What's the point of the 357 max? (pic inside)

[Wagguy80]

The only problem I really see with this is the rounds could easily be damaged. Also while it might not be enough to matter less brass in the chamber actually increases the chamber size. Which will increase the rate at which the powder burns, and increase pressure. Not sure if it's enough to matter though.Take anything I say in this matter with less than a grain of salt. My reloading experience is limited to lee hand loading die kits, and sticking stricktly to the book. But hey it beats mail ordering or driving around trying to hunt down good.303 british ammo

[nanuk-O-dah-Nort]

...less brass in the chamber actually increases the chamber size. Which will increase the rate at which the powder burns, and increase pressure. ....

is it just me or does this sound backwards?? 

Larger chamber, slower burn, lower pressure...  think 30-06 to 308... 

[tc scout]

I don't think anyone has mentioned the fact that the GBO 357 Maxi reamers are PTG rifle reamers and cut a 6º leade into the rifling which can make a big difference is accuracy with any ammo length that's used in it, 38spcl, Mag, 360DW or Maxi.  If anyone has seen a 357Mag chamber cast, you'll see that the chamber is already much longer than needed for the Mag, many times long enough to chamber 360DW or Maxi brass with no or very little trimming.

Tim

(Read the review) http://www.midwayusa.com/product/734226/ptg-solid-pilot-chamber-finish-reamer-357-maximum

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,125780.msg1098446320.html#msg1098446320

Very true Tim, I have had several factory 357 Max TC barrels, none can compare in accuracy to my rechambered H&R done with the GBO reamer.

[Fire Fox]

White rabbit I would go on the cautious side with this in the 357 mag cases due to differences in temperature, altitude and humidity on powder, pressure, and resistance on cases. You could have a very dangerous situation waiting to happen. Just my thoughts for what it is worth. Good luck!

[bikerbeans]

Erased my original response as I have no dog in this fight.  I was so underwhelmed with the 357 Max that I traded mine away a long time ago.


BB

[jsm88011]

I'm a newbie to reloading and would load the 360's and/or maxi if ever I could find the brass.  Just reamed my 357 Handi.  Holla if you can send me somewhere.  Thanks!


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[gcrank1]

When I first responded I did not have a 357, now I have had one since sometime last fall(?, how time flies....). Ive been doing what I had 'speculated' on and that WR started this thread on, though I am 'maximizing' my 357Mag chamber and brass the same principles and interior ballistics apply as they do to using the same concept to long load a 38Spl. case to use in a 357Mag chamber. And we are talking in an H&R Handi not revolvers intended for 38Spl. and loaded to 357Mag levels; that is a whole 'nother thang.......
Plain and simple what one gets when long loading the bullet in a 357Mag case for the 357Max chamber is less case neck so less neck tension so less pressure to boot it out if all else is equal.
If the 'throat', such as it is, doesnt allow gas cutting (and this really is the issue with cast bullets) and you have a decently concentric chamber the bullet nose will be supported at the front and enter squarely into the bore. This even happens with 22Shorts in a LR chamber and 38Spl. in a 357Max which are well short of the origin of rifling and back in the chamber proper, does it not? It even happens in Weatherby's with their typlical 'freebore' jump and a lot of other factory chambers like the 30-06 made for the longest, heaviest bullets factory available but often shot with something shorter and lighter.
IME, the 357 in Mag or Max is one of the most user friendly calibers in an H&R. Only thing I wish is that I had got one long ago!

[tacklebury]

My only thought besides what's already been said is that you have an issue of runout or concentricity easier in a bullet extending that far from a case with that little to hold it.  Many benchrest shooters use runout gauges or concentricity gauges to make sure there is no yaw in the bullet's exiting the case before engaging the rifling.  I think your chances of getting a bullet so slightly off center that you might not even really see it, but at the high pressures we are talking about like even 35k loads, it would exacerbate this and possibly make one edge of the bullet hit the rifling just slightly earlier than the other.  This can cause deformation or bounce or wobble on exiting the muzzle.  If I were going to load them that long and take the chance, I think I'd pick-up a product like True Tool and a concentricity gauge to be sure I keep everything in line.  I intend to still use .38 specials for plinking, .357 for defensive and maintain that the only time I really need the heavyweights is for hunting, but that's just personal preference. 

[jackddavis]

I've been loading Mag. cases to factory Maxi for a couple of years now (as stated in previous threads here) without any problems what-so-ever. These longer cartridges will not fit in .357 Mag. revolvers, so no worries there. A very good solution to the lack of Maxi brass, and perfectly safe when done correctly. Work up your loads according to safe loading practices. If you don't know how to do this, any good reloading manual will explain the process.

An article on this subject; http://www.bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=658

My Gun and loads; http://www.metalsmithpro.com/357MagnumRifle.htm

[SHOOTALL]

So far it seems everyone is interested in heavy weight bullets . look at using 110 or 125 gr bullets and you have a good "flat" shooting round. Use 158 JSP and you have a Flat shooting deer round . That is where the "extra" case capacity can be a big help.

[gcrank1]

Im so glad you linked to those again Jack; we've lost some continuity to our conversations with this last snafu and this is a good thread for them.

[petemi]

This is an old post.  I'm going back to the original question: "What's the Point"....
The point is it is the cheapest, easiest conversion you can do.  To the best of our combined knowledge, it makes .38s and Mags shoot better, and turns your .357 mag. into a .35 Remington.  If that's not enough reason to do it, I don't know what is.

Pete

[Badnews Bob]

Yep I think Pete said it the best, And we have collected a huge library of info on this round.  It just flat out works well.

Are there better or worse, Of course but most are not as fun as the Max is for me.

[petemi]

Ya better believe it, Sailors like Bob and I can make a career out of having fun

The Maxi fits right in the program

Pete

[don29]

isn't the whol;e "point" of the 357 Maximum to launch a heavier bullet?

[petemi]

isn't the whol;e "point" of the 357 Maximum to launch a heavier bullet?

Not necessarily.  Some of us do that and others like a fast, light bullet.  To each his own.  I do both.  Personally, I love it because of what I can do with the wide variety of loads available to me.  It's very Handi.  My .445 comes very close and it is fun too  It's just a little more heavy handed.  That baby shoots .44 Special, .44 Russian, .44 Magnum and .445 Super Magnum...another very versatile and Handi rifle.  I suppose if my only goal was to kill anything in sight, I'd have just a .300 Win. Mag.  My goal is to enjoy my guns, and the Maxi is perhaps the most enjoyable.

Pete

[gcrank1]

Whatever the original intent may have been, what is going on now is more relevant. We are shooting cast bullets from light to heavy (me from 148gr. WC's to 230gr. flying trashcans) and jacketed the same (me from 115gr. to 140gr. Hornady XTP(?) to regular 357 158gr. JSP and someday some 180ish, maybe 200ish something, just because). There may be an 'optimum' but I think that may be mostly dependent upon what the owner's want/needs are. For me, if I need more beans than what a top load in this does I can choose from a myriad of calibers/cartridges, but which all arent quite what this one is.

[45-70.gov]

Erased my original response as I have no dog in this fight.  I was so underwhelmed with the 357 Max that I traded mine away a long time ago.


BB

BLASTPHEMY  !!!!!!!


this post is bastphemy !!
so is the title of this thread!!

[sluggo]

...to each his own. But, has been done for years.

www.reloadersnest.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=18603

[jackddavis]

...to each his own. But, has been done for years.

www.reloadersnest.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=18603

Link doesn't work.

[jackddavis]

Reading this thread and many others like it, it seems many believe that moving the bullet out and adding more powder will raise pressure. This isn't necessarily so. Moving the bullet out lowers pressure, then adding powder raises pressure, and if done correctly, it will raise pressure back to where it was before the bullet was moved out.

The Powley computer can be used to illustrate this. Filling in the variables, you can make changes to those variables and see what happens to pressures, etc.

http://kwk.us/powley.html

[Jim Stacy]

the 357 Max rechamber serves two purposes , more horse power and cleans up some of the excessive .6" of free space.A friend in SC has a 357 Handi and was quite unimpressed with it's accuracy and performance.
2 year old project. We were aware of what appeared to be a LONG 357 chamber in his Handi so we wanted to see how long. We took a 357 max brass and belled the end of the case slightly .we slid the case in until it met solid resistance at the end ? of the chamber marked the case and subtracted the distance from the rim to the breech face and came up with a chamber length of 1.45 .For safety sake and to allow the crimp to open fully we cut the brass to 1.42 and used max 296/360 DW loads with the 180 XTP . The gun shot much better and the loads performed quite well on deer. 
It is interesting when people look at he 357 Magnum and 35K SAAMI and case strength ? Well original WW loads for the S&W Mod 27 was loaded to >50K pressure. Was the brass stronger then than now ?
I don't know. The original 357 Max loads were 50K also but SAAMI has reduced the max pressure .
357 Mags are underloaded to  protect the K frame S&W's and other small frame 357's The max is the next step up and as useful as the 22LR over the 22 long and 22 short. Good round too bad it is a hand loader ,almost , only with brass that is hard to find and the 180 SSP bullet is not routinely avaliable. Yep I think there is a reason for it. 

[quickdtoo]

50k loads are likely just fine on an SB2 frame, but unknown on a cast iron frame, anyone advocating using high pressure loads on a cast iron frame should keep their thoughts private,  without pressure testing who knows what the actual pressure is? 

Tim