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Author Topic: 204 or 223 ? Maybe 22 Hornet  (Read 1508 times)

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Offline tc scout

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204 or 223 ? Maybe 22 Hornet
« on: February 29, 2012, 02:35:26 AM »
My next barrel will be a 204 or 223, But ........ I just can't make a decision.
My only experience with little zippers is a 22 Hornet on my Contender.
It is mostly used for target and some varmint hunting as will the new handi barrel.

Like to hear some pros and cons as far as accuracy, ease of reloading, availability of used barrels, Etc.
I am kind of leaning towards the 204. Is there a big cost difference to reload the 223 compared to the 204.
This will be my second Handi caliber, will be a dedicated frame.

Your thoughts and opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks, TC
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #1 on: February 29, 2012, 02:45:46 AM »
You might as well get both  ;D  the 223 offers more bullets to choose from . The 204 has some good bullets to reload though. Both are good guns. The cost would show up in brass 223 is about as cost effective as you can get. The 204 is a screamer 4000FPS + . Its almost like picking between two trucks when the only difference is color .
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Offline r29l20

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #2 on: February 29, 2012, 03:00:03 AM »
You really can't go wrong with eather one. The .204 will shoot flatter, farther, barrel life is fine, and report is acceptable. They are real fun to shoot. Just keep in mind sub .22 cal, needs a thinner cleaning rod, and accesories, not a big deal. The .223 is more versital, cheaper to shoot. Oh just get both. ;D
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Offline jeneks84k10

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #3 on: February 29, 2012, 03:19:08 AM »
Im happy with my .223s but I dont really have any experience with the .204. Ive got a friend who has one Ive shot a couple times and its real accurate but Ive always been worried about barrel life on something that shoots 4000+ fps so I havent got one yet.
 
I dont know about other states but in Arkansas a .223 is legal for deer while a .204 is not. I also like the availability of factory .223 ammo. And Im a little biased since a .223 was my first handi and my first rifle.
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Offline petemi

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #4 on: February 29, 2012, 03:20:09 AM »
I live in fairly open farm country and it's almost always windy here.  I went with the .223, 1 in 9 twist, thinking the heavier bullets would give me better long distance accuracy under those conditions.

Pete
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Offline r29l20

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #5 on: February 29, 2012, 03:33:39 AM »
Quote from: petemi on February 29, 2012, 03:20:09 AM
I live in fairly open farm country and it's almost always windy here.  I went with the .223, 1 in 9 twist, thinking the heavier bullets would give me better long distance accuracy under those conditions.

Pete

    You are correct Sir. :)
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Offline tc scout

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #6 on: February 29, 2012, 03:54:51 AM »
You guys are not making this easy , "get both" ;D . Wish I could afford both.
Say I go with 223, what twist would be best with the lighter bullets in the 40-50 Gr range ?
Maybe it will boil down to the best deal on a used barrel that comes along.

Thanks for your input Guys. Much appreciated  ;)
TC
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Offline tobster

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #7 on: February 29, 2012, 04:03:50 AM »
Knowing this crowd, you should probably have asked which one to get "first". Not sure what you are going to do with it, but have you eliminated the 22-250?
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Offline tc scout

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #8 on: February 29, 2012, 04:24:18 AM »
Quote from: tobster on February 29, 2012, 04:03:50 AM
Knowing this crowd, you should probably have asked which one to get "first". Not sure what you are going to do with it, but have you eliminated the 22-250?

Yes, pretty much boiled it down to these two.
Probably should go with the 223, I do have access to once fired brass on a regular basis. Not a lot in 204.
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Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #9 on: February 29, 2012, 04:51:21 AM »
I love them both and there is good factory ammo out there for both.
If you go the 223 route and want heavy bullets the 1in 9 is great.
If you want to shoot lighter up to about 55gr then find an older 1 in 12 barrel.
 
 
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Offline r29l20

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #10 on: February 29, 2012, 05:12:02 AM »
Quote from: tobster on February 29, 2012, 04:03:50 AM
Knowing this crowd, you should probably have asked which one to get "first". Not sure what you are going to do with it, but have you eliminated the 22-250?
The 22-250, the best of both worlds. :)
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #11 on: February 29, 2012, 05:53:22 AM »
If you're into seeing the actual impact of the bullet on varmints, the 204 is king, that won't happen with a 22-250, yet the 204 will do pretty much anything the 22-250 will for varmints.  ;)

Tim

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=1&oq=204+ruger+vs+22-250&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGHP_en___US445&q=204+ruger+vs+22-250+rem&gs_upl=0l0l0l12839lllllllllll0&aqi=g2g-v1
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #12 on: February 29, 2012, 06:42:56 AM »
I too have had both. The 204 (for me) was a new kid on the block. Something I had to have cause it was new. Varmint hunting here in the east in mostly summer wood chucks along hedge rows and smaller fields, And coyotes and foxes in the winter months in same fields as well as the woods and bottoms. For the most part not a long range thing. For the most part a rim fire will suffice. But the Hornet/Bee are top dogs. Many don't have one and use the white bread 223. It's a excellent choice. Load it with light bullets for explosive expansion and heavier bullets to buck the wind if needed for longer shots. I love the 52/53g match bullets a H322 powder!  Anyhow. For out to say 3-350 the 223 would be my choice. Maybe a extra 100 yards on smaller critters and just 300 for coyotes.

Most everything said about the 223 can be said of The 204 BUT it's cheaper to shoot the 223 and many people already have a 223....

You likely will not go wrong with either!! My choice is and would be the 223!!

I am also looking at a new varmint caliber.... The 17 Hornet!  Should be great, but time will tell. ;)

CW
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Offline Couger

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #13 on: February 29, 2012, 06:50:49 AM »
Quote from: SHOOTALL
You might as well get both  ;D  the 223 offers more bullets to choose from . The 204 has some good bullets to reload though. Both are good guns ..... Its almost like picking between two trucks when the only difference is color .

I'm not made of extra $$$ but I was going to suggest the same thing if you can do it.  Scratch both itches!  If later you do the logical thing by keeping the more popular .223, you should certainly recoup most of your cost selling the .204 (except for the fitting charge and postage).
 
Or just leave any emotion aside and pick the more-popular .223 NOW and call it good.  8)
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Offline Rodland

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #14 on: February 29, 2012, 07:17:20 AM »
Yep, what SHOOTALL and Couger said, ya gotta scratch both itches. If ya don't the other one will itch till ya scratch it. You will always say, I shoulda. ;)
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Offline Uncle Harry

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #15 on: February 29, 2012, 08:28:54 AM »
I've got both.  Both shoot respectable with no modifications-yet.  Been laid up with a broken hip lately so no range or reloading time.
 
My .204 seems to like 40 gr. Bergers and my 223 isn't old enough to have found what it likes to eat yet.
 
So far as reloading goes, the 223 is cheaper due to the availability of inexpensive brass and vast choice of projectiles.
 
The .204 is a "finger pincher" to reload because the bullets are so damm tiny. Brass is becoming more readily available as are various bullet weights.
 
I got the .204 because it's new/unique. Put off getting the 223 because I already have a 22-250 and a 22WMR and saw no need for an in-between cartridge but, well, you know, I just thought I'd "need" (actually WANT is a better term) a 223 to fill in a "gap" in my collection.   ;)
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Offline r29l20

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #16 on: February 29, 2012, 09:09:54 AM »
Quote from: quickdtoo on February 29, 2012, 05:53:22 AM
If you're into seeing the actual impact of the bullet on varmints, the 204 is king, that won't happen with a 22-250, yet the 204 will do pretty much anything the 22-250 will for varmints.  ;)

Tim

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=1&oq=204+ruger+vs+22-250&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGHP_en___US445&q=204+ruger+vs+22-250+rem&gs_upl=0l0l0l12839lllllllllll0&aqi=g2g-v1
Very true, I love that red mist. ;)
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Offline moorepower

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #17 on: February 29, 2012, 09:12:12 AM »
Quote from: petemi on February 29, 2012, 03:20:09 AM
I live in fairly open farm country and it's almost always windy here.  I went with the .223, 1 in 9 twist, thinking the heavier bullets would give me better long distance accuracy under those conditions.

Pete

From the Hornady ballistic calculator with factory Superformance ammo.

                 10mph drift @300 yds.     drop @ 300 yds.       Energy at 300 yds.   muzzle velocity
.223 53 grain V-max   8.4"                      5.6"                          718 lb. ft.              3465 fps.
.204 40 grain V-max   6.3"                      4.3"                          675 lb. ft.              3900 fps.

These are book velocities. The 53 grain V-max is a very high b.c. VARMINT bullet. I don't use match bullets for any game as I do not know if it will expand. If you can stabilize a 75 grain V-max, it would be better. The .204 shoots inside the .223 over 2" at 300 yds. In my 1-10 LRPV, I can get 3850-3900 fps. I don't know if the H&R will. Either way, the .204 is not too shabby.
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Offline Darreld Walton

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #18 on: February 29, 2012, 02:10:22 PM »
I've got rifles chambered to both rounds. 
The .204 hasn't been out for two years. 
I thought I'd try the 204 after reading the hype.  One more time, I read the paper ballistics, and the data just didn't match what I see in the field.

For really fast, I shoot tried and true, like a 1-10 twist .220 Swift and a .22-250 Ackley Imp. shooting 40 gr. Noslers over 4200 fps.  For shooting things WAY out there, I reach for the .270 with 100 gr. Speer HP's over a case-full of 4831.

For cost effectiveness, you can not beat the .223.
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Offline tc scout

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #19 on: February 29, 2012, 03:43:44 PM »
Well, kinda looks like a hung jury, and I am still undecided. But the 204 intrigues me for some reason.
I appreciate all those who took the time to share their knowledge and  experience with these calibers in the Handi.
As some of you probably know already, I am new to handis, and so starts the learning curve.

I probably should go with 223, as I already have some 40Gr V-Max and Noslers and a source for once fired brass.
I like shooting 40 Gr. in my hornet, so as I read the posts I should get a 1-12 twist to shoot the same bullet.

I suppose I will leave it up to the best deal that comes along on a used barrel or complete gun.
A friend gave me a frame, he is gone right now so he doesn't know if it is a SB1 or SB2. Hoping it is a SB-2.
Thanks to Everyone again,
TC
PS Uncle Harry, I think you should sell me your 204 so you don't pinch your fingers anymore ;D

 
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Offline rdlange

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #20 on: February 29, 2012, 04:40:13 PM »
Info on how to tell if you have SB1 or SB2 is in the FAQs. 
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Offline tc scout

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #21 on: February 29, 2012, 05:07:10 PM »
Quote from: rdlange on February 29, 2012, 04:40:13 PM
Info on how to tell if you have SB1 or SB2 is in the FAQs.
Yes, I read that but my friend got it in a trade and he doesn't know anything about Handis.
I haven't had a chance to see it yet.
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Offline OldSchoolRanger

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #22 on: February 29, 2012, 06:23:19 PM »
I would recommend the .223Rem, availability of brass, greater selection of bullet weights, if you insist on getting the .204, don't say we didn't warn you.
 
You'll eventually end up buying a .223 anyway.

Come to think of it, I agree with the other guys, get both. ;D
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #23 on: February 29, 2012, 11:35:21 PM »
Quote from: tc scout on February 29, 2012, 03:43:44 PM
A friend gave me a frame, he is gone right now so he doesn't know if it is a SB1 or SB2. Hoping it is a SB-2.
Thanks to Everyone again,
TC
PS Uncle Harry, I think you should sell me your 204 so you don't pinch your fingers anymore ;D

Morning,
  Yea the info is in the FAQ's but here ya go...
 
SB1 on the left, SB2 on the right (W/holes) & second pic is a SG2:

 
But don't be confused. Sometimes they get a lil carried away with grinding the stock pocket and you will see holes in a SB1 frame.

BOTH of the above are SB1 receivers. The SB2 reciever will have distinct and large holes in the stock pocket.
 
CW
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Offline ironglow

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #24 on: March 01, 2012, 12:59:39 AM »
   Assuming a choice of one only.. If cost and versatility is of any concern, go with the .223..Lake City makes millions of rounds every week and .223 with proper loading can be a decent deer gun.
  ... But both would be nice..
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Offline Uncle Harry

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #25 on: March 01, 2012, 03:31:14 AM »
"PS Uncle Harry, I think you should sell me your 204 so you don't pinch your fingers anymore ;D "
 
Got new Hornady dies that have a sleeve that drops below the die so no more pinched fingers.  ;D
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #26 on: March 01, 2012, 05:25:28 AM »
Quote from: Uncle Harry on March 01, 2012, 03:31:14 AM
"PS Uncle Harry, I think you should sell me your 204 so you don't pinch your fingers anymore ;D "
 
Got new Hornady dies that have a sleeve that drops below the die so no more pinched fingers.  ;D

That floating dead length seater IS a nice thing!!

CW
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Offline tc scout

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #27 on: March 01, 2012, 07:34:33 AM »
Quote from: Uncle Harry on March 01, 2012, 03:31:14 AM
"PS Uncle Harry, I think you should sell me your 204 so you don't pinch your fingers anymore ;D "
 
Got new Hornady dies that have a sleeve that drops below the die so no more pinched fingers.  ;D

I will have to remember that if I end up going with a 204 barrel as I will have to buy dies for it.
Haven't had a problem loading 22 Hornet, but I suppose those smaller bullets could be more difficult.
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Offline moorepower

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Re: 204 or 223 ?
« Reply #28 on: March 01, 2012, 07:38:09 AM »
I am not knocking the .223. I have 3 including my AR. If the wind is blowing hard, I will still choose the .204 because when I have shot them side by side, the .204 makes more red mist and less dirt fly. I would love to try a 1-12 .22-250 and the 53 grain V-max. Until then, I guess I will have to get by with the 6br and 105 A-max.
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Offline tc scout

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Re: 204 or 223 ? Maybe 22 Hornet
« Reply #29 on: March 01, 2012, 11:01:40 AM »
Being that I already have dies and tons of bullets, brass, powder etc for the 22 Hornet and cash flow being a bit tight,
I thought maybe a Hornet barrel for now.

I get real good accuracy in my 14" contender and was wondering how the Handi barrel performs in this caliber.
Hate to keep dragging this subject on, but would like to know what owners or past owners think of the 22 Hornet in a Handi barrel.

Thanks, and I promise I will let this rest  ;)
TC
 
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