Author Topic: i don't care who?  (Read 5517 times)

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Offline twoshooter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #30 on: March 17, 2012, 04:08:57 PM »
I just exited my local republican caucus about an hour ago. We chose a total of 34 delegates in my county, 17 to district, 17 to state. Gingrich is not on the ballot. Santorum got 19. Ron Paul got 15. Romney got 0.....zip...zilch...nada....
 
There are lots of single issue voters here..... they have a problem with anyone who does not have an "R" by their name.
1000 years ago Men KNEW the Earth was the center of the Universe.....500 years ago Men KNEW the world was flat....... 15 minutes ago you KNEW man was alone in the universe.... Just IMAGINE what we will know tomorrow !! "K"- from Men in Black.

Offline KIMBER45

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2012, 01:40:15 AM »
Quote
Even if it means voting in a man who has the exact same principles as Barry.

 
 
 
Really?  Do you think he shares obama's abhorence of pursuing our own oil supplies?  Do you think he would appoint the same type of individuals to the SCOTUS?  Do you think he has the same disdain for capitalism as obama?  OF COURSE NOT.  But, according to some here, if they share similar patterns with regard to TWO areas, they are EXACTLY the same.  I say BS!!!!!!!




I say (COMMON SENSE) tells me there is only one party with two divisions representing it to give the sheeple a sense of having some control over the outcome.It was pretty obvious from day one of the primary. Romney, Newt  and Rick were picked to run against the dreaded Democrat.The others like Paul, were there to give an impression of choice!


The voters in this country have voted party politics(Lesser evil) for as long as I can remember, and they continue to do it while the country continues to deteriorate.( I use to be one of the Lesser of voters.)Romney may not be as bad as Ombama! He may even be worse."Remember" We voted Bush in, and for that we were given the Department of Homeland Security, the beginning of the bailouts and endless wars. I'm sure They have more planned to give us with Romney or Obama.


The people have once again proven they deserve these shill's by failing to see the only real change candidate in the pack.The rest of us will just have to suffer along with them because of it. "And that ain't NO BULL!
EXCELLENT POST- The wisest statements I have read here , in a loooooong time.
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Offline magooch

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2012, 04:15:34 AM »
The problem with picking any candidate is that none of them are perfect--not even Ron Paul.  Some might say that he is more perfect than the others, but that is a matter of opinion.  The main point is that any of the group that is running for the Republican nomination is to say the least, superior to the disgrace that presently occupies the oval office.
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Offline nw_hunter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #33 on: March 18, 2012, 04:50:40 AM »
The problem with picking any candidate is that none of them are perfect--not even Ron Paul.  Some might say that he is more perfect than the others, but that is a matter of opinion.  The main point is that any of the group that is running for the Republican nomination is to say the least, superior to the disgrace that presently occupies the oval office.




I try not to cast cast my ballot based on opinion!I follow the candidates and their prior history on politics.Not what they necessarily say, but what they have done.Doing so, I have found them all to be in the same category as the fraud now residing in the Big House, with the exception of Ron Paul.


My conscience will not let me vote for them. I owe it to my family and my country to do better.
When I vote, I will vote for someone that WILL work for the sovereignty of this once great country.
I don't see that character displayed by any of the candidates other than Paul. I see the others as the SAME as the criminal now occupying the office.(This is just my opinion)We all have one ;)
If his name isn't on the ballot, and it is obvious it won't be, then I'll vote for a good third party candidate. Hopefully Dr Paul will be the one.I don't think we will see a better day for America by any of the other choices.I see it as business as usual! More endless wars,Bigger debt,more of the trashing of our Constitution, and more slavery for a place that once knew freedom.I hope I'm wrong, and people that vote the lesser are right,but in my heart, I don't believe they are!
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Offline dukkillr

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #34 on: March 18, 2012, 04:51:19 AM »
It  looks  like   we   want   have   to   worry   over  the   issue.  Romney   said   he   would   fire   anyone   in  his  administration   to    suggest   a   moon   colony.  Im  not   against  a   privetly    funded     space   program.

If it's an investment with a 10,000% (and it's NOT) return I'm sure private investors will be fighting each other for the chance to build this colony. 

Offline twoshooter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #35 on: March 18, 2012, 06:29:12 AM »
That is correct, there is nothing "perfect" just relative degrees of approximation. From the caucus yesterday it was pretty easy to identify the factions, and there is a much greater difference between myself and  half of that room than between myself and many of my democratic friends.You have the faction that think that "Jesus" is the answer to every question , the little old ladies who were taught to have sex in the dark with their clothes on, and that God sent hurricanes because of gay people. You have those who think we can remake the world in our image if we use military power correctly, and that we have a mandate to democratize the world, and the misguided belief that once everyone is "Americanized" that all will be peachy. You can just look at the forums here or anywhere else and see how that will work. Then you have the business types, it is nothing "personal" just business, and that anything that gets in the way of making money needs to be removed-( even God loves money-right?) In fact- the amount of money you have is the living proof of your worthiness-- if you were not somehow great and deserving, you would not have had it in the first place! If ten people in a room made a million dollars last year, the average income was 100K , that is great! Only one made 901 K and the other 9 made 11K, and that shows the economy is working! We can mess with that now , can we??? 

This is better than Democrats how ??

They think pretty much opposite- that is the same---that Jesus wants us to make sure that everyone has the same thing, all actions and choices are ethically and morally equivalent, that we should use our military to prevent hunger and genocide, curtail other religions from operating io other parts of the world, and since making money is inherently bad-having a lot must mean you are bad or have done bad things, so we must spread it out again, according to some formula based on reversing the current ratios.....

So........ Where are the people I get to vote for that think Jesus was a wonderful man with good and kind ideas that have been pretty much perverted and reinterpreted by every charlatan in the last 2 thousand years for his or her own purposes, but that trying to apply one of the individual popular sects or divisions  current version as a plan to rule politically, either here or abroad = bad idea ? How about the ones that think that using force as an everyday tool of foreign policy, or as a nation, is really no different than one man with a gun robbing another, that force is justified to ensure survival, not as a convenience? How about those that know that having a great deal of wealth is proof of neither worthiness nor evil, it may or may not include or be due to intelligence and/or hard work, but could just as well be due to birth, circumstance, or just dumb luck ??

And even further, as you said, no one is perfect, where are those that recognize that steep gradients, entropy, physics, all teach us that creating large imbalances in anything, eventually lead to bad results ? That that condition should be avoided or mitigated where possible, not due to moral concerns, ethical concerns, political concerns, but sheer common sense ? That simply ignoring a situation will make it go away? You can argue that going around a curve too fast is immoral or unethical, that it might endanger other motorists, children playing on the other side out of sight, that it breaks the laws of the political subdivisions in which it lies. That is all debatable. It is a FACT that when centrifigal force exceeds the traction capacity of the tires, you are going to leave the road. At that point, neither Jesus, a bank account, nor philosophy is going to help. Slowing down will.


 
1000 years ago Men KNEW the Earth was the center of the Universe.....500 years ago Men KNEW the world was flat....... 15 minutes ago you KNEW man was alone in the universe.... Just IMAGINE what we will know tomorrow !! "K"- from Men in Black.

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #36 on: March 18, 2012, 07:54:24 AM »
please, someone explain how this is not a liberal candidate.
http://freestudents.blogspot.com/2007/07/ron-pauls-personal-pork-projects.html
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #37 on: March 18, 2012, 01:16:11 PM »
  For those of you who don't think anybody but Obama thinking is dangerous, think about this, anybody but Bush is how we got Obama.
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Offline ironglow

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #38 on: March 18, 2012, 01:19:10 PM »
please, someone explain how this is not a liberal candidate.
http://freestudents.blogspot.com/2007/07/ron-pauls-personal-pork-projects.html
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
 
  Just as Magooch said.."none of them are perfect"; but neither you nor I wouldn't sit here and trash the guy...as some would do, had they that kind of "skinny" on a candidate they didn't particularly favor. 
  Again.. they're all human..there are none perfect,..no not one !
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline twoshooter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #39 on: March 18, 2012, 01:50:01 PM »
Explain how candidates who want to invade others lives, their personal space, medical decisions, and even their BODY is conservative ??? Sorry fella, but your own personal definition just don't cut it. I guess that you could get some Taliban guys in, they might meet your criteria............ I am not concerned if a candidate calls himself conservative, or if media, or others for that matter of fact. I want to see a record of minding his own damn business on social issues, not wanting to expand the debt, and shows restraint on printing money . I will also tell you that if you do not stop spending BEFORE you start cutting taxes, that is not conservative either, as you are just continuing to run up bills you do not intend to pay. A conservative whose family was spending too much would cut up the credit cards FIRST, then get a second JOB, then after the bills were being met set up a budget to make sure income is equal to or greater than output.
As long as this is a democratic (little "D") society and they vote to maintain services, that is the way it will go. I remember well over the last 40 years all the "America- love it or leave it", rhetoric, well now hear this-- "America- pay for it or leave it!"

I am willing to cut---- lets start with the entire department of homeland security, 50% of the DOD,  all the DEA, the ATF,  tax credit subsidies on EVERYTHING, and all foreign aid. Where are you on that??

By the way, I remember well the campaign of '64, the little girl and the daisy add.... My first election I voted for  Nixon . EVERY single election has been billed as the MOST important election of my life..........that would mean back to Eisenhower's first election. I don't think so scooter.....
1980 made a difference, so did 1994.  2008 was historically significant because Obama was black, and that was a positive vis a vie race relations in America, but major sea change in policy.... give me a break.... the only guy that would have been a real change was the "Rent is too Damn High" party.

Ron Paul is not the answer to everything, he is just the answer to do we get some.... or none.
1000 years ago Men KNEW the Earth was the center of the Universe.....500 years ago Men KNEW the world was flat....... 15 minutes ago you KNEW man was alone in the universe.... Just IMAGINE what we will know tomorrow !! "K"- from Men in Black.

Offline Casull

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #40 on: March 18, 2012, 02:06:26 PM »
Quote
Ron Paul is not the answer to everything, he is just the answer to do we get some.... or none.

 
 
 
It doesn't matter what the hell you call him or what he is.  What matters is what he is NOT, and that is the next President.   
 
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Offline 1puckaway

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #41 on: March 18, 2012, 02:07:31 PM »
The Grand old party and the dems will never let go of power, so to expect things to change for the better for the common man is a complete falsey.

Offline nw_hunter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #42 on: March 18, 2012, 04:58:07 PM »
Quote
Ron Paul is not the answer to everything, he is just the answer to do we get some.... or none.

 
 
 
It doesn't matter what the hell you call him or what he is.  What matters is what he is NOT, and that is the next President.   
 






I agree! And sadly the reason being........The dumbing down of the American voter.Especially the Republican voter.Sometimes it's much easier to believe a lie. Our party leaders have failed to live up to the Republican platform, but have managed to keep (JUST) enough of it to sway the majority members of the party into going along with them.


The Democrats remain the same old Socialists, and have no problem keeping their numbers. Some of us in the Republican party have seen the Neo-con takeover of the party and want no part of it.We want our representatives to actually be Conservative.........Not just give lip service to it, and rule like Fascists. Do any of you folks that will vote for any republican (truly) believe we would drill for oil in Alaska or the Shale fields of Nebraska if we had a Republican in the White House and total control of the House and Senate?Do you (REALLY)believe we would stop Illegal immigration and expel the illegal's already here? Do you think they will try to bring back factories to the US to make jobs for real Americans?I think some of us older Republicans have seen enough to know the answer.......NO! It will not change with the GOP select!Not for the better anyway.


If we are ever to see real change for the better, I think it will come from this new generation of voters who don't buy into the lies of either party, and are suffering because of it.I hope so anyway! Our generation sure hasn't given them anything to brag about!"JMHO"
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Offline twoshooter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #43 on: March 18, 2012, 06:16:03 PM »
It is true that Ron Paul will not be president. Neither will Mitt Romney. Obama is president, and this time next year, he will still be president. There will be incremental changes in some areas with the most public outcries. There will not be major reform in regulation, tax law, nor energy policy. Why would you think this would occur? The wealthiest continue to thrive. The poorest are still eating and have trac phones, Netflix, alcohol and drugs. The middle class are working harder and longer for less, but they still fear loss more than they hold anger, and they still have many creature comforts. The last truly critical situation occurred in 1861. There were minor blips in 1929, and during the mid 1960's. Compared to even those the current situation is mere indigestion.
   I support Ron Paul because I want someone to know that liberty is not extinct as a concept, that like smallpox, even though locked away behind seemingly impenetrable barriers, the mention of it stirs primeval fears deep within those who despise it, and their numbers are legion. The cowardly, the weak, the greedy, the self righteous, the elitist, the lazy, the authoritarians. Like Jack Nicholson said, maybe "You cant handle........"
1000 years ago Men KNEW the Earth was the center of the Universe.....500 years ago Men KNEW the world was flat....... 15 minutes ago you KNEW man was alone in the universe.... Just IMAGINE what we will know tomorrow !! "K"- from Men in Black.

Offline gr8ful

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #44 on: March 18, 2012, 07:27:13 PM »
Even if the other guy is the EXACT same kind of idiot as Obama, I will vote ABO.  Because I am unhappy with his performance as POTUS, and I believe in a "Vote the bum out" policy.  I hope that I will get to pull the lever for Ron Paul, because I agree with most of the things he says.  But if not, on election day I will happily vote for Romney, or Newt, or Santorum.  And after 4 years if I don't like what they are doing, I will vote for the other guy again.   8)

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #45 on: March 19, 2012, 01:26:31 AM »
  For those of you who don't think anybody but Obama thinking is dangerous, think about this, anybody but Bush is how we got Obama.
I don't recall bush running against obama.
Give me liberty, or give me death
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Give me liberty, or give me death
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Offline magooch

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #46 on: March 19, 2012, 03:46:37 AM »
Hey, it's not that complicated; Obama is the absolute worst, even while considering no human is perfect.  Since no candidate who is presently running that has any chance at all to be elected is even close to being as totally bereft of any merit whatsoever as the obamanation is, this election is the simplest ever--ABO!!!
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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #47 on: March 19, 2012, 03:56:49 AM »
just watched part of a speech by eric holder in jan 1995, in which he stated that they needed to brainwash the people to think different about guns.
remember, he's obamas boy, so obama must think the same way.  ABO!!!!!!
Give me liberty, or give me death
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Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     bugeye

Offline twoshooter

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #48 on: March 19, 2012, 04:54:29 AM »
No. Sorry. Too many "wolf" cries.
1000 years ago Men KNEW the Earth was the center of the Universe.....500 years ago Men KNEW the world was flat....... 15 minutes ago you KNEW man was alone in the universe.... Just IMAGINE what we will know tomorrow !! "K"- from Men in Black.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #49 on: March 19, 2012, 04:58:06 AM »
I wouldn't bet on it  ;)
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline coyotejoe

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #50 on: March 19, 2012, 05:54:34 AM »
A couple of elections back one TV network promoted a debate among "lesser party candidates".  That was the only presidential debate in which I heard frank common sense answers to serious questions. The Libertarian candidate was asked "why do we need a third  political party"?  His very sensible answer was "two parties can never represent the vastly different ideals, attitudes and opinions of 300 million Americans, but today we don't even have two parties, we have one party with two faces".
 I totally agree that 50 years of voting for the "lesser of evils" is what has brought us to the sorry state of our nation we see today. There's an old saying "keep on doing what you've always done and you'll keep on getting what you always got".
 People say a vote for a third party candidate is a wasted vote, but what could be a bigger waste than to vote for someone you really don't want to see elected? I'll vote for Ron Paul if I have to write it in. No he won't be elected but at least I'll have the satisfaction of having voted for someone I wanted. This nation is headed to hell in a handcart and it makes no difference whether a Democrat or a Republican is driving. There will be no real change until we throw all the bums out.
The story of David & Goliath only demonstrates the superiority of ballistic projectiles over hand weapons, poor old Goliath never had a chance.

Offline Gary G

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #51 on: March 19, 2012, 06:15:31 AM »
Good post CoyoteJoe! There is still hope:


There is an interesting analysis article over at Real Clear Politics that lays out a scenario whereby the August Republican National Convention evolves into the worst nightmare imaginable for party officials – a brokered convention. Based on how Republican candidates for president have done so far with different demographics and regions of the country,Sean Trende predicts how the race for the Republican nomination may play out and lays out a scenario where a brokered Republican convention could take place.
[/size]Now, it’s no secret that a brokered convention would be a catastrophe for Republican Party leaders used to grand coronations at their quadrennial national party events. After all, anything could happen. Chaos could rule or a dark horse candidate not officially sanctioned by the party oligarchs could emerge. In either case their lack of control would disrupt the usual smooth proceedings meant to portray to the nation a party united, happy, and excited about its standard bearer.
[/size]Given his campaign’s strategy of focusing on caucuses and out hustling his rivals at local, county, and state conventions nationwide the main beneficiary of a brokered convention would be Texas Congressman Ron Paul. The fact of the matter is that most Americans do not get involved in politics. Many rightly view it as an ugly, corrupt business. Others are too busy following American Idol, Dancing with the Stars, or the latest escapades of Lindsay Lohan. While others would rather leave it to the professionals. But, Ron Paul supporters are different. They may not outnumber the supporters of other candidates, but they are hungrier and more dedicated to their principles. They are much more willing to show up, outlast, and fight for delegate positions than the supporters of rival candidates. These attributes seem to be paying dividends for the Paul campaign at least in the early stages of the delegate selection process.
[/size]In Iowa, Ron Paul supporters have become delegates for other candidates. Under party rules, if the convention is brokered at some point those delegates could be eligible to throw their support behind Dr. Paul.
[/size]In Georgia, Paul forces took over or as local GOP officials called it “hijacked” the DeKalb County delegate-selection convention in eastern metropolitan Atlanta. They also missed by a whisker doing the same thing in populous Cobb County.
[/size]And in Clark County, Nevada, home to Las Vegas, at the county GOP convention made up of over 2600 delegates, Paul supporters organized and triumphed by electing Paulites to all 14 seats on the ballot for county GOP executive committee board. These 14 new members of the board will make up two-thirds of the ruling body. Consequently, that county’s GOP platform now calls for holding elected officials to their oath to the Constitution, repeal of the 16th Amendment, and a full audit of the Federal Reserve.
[/size]The process of selecting delegates in most states is in the early stages. There will be multiple stories like the ones mentioned above. Ultimately, there may be a brokered Republican convention in August. Then again, there may not be. Ron Paul may not get the GOP nomination for president in 2012, but whoever does will be leading a party much different from the one that exists today. It will include delegates to the national convention, activists, and party officials who support a non-interventionist foreign policy, sound money, and civil liberties. You talk about a nightmare for the party oligarchs!
[/size]http://lewrockwell.com/orig13/jacobine1.1.1.html
[/size]
The sole purpose of government is to protect your liberty. The Constitution is not to restrict the people, but to restrict government.  Ron Paul

The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first. - Thomas Jefferson

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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #52 on: March 19, 2012, 06:34:35 AM »
Gary G, it would be interesting.  and if Rick and Newt stay in the race, there could be a brokered convention.  anyone could win it.
Give me liberty, or give me death
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Give me liberty, or give me death
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Offline Casull

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #53 on: March 19, 2012, 06:49:33 AM »
Quote
People say a vote for a third party candidate is a wasted vote, but what could be a bigger waste than to vote for someone you really don't want to see elected?

 
 
A vote that helps insure the election of the greater evil, of course.
Aim small, miss small!!!

Offline bilmac

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #54 on: March 19, 2012, 08:12:24 AM »
We are having a contest right now to see what the Republican party should be. Unfortunately it is not turning out the way I wanted, I would have preferred Bauchman.
So,  I'm not going to be able to vote for her in the general election. I guess I just stay home in the general election, or write her name in, or vote for some third party in the general. Yea, that will teach those Republicans.
And don't anybody dare call me a sore looser because my guy didn't win the primary. I'm just going to take my ball and go home. And maby pout while the country falls apart around my ears.
ABO

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #55 on: March 19, 2012, 08:18:57 AM »
We are having a contest right now to see what the Republican party should be. Unfortunately it is not turning out the way I wanted, I would have preferred Bauchman.
So,  I'm not going to be able to vote for her in the general election. I guess I just stay home in the general election, or write her name in, or vote for some third party in the general. Yea, that will teach those Republicans.
And don't anybody dare call me a sore looser because my guy didn't win the primary. I'm just going to take my ball and go home. And maby pout while the country falls apart around my ears.
ABO
;D ;D ;D
Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     Patrick Henry

Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     bugeye

Offline R.W.Dale

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Re: Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #56 on: March 19, 2012, 08:26:58 AM »
Quote
People say a vote for a third party candidate is a wasted vote, but what could be a bigger waste than to vote for someone you really don't want to see elected?

 
 
A vote that helps insure the election of the greater evil, of course.

And that other guy has an "R" next to his name. That means he HAS to be better right.

Yeah don't vote for  candidates because they represent who you want in government.  Instead vote for someone simply because he's not someone else. That's a surefire recipe for governmental excellence!

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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #57 on: March 19, 2012, 08:37:25 AM »
Quote
People say a vote for a third party candidate is a wasted vote, but what could be a bigger waste than to vote for someone you really don't want to see elected?

 
 
A vote that helps insure the election of the greater evil, of course.

And that other guy has an "R" next to his name. That means he HAS to be better right.

Yeah don't vote for  candidates because they represent who you want in government.  Instead vote for someone simply because he's not someone else. That's a surefire recipe for governmental excellence!

posted via mobile device.
well, the news today showed Romney vowing to drill in ANWR etc.  whatever it takes to bring down energy prices and put people to work.  that's kinda different from obama, don't ya think?
Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     Patrick Henry

Give me liberty, or give me death
                                     bugeye

Offline mcbammer

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Re: Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #58 on: March 19, 2012, 08:47:54 AM »

well, the news today showed Romney vowing to drill in ANWR etc.  whatever it takes to bring down energy prices and put people to work.  that's kinda different from obama, don't ya think?
We  are   exporting   oil   now  . ANWR   oil   will   end   up   in   China   ,   and   the   speculators    will  keep   the  price   up   no   matter   how   much   surplus  oil   we   have.

Offline R.W.Dale

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Re: Re: Re: i don't care who?
« Reply #59 on: March 19, 2012, 08:56:47 AM »
Quote
People say a vote for a third party candidate is a wasted vote, but what could be a bigger waste than to vote for someone you really don't want to see elected?

 
 
A vote that helps insure the election of the greater evil, of course.

And that other guy has an "R" next to his name. That means he HAS to be better right.

Yeah don't vote for  candidates because they represent who you want in government.  Instead vote for someone simply because he's not someone else. That's a surefire recipe for governmental excellence!

posted via mobile device.
well, the news today showed Romney vowing to drill in ANWR etc.  whatever it takes to bring down energy prices and put people to work.  that's kinda different from obama, don't ya think?

I'm sorry for me issues of liberty and personal freedom take precidence over my pocketbook. If you aren't right on these issues you don't get consideration from me on other issues.

If you vote based on your wallets health does that make you any different than an intercity single minority mother voting for the best candidates for her benifets.

I'm not worried about drilling here or there.  The longer we wait the more its worth. Oil is a worldwide commodity now. With markets in India and China poised to grow exponentially you might as well accept the fact that we are going to pay the "rest of the world" price. Any politicians who tell you they can significantly lower the price are drilling for votes not oil.

As for those manufacturing jobs. I'm sorry but give up on that dream THEY AINT COMING BACK. Short of a complete 1890's style protectionist realignment in Washington putting massive tarrifs on imported goods. Then expect hyper inflation and a dramitic lowering of the us standard of living.

We are in the same situation the UK was in 50yrs ago. Accept this and work with it as best you can.

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