more farm workers needed, realistically where will they come from?

[guzzijohn]

http://www.kansas.com/2012/07/05/2398059/fewer-workers-cross-border-creating.html

[DDZ]

I wonder if some of those that milk the tax payers for everything they can get, and complain about no jobs, could lend a hand.

[turk762]

How about allowing teenage kids to work again. Instead they make it more difficult. There has to be some kids that will work for extra money.
I started at 12yr old schering CHRISTmas trees. A stick in one hand to help hold the top runner and a razor sharp machette in the other. We did have chin protection to or I would have for sure had one less leg.

[yellowtail3]

Laborers are avail, it is up to the marketplace to determine their cost.... How much do you want pay for groceries is a question to ask the 'deport them illegal enemy invaders!' gang.... .

[hardertr]

You can't even get the average American to sit behind a counter at a gas station or work at a fast food restaurant for minimum wage, much less ask them to do any MANUAL LABOR outside in the fields.


Who do we need? Illegals.   I would say "documented immigrant workers", but they have already adopted the typical "too good for minimum wage" mentality Americans have.


It's still hard to keep from bursting out in laughter every time I hear the "they're stealing our jobs" argument against illegals.  We all know good and well Americans won't do those jobs for a wage the market can handle.  We are just too good for that.....

[rio grande]

You can't even get the average American to sit behind a counter at a gas station or work at a fast food restaurant for minimum wage, much less ask them to do any MANUAL LABOR outside in the fields.


Who do we need? Illegals.   I would say "documented immigrant workers", but they have already adopted the typical "too good for minimum wage" mentality Americans have.


It's still hard to keep from bursting out in laughter every time I hear the "they're stealing our jobs" argument against illegals.  We all know good and well Americans won't do those jobs for a wage the market can handle.  We are just too good for that.....

Apparently the 'illegals' are too good to do those jobs too.  How many are here now? 20 million?  And you say we need more?  Now, that's funny.

But you did provide an answer, "....wage the market can handle."  Maybe we should pay more for our fruits and vegetables, or maybe the distributors, retailers and investors should give up some profit.  Just so that (American) workers could be paid a decent wage for their hard labor.

[dukkillr]

But you did provide an answer, "....wage the market can handle."  Maybe we should pay more for our fruits and vegetables, or maybe the distributors, retailers and investors should give up some profit.  Just so that (American) workers could be paid a decent wage for their hard labor.

The problem is not the wage.  The wage should be whatever the market will bear, meaning if 3.25$ is enough to get some halfwit to go pick tomatoes, that's what it's worth.  The problem is that the market has an artificial floor in that the government will provide enough for the lazy and stupid to survive without working.  Those are precisely the people who should be picking tomatoes for 3.25$ an hour to keep from starving to death.  Because of the floor, it is true that many of these jobs are things Americans will not do, or at least not at a rate competitive with illegal laborers.

[yellowtail3]

Duk makes a point.


So which is easier, politically - get rid of the floor, or let the Mexicans pick the strawberries?

[jrnsuz]

  The problem is that the market has an artificial floor in that the government will provide enough for the lazy and stupid to survive without working.  Those are precisely the people who should be picking tomatoes for 3.25$ an hour to keep from starving to death. 

+1

[SHOOTALL]

But you did provide an answer, "....wage the market can handle."  Maybe we should pay more for our fruits and vegetables, or maybe the distributors, retailers and investors should give up some profit.  Just so that (American) workers could be paid a decent wage for their hard labor.

The problem is not the wage.  The wage should be whatever the market will bear, meaning if 3.25$ is enough to get some halfwit to go pick tomatoes, that's what it's worth.  The problem is that the market has an artificial floor in that the government will provide enough for the lazy and stupid to survive without working.  Those are precisely the people who should be picking tomatoes for 3.25$ an hour to keep from starving to death.  Because of the floor, it is true that many of these jobs are things Americans will not do, or at least not at a rate competitive with illegal laborers.

Great post ! would add fat people won't work at some jobs , cut the money and many will start doing things they don't like doing.

[powderman]

DUK. Good post. I'd like to  add though that if these illegals only come here to work why are they not applying for green cards to do so?? Nobody says they can't work, just stop breaking our laws and do it legal. Problem solved?? POWDERMAN. 

[SHOOTALL]

In many cases they can't just come and work. Farm workes OK but in the trades the person employing them must not be able to find some one here to take the job. What that means is you have to run ads in several news papers for several weeks with no replys that are suitable to hire. Then you have to do paper work and be approved to hire the person.

[guzzijohn]

Also remember that most crops have a fairly narrow harvest window so when you need the workers you need them now not two months later. If you say that we need to use people on welfare, etc. a plan will need to be developed to harden these people to this kind of work. I know I am done in after about an hour picking strawberries.
GuzziJohn

[DDZ]

As long as there is someone paying for their next meal, I don't care how hardened they are, they won't offer to go  labor in a field for 8 hours. If they know their next meal comes from picking strawberries they are going to do it and them some. Its amazing what the human body is capable of when there is a threat of not getting enough food. 

[tobster]

It's interesting that the drug cartels and human traffickers are slowing down the illegal invasion, not the U.S. government. I've seen spreadsheets that show why legal citizens won't work for minimum wage. The benefits for not working, i.e. 2 years of unemployment benefits, housing assistance,food stamps,WIC, free books and lunches for school age children, free Obamaphones, legal aid and the list goes on and on, far outweigh the benefit of a minimum wage paycheck.. The only thing Uncle Sam can't seem to give away for free is the work ethic.

[powderman]

DDZ, TOBSTER Good posts, true. As far as a narrow window to harvest goes it's not like these folks don't know ahead of time when they will be needed and that they need a green card to be LEGAL, they simply choose to ignore and laugh at our laws. POWDERMAN. 

[ironglow]

  Let's use the multi-generational welfare users..do them a favor in teaching them how to work for a living.  They can do as the legal migrant workers used to do..go to the farm for 3 to 6 months..whatever the crops require, then go home again.
   
    We could use foreign migrant workers..they just don't HAVE to be ILLEGAL ones !  Such a program was very succcessful at one time and could work again.
   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bracero_Program
     As a youngster, I recall working alongside some of these braceros..they made more money than I did, because they were experienced adults.  When the seasons for strawberries, beans etc was over..they went back home to Puerto  Rico, Jamaica, Domenica, etc.  There were some who came from the various cities, mostly recent immigrants (legal ones) from such places as Poland, or Czechoslovakia...willing to work hard for a living.
  No young, healthy citizen should be sitting around on their duff, drawing welfare WIC or foodstamps..while there are farm workers needed..

[Val]

In Commiefornia at least, only 2% of illegal aliens work in agriculture picking our crops. The rest are here, working in the Black economy being paid cash for work and not paying taxes, having their anchor babies so they can collect welfare, using our school systems, joining gangs, etc.

[Dee]

Why not require the farmer to turn loose of some of those millions in "farm subsidies", that they get, and their family members (wives & children) get, cut back on MULTIPLE VACATIONS a year, and scale back on expensive SUVs, and high end "farm pickups" and homes.
Maybe then they could afford to pay better wages to AMERICAN FARM WORKERS.

[keith44]

Why not require the farmer to turn loose of some of those millions in "farm subsidies", that they get, and their family members (wives & children) get, cut back on MULTIPLE VACATIONS a year, and scale back on expensive SUVs, and high end "farm pickups" and homes.
Maybe then they could afford to pay better wages to AMERICAN FARM WORKERS.

I'd like to know who gets multiple vacations per year...what subsidies high-end pickups


Not what we see here in my neck of the woods

[guzzijohn]

Nore my neck of the woods.
GuzziJohn

[Dee]

EWG Farm Subsidy Data Base. Look'em up for yourself, and note that many sign family members up also to "double down" on the money. I have friends doin it, and family members doin it. It will also tell you HOW MUCH they get.

[powderman]

In Commiefornia at least, only 2% of illegal aliens work in agriculture picking our crops. The rest are here, working in the Black economy being paid cash for work and not paying taxes, having their anchor babies so they can collect welfare, using our school systems, joining gangs, etc.

 
I'm afraid that is true all over America. They laugh at our laws and disrerspect us because they can. They refuse to obey our laws by getting green cards because they have no respect for us or our nation. If they are legal they would be required to pay taxes and be  accounted for. Too many would rather be leeches. In the drs  office Mon I saw a time mag with a bunch of them on the cover, the inside story said, we are Americans, just not legal, and WE AINT LEAVING. I couldn't make myself read any farther. If they can be interviewed to spout their arrogance disrespect they can be arrested and deported, and take their illegal kids with them. POWDERMAN. 

[DDZ]

EWG Farm Subsidy Data Base. Look'em up for yourself, and note that many sign family members up also to "double down" on the money. I have friends doin it, and family members doin it. It will also tell you HOW MUCH they get.

I remember looking at this a couple of years ago. You might be surprised who is getting what. A dairy farm just up the road from me has got $65,000 since 95. Thats more than most peoples gross wages for a year. Plus the family gets welfare benefits also. Another farm near me has got 72K and the government just paid them to put a branch of drainage ditches in their fields that didn't need drainage pipe in the first place. They did the work themselves just to make money on the deal, just because the tax payers were paying. There is a lot of money being spread around through the farm subsidy program, that most people don't know about. Its just another example of a poorly run government program, that is wasteful as the next government program. 

[turk762]

Also remember that most crops have a fairly narrow harvest window so when you need the workers you need them now not two months later. If you say that we need to use people on welfare, etc. a plan will need to be developed to harden these people to this kind of work. I know I am done in after about an hour picking strawberries.
GuzziJohn

So once again we need to accommodate them to make it easier. This is how this all begain. God forbid they go to work and come home with aching muscles and a sore back like the rest of us.

[DDZ]

Also remember that most crops have a fairly narrow harvest window so when you need the workers you need them now not two months later. If you say that we need to use people on welfare, etc. a plan will need to be developed to harden these people to this kind of work. I know I am done in after about an hour picking strawberries.
GuzziJohn

So once again we need to accommodate them to make it easier. This is how this all begain. God forbid they go to work and come home with aching muscles and a sore back like the rest of us.

Surely we can't have anyone on welfare getting sore muscles from physical labor. Sore muscles from working are for the other people.

[keith44]

EWG Farm Subsidy Data Base. Look'em up for yourself, and note that many sign family members up also to "double down" on the money. I have friends doin it, and family members doin it. It will also tell you HOW MUCH they get.

From the data base:


Kentucky ranking: 24 of 50 States

• 65 percent of farms in Kentucky did not collect subsidy payments - according to USDA.

• Ten percent collected 81 percent of all subsidies.
• [/size]
• [/size]So like I said not around me, and none of our income is from subsidies.  A few of the big operations (3,000 + acres) do have higher end equipment, but own nothing.  It's all on a two year lease, including the trucks.  [size=78%]

• [/size]Something to remember is the migrant farm worker is here on a visa, will work till the job is done (16 hours or more per day) (like so many American farmers do) then they move to the next harvest or planting, or pollination job.  [size=78%]

[saddlebum]

If all the occupiers went to work, we would have plenty of workers.
 
Might have to raise wages and benefits to more than what they make on disibility, food stamps and welfare though before they would. But who could afford to buy groceries then?

[ironglow]

Yeah..round up all those OWS rabble rousers, take them to the bean fields, citrus groves and apple orchards..and let them expend their excess energy on something worthwhile..

[Cuts Crooked]

I remember looking at this a couple of years ago. You might be surprised who is getting what. A dairy farm just up the road from me has got $65,000 since 95. Thats more than most peoples gross wages for a year.

That works out to less than 4,000 a year. I don't think that is more than most peoples wages per year