Author Topic: American kids the most spoiled??  (Read 627 times)

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Offline powderman

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American kids the most spoiled??
« on: June 30, 2012, 02:36:11 AM »
http://www.yahoo.com/_ylt=AkHpigTJa189pHIhja5Zl6ybvZx4;_ylu=X3oDMTUzNmhkMm1pBGEDMTIwNjI5IHNoaW5lIHNwb2lsZWQga2lkcyB0BGNjb2RlA3B6YnVhbGxjYWg1BGNwb3MDMQRnA2lkLTIzOTg4NTEEaW50bAN1cwRtY29kZQNwemJ1YWxsY2FoNQRtcG9zAzMEcGtndAM0BHBrZ3YDNARwb3MDMgRzZWMDdGQtbGlmBHNsawN0aXRsZQR0ZXN0AzU0OQR3b2UDMTI3NzUxNTA-/SIG=13ji47d0l/EXP=1341149264/**http%3A//shine.yahoo.com/parenting/easy-answer-why-american-kids-34-spoiled-rotten-192300981.html
 
 
  Why parents "spoil" their kids     By Valerie Isakova, Shine Parenting Editor 
 By Valerie Isakova, Shine Parenting Editor | Team Mom – Thu, Jun 28, 2012 3:23 PM EDtSpoiling our kids is the latest hot topic. An article in the July 2 New Yorker by writer Elizabeth Kolbert concludes that American children are "spoiled rotten." Kolbert writes: "With the exception of the imperial offspring of the Ming dynasty and the dauphins of pre-revolutionary France, contemporary American kids may represent the most indulged young people in the history of the world." Kolbert wonders why this might be, speculating on our various attitudes towards our children (Do we expect too little? Want too much approval?) and bringing up one anthropologist's theory that a long juvenile/ maturation period is necessary in order to handle the complexities of the modern world.    Related: 5 things parents should never say to their kids

A response by Lisa Belkin in the Huffington Post retorts defensively that maybe spoiling is good for us, or at least not so bad. Our kids, Belkin says, don't need to be obedient, they need to get into college. They're focusing on grades and extracurricular instead of chores. And anyway, she writes, we all have so little time together, let's enjoy it instead of enforcing discipline.

Any parent with common sense knows that "spoiling" is bad--it's bad for kids, primarily. Kids aren't ready to be in charge yet; that's what the parent is for. Or, as Robert J. MacKenzie, a family therapist, educational psychologist and creator of the "Setting Limits" program told Yahoo! Shine, indulging children, "decreases their sensitivity and respect for the rights, feelings and boundaries of others. That creates a 'me first' generation that believes 'rules are for other people.'" Not a good result, even if they do get into college.

The lead anecdote in the Kolbert piece compares contemporary middle-class children in Los Angeles with children in the Peruvian Andes, and is taken from an article in the journal  by the UCLA anthropologists Elinor Ochs and Carolina Izquierdo. The American children had to be nagged mercilessly to do even the smallest chore (as no parent will be surprised to hear). In the Peruvian Andes, however, six-year-olds routinely make themselves useful by sweeping sand off of sleeping mats and catching and cooking crustaceans for the adults' dinner.

This is funny, but it's unhelpful in that it makes child-discipline feel mysterious and wishful. If only times were simpler and we all lived hunter-gatherer existences in the Amazon, our kids would behave! No wonder Lisa Belkin just gives up and embraces the positives about spoiling.

However, Allison Pugh, a sociologist who has studied family life and the author of Longing and Belonging: Parents, Children and Consumer Culture made a different suggestion to Yahoo! Shine. "The New Yorker piece exemplifies the trend in our culture; we blame children for the symptoms without doing a lot of self examination," she says. "We marvel at the six-year-old [in the Peruvian Andes] who just chipped in. That six-year-old wasn't born chipping in; she was taught."

A similar view comes from Babble writer and mother of five Meagan Francis, whose essay "Why Household Chores Mean Happier Kids," up now in At Home section of Shine, put it a different way: "Frankly, expecting kids to pull their weight--and enforcing those rules day in and day out--is tough. When I had 'just' the two kids, the daily trade-off hardly seemed worth it: It was better to just do it myself than try to oversee a pair of rambunctious, clumsy, pint-sized employees."

Sociologist Pugh cautions against concluding, however, that American parents are just lazy or American children are just bad--what she calls the "individual vice" argument--and instead suggests we look to our culture, specifically the demands of the American workplace.

"Americans work more hours than anyone else in the universe," she says. "There's a drive for efficiency. It's just more efficient to do chores yourself or outsource them rather than teaching children to contribute. That's a shame, but I don't think it's a children's shame, and it's not just the parents' fault. There are only so many hours in the workday."

This seems like a practical, rational conclusion: We don't discipline our kids because it takes time, and we often quite literally don't have the time. That is a relatively clear, and a particularly American issue. And if we identify the source of the problem, our chances of solving it-i.e. spoiling our kids less, which, yes, needs to be done-might improve, with or without the crustacean dinner.
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

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Offline mrcooper

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2012, 03:47:40 AM »
I DONT USALY ANS THESE KIND OF POSTS, BUT I JUST SAW A ELDERLY MAN AND WOMAN LOSE THEIR HOME AND EVERY THING THEY OWNED AND ARE REGESTERED AS CHILD MOLESTER BECAUSE A TEEN AGE GIRL TOLD HER TEACHER THEY TOUCHED HER WHEN SHE GOT MAD CAUSE THEY WOULD NOT LET HER GO TO SHCOOL DRESSED LIKE A HOOKER, WAREING CLOSE THAT SOME ONE ELSE HAD GAVE HER, AND IN COURT SHE ADDMITED THAT SHE LIED. COURT COST AND ATTORNEYS WIPED THEM OUT. THEY WERE SO EMBARASED THAT THEY HAVE LEFT THE AREA.
LOOK AT WHAT HAPPENED TO THAT ELDERLY LADY ON THE SCHOOL BUSS THAT 10 AMERICAN TEEN AGERS VERBALY ATTACTED HER. WE AS AMERICANS ARE RASING A GREAT BUNCH OF CHILDREN   

Offline BBF

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2012, 04:13:30 AM »
Why are you yelling Mr. Cooper??
 
BTW. I do agree with you the "brats" out number the good kids.
 
Considering for some time now "Brats" are having new "brats" helps explain the trend.
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Offline powderman

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2012, 05:01:15 AM »
A few years ago 2 hi school girls accused a male teacher of molesting them. After the teacher went broke, got fired, and his wife divorced him the girls admitted in court that they lied because he refused to give them an A grade. Americans have more and appreciate it less than any nation on earth. POWDERMAN.  :o :o
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
http://www.illinois.gov/gov/contactthegovernor.cfm

Offline mrcooper

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2012, 05:03:58 AM »
BBF im sorry about yelling, i just get mad as he&^ when i here about our teen agers wrecking our older peoples lifes.

Offline powderman

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2012, 08:19:58 AM »
Take the time to drive by your local hi school and look at all the new cars and trucks the students are driving, almost all of them newer than mine. How many kids paid for them?? We had school buses growing up, still got em, why are they allowed to drive to school?? If they don't work after school or have a drs appt they should take the bus. POWDERMAN.  :o :o
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
I learned everything about islam I need to know on 9-11-01.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDqmy1cSqgo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u9kieqGppE&feature=related
http://www.illinois.gov/gov/contactthegovernor.cfm

Offline BBF

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2012, 08:21:00 AM »
Agreed, I get upset myself.
The really sad part of this is that besides making old folks miserable the young'uns are messing themselves up for the rest of their lives 'bigtime".
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Offline finisher

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2012, 05:49:28 PM »
Television! That mesmerizing, glowing box from which we derive the vast majority of our perception of the outside world beyond the borders of our bubbled communities.


One of the points made by the article that stands out most in my mind is the claim that modern parents "just don't have the time " to teach discipline, respect, work ethics, and values. But as usual, the question WHY is never addressed.


No time because they're putting in the extra hours for what? What I see more often than not is that it is for the pursuit of unrealistic lifestyles that have been shoved down their throats by the never ending bombardment of advertisement on television.


No time to tech the boy how to sling a shovel or swing a hammer, but dad definitely has the newest model 4x or sport sedan on lease or at some outrageous monthly payment .


Mom hasn't got the time to teach her daughter how to respect herself and not to fall for some stupid slim shady lookin' fool; or to teach her that she doesn't need to go out looking like a pole dancer to attract a young man who respects her. Yet quite often, it seems to me that mom has the TIME and money to take that weekly visit to the nail and hair salon in attempt to retain her lost beauty that resulted from a fast lane (phony Hollywood lifestyle) as seen on TV.


They've got the time for the toy boat for those river trips every other month and they've got the time for that BIG screen TV, but not the time to get the family out into the yard to teach them how to grow their own food!


I work my young boys and drive them hard (occasionally at the tip of my boot) and yeah, they hate me! But they know that I love them. It's not my job to be their friend. It's my job to raise them to be strong, righteous MEN and my wife's job to teach my daughter to become a LADY among women. I hope that when I'm dead and gone, they will look back and thank me when they are fitter and stronger and working circles around the spoiled little candy asses with whom they grew up.


We killed our cable TV three years ago and only subscribe to Netflix and similar websites. This allows us complete control over the brainwashing influence of mainstream commercialism. We have seen a significant improvement in there behavior compared to that of other kids who are constantly on "the glow" of cable or video games.


If you want to change the world, FREE YOUR MIND of that glowing brainwash box. READ, READ, READ!!!!! ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING THAT YOU CAN GET YOUR HANDS ON AND ON EVERY SUBJECT YOU CAN IMAGINE. Learn to speak, read, and write a second, third, and even a fourth language. But master the Queens English first and above all. Do so with an objective mind!


Teach your kids to LOVE READING books. TAKE the TIME!!!!


Ipods and cars and TVs and toys crumble in time but the knowledge that you pass to them is priceless.


Put yourself above the influence of that damned glowing box and don't allow yourself to fall under it's influence. Those that decide what you see on that tube don't give damn about keeping you informed. They specialize in misdirection and desire only to sell you out of your ability to think for yourself.


Free your minds, do it for your kids. Put your foot down and talk to them not at them. Find out who they really are. Are they mental carbon copies of a character on a TV show or are they something much more individual. Teach them that they are not ENTITLED to ANYTHING and that they must EARN.


YOU ALL can change the world by refusing to watch it go by you on that tube while those in power change it with their greed and indifference to humanity. DO IT.

Offline DDZ

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2012, 11:47:19 PM »
I agree finisher. People can, and do find time to do things that are important to them, and anymore kids are not the important thing in many parents lifes. Kids should be the most important thing in parents lifes, because kids are the future of America. Building good character in our kids is more important than anything else. The character building is getting diluted. If we have parents raising children that do not have good character, they really aren't going to be able to build good character in their children. 
Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.    Wm. Penn

Offline magooch

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2012, 03:24:26 AM »
Take a look at what passes for entertainment these days on the tube.  If that has anything to do with how the kids turn out, we're in big trouble.  Is there anything that resembles "Father Knows Best", or Leave it to Beaver?  Maybe we've left those times far behind, but my point is that even the commercials these days are immoral by comparison.  What would we do without ads for boner meds, rubbers, yeast infections etc.?  On the other hand, we don't have ciggarette and beer ads, so maybe it's not all bad, but program content is so far over the top from what it was back when I was a kid ....
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Offline guzzijohn

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2012, 03:31:04 AM »
I work with and around high school kids daily. There are a bunch of great kids out there that are not spoiled and are willing to work their butts off. There are also kids that expect everything and won't take ownership of any of their actions. Hmmm, sounds a lot like kids when I was growing up in the 60s and early 70s.
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2012, 04:04:07 AM »
I like spoiled and lazy kids! It means there's less competition for my kids.
 
Guzzijohn +1 on your comment. Very true.

Offline BBF

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2012, 07:16:07 AM »
Conan:
 The problem is that a large part of the income your more competitive kids are earning will be taken by the" spread the wealth" bunch( not their own of course) that forms your current Govt. and I see a low chance for change in the future.
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2012, 07:39:29 AM »
BBF:
 
Good point! I had some work done on our house last year, electrical, plumbing, a/c. All three of the contractors said they were having trouble finding people to work. Reason is that unemployment benefits were so good that it made no sense to have a job.

Offline BBF

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2012, 08:00:52 AM »
I became aware of a somewhat similar situation many years ago with the people that were herring fishermen on Canada's west coast.  The season required long and hard hours but was very short. Herring roe brought in premium prices from Japan that surpassed  yearly salaries for a lot of other folks.
Those fishermen then applied for a received unemployment payments for many months and had a long and pleasant vacation during that time.
 
Sorry I strayed . :-[
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Offline finisher

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2012, 09:56:20 AM »
Take a look at what passes for entertainment these days on the tube.  If that has anything to do with how the kids turn out, we're in big trouble.  Is there anything that resembles "Father Knows Best", or Leave it to Beaver?  Maybe we've left those times far behind, but my point is that even the commercials these days are immoral by comparison.  What would we do without ads for boner meds, rubbers, yeast infections etc.?  On the other hand, we don't have ciggarette and beer ads, so maybe it's not all bad, but program content is so far over the top from what it was back when I was a kid ....
*************
 I always thought those old shows were a little TOO idealized and "perfect" but no doubt, they did teach good values. I would love to see a show like the Beaver but portrayed from the working mans perspective.  I don't think ol' Wards soft, manicured, paper pushing  hands would've been enough to put my hard headed boys in line ;D

Offline KIMBER45

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2012, 11:35:48 AM »
obrabet“Northland College (NZ) principal John Tapene has offered the following words from a judge who regularly deals with youth.
“Always we hear the cry from teenagers ‘What can we do, where can we go?’
… My answer is, “Go home, mow the lawn, wash the windows, learn to cook, build a raft, get a job, visit the sick, study your lessons, and after you’ve finished, read a book.”
“Your town does not owe you recreational facilities and your parents do not owe you fun. The world does not owe you a living, you owe the world something. You owe it your time, energy and talent so that no one will be at war, in poverty or sick and lonely again.”
“In other words, grow up, stop being a cry baby, get out of your dream world and develop a backbone, not a wishbone. Start behaving like a responsible person. You are important and you are needed. It’s too late to sit around and wait for somebody to do something someday. Someday is now and that somebody is you…”“”
"In the final analysis, it is between you and God.  It was never between you and them anyway."__Mother Theresa
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Hawkeye: My father warned me about you...
Chingachgook, he warned me about people like you. He said "Do not try to understand them".
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Offline Rex in OTZ

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Re: American kids the most spoiled??
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2012, 03:02:18 PM »
At the store the other day I saw the exchange between teen girls, one working the register and required by employer to say Thank You, Please Come Again, there was snotty gal with a chip on her shoulder buying gum that made the chashier repeat the Thank You, Please Come Again...... louder! while 4 customers wated in line, snotty made a snide remark about worker gals apperance about her shoddy hair highlights, I'd also seen gal working the register also working a part time job as a flagger and i figure the high lights snotty gal was disparageing were sun bleached hair from standing hours standing outdoors flagging traffic.
The kid said it was alright though, she said with snotty kids like that you never win, best to leave them be, they useally will dig their own hole sooner or later.
 
My kids never say their bored, I useally fix em righ up with lots to do :D , if your to stipid to entertain yourself thats just plain lazy is what I tell them.