Libertarian party toying with being the spoiler.

[powderman]

Libertarian Party eyes spoiler role in 2012 race  By Joseph Weber
Published August 18, 2012
FoxNews.com     

•    FILE: Sept. 22, 2011: Libertarian Party presidential candidate Gary Johnson talks during a debate in Orlando, Fla. (AP)

  Libertarian candidate Gary Johnson almost certainly can't win the presidential election this year. But his supporters claim he could determine who does.
Johnson, the former New Mexico governor who briefly and unsuccessfully competed for the Republican presidential nomination before joining the Libertarians, is polling barely above 5 percent nationwide. Yet his numbers in key battleground states suggest he could make a difference in what is shaping up to be a tight contest between President Obama and Mitt Romney.
He was rating at 13 percent in New Mexico and 9 percent in Arizona in recent polling -- not enough to win, but certainly enough to disadvantage whichever major-party candidate he's drawing votes away from.
The Libertarian Party is now touting that possibility. An emailed statement from the organization earlier this week carried a rather sensational subject line: "Libertarian Presidential Candidate Gov. Gary Johnson Could Deprive Mitt Romney of 5 battleground states, 74 Electoral Votes, 27% of the Electoral Votes needed to win in 2012."
Libertarians reasoned Johnson, then, "could determine the winner" of the election.
It's impossible to gauge at this point what effect Johnson could have, but of course it's not unprecedented for a third-party candidate to tilt the scales.
In 1992, third-party candidate Ross Perot won roughly 19 percent of the popular vote, which many people think cut into GOP incumbent George H.W. Bush's take and put Democratic candidate Bill Clinton in the Oval Office with just 43 percent of the vote.
Though Johnson is polling barely above 5 percent nationwide, Romney and Obama are separated by single digits in the battleground states of Colorado, Florida, Nevada, North Carolina and Virginia.
The Libertarian Party is pointing to those states as among the places where Johnson's presence could make a difference. All five states voted for Obama in 2008. But they largely voted Republican in prior modern-day elections, and could be a toss-up this year.
As for which candidate Johnson benefits, it's unclear. The Libertarians think he mostly takes away from Romney's numbers. And they say Johnson will likely have the biggest impact in Colorado, based on a recent statewide poll that shows him with 7 percent of the vote.
However, the Aug. 8 survey by the Democrat-leaning Public Policy Polling also suggests Johnson could in fact hurt Obama in Colorado. The survey found Obama leading Romney 49-43 percent, but his lead was cut to 46-42 when voters were given the Johnson choice.
"He's going to be a problem for somebody, somewhere," political strategist and Fox News contributor Joe Trippi wrote last month. "We don't yet know which candidate he might harm the most -- but both campaigns should be looking over their shoulders at that guy almost nobody is talking about."
Tom Jensen, PPP's president, said the firm has been including Johnson in statewide polls in New Mexico and surrounding states essentially because that is where he generates significant numbers. However, those surveyed early in an election cycle and who pledge their support to a third-party candidate have a tendency to vote Democrat or Republican by November.
Despite the spoiler-role speculation, Carla Howell, the Libertarian Party's executive director, defended Johnson as a serious candidate.
"This is an election between two very similar candidates. ... Gary Johnson is a real choice for what people really care about," she said.
Johnson is now on the November ballot in at least 48 states and is expected by Election Day to be on all 50 and on the District of Columbia's.
However, Johnson getting to 15 percent to get into the three scheduled presidential debates is unlikely.   
"He's dreaming," said Larry Sabato, director of the University of Virginia Center For Politics. "The debate committee is run by the two (major) parties. They had to let in Perot because at one point he had 40 percent of the vote."
Johnson's supporters argue that he's not just a niche candidate. Howell noted Johnson's platform goes beyond decriminalizing marijuana and supporting same sex-marriage to include a balanced-budget plan.
"He stands for a lot of things that a lot of people want," she said.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/08/18/libertarian-eyes-spoiler-role/#ixzz23w6PzTkX

[Doublebass73]

Blaming Gary Johnson for Mitt Romney's loss in the upcoming election is nothing but liberal logic. The Republicans claim to be the party of personal responsibility but yet want to blame someone else when their candidate loses? That's no different than a black person blaming whitey because he can't get ahead in life.

It's real simple, nominate a candidate who is an actual fiscal conservative that follows the Constitution and I guarantee you that you won't have to worry about losing an election. The Republican party will reap what it has sown. The fact that the Republican party's candidate is running neck and neck in the polls with one of the worst presidents in US history is proof of that.

[nw_hunter]

Blaming Gary Johnson for Mitt Romney's loss in the upcoming election is nothing but liberal logic. The Republicans claim to be the party of personal responsibility but yet want to blame someone else when their candidate loses? That's no different than a black person blaming whitey because he can't get ahead in life.

It's real simple, nominate a candidate who is an actual fiscal conservative that follows the Constitution and I guarantee you that you won't have to worry about losing an election. The Republican party will reap what it has sown. The fact that the Republican party's candidate is running neck and neck in the polls with one of the worst presidents in US history is proof of that.

Couldn't agree more! Why do so many people have a hard time understanding this?
We pass up a good chance every election cycle to elect a good Constitutional candidate for a mirror image of the current criminal in office.I guess it's so they can whine and look for excuses if their choice loses.

[briarpatch]

The people dont pick the candidate, the media does. We just vote for their choices, the elite have a win either way and it will never change.

[Gary G]

I have three choices:
1. vote for the socialist
2. vote for the fascist
3. vote for neither one

[45-70.gov]

Blaming Gary Johnson for Mitt Romney's loss in the upcoming election is nothing but liberal logic. The Republicans claim to be the party of personal responsibility but yet want to blame someone else when their candidate loses? That's no different than a black person blaming whitey because he can't get ahead in life.

It's real simple, nominate a candidate who is an actual fiscal conservative that follows the Constitution and I guarantee you that you won't have to worry about losing an election. The Republican party will reap what it has sown. The fact that the Republican party's candidate is running neck and neck in the polls with one of the worst presidents in US history is proof of that.

then  why can't he even win in hte primaries  with out all those democrats voting against him?








still no oen has answered my question


if a conservative  CAN'T  win in the primaries
why makes you think he has a chance in the general election???


the  media situation is the same  if not worse
the DEMZ have most media
the REPUBS have fox and  talk radio
the LIBERTARIANS   have..........??  no one

[blind ear]

The people dont pick the candidate, the media does. We just vote for their choices, the elite have a win either way and it will never change.

-
If the public continues to let the media decide and "not think for themselves" we are doomed. It may take things getting a whole lot worse before the "public" wakes up. If they don't wake up we get what we deserve. We may need a good clensing of the political philosophy pool and start over and keep much closer control of what we teach our children and what we allow them to be taught.. ear

[nw_hunter]

The people dont pick the candidate, the media does. We just vote for their choices, the elite have a win either way and it will never change.

That's just it! We don't have to vote for the media (RNC, DNC choice.But as we can see by the results...........A large majority do.

[finisher]

I think it was Mae West who was quoted as saying "When I have to choose between the lesser of two evils, I pick the one I haven't tried before".


We've tried both Democrats and Republicans repeatedly. I agree with ol' Mae and I'll vote with the party America hasn't tried before.


To continue doing the same thing repeatedly while getting a negative result to me is INSANITY (Kind of like commuting every day in LA traffic).

[lakota]

I would love to see Gary Johnson be included in the presidential debates but I know that it will never happen. It would be very dangerous to the Repulicrat/Dempugnican Nationalist Uniparty's existence to have Libertarian ideas expressed on a wide spread scale like that.

[nw_hunter]

Blaming Gary Johnson for Mitt Romney's loss in the upcoming election is nothing but liberal logic. The Republicans claim to be the party of personal responsibility but yet want to blame someone else when their candidate loses? That's no different than a black person blaming whitey because he can't get ahead in life.

It's real simple, nominate a candidate who is an actual fiscal conservative that follows the Constitution and I guarantee you that you won't have to worry about losing an election. The Republican party will reap what it has sown. The fact that the Republican party's candidate is running neck and neck in the polls with one of the worst presidents in US history is proof of that.

then  why can't he even win in hte primaries  with out all those democrats voting against him?

 SIMPLE!........Columnist Fred Reed had it correct  (Quote)We are ruled not by a government but by a class. Here the
   media are crucial. Unless you spend time outside of America, you may
   not realize to what extent the press is controlled. The press is
   largely free, yes, but it is also largely owned by a small number of
   corporations which, in turn, are run by people from the same pool
   from which are drawn high-level pols and their advisers. They are
   rich people who know each other and have the same interests. It is
   very nearly correct to say that these people are the government of
   the United States, and that the federal apparatus merely a useful
   theatrical manifestation.


   Finally, though it may not be deliberate, the schools produce a
   pitiably ignorant population that can’t vote wisely. Just as trial
   lawyers don’t want intelligent jurors, as they are harder to
   manipulate, so political parties don’t want educated voters. The
   existence of a puzzled mass gawping at Oprah reduces elections to
   popularity contests modulated by the state of the economy. One party
   may win, yes, or the other. But a TV-besotted electorate doesn’t
   meddle in matters important to its rulers. It has never heard of
   them.

Not enough people use the means available, like the Internet to educate themselves. They instead choose sides and only listen to the mouthpiece of their choice.

[45-70.gov]

Blaming Gary Johnson for Mitt Romney's loss in the upcoming election is nothing but liberal logic. The Republicans claim to be the party of personal responsibility but yet want to blame someone else when their candidate loses? That's no different than a black person blaming whitey because he can't get ahead in life.

It's real simple, nominate a candidate who is an actual fiscal conservative that follows the Constitution and I guarantee you that you won't have to worry about losing an election. The Republican party will reap what it has sown. The fact that the Republican party's candidate is running neck and neck in the polls with one of the worst presidents in US history is proof of that.

then  why can't he even win in hte primaries  with out all those democrats voting against him?








still no oen has answered my question


if a conservative  CAN'T  win in the primaries
why makes you think he has a chance in the general election???


the  media situation is the same  if not worse
the DEMZ have most media
the REPUBS have fox and  talk radio
the LIBERTARIANS   have..........??  no one

still no oen has answered my questionif a conservative  CAN'T  win in the primarieswhy makes you think he has a chance in the general election???the  media situation is the same  if not worsethe DEMZ have most mediathe REPUBS have fox and  talk radiothe LIBERTARIANS   have..........??  no one

[nw_hunter]

then  why can't he even win in hte primaries  with out all those democrats voting against him?


I thought that question had been answered.   The schools produce a[/size]   pitiably ignorant population that can’t vote wisely.

[45-70.gov]

then  why can't he even win in hte primaries  with out all those democrats voting against him?


I thought that question had been answered.   The schools produce a   pitiably ignorant population that can’t vote wisely.

yes  answered why they can't win in the primaries


but  NOT answered why they can  NOW  win the general election


they can't...it is either  a dem or rep....any other vote is a non-vote

[45-70.gov]

does any one think that the libertarian candidate will get just one electoral vote??
does anyone think libertarians can swing ALL of floridas electoral voted for OBUMER


ONE OF BUSHES ELECTIONS  135 VOTERS IN FLORIDA SWUNG THE INTIRE STATE AND THE ELECTION


i was registered libertarian then....i voted for bush  not my party
how  many know it was THAT close??

[powderman]

does any one think that the libertarian candidate will get just one electoral vote??
does anyone think libertarians can swing ALL of floridas electoral voted for OBUMER


ONE OF BUSHES ELECTIONS  135 VOTERS IN FLORIDA SWUNG THE INTIRE STATE AND THE ELECTION


i was registered libertarian then....i voted for bush  not my party
how  many know it was THAT close??

 
Of course they can't win, they never intended to. They are just there to SPOIL for the illegal kenyan, and they will. It's HEY look at me time. Between them and the rp folks another win for imam obama is pretty well a sure thing, just as planned. POWDERMAN. 

[blind ear]

Same song different words, lesser of. When the election is over we may find out what WE are about. ear

[Dee]

Collectively the United States will get what it deserves, and yes, what it actually, and collectively WANTS. We may rave all we want individually about "wasting our vote", voting for "the lessor of two evils", or even for the Democratic devil, Obama himself.
There are too many pigs on the tit, and that is the truth of the matter. The welfare folks don't wanna work, so they vote Democrat. The unions want the golden retirement benefits, and salaries, so they vote Democrat. The farmers want their subsidies, so they vote Democrat. And the list goes on, and on.
Many "so called conservatives" say they want prayer back in school. Okay, we put prayer back in school. Right after the prayer, everyone can go back to class, and learns about EVOLUTION. That makes sense.
Many "so called conservatives" believe in 2nd Amendment, and 1st Amendment rights. Last election they voted RABIDLY for John McCain .
The reason Washington is such a mess, is because America's collective LOGIC is a mess. Until America hits "rock bottom" it will never learn the forgotten fact of: What's right is right, and what's wrong is always wrong. The waters in the court rooms of America have been muddied by slick talking lawyers, lookin to get rich, as has the waters in Washington by the same vermin. The complacent, apathetic, citizens are treated as bumbling stooges for decades, and indeed, collectively they are. i.e. Yes that's what we said, but we really didn't say it.   AND! Yes, that's what we did, but we really didn't do it.
As I said: Only when Americans individually hit "rock bottom" will they realize the Calvary they were expecting to come and rescue them, were lying all along, and it doesn't always happen to "someone else". And that's the way I see it.

[Minnesota1]

does any one think that the libertarian candidate will get just one electoral vote??
does anyone think libertarians can swing ALL of floridas electoral voted for OBUMER


ONE OF BUSHES ELECTIONS  135 VOTERS IN FLORIDA SWUNG THE INTIRE STATE AND THE ELECTION


i was registered libertarian then....i voted for bush  not my party
how  many know it was THAT close??

I agree.  Libertarians feel they have all of this support but in reality they don't.  Many people, myself included, subscribe and believe in many of their views, but they will never be a major party no matter how much money they have or time on the air they may have.  That's a fact.  Look at Ron Paul, he came off great in the debates at first, then when they had to discuss foreign policy and other issues he sounded like a stick your head in the sand idiot to many and he sunk in the polls.  Parts of the Libertarian party appeal to many but many parts of it like abortion, drugs, foreign policy have such huge impacts on peoples views that it kills their overall support for the party.  So yes, if you vote Libertarian you are wasting your vote.  If you want change in the party go and work in the party for the changes.  Look at the affect the Tea Party is having.  We are putting in a lot better breed of politician and that is real change that can be had, not voting for people that can never win, but only give Obama another term to tear our gun rights, religious freedoms, and appoint judges that will destroy the fabric of our nation for generations to come. 

Voting for Gary Johnson or anyone other than Romney in this election shows a lack of reasoning and understanding of what is really at stake.  Florida went for Bush like stated above.  If Gore had gotten in we would have 2 more rabid liberals on the Supreme Court not to mention the countless numbers in the lower courts.  That is what is at stake.  Wake up and realize what your vote is doing and how it will condemn future generations to the horrors of enslavement to so many ills that will intensify in the next 4 years.

[Cuts Crooked]

Ah yes! Many fine examples of how "the big lie" works! ALthough I was censored for pointing it out in another thread, I'll try again, just fer S#^+s 'n grins. Tell it loud enuff 'n long enuff and everyone starts getting on board........it even works fabulously right here on GBO!

[nw_hunter]

does any one think that the libertarian candidate will get just one electoral vote??
does anyone think libertarians can swing ALL of floridas electoral voted for OBUMER


ONE OF BUSHES ELECTIONS  135 VOTERS IN FLORIDA SWUNG THE INTIRE STATE AND THE ELECTION


i was registered libertarian then....i voted for bush  not my party
how  many know it was THAT close??

I agree.  Libertarians feel they have all of this support but in reality they don't.  Many people, myself included, subscribe and believe in many of their views, but they will never be a major party no matter how much money they have or time on the air they may have.  That's a fact.  Look at Ron Paul, he came off great in the debates at first, then when they had to discuss foreign policy and other issues he sounded like a stick your head in the sand idiot to many and he sunk in the polls.  Parts of the Libertarian party appeal to many but many parts of it like abortion, drugs, foreign policy have such huge impacts on peoples views that it kills their overall support for the party.  So yes, if you vote Libertarian you are wasting your vote.  If you want change in the party go and work in the party for the changes.  Look at the affect the Tea Party is having.  We are putting in a lot better breed of politician and that is real change that can be had, not voting for people that can never win, but only give Obama another term to tear our gun rights, religious freedoms, and appoint judges that will destroy the fabric of our nation for generations to come. 

Voting for Gary Johnson or anyone other than Romney in this election shows a lack of reasoning and understanding of what is really at stake.  Florida went for Bush like stated above.  If Gore had gotten in we would have 2 more rabid liberals on the Supreme Court not to mention the countless numbers in the lower courts.  That is what is at stake.  Wake up and realize what your vote is doing and how it will condemn future generations to the horrors of enslavement to so many ills that will intensify in the next 4 years.

I don't know of any Libertarians who feel they have a lot of support. I think most would agree they are fighting the good fight without help from fellow conservatives.You brought up a good point about the T Party!Do you think Romney fits the bill as a T Party type of guy? The T.party had no bearing at all on Romney being the candidate. Main stream media holds those honors, just like they hold the blame for not letting patriots be heard. I once thought being a Republican was all important and only voted for folks with an R in front of their names. Regardless of their voting record!It was what my party told me to do........The Right thing!
Somewhere down the road I started to read books and search the internet for information on these folks........."Low and Behold' I found them to be the same as the ones they cursed and ranted about. I found out at one time (When the Republican Platform) was written, they had many leaders with Libertarian views.The Liberals slowly pushed them from the RNC, until only a handful remained.

They are the ones that actually mirror the founding Fathers....The ones who started us on the road to greatness.The ones who love individual freedom. They believe in changing bad laws we have on the books. Not adding to them as Liberal Republicans and Democrats do.

I may not be the brightest bulb on the tree, but I'm smart enough to know truth when I hear it, and I don't hear anything but lies coming from Obama and Romney.I would be hypocritical voting for either of them feeling the way I do. If voting for the Right person helps elect the wrong person...........I'm guilty
***********************************************

"We have four boxes with which to defend our freedom: The soap box, The ballot box, The jury box, and the Cartridge box.
 Congressman Larry McDonald (April 1, 1935 – September 1, 1983) RIP Congressman
****************************************************

[Needles]

Blaming Gary Johnson for Mitt Romney's loss in the upcoming election is nothing but liberal logic. The Republicans claim to be the party of personal responsibility but yet want to blame someone else when their candidate loses? That's no different than a black person blaming whitey because he can't get ahead in life.

It's real simple, nominate a candidate who is an actual fiscal conservative that follows the Constitution and I guarantee you that you won't have to worry about losing an election. The Republican party will reap what it has sown. The fact that the Republican party's candidate is running neck and neck in the polls with one of the worst presidents in US history is proof of that.

then  why can't he even win in hte primaries  with out all those democrats voting against him?

 SIMPLE!........Columnist Fred Reed had it correct  (Quote)We are ruled not by a government but by a class. Here the
   media are crucial. Unless you spend time outside of America, you may
   not realize to what extent the press is controlled. The press is
   largely free, yes, but it is also largely owned by a small number of
   corporations which, in turn, are run by people from the same pool
   from which are drawn high-level pols and their advisers. They are
   rich people who know each other and have the same interests. It is
   very nearly correct to say that these people are the government of
   the United States, and that the federal apparatus merely a useful
   theatrical manifestation.


   Finally, though it may not be deliberate, the schools produce a
   pitiably ignorant population that can’t vote wisely. Just as trial
   lawyers don’t want intelligent jurors, as they are harder to
   manipulate, so political parties don’t want educated voters. The
   existence of a puzzled mass gawping at Oprah reduces elections to
   popularity contests modulated by the state of the economy. One party
   may win, yes, or the other. But a TV-besotted electorate doesn’t
   meddle in matters important to its rulers. It has never heard of
   them.

Not enough people use the means available, like the Internet to educate themselves. They instead choose sides and only listen to the mouthpiece of their choice.

+1   

[Doublebass73]

I used to think only liberals blamed other people for their problems and shortcomings, I guess I was wrong.

[powderman]

Voting for Gary Johnson or anyone other than Romney in this election shows a lack of reasoning and understanding of what is really at stake.  Florida went for Bush like stated above.  If Gore had gotten in we would have 2 more rabid liberals on the Supreme Court not to mention the countless numbers in the lower courts.  That is what is at stake.  Wake up and realize what your vote is doing and how it will condemn future generations to the horrors of enslavement to so many ills that will intensify in the next 4 years.

 
BINGO. Fact is that either Romney, an American,  or obama, an illegal kenyan, WILL be president of the United States. Your throw away votes will help elect one or the other, more than likely the kenyan,  thats just the way it is. Your principles won't send obama back to kenya, ONLY voting for Romney will. POWDERMAN. 

[Minnesota1]

They are the ones that actually mirror the founding Fathers....The ones who started us on the road to greatness.The ones who love individual freedom. They believe in changing bad laws we have on the books. Not adding to them as Liberal Republicans and Democrats do.

I may not be the brightest bulb on the tree, but I'm smart enough to know truth when I hear it, and I don't hear anything but lies coming from Obama and Romney.I would be hypocritical voting for either of them feeling the way I do. If voting for the Right person helps elect the wrong person...........I'm guilty
***********************************************

"We have four boxes with which to defend our freedom: The soap box, The ballot box, The jury box, and the Cartridge box.
 Congressman Larry McDonald (April 1, 1935 – September 1, 1983) RIP Congressman
****************************************************


When I hear Libertarians say that only they and those in there party are the true blue followers after the molds of our Founding Fathers it makes me smile.  The Republican party does have moderates in it for sure.  But to say the only ones that follow the Constitution or follow the Founding Fathers are the Libertarians is absurd.  It's a big tent and there are differing opinions.  Take your fight inside the party and fight it out.

Most Libertarians may have voted in primaries for Republicans and when their candidate didn't win they picked up their ball and went home.  They never go in and donate money to a candidate, never write letters to papers in support of their candidate, never knock doors, volunteer or do anything.  They chose to sit back and call themselves Libertarians so they can complain about everything and sit up and proclaim themselves to be the true followers of the Constitution.  Most probably never give time or money to their "conviction" of their Libertarian party as well.  It's an easy out and they can "feel" like the have the intellectual high ground on freedom and responsibility.

[nomosendero]

I still don't like anyone running for President (not talking about VP) & that includes Johnson. Johnson was not my pick before when he was running as a Republican. I don't see where his switching tickets has made him better. As a matter of fact, I don't remember others on this forum bragging on him back then either, but I may have forgotten.
 
Could someone show the post/posts where he was thought of as a good candidate back then ?

[SwampThing762]

For me it is the ballot box and the bullet box.  If Obama gets a second term, prepare for the end of the nation.  I know of two states that are giving secession a few thoughts.  The GBO membership should load their magazines and sharpen their knives.

ST762

[Dee]

For me it is the ballot box and the bullet box.  If Obama gets a second term, prepare for the end of the nation.  I know of two states that are giving secession a few thoughts.  The GBO membership should load their magazines and sharpen their knives.

ST762

Which two states?

[crustylicious]

Those in a state of confusion and state of delusion 

[Doublebass73]

The Republican party does have moderates in it for sure.

That's quite an understatement.