Author Topic: BPCR cast bullet lubrication & sizing (Read 28075 times)

ShortStake · « **on:** January 25, 2004, 07:16:20 AM »

Gents and Madams,

Lots of slack time during these Winter months and some folks are probably casting, sizing and lubing their next seasons bullet supply.

Brings to mind the question of how you lube and what equipment, if any is used to accomplish the mission.

Feel free to add your personal experiences and equipment opinions.

Thanks for looking.

Lead pot · « **Reply #1 on:** January 28, 2004, 02:10:11 PM »

Windcutter>your pole only lets me punch one so I punched my favorite one,the other one is the RCBS.I threw the Lyman away.

Kurt

The Shrink · « **Reply #2 on:** February 15, 2004, 01:24:38 PM »

OK, I voted twice, once for pan lube and once for the Lyman, since I just got it and used it for the first time.

Everything else I've shot has been pan lubed.

Wayne

bfoster · « **Reply #3 on:** March 02, 2004, 10:24:53 PM »

For black powder 32-40 bullets that I simply want to lube I use a Pope lubricator, elsewhere, for black powder bullets I use an Ideal #1, whether I size the bullets or not.

Bob

Sharps-Nut · « **Reply #4 on:** March 29, 2004, 07:48:22 AM »

I been using the lyman 450 for several years. I used to size and lube with it in the 45 cal. When I went 40 cal I started lubing only and shooting as cast bullets. No real change in scores with this method. I am affraid I am lost in the land of aaa FOR EVER.

dpastor · « **Reply #5 on:** April 02, 2004, 09:36:23 AM »

Please bear with me, but this might be of interest to somebody. Lube for Pyrodex loaded cartridges.

I use Lee liquid Alox with my 45-70. I make sure that lube is in each lube groove, dry on wax paper, and shoot. If resizing is needed, I give it a second, light coating to cover bare lead.

Using wheel weight metal or 5% tin, I have experienced NO leading with this lube.

Dave

ShortStake · « **Reply #6 on:** September 10, 2004, 04:10:27 PM »

WOW, finally an even hundred replies. Only took about eight months!

Thanks to all that have replied............

Now to try and make some sense of all the replies.........

1. The strong numbers of persons that pan lube is most surprising. Is this budgetary or a learned process that exceeds the results of previous efforts with lube sizers?

2. Lyman lube sizers seem to be the overwhelming favorite. Again, budgetary, frugality or better results than other manufacturers products?

3. The more expensive SAECO and Star lube sizers seem to take a back seat to those that frequent this website. Budgetary? Frugality?

4. Those that answered "other", any comments?

5. Any favorite lube formulas to share?

Thanks one and all,

bfoster · « **Reply #7 on:** October 02, 2004, 08:33:49 PM »

Short Stake,

I use the equipment that I do for other than budgetary concerns.

The Pope lubricator's "chamber", like that of my rifle, is cut to precisely match the bullet my mould casts. Therefore I can't damage the bullet in any way by lubing it using this tool.

For other black powder bullets my old (it was made prior to the engineering change of 1905) #1 Ideal lubrisizer (a precursor to the Lyman-Ideal #45 and Lyman #'s 450 & 4500) is more than adequate. Black powder bullets are made from soft lead, good black powder lubes are generally quite soft. This machine is more than up to the task. I do use modern "H & I" dies and punches, the principle upon which these work has been greatly improved over the years.

The SAECO and current Redding SAECO lubrisizer is a great piece of equpment. It's biggest drawback is that for many blackpowder bullets you'll have to go the "custom" route on sizing dies and top punches. Unlike old Ideal casting equipment, SAECO products don't go back to the black powder era. That's not to say that there aren't a few current offerings from Redding that may fit your needs, it's just that if you're willing to deal with E-Bay and other on line auctions you'll find a much greater variety of "stuff" for the black powder shooter available.

The Star lubrisizer is the greatest thing since sliced bread for the plinker, or serious shooters who aren't serious about shooting soft bullets. It, and a few former Star clones are fast, but they do marr the bases of dead soft lead bullets. If you're casting from wheelweights (or some other medium to hard alloy) you'll not likely have a problem with a Star.

Lube? For black powder I use either beef or mutton tallow and beeswax. The consistency is adjusted to the conditions I will be shooting in.

Bob

ShortStake · « **Reply #8 on:** October 15, 2004, 07:04:36 AM »

Quote

The SAECO and current Redding SAECO lubrisizer is a great piece of equpment. It's biggest drawback is that for many blackpowder bullets you'll have to go the "custom" route on sizing dies and top punches. Unlike old Ideal casting equipment, SAECO products don't go back to the black powder era.

The presently manufactured Redding-SAECO lube sizer is almost identical, externally, to the Ideal Bullet Lubricator and Sizer No. 1, as shown in the Ideal Handbook 30, copyright 1931. Of course the G, H & I dies and the top punches are NOT interchangeable.

In all the cast bullet sizing chores that my hobby interests have encountered, Redding SAECO dies and top punches can usually be made to function or have been available aftermarket or through some type of modification.

R J Talley · « **Reply #9 on:** October 28, 2004, 07:32:12 PM »

I have used an RCBS machine, a Lyman 45 and a Star. The Star is the fastest and sizes the roundest and most cleanly of the three useing the nose first method. I have never witnessed a distorted base and I use a 1/30 Tin/Lead alloy. That's not to say it can't happen but I cast my bullets at .459 and size to .459 so I may not be seeing any trouble given the slight resistance my bullets experience while being driven through the dies. I shoot the Lyman Postell and an LBT LFN design...that latter being strictly a smokeless bullet. For lube I use SPG with BP and LBT Soft Blue for my 5744 loads. I have sold my #45 machine and now use the Star for all of my smokeless loading and the RCBS for my BP stuff. If I had to size a bullet down more than .001 I would always use the Star for the previously mentioned reasons.

Longcruise · « **Reply #10 on:** November 23, 2004, 12:18:14 PM »

I pan lube and don't resize at all. I have a lube/sizer machine [been so long since I used it don't remember what it is :? ]. My soft bp bullets always seemed to get bumped up in the nose

If I decide to do any sizing in the future I'm going to get a lee sizer. Will get it in a custom size if necessary.

Here's a super cheap way to lube without using the pan and without changing the size of the bullet; TC makes a plastic deally that fits on the threads of a TC 1000+ tube. it's meant for lubing ml bullets. You slide the bullets through a tube that is at 90 deg to the lube container and squeeze lube into the bullet lube grooves as it slides by the mouth of the tube. It helps if you warm the lube in hot water and push colder bullets through. Makes it easy to squeeze and the colder bullet solidifeis the lube in the grooves. You can use the 1000+ or use the tube and fill it with your favorite lube. I have one in 45 cal and one in 50 cal.

Wonder if there is some other container that could be used instead of the 1000+ tube??

rldarmstr · « **Reply #11 on:** December 12, 2004, 07:38:53 AM »

Pan lube without resizing. I have a custom mold from Dave Farmer and the deminsions are exact for my chamber/barrel. I don't want to mess that up by running them through a sizer.

I melt the lube ( my own mixture ) in the micro wave and after setting up as many bullets as I can get in an 8" X 8" bake pan I just poor the lube in and around them.

Let it set until it becomes just warm to the touch. You can touch the tips of the bullets since they are above the lube line. The whole block should then come out of the pan simply by turning the pan over. As long as the lube is still a little warm the bullets can be pushed out by hand.

That's it. Let the freshly lubed bullets set over night so the lube hardens up in the grooves. You can clean up any little extra spots of lube better after they set over night or when you are actually loading.

Omaha Poke · « **Reply #12 on:** December 15, 2004, 01:22:46 PM »

Short, I do both pan lubing and have used a Lyman lube-sizer. Now I only use the Lyman for pistol bullets and do all my lubing for rifles by pan lubing. Randy

John Boy · « **Reply #13 on:** April 20, 2005, 04:31:56 PM »

For those that need a BP Lube Recipe, here is a whole passel of them:
Black Powder Lube Recipes

OK, back to the Q's:
First of all, I only shoot 45 - 45-70 and 38-55's that I cast.
I started out pan lubing and now lube everthing in a Lyman 450

My favorite lubes are:
Cold Months - Dick Dastardly's Pearl Lube
Warm Months - Modified Matthew's Mix, except I additionally add 1 oz of Joboba Oil

All these lube formula's are listed in the link above

dodd3 · « **Reply #14 on:** July 01, 2005, 07:11:03 AM »

hi short. i youse my own lube 75 percent bees wax 15 coffa 10 trappers pure mink oil, hand lube and size thru a lee sizer.
bernie :grin:

ShortStake · « **Reply #15 on:** July 01, 2005, 08:21:53 AM »

dodd3,

Nice to hear from someone "down under" and their personal lube receipe.

Being from South Western New Mexico, some Yankees might consider this part of the United States as 'down under'.......

The "coffa" part of your lube mix is a mystery to me. The internet provides nothing of value for the word "coffa". Please share with us the description of "coffa" and where it is found.

dodd3 · « **Reply #16 on:** July 01, 2005, 03:57:08 PM »

thanks sort .did some checking coffa is the same as your crissco so i've been told.bernie
ps hope this is the coerect way to spell crissco

flintski · « **Reply #17 on:** August 01, 2005, 05:10:39 PM »

Well, right now I have tried them all, have them all and if I HAD to START all over again I would just get a RCBS and SAVE the money.
I like the straight push thru of the Lee sizers and then pan lube with DGL.
that's my story and I'm sticking too it.
flint

longcaribiner · « **Reply #18 on:** May 26, 2006, 07:04:35 AM »

I have an old orange lubrisizer, but only a die for .457. I frequently simply apply the lube, my own mix, with fingers and often use the sizing hole on my Ideal tong tool. The .457 is good for the modern barrel Hepburn (45-70)and my Martini (45-90) but the older guns like the trapdoor need something a couple thousandths larger. Made a sizer for my 577-450 to size to .472. The lubrisizer is great, but only if the lube will go through the machine. Mine doesn't. For the 50-70, I also use the sizer on the Ideal tong tool.

For some odd calibers, I have made my own sizers 43 Reformado and 43 Spanish. They are basically reamed a bit under size and then polished out with buffing compound to proper size They fit into an old Ideal Bullet sizer, a hand tool that took interchangeable sizing dies. A little time consuming to make, but works fine. [/img]

Cottonwood · « **Reply #19 on:** September 18, 2006, 02:45:09 AM »

Been makin my own lube now for what seems like ages, its not rocket science to make good lube. But for those on a budget and the lack of know how While Label Lube from Larson Gun Works has stick lube on the cheap.

One thing I found early on, was finding the smoke point of cooking oils and then just bought the best that was available along with a deal on refined beeswax, and one other ingredient. It looks better than SPG and actually works better as well.

I have an old Lyman 450 that needs internal seals and rings, so I lube by hand then run thru my sizer.

Lead pot · « **Reply #20 on:** October 01, 2006, 12:17:01 PM »

I pretty much quit using a lube sizer and pan lube my bullets.
I have the proper size bullet mould from Steve Brooks and Paul Jones that fit the barrel. I found even with a bullet that is not out of round gets deformed some what if it is not started straight.
I have a lube that I'm working on right now with out wax that is working great in my climate but I think it might have failed me out in the dry climate in Montana or the new alloy I was using didn't hold with the velocity I was pushing that .40 cal bullet.

Kurt

ShortStake · « **Reply #21 on:** October 01, 2006, 04:27:30 PM »

Lead Pot,

Good to see you posting again.

Your BPCR lube without any wax is certainly an interesting subject. Care to elaborate?

When this thread was started a looooong time ago there was a poll attached. Evidently when this website was stricken by hackers the poll got lost in the shuffle.

Everytime I see "Lead Pot" a double-entendre comes to mind.........."heavy marijuana".

Lead pot · « **Reply #22 on:** October 01, 2006, 06:10:04 PM »

Never used marijuana but I did load up a corn cob pipe once I made with corn silk when I was a kid and got sicker then a dog and never touched it again after that

This lube I think let me down I think on the shoot I was on, but I'm not sure.
I made some changes with it and it's looking a lot better, got a very wet lube star and a couple of blows with the tube a dry patch comes out wet and greasy.
But I won't know for sure till I get back out west again were the humidity is lower then it is here.
Before when blowing on the lube star it was soft but it didn't get that wet and greasy look, now I do.
I will post the receipt when I get a Chance to test it out there again. I don't want a bunch of lube a helices going out and spending a bunch for the ingredients if they cant make there own.
So far the 200 yard groups have consistently tightened up, it looks good so far.

Kurt

ShortStake · « **Reply #23 on:** November 03, 2006, 04:22:04 PM »

Gents aand Madams,

Poll was lost during last website update.

NEW Poll added.

Thanks for looking and contributing.

From the Land of Enchantment,

ShortStake,

brad925 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 19, 2013, 06:59:01 AM »

I pan lube with my own mixture for a couple of reasons. First cuz i'm cheap,cheap cheap.......did I mention I was cheap? also cuz I don't re-size and I find that pan lubing and using a cookie cutter made from a 45-70 brass is rather fast. After using the cookie cutter to remove the lubed bullets I just fill the holes with new ones and put the pan back in the oven and do it all over again. Then I can go do something else while they are in the oven.

Poll

BPCR cast bullet lubrication & Sizing

Author Topic: BPCR cast bullet lubrication & sizing (Read 28075 times)