Walked out of Wal-Mart

[Sourdough]

About a week ago, I was looking for a new .45 for concealed carry.  Went into Wal-Mart, since they have the best prices in Fairbanks.  Asked to see a Ruger P345 in .45ACP.  Clerk asked for ID.  He took my ID and placed it behind the counter.  They have never asked to see ID before, let alone took it and placed it out of my reach.  Then he opened the case and handed me the pistol.  I asked if he could remove the trigger lock, he said no.  Corparate policy, "trigger locks can not be removed".  I threw gun down on counter and asked for my ID.  Told him I was going elsewhere to buy pistol.

Went down the street to Frontier Outfitters.  Walked in and a clerk was placing a Ruger SR1911 in .45ACP in the case.  Asked to see it, clerk hands it to me.  No ID required, no trigger lock.  I asked when they had gotten it in,  Clerk said he had just gotten it in with that days shipment.  He had just taken it out of the box to put in case.  I bought it.   I had much rather have the SR1911 than the P345 anyway.  The only reason I was even considering the P345, was that none of the Fairbanks suppliers were getting the SR1911 in. 

Wal-Mart is now in the same catagory as Sports Authority in my book.  No one goes to Sports Authority to buy or look at guns because they do the same thing.  They hold your ID and refuse to remove trigger locks.  I did go back and lodge a complaint with the manager at Wal-Mart.  We will see how well they listen to customers complaints.

[Empty Quiver]

The behavior is not what surprises me. The fact that a Wal Mart has handguns for sale now that surprises me, even in Alaska.


Next thing you know they will discontinue sales. I can hear it now, "well there were so few sales we couldn't justify the floor space". Not really caring that they drove away customers. Why treat a gun sale any different than a jeans purchase, you want to try the things on before you take them home.

[Poopers]

I had the displeasure of being  a Walmart slave,... er.. "employee" for a little over a year.

I can promise that complaining will get you nowhere. Even if the manager agrees with you personally, corporate policy is dictated by money and lawyers. You not buying a pistol that might gross them $30 in profit is less of a loss than they are willing to take on a lawsuit.

That place is unreal with their rules. I worked in the deli with a (razor)shaved head and they made me wear a hair net because its policy. If a man had any stubble he had to wear a beard net, yet the old ladies with whiskers longer than mine never had to.

Good times 

Generally speaking, the only time I will shop at a China-Mart is when I get a gift card.

[quasne.inc]

Sourdough I had the exact same thing happen to me when I walked in cash in hand to buy a Pardner shotty.  Wouldnt take the lock off, set it down walked out, went down the road to Al's and bought it for 5 bucks cheaper.  Ill never buy another gun from Walmart. 

Poopers I feel your pain.  I was unfortunate to have to work there for a few years and it is a horrible place to work.

[streak]

To bad my distant cousin" Sam Walton" is not around to see what goes on with his enterprise in this day and time! I bet he would do some house cleaning!!

[mcwoodduck]

Some shops here have a similar policy about showing an ID before handing a pistol over.
I can understand why a retail store that has a sporting goods department that has firearms has those policies.
Most retail people are not gun people and having the ID and a trigger lock will keep some people from running out of the store with the gun.
Don't feel bad I was asked for an ID in Macys jewlery section when looking for something nice for the girlfriend of at the time.

[nw_hunter]

Some shops here have a similar policy about showing an ID before handing a pistol over.
I can understand why a retail store that has a sporting goods department that has firearms has those policies.
Most retail people are not gun people and having the ID and a trigger lock will keep some people from running out of the store with the gun.
Don't feel bad I was asked for an ID in Macys jewlery section when looking for something nice for the girlfriend of at the time.

“Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.”
~ Ron Paul

[Old Syko]

First of all, I can't imagine trying to purchase a gun from Walley World due to it's inane practices.  No store clerk anywhere will ever be given permission to take position of my information.  I had a clerk tell me once that she HAD to scan my drivers license.  Store policy or not, it wasn't going to happen.  I told him since I am the customer MY policy trumped store policy.  Were he to attempt to do so without my consent I would consider it a form of theft and take appropriate action to stop his actions.  They received enough similar complaints that policy was changed within days.  I still won't go back there and neither will many others. 
     

[jlwilliams]

 Sourdough my friend, you did the right thing.   The store that lost your business will never miss it and the store that got it is greatful to have it. 
 
  I don't hate WalMart and I don't begrudge anybody an honest buck.  Lot's of American money does go to China through WalMart, but lots of Americans get paid by them too.  That's the good with the bad.  Still, they (as a corporate entity) don't give a darn about me or you.
 
  One more reason  buying a gun from a big box store may be a mistake.  Information security.  I understand that only some employees are cleared to see the bound book.  How well is that guarded?  What assurance does anybody have that their personal information including the fact that a brand new firearm was just purchased and brought to ___________address is secure?  How sure can you be that there isn't some scumbag who has got into their employ who may be feeding such information to those who would burgle your home?  At least at a mom and pop shop they have something more effective than a pre-employment background check.  They have the personal judgement of the owner who can just decline to hire someone who they get a bad feeling about.  Not foolproof, but better than a corporate hiring policy designed to protect the company from lawsuit (ie hire anybody who passes _____requirements)
 
  Sorry they made you unhapppy.  At the same time it's a good thing they did.  It caused you to make a better choise.

[mcwoodduck]

Some shops here have a similar policy about showing an ID before handing a pistol over.
I can understand why a retail store that has a sporting goods department that has firearms has those policies.
Most retail people are not gun people and having the ID and a trigger lock will keep some people from running out of the store with the gun.
Don't feel bad I was asked for an ID in Macys jewlery section when looking for something nice for the girlfriend of at the time.

“Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.”
~ Ron Paul

What a store does, is what a store does and holding my ID until I return merchandise does not bother me.  I like Sourdough did  have the ability to say no, and to not purchase anything from them.
Government intervention is another matter.  Ron Paul was talking about government not private industry.
I for one would love to have a national ID.
One card like a Passport.  If you have one it will cover all 50 states, drivers licens, CCW, proof of citizenship for voting, Social Security for working here, and should be taken as an instant background check on any fire arm purchase. 
If you are a legal allien you would get a green one.
If you do not have one we toss your illegal butt out.  If we catch you a second time we imprison you for up to 60 days and deport you 5,000 miles or more away.

[Casull]

Excellent points, mcwoodduck.  A business' policies have absolutely NOTHING to do with liberty, since one is free to visit that establishment or not.  Also, I had not seen that particular quote from RP.  If he has a problem with identification cards, then he must not take our borders too seriously.  If legal citizens cannot be required to identify themselves as such, then it would be impossible to identify illegal aliens. 

[powderman]

“Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage.

 
Very true, tsa was the 1st thing I thought of. POWDERMAN. 

[mcwoodduck]

“Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage.

 
Very true, tsa was the 1st thing I thought of. POWDERMAN. 

And with TSA you have an option not to fly.  Take a bus, take a train, or drive.

[Sourdough]

Last time I took a bus or a train, I had to show ID.  I don't look at it as a liberty lost, I look at it as a means of showing the world I am an American.
 
I have carried a Government ID card for over 40 years.  A military ID card.  I do not consider it a problem, In fact I consider it an honor.  I use it for shopping in the PX, Commisary, Medical Treatment, any time I am asked for ID that is the one I show.
 
When I got caught making an illegial entry into the US.  (I got caught crossing the Rio Grande in a canoe.)  The Border Patrol calmed down once they saw my military ID.  Oh they still kept me in custody, but they treated me differant (better) than they had earlier.  The rest of those poor boys, (all but one were Tajanos) were not so lucky.  They actually got deported to Mexico, cause they had no ID that said they were citizens.  The one real Mexican in the group, I thought that old man was going to have a heartattack.   

[Swampman]

I'm just interested in the cheapest price.  I don't care what they do.

[Old Syko]

To SHOW your ID as proof of who you are such as comparing the photo to the person or confirming age isn't a problem.  To have your information scanned into yet another database to be sold or distributed as some corporation sees fit is another story.  It's amazing how complacent we have become about divulging our personal lives and yet so many will support this complacency with one breath and complain of losing rights and privilege with the next.

[Spirithawk]

I was in Wal Mart and was looking to buy some ammo for my P-32.  The guy behind the counter asked me if I was carrying. Kinda caught me off guard, never been asked that before when buying ammo. I answered, " I have a Conceal Carry Permit, what do you think? " He then told me he couldn't sell me ammo if I was carrying! ( Now if you are carrying, wouldn't it be logical to assume the firearm was already loaded? So what would selling you a box of ammo hurt? Even if not loaded, you could simply go outside, load up, and come back in.    ) He then proceeded to tell me I couldn't carry in Wal Mart at all! I informed him he was very much wrong but fine I'll take my gun out to the car and be right back. He argued with me proceeding to tell me all the made up reasons, in his mind, why I couldn't carry in there. As I expected he ran straight to the manager, whom also told him he was wrong. The guy apologised rather reluctantly. I asked to see the manager myself and registered a complaint also telling him I was through with their store if that's the kind of person that worked in their sporting goods dept. I also informed him that between my son and I we normaly spent a conciderable amount of money buying sporting goods and other items in the store and that rather than risk getting robbed in their parking lot, because I had to leave my firearm in my vehicle, I'd simply rather shop elsewhere!  Guess he took it to heart because he apologised and the next day the guy in Sporting Goods had been transfered to another department.

[Doublebass73]

“Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage.

 
Very true, tsa was the 1st thing I thought of. POWDERMAN. 

And with TSA you have an option not to fly.  Take a bus, take a train, or drive.

That's not the point. The TSA is unconstitutional, read the 4th Amendment. The airlines are a private industry. In order to use the services of said private industry I have to submit to an illegal search by a government agency. That would be no different than a government agent standing at the door of Walmart saying that you're not allowed to shop here unless we search you first.

Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

[Swampman]

The airlines have always been regulated by the government.  If you don't want to do what Walmart ask, then shop elsewhere.

[lakota]

 When did they start making Rugers in China to Wal Mart specs?

[gypsyman]

I'd rather buy from a local shop or gun show dealer. Probably cost me a couple extra bucks, but I'm trying to keep a local guy going, plus, there have been times that extra couple bucks paid off in benifits. Donations to the local gun club, finding that one particular gun or item, that you'll never find in a box store. Local dealer told me about a customer that walked into his gun shop, and wanted him to mount and bore sight a scope and rifle, that he'd bought at the local big box store. Was appaled at first, then got mad, when the owner told him fee was $10. Guy said that he was told it was free. When the owner of the shop said it was if he had bought the gun and scope from him, but since he'd bought it elswhere, it was $10, he walked out mad. Not surprising when you consider the amount of idiots out there.Walmart,Kmart,Sears, gets enough of my money for other stuff, don't need it for my guns. gypsyman

[OldSchoolRanger]

I was in Wal Mart and was looking to buy some ammo for my P-32.  The guy behind the counter asked me if I was carrying. Kinda caught me off guard, never been asked that before when buying ammo. I answered, " I have a Conceal Carry Permit, what do you think? " He then told me he couldn't sell me ammo if I was carrying! ( Now if you are carrying, wouldn't it be logical to assume the firearm was already loaded? So what would selling you a box of ammo hurt? Even if not loaded, you could simply go outside, load up, and come back in.    ) He then proceeded to tell me I couldn't carry in Wal Mart at all! I informed him he was very much wrong but fine I'll take my gun out to the car and be right back. He argued with me proceeding to tell me all the made up reasons, in his mind, why I couldn't carry in there. As I expected he ran straight to the manager, whom also told him he was wrong. The guy apologised rather reluctantly. I asked to see the manager myself and registered a complaint also telling him I was through with their store if that's the kind of person that worked in their sporting goods dept. I also informed him that between my son and I we normaly spent a conciderable amount of money buying sporting goods and other items in the store and that rather than risk getting robbed in their parking lot, because I had to leave my firearm in my vehicle, I'd simply rather shop elsewhere!  Guess he took it to heart because he apologised and the next day the guy in Sporting Goods had been transfered to another department.

Spirithawk -  I agree with your stand a 100%, a lot of people talk the talk, but don't walk the walk.
The incredible part of this story is that Wal-mart will just put anybody in the sporting goods department, even if they are anti-gun. 

Don't they believe that good service equals increase sales.  Luckily the Dick's where I shop has a "Hunting Lodge" manager that is very knowledgeable, pro-gun, and a hunter.  He also makes it a point to try and get people who share his points of view in his department.   I believe the sales in the "Hunting Lodge" section have gone up, compared to when the previous manager ran that  department.

We as gun owners must learn to vote with our money.

[Doublebass73]

The airlines have always been regulated by the government.  If you don't want to do what Walmart ask, then shop elsewhere.

All businesses are regulated by the government. How come I don't have to submit to a warrantless search by a government agency to patronize any other business besides the airline industry?

I don't have a problem with Walmart's rules, they are a private business. I buy guns at my local Walmart, the prices are great and the guys behind the counter are hunters themselves.

[powderman]

The incredible part of this story is that Wal-mart will just put anybody in the sporting goods department, even if they are anti-gun. 

 
As a former 8 yr employee of wm I can attest to that as being true. They had an opening for sptg gds mgr. There were several good people applied for it. They picked a woman from infants. She had no experience, didn't fish, camp, hunt, shoot, or even own a gun. Then they transferred a young guy there who didn't like anything to do with sptg goods. I was on lunch one day and looking around and he said, Charlie can I get you something?? I said yes, I need a bx of shotgun shells. He smiled real big and said what kind?? I said, I want a bx of 13 ga, 4 in dbl magnums 2 1/2 oz of #11 shot. He grinned real big as he turned around to look for them. Seems like anytime they got anybody that actually knew the business they would transfer them. I never did get there except when somebody didn't show up for work. POWDERMAN. 

[Duke0313]

I have no problem with them holding my ID...but I ain't buying a firearm until the trigger lock is removed!

[scootrd]

does anyone know if your car by law is considered an extension of your home?

Here's why I ask.

I can't complain The gun laws in Vermont are some of the most common sense liberal in the country and for the most part make sense.

The one that makes me scratch my head is I can have a loaded no permits required handgun Concealed or Un-Concealed in my Auto, on my persons etc.. but a loaded rifle or shotgun is a no-no.  The old deer-jacking law in play. 

But if a car is an extension of your home -  is this not a conflicting law?.
I leave my shotgun loaded in my home.

I ask because Spirithawk had to walk out and put his gun in car to satisfy unknowing wall-mart employee

[OldSchoolRanger]

does anyone know if your car by law is considered an extension of your home?

Here's why I ask.

I can't complain The gun laws in Vermont are some of the most common sense liberal in the country and for the most part make sense.

The one that makes me scratch my head is I can have a loaded no permits required handgun Concealed or Un-Concealed in my Auto, on my persons etc.. but a loaded rifle or shotgun is a no-no.  The old deer-jacking law in play. 

But if a car is an extension of your home -  is this not a conflicting law?.
I leave my shotgun loaded in my home.

I ask because Spirithawk had to walk out and put his gun in car to satisfy unknowing wall-mart employee

I'm not a Vermont resident, but I can definitely tell you in NY the car is not an extension of your home, a car is mobile, but a mobile home (even though it can move) is a home, by law.  The reason for this is that most likely Conservation Law comes into play regarding your car.

[Old Syko]

Whether or not your car is an extension of your home is a state by state issue.  Here in Indiana your car is an extension of your home concerning most issues yet there are still conflicting issues involved.  Your car was determined as an extension of your home for the purpose of employers not being able to keep you from having firearms or other items in your car while on their property and eliminates an employer from searching your car while on their property.  Most states at this time don't even go this far and allow the vehicle is a part of the property on which it sets.  You need to know where you stand depending on where you are.

[KIMBER45]

http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images?_adv_prop=image&fr=fp-yie9-s&sz=all&va=people walmart
I'm glad they have the sense to ask for ID.

[bluedog6]

Only in the event of emergency do I shop at walmart. A cheaper price is not always best. This is why so many jobs have gone overseas! I will always support the local guy. Too many people let the almighty dollar dictate their morals.