israel...
   Can we really be absolutely assured that those missles will not be used on Israel ?

Ironglow, you should run for political office.  If Powderman is in your district you'd get two votes . . . maybe.

[ironglow]

  We already know Obama doesn't like Israel...
   Can we really be absolutely assured that those missles will not be used on Israel ?

Ironglow, you should run for political office.  If Powderman is in your district you'd get two votes . . . maybe.

'
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
  Sure Junior....and you could be depended upon ...to leave a "hanging chad"..    

[mdwest]

mdwest....if they're a client state...we're selling the stuff to ourselves. Ain't the intell-MIC a wonderful thing. Now what did you say they need this stuff for...?
 
..Tm7
.

I'd hardly call the UAE a client state.. when was the last time you knew of the UAE doing anything just becaused we asked?
 
they have limited oil by comparrison with the other nations in the region..  where they have made their real money is by acting as the bankers and the recreational playground for the rest of the arab world.. they are far more interested in building the world's first 7 star hotel (Birg Al Arab), shopping malls with ski resorts located inside them (Mall of the Emeriates), the worlds tallest building (Birg Al Dubai), etc.. than they are worrying about their long term economic relationship with the US.. the emir in dubai has made it very clear that he knows their oil reserves are going to be one of the first to run out and that he is on a mission to establish other sources of income for his country (banking, entertainment, tax free commerce zones, etc..).. he has no interest in taking his country back to the 1950's where they were one of the poorest nations on earth and essentially were nothing more than a community of bedouins and pearl diving susbsistance livers.. he also knows that when the oil does go away, US and European interest in his country will go away with it.. as the location of the UAE doesnt offer any real strategic value, and they have no other natural resources that anyone is interested in.. he has to depend on other countries in the region as his customer base for the future..
 
 
all of the above are among the reasons the UAE economy has taken such a hard hit when compared to the other oil driven countries in the region.. when the global economy tanked.. no one stopped buying crude from the gulf region states that base almost their entire national economy on its sale.. they felt very little impact... the UAE however has taken a bath.. they have half finished projects and bankrupt companies all over Duabi and Abu Dhabi that counted on money from other industries and sources.. what was once one of the fastest growing cities in the world (Dubai) has in less than 3 years almost come to a complete halt in terms of growth and development.. unemployment is high, and vacant buildings are everywhere.. the government sector is still doing ok.. but the private sector there is struggling very hard right now (much like europe and the US)..
 
 
on to the next question...
 
I dont have a clue what the UAE needs bunker busters for.. other than they might think it is another deterrant to add to their arsenal.. or maybe they think its something to "show off".. they bought a couple of thousand sniper rifles a decade ago.. but dont even have a couple of hundred "snipers" in their military.. they have more tanks in their warehouses than they have qualified crews to drive and operate them.. as often as not they do things just because they can (see ski slopes inside shopping malls inside the desert reference above)...
 
at the end of the day, the UAE lacks the capability of delivering a precision strike against an Iranian nuclear target.. they have a limited number of advanced war planes.. and a limited number of pilots with reasonable skill sets.. they have a limited number of munitions capable of delivering the strike..
 
they are also terrified of the Iranians.. the Iranians "took" one of their islands in the persian gulf in the early 90's.. they have done nothing to take it back other than complain about the Iranian occupation to the UN for the past 20 years.. if they struck Iran.. Iran would roll over their country in less than 7 days.. and destroy everything in sight.. and they know it.. they dont want to loose those ski resort shopping malls, sky scrapers, and 7 star hotels.. and have no capability to defend them against an Iranian attack (no different than the Kuwatis trying to stop the Iraqis in the 90's)...

If we were going to pick another nation to do our dirty work for us.. there are far better choices in the area.. whether they be the Saudis, Israelis, or others.. countries with more weaponry.. more capability.. better trained pilots, etc... and greater stand off range between them and the Iranians
 
If we were going to do it ourselves.. we wouldnt use UAE aircraft or munitions that sold them.. the warplanes and munitions we already have in the region stored in bunkers in Kuwait, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.. are far superior and more capable..

[ironglow]

  We already know Obama doesn't like Israel...
   Can we really be absolutely assured that those missles will not be used on Israel ?

 
mdwest....as an expert and political officer in the region.....does Obama dislike isreal as asserted above...??   you're opinion please...?
 
..TM7

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
  TM ;
  We don't have to go that far !  He sat under Rev Wright for 20 years, lapping up the anti-israel, anti-America screeching from the guy whose church ran a special day to HONOR .. Minister (Calypso Louie) Farakahn..probably the best known anti-Jew, anti-Israel rabble rouser in this country.
  We don't have to look further to discover his hate-base..  If I were attending a church where they honored the racist Faarakhan and shouted things like .. the "G _ _  D _ _ _ America" garbage, I wouldn't stay for 20 seconds, say nothing about 20 years..
 
        Today's left is anti-Israel     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK_MblDcvA8

[mdwest]

mdwest....as an expert and political officer in the region.....does Obama dislike isreal as asserted above...??   you're opinion please...?
 
..TM7

I am neither an expert, or a political officer in the region (or any region).. I have spent quite a bit of time there however..
 
I have no idea what Obama's real motiviations are about much of anything foreign policy wise honestly.. my personal opinion is that he talks out of both sides of his mouth on just about everything..
 
he certainly isnt as "pro" Israel as his predecessor..
 
but I wouldnt put it past him to "use" any relationship he might have with any goverment (israel or anyone else in the region) to press his own personal agendas..
 
sadly, his vision for the future of USA isnt anything like mine..

[mdwest]

I don't think BHO has canceled any payment or arms shipments to isreal, including the notorious bunker buster shipment....do you know if that shipment is DU tipped?   If it is I believe it is illegal according to International Law or Treaty.

I dont know anything about them being DU tipped.. but I would seriously doubt it.. as stated above it is common practice for us to sell "modern" weapons and weaponry to our "friends" (whether Jewish, Arab, or Christian) that are a couple of generations old.. if the Israelis wanted to DU tip them.. they could likely do that easily enough themselves.. they have been a nuclear nation for a long time, and have the resources, technology, and industrial capability to do so.. they dont need us to break an international law or treaty for this..
 

As for 'client' state status...UAE is in deep with the west,,,not only for the banking dominance and committment to dollar support, but also for the hospital and air base: 

if this is your qualifier.. most of the middle east (to include Israel), about half of Africa, and a large chunk of South America and Asia are all client states.. you cant have it both ways.. either we are the dog wagging the tail.. or we are the tail getting wagged by the dog..
 

Al Dhafra Air Base, UAE
24°14'54" N 54°32'52"E Al Dhafra Air Base in the United Arab Emirates is located about an hour outside of Abu Dhabi, the capital of the United Arab Emirates. The 763rd Expeditionary Air Refueling Squadron [formerly designated the 4413th Air Refueling Squadron (Provisional)] conducts in-flight refueling missions throughout Southwest Asia in support of Operation Southern Watch, a coalition force tasked to monitor United Nations Security Council resolutions restricting air and ground operations in Southern Iraq. The Air Force operates KC-10 refueling planes which are involved in sustaining US warplanes covering the southern no-flight zone over Iraq. Both U-2s and Global Hawk operated from the the United Arab Emirates since early in Operation Enduring Freedom.

nothing unique here.. we also have military bases in Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and a number of other places in the region.. is the entire middle east our "client state"? We sell weapons and armament to almost every country in the region (there are some obvious exceptions in Iran, Yemen, Syria, etc..).. whether they are jewish (israel) or muslim (all the rest).. moderate and relatively pro-western (Jordan, UAE, etc..) or not so moderate, and not so israel friendly or pro-west (Egypt, Saudi Arabia, etc..)..
 
so do the Russians, the Chinese, the French, the Brits.. even the South Africans are in on the game.. they have been selling light reconnisance aircraft, small arms, and light armored vehicles all over the region for several years now..
 
are they the client states of the Russians? or Nelson Mandela?
 

The UAE air force is split into a western and central air command based in Abu Dhabi and Dubai, respectively. Western command has air bases at Al Dhafra, Bateen and Al Ain Sharjah international airport. The largest base is Al Dhafra in Abu Dhabi, which has two squadrons of Mirage 2000s and one with Mirage-5s. Al Dhafra is also home to the Abu Dhabi Royal Flight, the AH-64As, the Cougars and the Puma transports.

most of their airforce was purchased from the French and the British.. are they our client state? or the client of the French (who we at best have had an on again, off again relationship with over the past 60 years)..
 

The 10th Tactical Fighter Squadron deployed to Al Dhafra AB, United Arab Emirates, for operations Desert Shield and Desert Storm. The Gulf War stimulated the UAE's interest in building a security relationship with the United States. The two countries concluded a Defense Cooperation Agreement in 1994. Among Gulf states friendly to the United States, the UAE is probably least supportive of the US hard line toward Iraq. UAE officials are sensitive to criticism from Islamic sects of close ties to the United States.

from your own source.. but they are our "client state"?
 

[mdwest]

our definitions are different then.. but we are likely in agreement in terms of who they do business with and why..
 
there is no doubt that the UAE, and just about everyone else in the region, rely on the west and the russians to supply and train their militaries.. all the mirage F1's, AK47's, and UH60 helicopters didnt get there by local manufacture..
 
I believe that for the most part, who they choose to do business with, and how they divide up their money is much more often then not about what they think serves their best interest as opposed to getting an offer they cant refuse..
 
middle eastern countries very carefully calculate how much or what they need to buy from whom in order to keep everyone happy with them (buying their oil)...
 
Kuwait for example buys most of its tanks from the US.. but they buy most of their artillery from the French.. most of their APC's from the British.. etc..
 
The UAE buys its fighters from the French, its heavy lift helicoptors from the British, its attack helicopters from us..
 
The Jordanians buy HUMMVEE's from us.. but they buy APC's from the Russians.. and small arms from just about everyone (brits, US, russians, chinese, etc..)
 
Israel buys from the US.. but it also buys from Germany, France, and the UK, and has its own little arms industry as well.. they sell weapons all over latin america and africa..
 
 
As far as Israel being nuclear.. they have never admitted to it.. but they have also never denied it.. they maintain a "nuclear ambiguity" policy.. there is no doubt however that the French (not our friends at the time of the occurance) helped them develop nuclear technology in the 50's, and that the British helped them continue with that technology through the 60's after they fell out of favor with Charles De Gaul..
 
they have gone on the record and stated that they have an interest in, and have full intention of, building a nuclear power plant and even went so far as saying they would build one in cooperation with the Jordanians and allow the French (now back in their faovr) supervise the constuction of it... I think this was either late 2009 or early 2010 that they said that (ill have to go google.)..
 
I dont think anyone questions whether or not they are a nuclear nation.. anymore than anyone questions whether or not Pakistan or India are nuclear (they are not recognized "Nuclear Weapon States" and have not signed a Nuclear Non Proliferation Treaty either)..

[powderman]

We have no business selling weapons or training our enemies. Other than Israel we have no friends over there, they only tolerate us and bleed us of our money. POWDERMAN. 

[mdwest]

I question why we have sold some of the stuff we have to the Saudis, Egyptians, and some others...
 
but I dont think you can qualify the UAE as our enemy..
 
they lack the strike capability to reach even a few hundred miles outside of the their own borders.. arent known for extremist acts.. or people.. and are honestly just about as pro western as any arab nation you will find..
 
one of the primary reasons people from all the other arab nations vacation there is alcohol is readily available, night clubs, bars, and good resturants are everywhere, women dont have to cover up, and every high end shop that sells anything western you can imagine ranging from rolexes to gucci to cowboy boots to ferraris is all packed into one central place..
 
they can go there, and act like europeans and americans do on vacation.. they can get drunk, buy expensive stuff, let their wives walk around without a scarf tied to their heads, ride harley davidsons, and not be bothered..
 
thats not to say the UAE doesnt have its quirks.. I have heard of several instances where western women have been abused for not "behaving" while there, I have seen westerners arrested for things that arabs would be left alone for, etc.. you cant go there and expect to act like an "ugly american" and get away with it..
 
but there is a reason that the irish pub in terminal 2 at the airport serves some of the best beer in the country, that the JW Marriott Steak House has a western US theme in its decor.. they like that kind of stuff there (it isnt Saudi Arabia).. and there are enough westerners living there to keep places like that packed 7 days a week..
 
there are more europeans, americans, and asians living in the Dubai and the surrounding cities than there are arabs by the way.. only about 17% of the people that live there are emirati.. there is maybe another 10% that are arabs from other countries..
 
this means that 3 out of every 4 people you see walking down the street are from somewhere else other than the middle east.. only about half the total population is even muslim (there are TONS of Christian Indians there... they are the cheap labor pool for the country.. the emiratis trust the Indians that are monotheistic.. but dont trust the ones that practice hinduism at all..)...

[NWBear]

U.S. Reportedly Planning Bomb Sales in Gulf to Counter Iran


Published November 10, 2011
| The Wall Street Journal
WASHINGTON – The Obama administration has quietly drawn up plans to provide a key Persian Gulf ally with thousands of advanced "bunker-buster" bombs and other munitions, part of a stepped-up U.S. effort to build a regional coalition to counter Iran.
...
The proposed package for U.A.E. is expected to be formally presented to Congress in the coming days and would authorize the sale of up to 4,900 joint direct attack munitions, or JDAMs, along with other weapons systems.
 

I hope the members of congress keep the secret.  I sure wouldn't want Iran to find out about this.
I wonder who the UAE would hire to drop them on Iran or anyone else anyway?
 
 

[mdwest]

they have 3 full squardons of F16 block 60 fighter bombers and 3 full squadrons of Mirage 2000 fighter bombers in their airforce..
 
all of which are capable of deploying the JDAM..

[mdwest]

bunker buster = JDAM.. they are the same thing... JDAM is just a type of bunker buster..
 
UAE location:
 
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=UAE&gs_upl=390l1469l0l1969l3l3l0l0l0l0l469l907l4-2l2l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.,cf.osb&biw=1355&bih=563&wrapid=tlif132182572232810&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=vHXJTsiSLo6btwfF4dXkCw&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=3&ved=0CB8Q_AUoAg
 
 

[mdwest]

AGM130 is a "smart bomb".. precision guided (GPS) missile.. it was developed specifically for the F16 (and F15)... and can be carried by just about every NATO fighter bomber.. it doesnt need JDAM.. its smart already..
 
thye GBU37 is another GPS guided munition.. based on pretty old technology.. developed in the late 80's and early 90's and first fielded in the late 90's.. it pre-dates the JDAM, but had the same basic intent (penetrate hard targets).. I dont think it can be carried by F16's (not sure about this though)... it was originally developed for heavier bombers like the B2..
 
JDAM isnt probably being used correctly in this thread.. the JDAM isnt a bomb in and of itself.. its a bolt on product that is attached to bombs.. most commonly to create "bunker busters".. in a nutshell it allows "dumb" bombs to become "smart".. and is most often used on heavy bombs that are designed to penetrate deeply into hard targets.. and combines them with technology that allows them to be dropped very precisely (down a ventilation shaft, or through a specific window, etc.. thereby making them more effective against "bunkers")...
 
the "old" JDAM device has been sold (with complete "bunker buster" packages) to over 20 countries.. to include several arab countries in the middle east and israel..
 
the "newest" JDAM technology is pretty much reserved for the US only..
 
 
 
 
 

[billy_56081]

they have 3 full squardons of F16 block 60 fighter bombers and 3 full squadrons of Mirage 2000 fighter bombers in their airforce..
 
all of which are capable of deploying the JDAM..

 
I was going to say the same.  Along with upgraded old hawkers.

[billy_56081]

They also have C130's which can deploy MOAB.

[BBF]

Would I be correct in presuming that Iran is buying/developing all kinds of Air Defense Ordnance?

[powderman]

Would I be correct in presuming that Iran is buying/developing all kinds of Air Defense Ordnance?

 
Probably so and it wouldn't shock me to find out that holder and the obamination were arranging it and paying for it. POWDERMAN. 

[mdwest]

Would I be correct in presuming that Iran is buying/developing all kinds of Air Defense Ordnance?

I wouldnt doubt it at all..
 
The French and the Germans used to sell them alot of that type of stuff..
 
wouldnt surprise me if the Russians and Chinese havent stepped up and started selling ADA to them as well..