.44 mag throat...........is long

[Spokerider]

Just got my .44 mag Encore pistol barrel today, and decided to load up some ammo on the press.
As with any new shooter I get, and hand load for, I decided to see how far I could seat a bullet out in the case and still have chamber without hanging up in the throat. To my surprise, or not I guess.....I was able to seat the .430"  330gr hard cast, 70% meplat bullet well before the crimp groove, as in .130-.140 before the crimp groove. I did not want to seat the bullet out any further, as the roll crimp would be into the first lube groove.
 
Hummm, I thought. This TC barrel has a long throat. Then I dropped a bullet into the chamber until it would go no further, and then stuck a rod into the chamber to get a rough ideas as to just how far out the bullet could be seated. A quick and dirty measurement showed it could be seated out a further .200 easily before the bullet engaged the rifling. This would put this bullet approx .330 before the crimp groove.  Obviously, I cannot seat the bullet that far out of the case. Yep, this barrel looks to have a long throat. The bullet is going to have to "jump" .200 before it touches any rifling.
 
Is this a *normal* TC .44 mag pistol barrel throat leade?

[BCB]

Years ago I purchased a Super 14 in the 44 Magnum cartridge...

There was no way you were going to seat a bullet/boolit anywhere near the rifling--period...

Truly one of the worst shooting barrels I have ever owned.  I tried many bullet/boolit designs and many different powders--all worthless except at 50 yards or less...

Got it rechamber to 445 SM and it worked 100% better.  Still not the shooter I had wished for, but it will shoot at 2" at 100 yards most of the time--if you can stand the recoil...

Good-luck...BCB

[TNBilly]

Like BCB I rechambered mine to 445 SM............  made not dif at all how it shoots specials and regular mags that I've been able to tell.  TC, somewhere in the 90's started making the 44 barrels with a forcing cone chambering rather than a standard throat or leade.  Can't say it shot any better or worse than my old 44 barrel from 83 but I think TC did it to lessen pressure spikes.  As BCB stated... I love the 445 but once you get those 300gr xtp's up above 1400 the recoil becomes quite noticable.  The top load is right at 1650fps and is accurate.  I'm not able to get 2" at 100 but I really can't see that far anymore with a 1x scope either.

[Spokerider]

Thanks for the replies.
Ya, I just bought this encore and barrel. Don't think it's too old..........the prevoius owner only put 100 rounds through it, but that of course has nothing to do with its DOM.
Had it to the range today. Loaded up some 330 gr GC water-dropped wheel weight bullets over some H110, 19.5gr to 21.5gr. The best group was from 20.5 grs H110. 5 shot group @ 25m could becovered with a quarter, and three of those shots could becovered with a penny. Thats with a scope. I have a Skinner sight coming, so my hunting shots are going to be from point blank to 100m or so. Thinking the accuracy is good enough for my hunting needs.

[spinafish]

I vote would be run with what you got!!!

[Iowa Fox]

The long throat on the TC 44 mag barrels is a pet peev of mine. I can get the barrels to shoot well enough but I mainly shoot cast and that throat is tough to controll the leading.
 
I'm not sure where the changes were made along the way at TC. I have a couple super 16's in 44 mag and they do not have the long forcing cone style throats.
 
I have a ten inch SS 357 barrel that has the forcing cone throat and a ten inch blue 357 from the same time period that does not have the forcing cone throat.

[Spokerider]

The long throat on the TC 44 mag barrels is a pet peev of mine. I can get the barrels to shoot well enough but I mainly shoot cast and that throat is tough to controll the leading.
 
I'm not sure where the changes were made along the way at TC. I have a couple super 16's in 44 mag and they do not have the long forcing cone style throats.
 
I have a ten inch SS 357 barrel that has the forcing cone throat and a ten inch blue 357 from the same time period that does not have the forcing cone throat.

 
I also shoot cast, exclusively. Can you tell me more about any leading problems with these 44 barrels? I'm shooting water-dropped WW GC bullets. With only 25 rounds through by me, I haven't seen any leading issue......yet.

[gypsyman]

Back in the '80's, when I was doing tons of sillywet shooting, the infamous 7tcu barrels that T/C put out, where nicknamed ''Linda'' barrels. In honor of Linda Lovelace. Main reason all but one of my T/C barrels are custom. gypsyman

[Spokerider]

Well mine is named Debbie..........Debbie Does Dallas, lol.

[Steve P]

Sounds like you have plenty of room to play with .44 cal rifle bullets and 445 SM cases.  All kinds of options.  First I would try is the 445 case and the Nosler 300 grain bullet.  Would be perfect for deer, bear, hogs, terrorists, etc.
 
Steve

[BCB]

Sounds like you have plenty of room to play with .44 cal rifle bullets and 445 SM cases.  All kinds of options.  First I would try is the 445 case and the Nosler 300 grain bullet.  Would be perfect for deer, bear, hogs, terrorists, etc.
 
Steve

Unless that chamber is insanely long, a 445 SM case won't fit, let alone with a bullet in place...
 
One could trim a 445 case shorter, but it would be thicker at the mouth then.  Seating a bullet in it could cause a problem with case expansion when fired...
 
Stay 44 Magnum or get it rechambered...
(Or trade it and let someone else deal with it)
 
Good-luck...BCB
 
 

[Spokerider]

I'll be using it the way it is......44 mag. Accuracy is good enough for my needs. I'm putting a Skinner sight on the barrel, and this 26" carbine will be my back packing carbine.

[tc scout]

Approximately what year did TC change to a long throat in the 44 mag barrels ?
I have a 10" stainless barrel that I acquired in a trade that appears to have very little throat, almost like the rifling  just starts at the end of the chamber. Haven't slugged it or shot it yet, but is very different from the throats in some of the other barrels I have owned.

[Steve P]

TC was putting long throats in the 44 mag barrels to compensate for the Hot Shot cartridges.  Not only were throats long, so were a lot of the chamberings.  Many folks have been able to use 445 SM brass in original barrels without much trimming.  Even though the SM is .325" longer case, the minimal trimming required and minimal dimension in brass thickness at the case mouth has allowed the longer brass to compensate for the longer throat to elimiate some of the jump to the lands.
 
Similar situation with some .357 mag chambers and the longer 357 Max cases.  Starline has been the saving grace here in offering the 360 DW brass which compensates nicely in many of the long cut chambers.  It is also successful in allowing the use of 35 Remington rifle bullets in absence of Max brass and heavier pistol bullets.
 
One caution in using the longer brass is ensuring fit to the chamber of YOUR barrel.  Of all of the tolerances TC has had in their barrels, chamber length is probably the loosest.  A buddy and I have been shooting together for better than 30 years.  Many of our same caliber Contender barrels will not interchange ammo both ways.  One of us always has the longer or tighter chamber not allowing the use of the others ammunition even though loading are nearly identical.
 
Just some more info to throw in the pot as it boils.
 
Steve

[Iowa Fox]

The long throat on the TC 44 mag barrels is a pet peev of mine. I can get the barrels to shoot well enough but I mainly shoot cast and that throat is tough to controll the leading.
 
I'm not sure where the changes were made along the way at TC. I have a couple super 16's in 44 mag and they do not have the long forcing cone style throats.
 
I have a ten inch SS 357 barrel that has the forcing cone throat and a ten inch blue 357 from the same time period that does not have the forcing cone throat.

 
I also shoot cast, exclusively. Can you tell me more about any leading problems with these 44 barrels? I'm shooting water-dropped WW GC bullets. With only 25 rounds through by me, I haven't seen any leading issue......yet.

I also shoot cast almost exclusively also. In the 44 mag with the long throat I always get leading in the barrel starting about 50 rnds fired and I am convinced its the throat as I don't get it with other barrels. I cast my own both plain base and GC from air cooled WW with a pinch to tin for fill. I sized to 431, lubed with LBT soft or speed green. The lbt gave more leading than the speed green. I have a 432 size die now but have not had a chance to get to the range with that long throat barrel. The leading comes right out of the barrel with choregirl on a brush. It bugs me because if you have leading something isn't right.
 

[Spokerider]

What does the leading in the throat look like?
I have been looking for leading in the bore of the 44mag......looking for smears or dull looking streaks, and have not seen any yet. But in the .300" long throat, what are you looking for?
My latest load test was with Lilgun. 330gr water dropped wheel weight GC bullets, red lube [ dunno which brand as I didn't cast them ], Win lg pistol primer, 1.860 OAL, 18.5gr Lil'gun and excellent accuracy. 4 shots easily covered with a dime and the 5th shot of the group 1.25" low. 1435fps average speed. No leading.

[Iowa Fox]

No lead build up in the throat but thats where the blowby occurs causing the leading in the rest of the barrel.

[Spokerider]

OK, thanks. That explanation helps me paint a picture.........