Author Topic: Heavy 44 special (Read 6239 times)

HGunner · « **on:** January 14, 2012, 04:15:49 AM »

What is your favorite deer hunting load for heavy, modern 44 special handguns such as the FA 97 ? Bullets I am currently considering are 200 and 240 xtp, 210 speer gold dot, and hard cast 255 SWCGC, 280 WFNGC.
I'm not looking for the hottest possible load just a good accurate hunting load that will do a good job on deer. I currently have all but the speer bullets. The least expensive and most readily available bullets for me are the XTPs.

Thanks, HGunner

Swampman · « **Reply #1 on:** January 14, 2012, 04:22:39 AM »

240-250gr LSWC, 7.5 gr, Unique, 950 fps, 1.5", WLP, ..........Classic Skeeter Skelton load, no 44 Special database is complete without it ...

jar-wv · « **Reply #2 on:** January 14, 2012, 04:37:52 AM »

Just in case you haven't already wandered onto this. http://handloads.com/articles/default.asp?id=4

Graybeard · « **Reply #3 on:** January 14, 2012, 08:04:41 AM »

I'm using 7.8 grains of Unique with the Lyman 429421 Keith 250 grain bullet. It's basically the Skeeter Skelton load but with a target velocity of 1000 fps compared to the often reported 960 fps that 7.5 grains gives.

Really I can't tell the difference in accuracy or recoil between the two.

HGunner · « **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2012, 03:14:20 AM »

That handloads.com article has some interesting data. Lil' gun looks awfully good but I seem to remember something about "flame cutting" problems with extensive use of this powder. I currently have 2400, 4227 and H-110.

Graybeard · « **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2012, 06:13:30 AM »

FA recommends you don't use Lil' Gun in their revolvers.

Larry Gibson · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2012, 08:46:55 AM »

Try your SWCGC's bullet cast soft (20-1 or WW + 2% tin/lead at 30-70) over 16.5 gr of 2400 in modern 44 SPL cases. Should run 1050 - 1100+ fps depending on length of barrel of your FA 97. I used that load in a converted M48 w/4" barrel and it was a very good load.

Larry Gibson

Ranch13 · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2012, 09:26:53 AM »

7.5 grs unique is a wonderful load, as is the old 17.5 grs of 2400, and lately I've been pretty pleased with 10 grs of bludot all behind the 429241 cast from wheelweights.

flexjr · « **Reply #8 on:** January 15, 2012, 10:25:20 AM »

i used 19 grains of h110 and a 240 xtp this year in my new model .44 special. according to ross seyfried, that load is less that 30000 psi so it is safe in a modern strong 44 special. it is more than saami pressure limits though. here is the deer that i shot with this load this past season. it went down as quick as any deer i have shot short of a spine shot and hosepiped blood as it was going down.

OLDHandgunner · « **Reply #9 on:** January 16, 2012, 04:07:04 AM »

Quote from: Graybeard on January 14, 2012, 08:04:41 AM

I'm using 7.8 grains of Unique with the Lyman 429421 Keith 250 grain bullet. It's basically the Skeeter Skelton load but with a target velocity of 1000 fps compared to the often reported 960 fps that 7.5 grains gives.

Really I can't tell the difference in accuracy or recoil between the two.

Like Graybeard said the Skeeter Skelton load can't be beat. My three 44 spl all shoot it well with (7.5grs Unique with a home cast Keith 250gr bullet.)

And if I want a heavy 44spl load with 2400 I shoot them in one of my 44 Mag handguns.

You can vary the Unique grains a little to suit your own gun. I have one gun that shoots 7.0grs better and another that likes 7.8grs., but 7.5 does well in all.

And if I want a heavy 44spl load with 2400, I shoot them in my 44 Mag. guns.

HGunner · « **Reply #10 on:** January 16, 2012, 06:15:38 AM »

The 16.5-17.5 grains of 2400 looks good for the 255 swcgc bullets I have. The 19 grains of H-110 with the 240 xtp also looks very interesting. I'll have to get some Unique given all the folks that love that Skeeter load but my real goal is to get 50 yard deer hunting performance out of a gun that is much lighter and handier than my FA 83. We'll see. Truth is I may not like the heavier recoil in the 97 and end up going with the Skeeter load most of the time.

Ranch13 · « **Reply #11 on:** January 16, 2012, 06:37:24 AM »

That skeeter load with the 421 bullet will be hovering in and out of the 1000 fps area, depending on barrel lenght crimp, and all the other variables in handgun velocity. The 2400 load gets up closer to 1100.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #12 on:** January 16, 2012, 11:46:35 PM »

my go to load is well built 44 specials has allways been a 250 with 17.5 grains of 2400. For plinking and smaller animals my generic load is 7 grains of unique, herco, power pistol or universal clays which ever that particular gun likes.

painted horse · « **Reply #13 on:** January 17, 2012, 07:20:49 AM »

No need to run the 44spcl hot. A 240/250gr. bullet at 900/1000fps will cover 100yards in about .3 tenths of a second so I'm pretty sure a deer won't outrun it. If the gun is sighted in at 50 whats the "drop" at 100, an inch, 2? Not many can shoot well enough with an iron sighted gun at that distance that it would be noticed...and I'm pretty sure if a deer were hit at 100 yards at the aforementioned muzzle velocity, with a good cast boolit, it would be a thru and thru. I think the 7.5gr unique load is a dandy..

HGunner · « **Reply #14 on:** January 20, 2012, 03:08:37 AM »

Several years ago I read that Taffin likes the Black Hills 240 grain JHP 44 MAGNUM for deer hunting. I decided to try some and they shot great in my 7.5" Ruger Bisley. I found a good sale on them and bought a bunch. This has been my go to deer hunting combo ever since -- I've taken at least 8 deer with it at ranges from 30 to 80 yards. I started reloading early last year and recently tried to duplicate that load. I did it with 4227 in MAGNUM cases with 240 xtp bullets. What surprised me is that my load clocks only 1176 fps and is slightly more accurate and has slightly higher velocity in my Bisley than my trusted Black Hills ammo. I only tested 5 shots from one lot but the Black Hills ammo clocked only 1157 fps! I've gotten full penetration and evidence of some expansion on every deer I've shot plus one 150 lb hog. The only exception was a big bodied buck I shot at 75 yards that was very steeply quartering to me. That bullet busted bone and stopped under the back, offside hide fully mushroomed. The point of all this is that I just discovered that I have been hunting with heavy 44 special for a while now!

flexjr · « **Reply #15 on:** January 21, 2012, 09:22:04 AM »

HGunner, that is the appeal of a mid frame single action 44 special. it will safely launch 250 grain class bullets where most people shoot their 44 magnums these days from a more compact package. it is only lighter if you put the aluminum parts on the gun. how was the autopsy of the pig? i shot a 300 pound sow with cast bullets this past year that didn't die as quickly as i would have liked. i think the next pig i go after i will use a 240 xtp for the first shot and have the cylinder full of hard cast bullets if a fight ensues.

HGunner · « **Reply #16 on:** January 21, 2012, 12:58:49 PM »

The pig I shot was a sow estimated to be 150 lbs by a guy who's hunted quite a few. It was one of the best and most exciting shots I ever made. I was sneaking through some brush with my Bisley in hand when I heard a little shuffle in a thicket nearby. I headed straight toward it and two pigs busted out running to my left at 15 yards. I pulled to the front of the first pig and shot. I hit the pig at the base of the neck and rolled it. I got full penetration through the pig and it never moved again. That was exciting!!!

HGunner · « **Reply #17 on:** February 05, 2012, 02:24:45 AM »

Anyone loading the 200 grain XTP in a heavy 44 special?

DennisB · « **Reply #18 on:** February 11, 2012, 04:32:44 AM »

Quote from: flexjr on January 15, 2012, 10:25:20 AM

i used 19 grains of h110 and a 240 xtp this year in my new model .44 special. according to ross seyfried, that load is less that 30000 psi so it is safe in a modern strong 44 special. it is more than saami pressure limits though. here is the deer that i shot with this load this past season. it went down as quick as any deer i have shot short of a spine shot and hosepiped blood as it was going down.

Not to veer too far off topic, but ya just gotta admire a fellow who hunts barefooted-

Graybeard · « **Reply #19 on:** February 11, 2012, 04:43:34 AM »

Quote from: HGunner on February 05, 2012, 02:24:45 AM

Anyone loading the 200 grain XTP in a heavy 44 special?

Not yet but likely will. I have 50 loaded up with Sierra 210 JHC with 9 grains of Unique I think it was that I plan to try next time out shooting.

KAYR1 · « **Reply #20 on:** February 11, 2012, 07:39:32 AM »

I appreciate this thread. I own several .44 mags but no .44 Specials. Thanks for sharing these loads. If the Special was good enough for Skeet and Elmer, its good enough for me! I have never loaded anything but full-house magnums in my revolvers.

flexjr · « **Reply #21 on:** February 15, 2012, 01:57:47 PM »

the bare foot is a bit of an in joke with another forum member. fwiw that load clocked 1189 out of my new model flattop with a five and a half inch barrel, which is what Ross said it would do. it is one of my favorite loads now.

Graybeard · « **Reply #22 on:** February 15, 2012, 06:11:57 PM »

I took my three Black Hawks out to my range today. Most of my groups were just barely under or over the 2.5" mark for five shots at 25 yards.

The load I mentioned above with 9.0 grains of Unique under the Sierra 210 JHC was 1.8" so was my best five shot groups of the day. That was with my 5.5" Bisley flat top 44 special.

My next two groups behind that were 2.0" and 2.1". The better of those two was shot with my BH 45 Colt and the other was shot with my BH Flat top 45 Colt. All three guns have 5.5" barrels.

I had three additional groups that if I toss the widest shot out were: 1.35", 1.35" and 1.4". Two of those were with my newest the flat top 45 and the other was with my Bisley 44 special using the Skeeter Skelton load.

HGunner · « **Reply #23 on:** February 20, 2012, 02:06:38 AM »

I notice that both Seyfried and Pearce use magnum pistol primers with the 240 XTP over 19 grains of H-110. Pearce lists 1189 fps with this combo. I am getting 1130 fps using WLP primers in my FA 97 with very good accuracy. Is it reasonable to increase the load by half a grain with my WLP primers or should I switch to magnum primers to get a little more velocity.

I have tried this before in a 44 magnum and found that switching to a CCI 350 primer got me a little over 50 fps but significantly increased the extreme spread. That load was improved by adding a whole grain of H-110 and sticking with the WLP.

HGunner

HGunner · « **Reply #24 on:** February 25, 2012, 01:37:56 PM »

I'm not surprised that nobody was comfortable answering my last question so I did what research I could and decided that I would go up a half grain and change nothing else. I felt this would be reasonable given the chronograph readings I was getting. The new load is very accurate and the muzzle report is more pleasant. I cannot notice the difference in recoil but the POI at 50 yards is about 2" lower suggesting a decent increase in velocity (I haven't chronographed it yet). Extraction is easy and the primers look fine. I am not recommending this for your gun and components-- just sharing my experience. If I change lots of powder or primers I will work up again using the chronograph. I'm very pleased with my FA 44 special.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #25 on:** February 26, 2012, 02:17:05 AM »

Ive run ruger and FA guns with 20 grains of 110 and a cci350 using a 250 cast so your load would be fine. I have to ask why though. Do you really think that any animal is going to notice the differnce in 1130 and 1190? Id be more interested myself in accuracy at around a 1100 fps.

HGunner · « **Reply #26 on:** February 26, 2012, 04:42:08 PM »

My loading goal here is to optmize a deer hunting load with the 240 XTP. My FA really likes this bullet. I figured that I'm more likely to get a little expansion from the jacketed hollow point at 1200 fps than 1100. I also found it interesting that the 19.5 gr load had a more pleasant blast than the 19 gr when shot side by side. More of a crack than a hollow bang.

Lawful Larry · « **Reply #27 on:** March 01, 2012, 02:51:02 PM »

Quote from: Lloyd Smale on February 26, 2012, 02:17:05 AM

Ive run ruger and FA guns with 20 grains of 110 and a cci350 using a 250 cast so your load would be fine. I have to ask why though. Do you really think that any animal is going to notice the differnce in 1130 and 1190? Id be more interested myself in accuracy at around a 1100 fps.

Ditto Lloyd, my sentiments exactly. My aim is accuracy at medium velocities. I find it is not necessary to over speed my loads and over stress my handguns in the process. I can kill my game by using my loads in the medium ranges.

My favorite load for my Ruger .44 spl.

is the 7.5 Unique and 240 or 250 gr. bullets. 950 fps or so, is plenty of speed to kill game. I am still looking for a good bullet though. I will know it when I see it.

Graybeard · « **Reply #28 on:** March 01, 2012, 06:22:22 PM »

Larry try the Lyman 429421. It really shoots accurately in my Ruger Bisley flat top 44 special over that powder charge. I've pretty much settled on it as cast by Magnus in Tony, AL. Midsouth Shooter's Supply a GBO sponsor sells them.

One other I'm liking is Lyman 429667. The RCBS 44-250-K is their version of the Keith (429421) bullet and should work as well if you plan to cast your own. I dunno if anyone is casting it commercially or not but the Lyman is cast by most folks in the business.

I have a four cavity Lyman 429244 GC mould and that is about my all time favorite for the 44 magnum but in my special I think the Keith bullet will wind up being the only one I load once I've messed around trying all the others I have on hand.

HGunner · « **Reply #29 on:** March 10, 2012, 02:55:05 PM »

I got a chance to do a little more testing with the 240 XTP bullet and found that the best load seems to be 19 grains of H-110 with the CCI 350 magnum primer. It's accurate and consistent and runs about 1170 fps in my gun with my current lot of H-110. At the same range session I shot some 255 gr SWCGC over 15.5 gr of 2400 with a WLP primer and this load was very accurate and a little more pleasant to shoot at 1120 fps. I think I've got a pair of nice deer loads here.