Author Topic: Barrel break in ? (Read 1309 times)

DANNY-L · « **on:** March 04, 2012, 03:37:52 AM »

What method is normally being used for breakig in a new barrel. I'm going to be picking up a new SBH and want it to be broke in right. Thanks

guns-o-fun · « **Reply #1 on:** March 04, 2012, 06:11:16 AM »

I have two Blackhawks - a 44 magnum 7.5 inch Super, and a Bisley 5.5 inch 45 Colt. Nobody official has ever sanctioned what I do, but it seems to work well. First I use a good solvent (something like Butch's Bore Shine, or Hoppe's #9) to clean it thoroughly of any factory goo, then I polish with Flitz (which is like 1500 grit paste, so it cleans and smooths without damaging). Finally, I apply a coat of SmoothKote to protect the lands and grooves from corrosion and further reduce friction. Seems to make it easier to clean the barrel down the line. Just my 0.02. Of course, you can always check with the manufacturer to see what they recommend.

DANNY-L · « **Reply #2 on:** March 04, 2012, 06:26:10 AM »

Thanks,did a search and came up with lots of ways but it seemed more like they were just trying to sell products. I would rather get individual methods such as yours.

coyotejoe · « **Reply #3 on:** March 04, 2012, 07:00:32 AM »

Every Ruger revolver I've seen of late has needed to be lapped before it shoots really well. The issue is "thread choke" or "frame pinch" or whatever you choose to call it. Ruger torques the barrels in so tight that the bore is actually squeezed down by .001" to .002" at the breech end where it enters the frame. This can be detected by starting a soft lead bullet or ball down the muzzle and pushing it on through the bore. Once started past the muzzle it should then push fairly easily on down the bore. But dollars to doughnuts it will become very tight and hard to push at the breech end, maybe requiring a mallet to punch it on through, that's the choke. The fired bullet is sized down in passing through the tight bore and is then a loose fit through the remainder of the bore. That results in poor accuracy and bore leading with cast bullets. Many people "fire lap" their revolvers and that seems to work OK if you put enough bullets through it but it may take lots of them. I prefer to hand lap the old fashioned way, by casting a slug in the bore, coating it with compound and working it back and forth repeatedly in the tight section to even it out. That may take an hour and require casting several slugs as they wear down but, to me, seems much quicker and easier than making up, loading up and firing several dozen fire lapping rounds, with possibly several trips to the range before it is worked out.

DANNY-L · « **Reply #4 on:** March 04, 2012, 07:28:26 AM »

How do ya work it back and forth or do you just keep running it through and back down the muzzle.

luckydawg13 · « **Reply #5 on:** March 04, 2012, 11:00:55 AM »

i just clean out the factory oil and shoot it

Graybeard · « **Reply #6 on:** March 04, 2012, 11:58:12 AM »

Quote from: luckydawg13 on March 04, 2012, 11:00:55 AM

i just clean out the factory oil and shoot it

Yup that's been my procedure now for over 45 years.

If a revolver I pull the cylinder and clean factory preservative oils/grease from it and barrel. I properly lube it then shoot the heck outta it. When it gets crudded up so I feel ashamed of it I pull the cylinder and clean it again then do it all over.

I hear folks talk about the "thread choke" issue but have never experienced it myself. My latest three centerfire Ruger revolvers are the most accurate I've ever owned. The only thing I've done with them is clean, shoot, shoot a whole lot more then some more and clean them eventually.

They aren't made to be cleaned they are made to be shot so that's what I do with mine.

DANNY-L · « **Reply #7 on:** March 05, 2012, 09:06:37 AM »

Is it ok to use hard cast bullets or would I be better off with jacketed,I'm thinking it doesn't matter but wanted to check.

stubshaft · « **Reply #8 on:** March 05, 2012, 09:13:33 AM »

I use the method Coyote Joe mentioned. You can feel the smoothness of the barrel while using it.

coyotejoe · « **Reply #9 on:** March 05, 2012, 10:08:02 AM »

Quote from: DANNY-L on March 04, 2012, 07:28:26 AM

How do ya work it back and forth or do you just keep running it through and back down the muzzle.

I cast the slug on a 3" long 10x32 round head screw. Fold up a cloth patch to just cover the screw head when pushed into the bore, then visually center the screw body at the muzzle before pouring the molten lead. It helps to remove every trace of oil from the bore and warm the barrel with a propane torch so that you get a good clean, full cast just like casting bullets. With a revolver the slug will be too long to come completely out of the bore at the breech end. With rifles you need a stop collar on the rod to prevent the slug from exiting the rifled portion of the bore. Many people seem to think fire lapping must be easier but I find it just the opposite.

DANNY-L · « **Reply #10 on:** March 05, 2012, 12:15:32 PM »

Thanks all now I have options.

guns-o-fun · « **Reply #11 on:** March 05, 2012, 01:49:12 PM »

I also have heard of the thread choke problem, but have not really run across it in practice. Both my 44 and 45 colt shot well right out of the box with nothing more than a little barrel prep as described. Once I do this little routine, I find that I do not have to clean that often afterwards. Bought the Bisley 45 most recently. First time I shot it I set up a couple of empty soda cans on a log at somewhere between 15 and 20 yards and without much effort put the first two rounds through them (almost dead center on the first one). Have heard some stories about Ruger's 45's, so if she develops some accuracy problems, then I may have to look into fire lapping or something else. For now, I'm good.

coyotejoe · « **Reply #12 on:** March 11, 2012, 12:38:47 PM »

If you don't slug the barrel you'll never know, but it's as much a problem as oversized or undersized chamber throats, something else you'll never know of it you don't check for it.

DANNY-L · « **Reply #13 on:** March 12, 2012, 02:12:55 AM »

Won't you get an inacurate reading of bore dia. when slugging due to the choke or should you slug the bore before and after.

coyotejoe · « **Reply #14 on:** March 12, 2012, 05:37:51 AM »

Yes to both. When you push a slug all the way through the bore the measurement you get will reflect only the smallest diameter of the bore. You can tell by the resistance if there is a tight spot although you can't tell exactly how tight. If you push the slug through the bore, past the tight spot, and then reinsert it at the muzzle, taking pains to align lands and grooves, it will nearly free fall back to the tight spot. I have a Rossi '92 in .44 mag which is tight at both muzzle and breech and the slug virtually falls for about six inches in the middle, accuracy is of course terrible.

darkgael · « **Reply #15 on:** March 15, 2012, 03:36:21 AM »

Quote

i just clean out the factory oil and shoot it

+1 more.
I have a .44 SBH and a .45 Vaquero. Cleaned them. Shot them. They shoot just fine...cast or jacketed...both work well.
Pete

DANNY-L · « **Reply #16 on:** March 15, 2012, 06:19:18 AM »

I went ahead and started shooting away,about 50 cast and 10 jacketed and fun so far. I slugged the barrel this morning and had to whack it pretty good where the barrel connects. Added a pic.of my new addition.

tacklebury · « **Reply #17 on:** March 15, 2012, 01:34:27 PM »

Sounds like a set of Beartooth Lapping bullets may be in your near future. 8(

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #18 on:** March 17, 2012, 03:32:38 AM »

Quote from: luckydawg13 on March 04, 2012, 11:00:55 AM

i just clean out the factory oil and shoot it

That is all I have ever done for the past 35 years.. All these barrel break in procedures are pure bunk!
To the OP, just take your gun, clean it when you get it. Load up some ammo and go shoot it.. Nothing further is needed!

irold · « **Reply #19 on:** March 18, 2012, 02:53:54 PM »

Quote from: Redhawk1 on March 17, 2012, 03:32:38 AM

Quote from: luckydawg13 on March 04, 2012, 11:00:55 AM
i just clean out the factory oil and shoot it

That is all I have ever done for the past 35 years.. All these barrel break in procedures are pure bunk!
To the OP, just take your gun, clean it when you get it. Load up some ammo and go shoot it.. Nothing further is needed!

Yep....agree 100 %. Don't make a problem if one doesn't exsist....
regards , irold

DANNY-L · « **Reply #20 on:** March 19, 2012, 02:01:26 AM »

I'm liking the shoot-it method.

coyotejoe · « **Reply #21 on:** March 24, 2012, 02:16:26 PM »

The following is a quote from J. Marshall Stanton of Beartooth Bullets .
In most guns, there will be at least a modest increase in accuracy potential, to often times dramatic improvement in accuracy from increasing the uniformity of the bore dimensionally, and eliminating the constrictions which are common under dovetails in barrels, and barrel bands.
Especially in revolvers where the threaded barrel shank is screwed into the frame of the revolver, dramatic improvements in performance may be achieved. This is particularly true where cast bullets are used in the revolver, because the constriction under the threaded barrel shank (which can be from .002"-. 004" depending on make and caliber), acts like an undersize, bullet sizing die, thus sizing the bullet down under barrel groove dimension, creating an improper bullet to barrel fit. Not only does this condition deteriorate accuracy; it also promotes barrel leading. Fire lapping, properly done eliminates this condition.
I couldn't find an easy quote from Vernal Smith of LPT, a sponser here on GBO, but I know he has written something very similar, and I doubt you'll find a gunsmith who would disagree. But lucky for you, here we have experts who can tell you that is all "bunk".

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #22 on:** March 29, 2012, 02:49:19 AM »

coyotejoe, I know several gun manufactures that actually make barrels, and build guns from the ground up. I think they would know what they are talking about. A friend of my is a custom long range rifle builder, and he says it is bunk as well. I think I would take his advice over most people any day! I have a bunch of custom handguns, and I have asked the builder if I needed to do anything special for barrel break in, his answer was, go shoot it. With him having well over 30 years of gun building, I think he know what he is talking about! But if you want to buy into the barrel break in, by all means do it. Most guns out of the box, are more accurate than the shooter.

gypsyman · « **Reply #23 on:** March 29, 2012, 03:19:37 AM »

Every gun is different. Even with todays cnc machining, I believe some will shoot out of the box extremly well, others will need some work. gypsyman

coyotejoe · « **Reply #24 on:** March 31, 2012, 04:25:25 AM »

Redhawk I'm inclined to agree that there is probably little if any benefit to special "break in" procedures for a properly bored and fitted barrel.
I did not post about barrel "break-in" but about "thread choke". Ask any of your gun builder friends if they would expect accuracy from a barrel which starts with a bore diameter .002" smaller than the remainder of the barrel. That is a common condition in revolvers and especially Ruger revolvers of .44 and .45 caliber, not so much with smaller calibers because the thicker barrel walls aren't so easily squeezed down when torqued into the frame.

RevJim · « **Reply #25 on:** April 02, 2012, 03:11:01 AM »

I had a BH in .45 Colt back in the '90s. and it had a tight frame-choke. I loaded 6 rds of 255gr hardcast over a mild charge and I had replaced the lube with valve grinding compound. Voila! Ha It was smooth as babies heinie then! Nowadays..I clean it well, then I lube it with EezOx and shoot the devil out of them! It "may" be worth it for a cast shooter, but after what seems like a gazillion revolvers/pistols since then....naw! ha Have fun.

anachronism · « **Reply #26 on:** April 03, 2012, 04:35:30 PM »

With just six rounds? I lapped my Super Redhawks barrel with 18 coarse, 18 medium, and 12 fine lapping bullets, and still didn't get all the constriction out. Veral did warn me that Rugers stainless is really abrasion resistant, but I was amazed at how tough it was. It was nicely polished when I was done with that first run. Shortly after that, a guy offered my more than it was really worth, and now owns it, so I never did finish it. Now he won't sell it back to me...

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #27 on:** April 04, 2012, 10:33:14 AM »

I dont lap them until theyve been shot enough to know theres a problem. What i do do though is every new handgun i get will get about a 100 jacketed bullets shot through it, then its cleaned and i switch to lead. To be honest i dont know if it does a thing though. Just an old habbit thats hard to break.