Author Topic: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?  (Read 1091 times)

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Offline DalesCarpentry

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Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy? I am in construction. I drive a lot to every job I do. My jobs are everywhere and I drive up to 70 miles one way every day to get to work. I know the extra money I spend in gas is not being spent elsewhere where it would help other Americans by buying there products. What I'm trying to say is what used to be disposable income the money you could spend on something you would like to buy and not needed is now going in my gas tank and yours. This has to hurt our economy. I see it and I'm pretty sure you can see it also. So why is this not big news that the cost of fuel is hurting our recovery? Is there anything our government really could do in the short term to lower gas prices by lets say a buck a gallon so we can all breath a little easier? For crying out loud I can't hardly buy food any more and eating a good juiecy steak seems like a thing of the past. Dale
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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2012, 01:31:38 AM »
I cannot think of one thing that isn't affected by rising fuel prices.
most thing are transported by road or rail which takes fuel.
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Offline Cuts Crooked

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2012, 01:43:28 AM »
I know that that the first two hours of every work day are now going to pay for the gas I used to get to work.
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2012, 01:44:00 AM »
The government doesnt see it as having a general economic value. It is just something to tax.

Offline scratcherky

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2012, 02:28:56 AM »
Government wants to see even higher gas prices to keep tax revenue rolling in.
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Offline magooch

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2012, 03:12:23 AM »
Let's get real specific; the Obama government doesn't give a rip how high the price of energy is.  Oh yeah, now he says he didn't want it to go up as fast as it did, but everything he and his government has done has either directly caused energy prices to go up, or has done nothing to prevent it.
 
It also appears to me that oil companies aren't bothered at all by the high prices since they raise their prices at the drop of a hat any and everytime there is the slightest reason.  I guess that is to be expected, but it's still enough to lose them any sympathy that might be left out there.
 
The only other segment of the economy that might benefit from high fuel prices is the auto industry.  Smaller cars should be a hot item.
 
If there is a bright side to high fuel prices, it is an important factor in who people will vote for in this year's election.  If it helps to get rid of Obama and possibly some of the other idiot Dumycrats, it might be a blessing in disguise.
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Offline DANNY-L

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2012, 03:22:54 AM »
I have noticed people that once stopped to get gas,coffee and maybe a snack at the local convenience store is now just stopping and putting in enough gas to hoefully make it til payday. I also think obummer is going to continue to let gas prices go up and then knock them back down to where they were several months ago to help his election. There are fools out there that will support him if he does that.

Offline oldandslow

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2012, 04:12:45 AM »
Of course it affects the economy. If you are spending more on fuel it leaves less for other things. Simple arithmetic.

Oil companies don't raise the price of oil they sell. They take what the commodity traders offer. Demand is up, high prices, demand drops, low prices. Refineries purchase oil from the traders. They do set the price of their product. If they pay more for crude they have to charge more for what they make from it. Simple arithmetic.

Offline mrcooper

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I don't think it has any effect on it, record sales on new vehicles and I see a lot of RV traveling, so I think the government can raise it again, go for $5.00 a gallon, just before election obummer can lower it 2 cents a gallon and most voters will vote for him AGAIN.

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2012, 07:43:33 AM »
Me personally, $600.00 monthly electric bill, our electricity is produced with fuel oil.  $1,400.00 to top off my fuel tank for my boiler at my house every six weeks.  $155.46 to fill up my truck yesterday afternoon.  I can squeeze one week out of a tank of fuel.  $4.57 per gallon for diesel.  I'm going to have to buy a small used car just to be able to go to town every day.  I figure it will pay for itself in just one summer.  I screwed up leaving my Miata in Tennessee.

We have a new Clean Burning Coal power plant located at Healy.  Out local power company owns it, but EPA won't let us fire it up till the Sierria Club gives it's approval.  Why did the EPA set up the Sierria Club as an approving agency?  They will never give their approval.

We see it in the prices of food on the shelves.  In the prices of clothing and shoes, toys for the kids, and everything we buy.  The man Obama put in charge of the department of energy said he thought we should be paying the same price as the Europeans.  He does not think we are there yet and wants to see it go higher.  Obama is helping every way he can.  Obama has placed so much of the oil producing areas OFF LIMITS to oil drilling.  He claims he has released those areas, and people believe it, but he lies.  Shell Oil has spent over $60 Billion to drill and oil well off the northern coast of Alaska.  They only have a very short window to drill during the short summers in northern Alaska.  For three years, just as that window approaches environmental groups protest to the EPA, and the EPA pulls Shell's permit to drill, for 30 days.  Then the permit is given back, but it is too late, Shell has missed the window for that year.  Last year Shell had the crews in place, drilling rig in place, everything ready to go when the EPA pulled the permit.  Now Shell is preparing to drill again.  This week an environmental group has turned in a complaint about air pollution produced by the drilling rig.  We expect to see the permit pulled again, just before drilling starts.  If so this will be the forth year in a row, Shell will most likely give up and move to a location in another country that wants their oil produced. 

America is a very unfriendly country for oil companies.  So many people think the oil companies are gouging us, they are not it's the speculators that are driving up the price of oil.  That and the fact India and China have started using oil to fuel their growing economies.  And since we do not produce enough for our own use we have to compete with them for oil on the open market.  Yes America exports gasoline, made from oil bought off the open market.  America's use of gas is down, and the rest of the worlds use is up.  That set the price of gas world wide.  The only way we will see the price of gas go down is if we produced enough oil for our own use, and banned exports of gasoline to the world wide market.  To do that we will have to own the oil rigs and do all the production ourselves.  Ain't going to happen.

One more thing, people are not buying those new fuel efficient cars.  The average age of cars on the road in this country has risen to 11 years.  People are hanging on to their cars longer.  Those old low mileage models.

 
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Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2012, 09:06:07 AM »
Some plastics are made from oil.  Some drugs are made from oil.  Food has to be transported to market.  Fertilizers are made from natural gas.  If oil continues to stay up, it will cause some inflation.  Add to that the government flooding the market with money to try to keep it propped up.  Sooner or later we will have a SHTF situation caused by hyper inflation.  Health care is going up because of Obamacare.  Social security and Medicare have been cut or they have had no raises for a few years.  I drive less, we don't hardly eat out anymore, we set our air on 80 in summer and our heat on 60 in winter.  We are trying to get preps for when the SHTF.  I hope everyone here is doing the same.  On the show "Doomsday Preppers" it states that 45% of Americans have prepped some, like buying extra canned goods and things to cover hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes, etc.  That is a good number, and hope it increases.  It will help when things do go bad to keep it from being really bad. 

Offline mcwoodduck

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2012, 09:25:52 AM »
High gas prices are part of the fundimental transformation of America.
We were told that $5 a gallon or more was their goal to end our dependance on oil (not forgien oil but oil)  they do not want to drill, they do not want to make new refineries. 
The Energy secratary talks about Wind and solar energy not about fuel prices.
As far as I know my car, the 18 wheelers, the trains do not work off of wind or solar, the power for my house comes from Nukes, Coal and some times wind but The wind farm during the day the blades do not always turn.
The idea is to force people out of their cars and into mass Public transit (taking away your options) 
Unfortunatly we have morons in office that do not understand the basic of economics and think that everyone can work at a plant or at a home office on the internet. 

Offline srussell

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2012, 09:52:49 AM »
i don't think drilling will help not until we do something about our oil going out of the country. we need more refineries and some type of tax on exported oil. need a reason to make them keep it here

Offline guzzijohn

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2012, 10:04:57 AM »
Quote from Cuts Crooked:
"I know that that the first two hours of every work day are now going to pay for the gas I used to get to work."


Man Cuts, you either have a very long drive to work, or get very poor milage or both. Even at minimum wage that is over three gallons of fuel.
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Offline guzzijohn

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #14 on: March 02, 2012, 10:09:08 AM »
Reply from Scratracherky:
"Government wants to see even higher gas prices to keep tax revenue rolling in."


That does not make sense to me as the tax on gas is set a a certain amount per gallon, not a percentage. If you sell less gas due to high prices the government is going to get less tax money.
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Offline DDZ

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2012, 10:25:01 AM »
Government does want higher gas prices. Its all part of government forcing Americans to do what government wants them to do. The environmentalists want higher prices also. The belief is that if people can't afford gas prices, and heating costs. Then we will all go out and buy a government motors volt, and turn our thermostats down to the point we have to wear our insulated coveralls inside our homes. Food costs will rise more also with the rise of fuel costs. Then when we can't afford food, we will have government handing out cheese and milk.

Its all part of government controlling our lifes. Just look at the control government has gained in the last few years. It appears this is the way voters want it. Its either that, or the voters have become dumb as a box of rocks.
 
http://www.examiner.com/conservative-in-spokane/obama-regime-admits-it-wants-high-gas-prices
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Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2012, 11:03:43 AM »
For you guys who don't understand EXPORTING oil.  We export the oil from Alaska to Japan, because the tankers can't get through the Panama Canal to the Gulf coast refineries.  We in turn buy oil that Japan would buy for the same price from somewhere else.  We also sometimes export oil to Mexico to be refined during refinery maintenance shut downs or hurricane damage.  It is then imported back as gasoline or diesel.  So that is a wash. 
 
97% of Obama's appointees are Ivory Tower liberal professors and lawyers.  (Bill Clinton had 50% appointees from business and industry for you die hard dems).  They are from the East coast or West coast.  Big cities have more mass transit.  They don't realise that suburbs, small towns, and rural areas have longer driving distance.  Some have businesses, thus use trucks, which are lower in gas mileage.  Some have 2-3 kids, thus need an SUV, because cars are too small to carry kids, groceries, balls, bats, tennis rackets and such.  Some just don't understand this. 
 
No one is going to pay $40k for a hybrid that gets 50-75 mpg if they can pay 12 K for a small gas car that gets 32 mpg.  They can still buy a lot of gas for $20-30 k, not counting lower monthly payments, and lower insurance.  Doesn't make sense yet. 
 
Windmills are only good in low populated windy states.  So, the rest of the more dense populated areas must rely on coal (50%), nuclear (20%), natural gas (10% and rising), hydro (10%),  wind and solar (10% or less).  All of these fuels are American produced and not imported thus are far less voliatle. 
 
OIL IS THE PROBLEM.  50% of our trade deficit is imported oil which relies on WORLD market prices, which makes it highly unstable.  We have 200 million vehicles (AND THEY ARE NOT GOING AWAY IN THE NEXT 20 OR SO YEARS), not counting all trains, planes, and ships that use oil, diesel, jet fuel, and gasoline.  This is the problem that needs solving, not hybrids, not solar and wind (it will come naturally if you just let it alone). 
 
We could solve this problem within 5-10 years easily. 
 
1) Use natural gas for city buses, garbage trucks, delivery trucks like Fedex, UPS and postal, school buses, city vehicles.  This would cut 40% of the imported oil.
2) Use more diesel vehicles, which are lower in price than hybrids, but get an average 20% better mileage than gasoline.  This would cut 20-30% of  the imported oil.
3) Drill our own oil, Alaska, on government lands, offshore. This should cut another 10-20% of imported oil. 
 
All this money stays in the US and is thus spent in the US which will help the economy. 
 
Finally figure out a way, either by tarriffs on imported oil or tax breaks, to develop coal gasification and/or algae oil production. 
 
We also have to build more nuke plants in the east for the simple reason wind and solar are not cost effective outside the plains states except in a very few areas.  This would eventually replace the coal, which then can be made into oil and gas for transportation fuels. 
 
Coal miners are happy, oil companies are happy, Americans are happy with lower fuel costs, more people back to work, thus more tax revenue to the government without raising taxes.  Everyone should be happy. 

Offline guzzijohn

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2012, 11:50:35 AM »
Apparently it is not affecting some building contractors very much. We are having some major remodeling/additions done to our house. Most of the contractors have a 50-70 mile round trip to out house in 4x4 PUs or full size vans with trailers. Even with that distance they only put in a five to six hour day on most days. You would think they would work longer to have less travel days. 
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Offline DDZ

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2012, 12:17:23 PM »
I agree Dixie, but what happened to the clean burn diesel technology? Its out there, but no diesel engine cars here yet. Many of the car manufactures offer diesel engine cars in Europe. I guess VW is the only affordable car with a diesel engine in the states. By affordable I mean other than a Audi or BMW.

Also I don't think we are ever going to see happy coal miners again. Not unless things change as they are. In western Pa. there are five coal fired power plants slated to shut down from now to 2015. The reason is they can not afford to run, and meet the new EPA's clean air standards. Basically Obama and the EPA want to make it to expensive for companies to burn coal. In a way its what is happening with oil. Their plan is to just make it to expensive to burn. Our air is cleaner than ever, but the government and the media have the ignorant so miss informed, they think we are all going to die from lung cancer from breathing dirty air.   
For those coal miners that voted for Obama along with the rest of the unions, Obama said he wanted to eliminate the use of coal while he was campaigning. So no complaining when there is no one left to burn your coal.
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2012, 05:52:31 PM »
I'm looking at putting a coal fired boiler in my place.  The new coal fired units are cleaner than the oil fired one we are currently using.  A cost comparison works out to costing $.98 for a comparable gallon of fuel, to get the same amount of BTUs.  EPA does not like it, but have to admit the results of the test.  The Bourough just approved the use of those clean burning Coal Fired Boilers here in the Fairbanks area.  The environmentalist movement are going nuts.

We have 13 basins in Alaska that contain oil.  Some of those have the capability of being huge.  But between BLM, EPA, and environmental groups blocking any further drilling, we do not expect those basins to ever be drilled.  We have the oil but they won't let us get to it.
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Offline DalesCarpentry

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is affecting the economy?
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2012, 06:10:46 PM »
That's another thing that makes and me upset. From what I understand drilling has come far enough in technology that there would be little to no lasting effects on the environment drilling these areas. All I can see is a plus side to drilling. I have heard but can't back it up that the US has more oil than 90% of the middle east. Years ago I just thought we were using up their oil before tapping our own but I don't think that anymore. Dale
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Offline yellowtail3

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #21 on: March 03, 2012, 12:23:12 AM »
Government wants to see even higher gas prices to keep tax revenue rolling in.


I do not believe it would have that effect, since the federal and state taxes are fixed by the gallon.


How hard is your state screwing you on taxes?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_taxes_in_the_United_States
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Offline mcwoodduck

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #22 on: March 03, 2012, 04:53:01 AM »
Reply from Scratracherky:
"Government wants to see even higher gas prices to keep tax revenue rolling in."


That does not make sense to me as the tax on gas is set a a certain amount per gallon, not a percentage. If you sell less gas due to high prices the government is going to get less tax money.
GuzziJohn
but that is the rub, the higher the taxes the few total dollars head into the federal treasury.
If the government would lower taxes across the board by 20% and the economy will take off. We will also need to remove the EPA and their restrictive rules that punnish manufacturers. 
 

Offline mcwoodduck

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #23 on: March 03, 2012, 05:02:29 AM »
i don't think drilling will help not until we do something about our oil going out of the country. we need more refineries and some type of tax on exported oil. need a reason to make them keep it here
But added drilling will create jobs,
creating jobs will create more disposable income, that money is what drives our economy.
A new car, refegerator, washing machine, clothes, nice dinner out, and on and on.
the drilling will generate profits of oil.  those profits will be sent out as revinue to investors, and that $ is both taxed and is either saved, reinvested or is spent, all good things for the economy.
Reinvested $ creates new jobs,
saved $ lowers interest rates and allows for cheap money to be borrowed.
Spent $ creates jobs, and profits.  Profits create a tax base, and creates jobs, creates new products and creates research.
Drill baby, Drill!
 

Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #24 on: March 03, 2012, 05:42:38 AM »
I work in the natural gas pipeline industry.  When I started 36-1/2 years ago, permitting was only required on state highways, and then just a notification of work.  Approximately 10% of my job was due to some type of government regulation.  Today it is about 50%.  It has been getting worse the last 3 years.  We crossed a creek recently, (by directional bore so the creekbed was not disturbed).  Anyway, we had to stop construction so that some EPA clowns waded through the water looking for some endangered mussel.  They never found any, but held us up a month.  We bored the creek with absolutely no disturbance.  Creek was only about 10-12' wide and about 3-4" deep.  They shut down another job because the OSHA man said the ditch was 5'2" deep.  If over 5' it has to be shored.  He took his foldable rule and stuck it in the middle of the ditch and laid it over to the side to get 5'2".  Well they shut the contractor down and charged $10,000 fine.  We appealed, because we took pictures.  It was only about 4'10" at the absolute deepest point straight up.  They dropped the fine and let us proceed, but it also held us up about a month.  Stupid stuff holding up jobs, and keeping customers from being served.  Nit picking.  Some of these young inspectors right out of college have no common sense and cause great expense.  This translates to higher gas prices to customers.  We operated fine without OSHA and EPA.  No problems, no lawsuits, no one killed.  We didn't need them.  Insurance companies, underwriters, and lawyers keep us safe and using common sense without a big bloated government bureaucracy. 

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #25 on: March 03, 2012, 06:16:17 AM »
well, liberals ARE stupid ya'know.
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Offline Empty Quiver

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #26 on: March 03, 2012, 09:33:36 AM »



I do believe it is effecting the economy. How much is arguable to a point I believe. If I use a base line of $2.00 fuel and assume a 100% rise to $4.00 it is costing me about $2700 a year in fuel costs. Like many I have mitigated that cost rise.


I tended to run around much more, shopping out of town, making two trips a weekend , that sort of thing. Well that is no more, one trip every other week or so. Thought is given to where we go to not necessitate a return trip. We shop in our small town, much more, rarely go to a restaurant that is out of town anymore. I make a tank of gas last me two weeks now, it was nothing to use one per week. There are often exceptions, but that is a baseline goal now.


I honestly feel that the real culprit is the Quantitative Easing. The dollar simply is not worth what it once was. Fuel prices are trotted out to blame every price increase. Uh, fuel price increases are largely due to the QE 1 and QE 2. Gold is reflecting the devaluation of the dollar (speculation and other mind games are also responsible).


I'm by no means a financial whiz. For some reason I think we have been watching the pretty girl, while the magician has been hiding the cards.
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Offline mcwoodduck

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #27 on: March 03, 2012, 10:45:26 AM »



I do believe it is effecting the economy. How much is arguable to a point I believe. If I use a base line of $2.00 fuel and assume a 100% rise to $4.00 it is costing me about $2700 a year in fuel costs. Like many I have mitigated that cost rise.


I tended to run around much more, shopping out of town, making two trips a weekend , that sort of thing. Well that is no more, one trip every other week or so. Thought is given to where we go to not necessitate a return trip. We shop in our small town, much more, rarely go to a restaurant that is out of town anymore. I make a tank of gas last me two weeks now, it was nothing to use one per week. There are often exceptions, but that is a baseline goal now.


I honestly feel that the real culprit is the Quantitative Easing. The dollar simply is not worth what it once was. Fuel prices are trotted out to blame every price increase. Uh, fuel price increases are largely due to the QE 1 and QE 2. Gold is reflecting the devaluation of the dollar (speculation and other mind games are also responsible).


I'm by no means a financial whiz. For some reason I think we have been watching the pretty girl, while the magician has been hiding the cards.
The blaming is what the liberals want.  they cause things that raise prices and then blame the oil companies.  Their ultimate goal is to Nationalize larger industries.

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is afecting the economy?
« Reply #28 on: March 03, 2012, 11:11:33 AM »
yep, either work in a government factory, or live in a commune and raise root vegetables.
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Offline mrcooper

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Re: Ok guys you tell me how much the cost of gas is affecting the economy?
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2012, 06:50:04 AM »
I have changed my lifestyle a bunch, as long as the Dem are in office I do not buy any thing new that I can buy used, I can afford to buy new, last Mo we needed a couch and love seat i found a used one, our vehicles are older but still runnin good their NOT American made.
     I Am disabled and have to have contractors do maintenance on my home, but have also learned I do not hire any one that is under the age of 45.
WORKING FOR ME.