Barnes 200 gr 44 Bullets

[Txdrmy Man]

Has anyone tried the barnes 200 gr in a 444. My handi loves 180 xtps but they are too light for deer. I,m shooting 240s now but am curious with the 200 barnes. I know they should hold together but are EXPENSIVE! Or maybe the 200 xtp, Ive killed several derr with them in a muzzleloader. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree but if I wanted to sling huge chunks of lead I would've bought the 45 70.

[watkibe]

Somebody, maybe Hornady, used to make a 265 gr bullet for the 444. A friend used it in the Arctic to take a caribou.

[LedLobber]

I personally have used XTP's (240 & 300gr) out of various .44 mag revolvers with Great success. I have never tried Barnes bullets, simply because of the cost. I knew I could get 2-3 times as many XTP's for the money.
I researched as much as I could before buying my 1st .444, which was only about a week ago. I am going to try the Speer 270gr Deepcurls (Gold Dots) first because the real life reviews I have read say they are accurate and work as intended on game, even bigger game like elk. If they are not as accurate as I hoped out of my Handi Rifle, I will try Hornady's 265gr JFP. I have read good things about them also in the. 444. Sorry I have no info on the Barnes stuff for you.... Good luck!

[cwlongshot]

Has anyone tried the barnes 200 gr in a 444. My handi loves 180 xtps but they are too light for deer. I,m shooting 240s now but am curious with the 200 barnes. I know they should hold together but are EXPENSIVE! Or maybe the 200 xtp, Ive killed several derr with them in a muzzleloader. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree but if I wanted to sling huge chunks of lead I would've bought the 45 70.

Welcome!
 
 I think your missing the point about bullets. I know what your saying, BUT the 444 is a big boy just like the 45-70... Its at its BEST for game with heavier bullets. It's built for move heavy bullets. The 265 is considered by most to be the bullet for this caliber. (I agree)  If lighter bullets are what you want, you should buy a smaller caliber...
 
The "magic" number (Sectional Density) for a big game hunting bullet is .200 + The light weights in .429 dia simply don't measure up. They are nearly a ball and ballistically inferior. Now a solid copper slug will be longer mimicking the heaver slug. But will lack terminal performance that also needed.
 
If you building a hunting bullet, give the heavier slugs a look, I think you will like what you see. I know you will like there preformance!
 
CW

[jeepmann1948]

I use the 240 wide meplat flat nose hard Cast bullets in mine never had a critter take another step.They also shoot well in my Handi as well.
Good luck
George

[jpshaw]

I use the 240 wide meplat flat nose hard Cast bullets in mine never had a critter take another step.They also shoot well in my Handi as well.

Can you shoot those up to about 1700 or 1800 without too much leading?  I'm trying to work up a hunting load with cast bullets to shoot in my older overbore .44.

[cwlongshot]

I use the 240 wide meplat flat nose hard Cast bullets in mine never had a critter take another step.They also shoot well in my Handi as well.

Can you shoot those up to about 1700 or 1800 without too much leading?  I'm trying to work up a hunting load with cast bullets to shoot in my older overbore .44.

I have cast bullets with Linotype and recovered some that could be relubed,loaded and fired!! Leading is was a non issue!!

CW

[Txdrmy Man]

Hey guys, thanks for the tips. I'm just toying with the idea. I started with the Hornady 265, it sucked on groups, then tried 180 xtp handloads, cloverleaf 3 shots at 100 yds! Shot a 185 lb buck in the shoulder, ran about 75 yds but the only thing that got to the vitals were some fragments, luckily i found him. Prior experience with heavy bullets in muzzleloaders is they tend to run off with a blood trail. I killed alot of deer with 200 and 240 xtps in those and they tend to drop or stumble a few yards and fall. Down here in the land of cutovers and pine thickets and at my age  LOL I don,t like blood trailing on my hands and knees anymore. Just a thought, I,m still experimenting, but whatever I load has to shoot accurately. I'll see what I come up with and how it works for next season.  Thanks 

[jpshaw]

I say if it's accurate and doing the job don't worry about the weight.  I'm just using a .44 not a .444 so I'm going to stick with around 240 just to keep some speed up.  I've worried about shooting deer with the non-expanding cast bullets but jeepmann said 240 gr cast does fine for him.  Looking to order these from Montana;
 
 

NEI (252)[/t][/t]  240 (22)  .431 - .433  Semi-Wadcutter - Gas Checked (HT)  0.335 (0.265)  23.95

[quickdtoo]

I'm with CW on this, while I haven't hunted with either of my H&R 444 Marlins yet, the lightest bullet I'd hunt deer with is the 265gr Hornady FP or FTX, I've shot the FP, 240gr XTP, 275gr Hawk and 355gr Beartooth, all shoot under an inch, so I can't help but think you just need to work with the 265gr bullet for better accuracy. I've also shot the 265gr FTX in the 445 Supermag which shoots excellent also. 

Tim

[cwlongshot]

I say if it's accurate and doing the job don't worry about the weight.  I'm just using a .44 not a .444 so I'm going to stick with around 240 just to keep some speed up.  I've worried about shooting deer with the non-expanding cast bullets but jeepmann said 240 gr cast does fine for him.  Looking to order these from Montana;
 
 

NEI (252)[/t][/t]  240 (22)  .431 - .433  Semi-Wadcutter - Gas Checked (HT)  0.335 (0.265)  23.95

A couple things to keep in mind when considering hard cast for big game.... Bullet profile and bullet diameter. Since they don't expand a wide meplat an or driving band are what you want. I say .40 cal is a minimum as that diameter is usually sufficient and most often exceeds the expanded diameter of many "deer bullets".

Personally I like the 45's and have used a 310 WFNGC with much success. My first slugs where all Linotype. Later I mixed it with no change in performance.

Back on topic; When considering a light 44 cal jacketed slugs for deer. Keep in mind that NONE where designed for big game hunting and never to the velocities atainable with the 444.
You have already seen what happens with a fast lightly constructed bullet and frankly, where lucky to recover the deer.
 Another excellent projectile that I have loaded in the 44Mag is the Speer 270 Gold dot. If you check with Speer at its operating range it might make a good 444 bullet too. The 300 XTP may be a bit light but if loaded at starting loads should also prove a good choice.  Some guys had troubles with these long bullets in Marlins 1:38 twist but all three generations of my 444's shot them just fine.

BTW you did not ask, but H322 was the best powder I found for the 444 followed by RL7 and 4198.


Good luck,

CW

[LedLobber]

Quickdtoo, thanks for the Pics of the Targets! Nice shootin'. Were these all shot from Handi Rifles?


Cwlongshot, thanks for the info on the Powder Choices for the .444. I have been set on Reloader 7 because I already use it in my .45-70 loads. Glad to hear there has been success with it in the .444.

[quickdtoo]

Quickdtoo, thanks for the Pics of the Targets! Nice shootin'. Were these all shot from Handi Rifles?

Yup, all from 444 Handis, the top two from the 22", the other from my 20" octagon which started life as a Youth 44 mag Superlight before I rechambered it and milled the barrel.  The 240gr XTP shot equally well in the 22" barrel.  The 22" barrel is a 1:20" as are all late model H&R 444 Marlins, the 44 mag is 1:38". All shooting done scoped at 100yds.

Thanks,

Tim

[Monteria]

If I understand your posts correctly; it sounds like you want a bullet between 200 and 240gr, because that is what has provided the terminal performance you desire in a muzzle loader. And though I am not up to snuff on ML velocities, nor that of the 444, theory leads me to wonder if you are not missing the predominant factor in terminal performance, Sectional Density/Velocity. with what I assume is the higher velocity of the 444, a heavier bullet with higher sectional density should produce terminal results similar to those of a lighter bullet at lower velocity. Am I completely off, assuming that the 444 would be quite a bit faster than a muzzle loader?

[bikerbeans]

I use the 240 wide meplat flat nose hard Cast bullets in mine never had a critter take another step.They also shoot well in my Handi as well.

Can you shoot those up to about 1700 or 1800 without too much leading?  I'm trying to work up a hunting load with cast bullets to shoot in my older overbore .44.

jp,
 
I have shot a couple a hundred of the Oregon Trail True Cast 310 grain LWNGC bullets, 0.430" at velocities from 1500 to 1850 fps.  I have not yet had a leading problem in any of the (3) 444M handis I have used this bullet in.  Note that all 3 barrels are Illion NY manufacture and have tighter bores than the older 1:38 twist ejector barrel.   These bullets are not all that cheap, about $0.40 a piece delivered, but if you don't cast your own they are IMO a good option. 
 
BB