for those that want to talk about bigfoot as a real animal

[Swampman]

there are a few videos of this encounter on youtube. i have watched them and the slow motion versions as well.
 at first blush, it seem credible, mostly because at the end , the creature raises it shoulders and widens its arm and leans forward.
 its a very classic chimpanzee movement.
however, there are several points that seem to say hoax, distance/size for one, what they were wear/time of year
 head size and arm length ratio to body width. post incident video footage ... just to name the obvious
 
when the video came out, it was touted as credible,  reasonably clear and the teens "acted" correct for the event ..
 but as its looked at with clear and logical heads, its clearly a hoax, stage set by someone who knew something a bit about BF sightings.  at the end of the day, its a kid in a costume of some kind.

So you're an expert on primates now?

[Scibaer]

As Ive said, i have studied the BF phenomanon for close to 30 years.
Ive read just about everything , watched countless vids, and talk/discussed the topic with experts , hunters and researchers at one time or another. it occurred to me long ago, that to find, hunt or understand BF, you need to understand what habitat, conditions and ecology it should need to live in. so studying and understanding primates was a logical choice. Ive read books on primate behavior, and watched lectures on them. 
does that make me a expert, NO and i i don't claim to be. i do claim to know some primate behavior and can recognize it when i see it.

another post to follow this will come shortly
i have some interesting to show you all
 

[Scibaer]

In the video, the guy swings the cam , as they turn to run away.
 it looks as if he swings the video cam to the right, as he turn to the right as starts to flee.
  at the 36 second mark, there is another BF , it appears to be watch them as the record the first BF.
   you can see it for yourself if you watch the youtube video, frame by frame.
at the 34 second mark you can see the BF .
at the 35 second mark you see the cam swing away to the right
at the 36 second mark, you see very briefly a 2nd BF watching them.
 here is a video capture of the 2nd creature.

this is a direct capture, i did not alter it in any way from the you tube video if this event.

[FPH]

I'm not saying bigfoot exists or doesn't exist but it's just strange that as many people that are in the woods and have been in the woods with a rifle, not a one has busted a cap on one of them. There is a guy in my hunting club here in Alabama that swears, he and others in a club he used to be in, saw one several times over near Selma. Said they saw strange lights in the sky too. I just say ok and let him carry on. Until I see one for myself I'll remain skeptical.

As much time as I have spent in the outdoors in TX, CO, Utah, AZ and NM, they must not like it here if they exist(no scat or track or sign of any kind).  Why wouldn't the folks I have known who have run dogs after cats, bear and hogs never scented on one?

[Scibaer]

right. one of the biggest problems with BF being believable is geographic location and ecology.
   BF cannot occupy tropical, desert, swamp or mountain regions at the same time.
    it would have to be adapted to one or possibly two regions , not the wide ranging regions that they have been reported being seen in. it just does not make biological sense.  heavily haired animals just dont occupy swampy or desert locations.
large primates, great apes, gorillas and chimps have ranges limited to tropical and sub tropic regions. and BF as commonly described would likewise occupy a similar region.
as for BF being a demon or some other extra dimensional being.. thats just not even worth discussion.

[Swampman]

You're ill informed.....bears live in many climates.  Men live in many climates.  Nobody has ever said anything about demons.  Many scientist believe there is strong evidence of other dimensions.  Bigfoot is one of many commonly observed extra dimensional beings.

[Scibaer]

well  no, actually. different species of bears live in different climates. adaption to ecological changes or variations, new species or a change of species happens.
 man adapts himself to different climate by using clothing or other devices ( part of what makes us human , so does not apply to this  scenario ) but actually humans have done this too, witness the different "races" of people.
 you and a few others try to uses other dimensional beings as an excuse all the time, do i need to go back and makes quotes ?
 many scientists believe nothing. science is about testable facts. other dimensions cannot be tested.  show me any scientific data that proves for other dimension , other then speculation.. there is none.   there is not many scientists ,  non a one who have testable scientific data on the subject.
bigfoot, if real would have to be of this dimension. bound by reality , biology and rules of time and space of this known universe.
 it is not , in an way, commonly observed a extra dimensional being . there is nothing that would suggest that, scientifically or otherwise. statements like that are laughable at best. 

[Scibaer]

so back to reality and rational thought now ..
 in frame 36, its hard to see but if you slow down the video and go frame by frame, it appears that a second BF is standing off to thier right, back over thier right shoulders, looking at the group while they view  the BF who stands up.
 its hard to tell but it looks to be about the same size and color of the 1st BF.
 the cam is moving so fast, as its being swung , the BF only appears in frame for 1 second  and in one frame

[Swampman]

Current quantum-physics proves that other dimensions exist.  You don't like my facts because they don't agree with your preconcived notions and they prove you wrong again.

[Scibaer]

cite your source, name the physicist and provide the data, or stop your delusional bull stink.
 
you dont have any facts.
my statements are not notions.
there is no current "physics" that prove other dimensions.

im calling you out. just a i did when you claimed to have pictures, and you provided nothing.
where is the proof ?

 show your cards. put up or shut the hell up.

[Swampman]

I've never claimed to have pictures.  My facts really bother you because you can't dismiss them.  They hold water.....
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/String_theory#Extra_dimensions

[FPH]

Current  quantum physics proves that other dimensions exist.  You don't like my facts because they don't agree with your preconceived notions and they prove you wrong again.

Actually, that would be quantum mechanics and nothing has been proven......it is all theoretical hypothesis.

[Scibaer]

i called you out.
i asked you to prove your statements. i never bothered to mention you were in the wrong area of science, however your so called facts are nothing more then delusional statements of ignorance.
you , once again provided nothing. nothing you say holds water.
and yes, in another thread, you claimed to have pictures of dimensional portals.
 do you think what you say in another thread, dont apply here to these statements ?
  a wikipedia link would be fine, provided it had links to actual papers or data, and it was in the right field of science.

 show your cards, put up.

[Swampman]

I can see you squirming from here......uncomfortable?  It's ok, I do that to most folks who don't know what they are talking about.

[Swampman]

and yes, in another thread, you claimed to have pictures of dimensional portals.

That would be impossible.......you just don't understand how things work.  I never claimed any such thing.

[ultramag44]

Right then.

BF is quite real. I and a friend had a clear daylight sighting mid October 1971.

See the BFRO Site and read the sighting report for NJ 1971.

We were quite sober. I am now retired military, a college grad and now hold a very responsible position in the Health Information Network Management area of a hospital.

A breeding population of BF requires forested places to hide,  a close water source, and food. 

They are flesh & blood animals, primates.  Yes, they have been shot & killed.  The few that have killed them understandably do not come forward.  NO  conspiracy theory, just one they realize the full implication  of what they have done and the possible consequences, they remain silent.

[Scibaer]

another thing a breeding population needs is a certain minimum numbers of animals.
and to fit into a certain ecological niche fulfilling a specific biological requirements.
 and having BF's all over, from mountians to swamps and/or forests does not make biological sense.

how do you know they have been shot and killed ? by who, when and where ?
if they have not  come forward, then how do you know ?
 the full implication of what they done in killing a cyrptozoological animal ?
  changing the history books and alot of other sciences ?
   id say they  be in the history books too, not alot of reason to hide in my mind there..

[ultramag44]

I could answer  your questions, but I won't; go to  the BFRO site and do a bit of research.
All your questions, and quite a few you didn't think to ask will be answered.

[WD45]

seems ultramag doesn't need to site a source. Interesting thing about science or most scientists is they like to state a lot of theory as fact as long as it comes from them. They can put a man on the moon but can't figure out how the pyramids were built along with other structures. They will look at a few dinosaur bones and pretend they know every detail about a creature that they have never seen. What it ate, how it ate, how it lived, what color it was, how it hunted, how smart it was or wasn't but tell them you actually saw an animal like a bigfoot and you are a nut.

[Tal_Branco]

As Ive said, i have studied the BF phenomanon for close to 30 years.
Ive read just about everything , watched countless vids, and talk/discussed the topic with experts , hunters and researchers at one time or another. it occurred to me long ago, that to find, hunt or understand BF, you need to understand what habitat, conditions and ecology it should need to live in. so studying and understanding primates was a logical choice. Ive read books on primate behavior, and watched lectures on them. 
does that make me a expert, NO and i i don't claim to be. i do claim to know some primate behavior and can recognize it when i see it.

another post to follow this will come shortly
i have some interesting to show you all

In studying about Bigfoot for "close to thirty years" did you happen to spend any time in the field at night in the areas of counties in Michigan which have generated numerous Bigfoot reports? I would also be interested in knowing the names of the Bigfoot "experts" with whom you "talk(ed)/discussed" the topic. I frankly didn't know there were any.
 
Since 1995, there have been 161 Bigfoot encounter reports submitted to the BFRO from Michigan.  Schoolcraft county has generated ten such reports, Oscoda had eight, and Ogemaw & Washtenaw produced seven each. The other 128 reports came from other counties across the state. There have been many more such reports from Michigan submitted to various other Bigfoot Research groups as well.
 
After your post quoted above, and after all the research you did, in a later post you concluded that Bigfoot could not, and did not exist, and gave your opinions for the conclusion.
 
Having read each of your posts on this subject it is pretty clear that little, if any, of your research was conducted in the field in areas of Michigan's counties having reported populations of these creatures, or done at night when the creatures are the most active and "playful". Thinking, talking and discussing them with those that have seen them would be a good start, but getting in their territory at night might very well bring you to decide your original conclusion was erroneous.
 
Respectfully, T
 

[ultramag44]

seems ultramag doesn't need to site a source. Interesting thing about science or most scientists is they like to state a lot of theory as fact as long as it comes from them. They can put a man on the moon but can't figure out how the pyramids were built along with other structures. They will look at a few dinosaur bones and pretend they know every detail about a creature that they have never seen. What it ate, how it ate, how it lived, what color it was, how it hunted, how smart it was or wasn't but tell them you actually saw an animal like a bigfoot and you are a nut.

I have seen Bigfoot (s),  (see BFRO, report of NJ 1971 Essex County), so, no armchair theorizing from me.  I have been there & done that!
Here's just one source, read it and see how it applies.
Public Health Service Act
In every state, the wild animals belong to the state.  As a source, ask any conservation officer.
There is no "School" per se for BF research.  The BFRO uses techniques in the field that have been learned by trial & error.  As Tal says, get in the field. 

[pastorp]

Ultramag,

Most states claim ownership of native wildlife. And regulate/manage it for the good of the people. Non native species are usually not regulated of protected. In some instance they are, for instance when the original Tarzan movies were filmed near Ocala, fl on the Silver River they released monkeys that still reside in that area and I understands the state of Florida protects.
However the state of Florida would sure like to get rid of our Burmese pythons, salt water crocks, and a few other species that were illegally introduced into the wilds of Florida.

Since Bigfoot is not even recognized as a animal native to any state I doubt they are protected.

Regards,

[ultramag44]

Byron,
Yes, I knew about the Johnny Weismiller films made in Florida!  The crystal clear waters made underwater filming easy.  Johnny was an olympic swimmer, but they had a body double swimmer for Maureen Ohara (Maureen could not hold her breath long enough for underwater takes).

Most (but not all) of the non-indigeint snakes were released during a huricane (Andrew?) when a snake farm was flattened and the snakes escaped.  Apparently they are now over breeding due to lack of predators and taking small dogs, cats etc. 

Regardless of the protected status of any wild animal, it is still state property.  All states claim this sovernty.  As such, the conservation dept. could (and most likely would) get a judge to sign a court order to surrender the carcass of any unusual or unreconized animal.  Enen in the most desired circumstances, IE, like if it just dropped dead on your property of old age or from an infected tooth abcess, the carcass is still state propery.   

Under provisions of the Public Health Service Act, the Feds can get their fingers in the pie.  Believe me, the Feds have judges sitting around cutting out paper dolls and doing crossword puzzles while waiting to sign a Federal Warrant for whomever.  Many of the newer laws have vaguely-worded  provisions (provisions that you'll never hear of until they use them) that give a wide latitude as to how the law is applied and what they can do (get away with).