Help heavy bolt lift

[huntducks]

I'm working on a load for my 338 WM using 180 Nosler AB, after some rounds down range 4-5 months ago I found a load that is real accurate, so I set everything aside for hunting season so Waterfowl season just ended so I pick right up where I left off .
 
Thursday was a range day and I took out 20 loaded rounds having all the time to tinker I loaded these 4-5 months back and decided to see the effect if any of Collett sizing vs Neck sizing vs FL size, well I grab the first round out the box and it's a FL sized round and fire darn stiff recoil, but the kicker was bolt lift I had to beat the bold open with a leather hammer I have been loading for 53 years and have never had a bolt open so hard.
 
Here is what i'm loading and nothing has changed from before.
 
Case> 1x fired WW brass
Powder> 77grs of RL-19 which is 1 grain under max from Nosler manual same container of powder as before each load was weighted on a RCBS 10-10 scale (i even checked the scale) cases will only hold 79.5grs of RL-19.
Primer> Fed 215 GM
Bullet> 180gr Nosler AB
OAL is .025 off lans
 
Well needless to say I only fired 1 round when I got home I pulled every bullet and checked dimension and weight of all 19 which where fine, weighed every charge all were at 77grs, all primers were 215GM.
 
One thing I did notice was when I dumped the powder all the FL sized cases I had to put a screw driver into the case to brake up the powder it was stuck together not so with the other cases, I usually don't full lenght size my brass unless it comes from another chamber, but when I do I use Imperial wax, I have shot other cases where the powder was stuck together with no effect behond normal.
 
Any help or insight would be greatly appreciated.

[Grumulkin]

1.  It's possible that the first round you shot was a little overloaded and all the other rounds were OK.


2.  If it was much cooler when you worked up the load which given the time frame is probably unlikely, then shooting the same load at a higher temperature could cause excessive pressure.


3.  If the cases are too long (i.e., out of spec) it can cause excessive pressure.


If I were you, I would work up the load again starting 2 or 3 grains under the load that gave you the problem.


I've used compressed loads many times and it has never cause a problem for me.  Did you remove the Imperial Sizing Wax from the mouth of the cases when you seated the bullets?  I don't know what would happen if the powder was contaminated with a significant amount of wax but I would think that if powder combustion was interfered with, it could cause detonation like with a light load in a large case.

[Lloyd Smale]

you powder clumping could have been caused by case lube that got inside the case if you didnt tumble after lubing. It also could be caused by compressing the powder radicaly. one guess i would have is because you full lenght sized you actually made your case interior smaller then if you neck sized but ive never seen that cause a load that was book safe to cause sticky extraction. Most loads in manuals are shot with full lenght sized brass or new brass that is at the same spec. reloader powders are temp sensitive and ive found them to show pressure faster in warmer weather so that could have added to it possibly and one last question.  If so lot numbers can vary in burning rate. my guess is that it was a combo of all of those. Compressed load, slightly smaller internal brass size and temp 

[cjrjck]

If you worked this load up in the past and it did not show any pressure signs, I would look for something that changed this time around. Temperature is one factor. If this is a new load, then it is likely too hot for your gun. I have had several instances with different rifles where a load that was below the max in the loading manuals was too hot for my gun. One such load was at or below the starting load in the manual.

[max1138]

it may just be too warm for that particular gun, I have a 270 that craters primers and  gets a sticky bolt 2.5 grains below book max with RE22, velocity is good at 3021avg. it just takes less powder to do it.
If I really wanted to I  could start over with different primers and cases and rework up but 3 grains below max gets me where Im happy with good accuracy so Ill leave it be.


 IF it took a hammer to open a bolt theres something really wrong going on there. I would start over.


 it may be just silly but ive found that if I clear the flasholes with the lyman reamer  the loads get warmer with less powder.  dont know if it applies in your case  but cleaning/deburring the flashole will make my loads shoot differently, to a degree that was startling when I prepped a batch and  loaded them using an already developed load, way warmer than unprepped cases.

[huntducks]

The last time I shot this load same bottle of powder was in Aug. i'm sure it was much warmer that day here in SoCal most likely around 90 the other day it was 64 so temp should not have been a factor, this was not my first range session with this combo I started at 73grs and worked up to 77grs with 77 being the most accurate my second range session in Aug. was nothing but 77gr loads dialing in the gun out to 500yds so I fired about 35 rds total no pressure signes.
 
When I loaded these and like I said each load was hand weight I started with the collet size loads first then FL then Neck..
 
Max 1138> you got me thinking with the flash hole Each case was trimmed to lenght and preped on a RCBS case master and I do deburr the flash holes.
 
Lloyd > I can't remember if I tumbled after I lubed the cases, i'll bet I did not because I only had 6 loaded FL sized cases I normaly use graphite for inside the case necks but again I only had 6 cases (pi$$ excuse on my part) I did not think about smaller cases capacity and higher pressure i'm going to do a water volume test on the cases just to see.
 
One thing I also noticed when pulling the bullets (RCBS collet puller) the FL bullets came out hard had to crank down the collet farther .
 
I'm loading up a new bunch minius any FL sized brass NS only plus i'll load some up using new brass.
 
I had some 210 gr NP that I took along these are my go to elk loads and fired about 10 rds just to see if the gun was OK  all went fine plus it was same lot of RL-19 powder.
 
The reason i'm changing Bullets is i'm trying to get this gun into a long range shooter 500-700 yards and have had what looks like some real success with the 180gr AB I also took my first loading of Barnes 160gr TTSX started at 50 and it looked great moved out to 100 and I was not impressed with my group about 1" at best but it was my first go round and I only loaded up 20rds 10 with RL-15 and 10 with RL-19 I picked up a lbs of RL-17 yesterday and i'm going to give it a try it's a HE powder and shows some good results with and FPS up to 150 over both RL-15 and 19.
 
Anyone else got any thoughts jump in.
 
Guys THANKS for the impute it really helped a gave me some other insite.

[stimpylu32]

hd
 
Was there a chance that you had left some gun oil in the chamber ?
 
I've done that before and had the very issue you explained on the first round but after that all went well , must have cooked it out on the first shot . 
 
stimpy

[Grumulkin]

Was there a chance that you had left some gun oil in the chamber ?

Or maybe some oil in the barrel?

[Lloyd Smale]

if you noticed hard bullet pulling you may need to trim your necks. necks to thick wont open up properly to release a bullet in your gun and will drasticaly raise pressures

[huntducks]

No oil I had already put 10 rounds down range as I always load some fouler rounds for a clean barrel.
 
Lloyd I think you might be on to something there the FL bullets pulled like they were crimped but I don't crimp any rifle rounds.
 
I sure appreciate you guy's imput.

[sr sawyer]

Did you change powder or primer lot numbers.  This can have an effect on pressure on near max loads.
 
Ken

[huntducks]

Did you change powder or primer lot numbers.  This can have an effect on pressure on near max loads.
 
Ken

 
No everything the same lot.

[sr sawyer]

Just a shot in the dark but did you remember to clean the case lube from the FL sized cases.  Oil is one thing but case lube can create all kinds of false indicators.
 
For cases I do not wash and after loading I clean with a cloth slightly dampened with acetone or 91% alcohol.
 
Ken

[Dand]

Where or how was that ammo stored between August and now?  Could it have gotten real warm?


How about case length?


Double check you seating die to make sure you aren't slightly crimping the bullet - that could happen with over length cases or the die set down a little more than needs to be.


Seems like I had a problem once that my die locking ring was slipping a little and I didn't know it - I think I discovered it before I got the ammo loaded.


Just some long shots.