Author Topic: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??  (Read 1867 times)

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Offline Conan The Librarian

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"Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« on: September 10, 2012, 04:58:00 AM »
My son's a devout Catholic and is engaged. They are planning to use the "natural family planning" method, which sounds like a load of crap to me. He says the method is claimed to be "97.5% effective". So I pointed out that newlyweds typically have sex more than 100 times in a year, so what does that do for the probability of a pregnancy during the first year? I also said that each religion has a point at which it fails to serve its adherents, and this is one of them. I also recalled that when I was growing up we always knew who all of the American Catholic familes were because they had 5 to 12 kids.
 
I had some other thoughts, but didn't want to carry on too much about it, just point out a few obective facts.
 
My wife and I are Catholic and when we were going through our interviews with the priest prior to marriage, we raised the objection that we cannot agree with the church's position on birth control. In not so many words, said that the old idea was to go forth and populate the earth, and we did that. And he left it at that. Very tactful, I think, because it didn't compromise his duty to the church.
 
I would hate to see this couple burdened with a bunch of kids, especially since they are marrying young.

Offline guzzijohn

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2012, 05:06:25 AM »
I know of quite a few Catholic families that have 1-3 kids. I doubt that they are using natural birth control. I would guess the church likes lots of kids so that the churches still stay fairly full even with the drop outs. Birth control has to be the number one "Bent" rule with Catholics.
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2012, 05:08:08 AM »
Interestingly, I grew up in an area with a lot of non-American Roman Catholics, and it was unusual to see a family with more than two kids.

Offline m-g Willy

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2012, 07:36:24 AM »
I could never understand how someone would say they were one religion or the other when they didn't believe what that religion taught.
If catholic doctrine says it's wrong to use birth control.
But you don't agree with it. Are you really a catholic?
What about abortion?
The catholic church is against it.
But the Kennedy women that say they are catholics claim that abortion is ok!!
So if you are catholic,, do you have any rules,, or do you just pick and choose which you want to follow?
 

Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2012, 07:52:18 AM »
Picking and choosing definitely seems to be the way religion is practiced worldwide. And the religions seem to realize that. In Africa and Latin America the Catholics definitely tailor things to local beliefs.  It's largely a popularity contest anyway, and the different religions are competing for head count.
 
Those that don't pick and choose are considered orthodox, and tend to have a lot of disconnects from mainstream society, like special diets, etc.
 
The real purpose of religion is to get a tribe of like minded people together, bettering themselves in the process. Most of the rules are made up by ivory tower types who get a kick out of telling other people what to do.
 
Contraception is one good example. Abortifacients and contraceptives are as ancient as man, yet somebody says they are bad. Why? Because they want more Catholics, that's the only reason.

Offline Swampman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2012, 08:21:38 AM »
Natural Birth Control is a waste of time.  I wasted so much of my life on religion, I hate to see others do the same.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline powderman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2012, 09:19:48 AM »
I could never understand how someone would say they were one religion or the other when they didn't believe what that religion taught.
If catholic doctrine says it's wrong to use birth control.
But you don't agree with it. Are you really a catholic?
What about abortion?
The catholic church is against it.
But the Kennedy women that say they are catholics claim that abortion is ok!!
So if you are catholic,, do you have any rules,, or do you just pick and choose which you want to follow?

 
M-G WILLY. Good post Sir. POWDERMAN.  :o :o
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
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Offline Swampman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2012, 09:51:00 AM »
Some people just do what the Bible says, and it addresses neither abortion or birth control.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline blind ear

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2012, 11:59:47 AM »
Leads to a strong and growing sect. ear
Oath Keepers: start local
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An economic crash like the one of the 1920s is the only thing that will get the US off of the road to Socialism that we are on and give our children a chance at a future with freedom and possibility of economic success.
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everyone hears but very few see. (I can't see either, I'm not on the corporate board making rules that sound exactly the opposite of what they mean, plus loopholes) ear
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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2012, 12:24:10 PM »
I could never understand how someone would say they were one religion or the other when they didn't believe what that religion taught.
If catholic doctrine says it's wrong to use birth control.
But you don't agree with it. Are you really a catholic?
What about abortion?
The catholic church is against it.
But the Kennedy women that say they are catholics claim that abortion is ok!!
So if you are catholic,, do you have any rules,, or do you just pick and choose which you want to follow?
;D ;D
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Offline Curtis

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2012, 02:25:06 PM »
Some people just do what the Bible says, and it addresses neither abortion or birth control.

Yes it does.  It teaches that the power over life and death are God's dominion, not ours.
 
Curtis
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Offline Swampman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2012, 03:06:14 PM »
Odd thing to say presuming you hunt......
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline Curtis

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2012, 03:24:24 PM »
Odd thing to say presuming you hunt......

Touche'
 
Curtis
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2012, 12:34:32 AM »
Odd thing to say presuming you hunt......
in the garden of eden, God gave man dominion over all the animals.
then when peter fell asleep on the housetop, God showed peter all the animals in the world and told him to kill and eat.
Give me liberty, or give me death
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Offline Shu

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2012, 06:11:03 AM »
Why is it such a deal for a church to be in the bedroom of a husband and wife? The church needs to focus on supporting its community.

Offline Swampman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2012, 07:58:04 AM »
The Church needs to butt out.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline Stillkickin

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2012, 07:58:44 AM »
I wasted so much of my life on religion, I hate to see others do the same.
Those are words that, many times, fail to provide the comfort on one's deathbed as they appear to provide earlier in life.  It is confusing to me that those words are posted in conjunction with the bible quotes of your signature line.
Peace be with you, Brother.

Offline Swampman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2012, 09:45:52 AM »
Sounds like you're confusing religion and Christianity.  Religion is completely man made.  Christianity isn't.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~

Offline Capt. Augustus

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"Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2012, 11:06:31 AM »
Like I told my parish priest, still no check from the Vatican. He and I discussed this well after more kids were a worry.

Birth control like most things can be either used for right or wrong. Is it right to have so many children, that you cannot provide for them?  We fought this battle during the 60's and invented, "Don't ask, don't tell."


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Offline Cuts Crooked

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2012, 11:24:03 AM »
I wasted so much of my life on religion, I hate to see others do the same.
Those are words that, many times, fail to provide the comfort on one's deathbed as they appear to provide earlier in life.  It is confusing to me that those words are posted in conjunction with the bible quotes of your signature line.
Peace be with you, Brother.

Actually, given the second Biblical quote he uses, it makes perfect sense!
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Offline garbhead

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2012, 12:29:50 AM »
"When God Made Me"
               
 
 Was he thinking about my country
Or the color of my skin?
 
Was he thinking  about my religion
And the way I worshiped him?
 
Did he create just me in his image
Or every living thing?

When God made me

Was he planning only for believers
Or for those who just have faith?
Did he envision all the wars
That were fought in his name?
Did he say there was only one way
To be close to him?

When God made me

Did he give me the gift of love
To say who I could choose?

Did he give me the gift of voice
So some could silence me?
 
Did he give me the gift of vision
Not knowing what I might see?
 
Did he give me the gift of compassion
To help my fellow man?

When God made me

Words by Neil Young
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Offline ironglow

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2012, 12:42:10 AM »
Odd thing to say presuming you hunt......
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
 
  Swampy..  Do you realize the difference between killing an animal as compared to a human?  Since you hunt..then, by your own words, are we to assume that you would as easily kill a human as a rabbit?
  If that statement on killing is a sample of how you exegete scriptures..you better get back involved with a little country church somewhere near your house.
 
   As far as the RC method of birth control..not my business..  Besides, it beats killing our mistakes and selling the parts to laboratories.
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline Mikey

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2012, 01:07:10 AM »
Is the 'natural method' anything like the 'rhythm method', ya know, the one you use when neither you or the gal can keep a beat???

Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2012, 01:39:05 AM »
Yep, they just gave it the Hollywood treatment to make it more complex, like dependent on temperature to. Same old BS though.

Offline Swampman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2012, 03:23:53 AM »
A fetus is not a human until it takes the breath of life.  Nothing you can say will make that false.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline ironglow

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2012, 03:46:42 AM »
A fetus is not a human until it takes the breath of life.  Nothing you can say will make that false.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   I was speaking of all human life, compared to animal life.
 
  Since you bring it up though, here are some facts;
 
 1)  The child has his/her own fingerprints
 
 2)  The child has his/her own blood type.
 
 3)  The child has his/her own DNA.
 
 3)  The child does breathe.. amniotic fluid until exposed to air.
 
  ........What do you think the "fetus" is, if not a human?
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline powderman

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2012, 03:47:14 AM »
A fetus is not a human until it takes the breath of life.  Nothing you can say will make that false.

 
Not true. I reckon you forgot that God told Jeremiah, I knew ye before I formed thee in the womb. Have you given up reading the Bible too?? POWDERMAN.  ??? ???
Mr. Charles Glenn “Charlie” Nelson, age 73, of Payneville, KY passed away Thursday, October 14, 2021 at his residence. RIP Charlie, we'll will all miss you. GB

Only half the people leave an abortion clinic alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM
What part of ILLEGAL is so hard to understand???
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Offline guzzijohn

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2012, 03:48:59 AM »
Where is the munching popcorn icon when you need it. ;D
GuzziJohn

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #28 on: September 12, 2012, 03:54:02 AM »
A fetus is not a human until it takes the breath of life.  Nothing you can say will make that false.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   I was speaking of all human life, compared to animal life.
 
  Since you bring it up though, here are some facts;
 
 1)  The child has his/her own fingerprints
 
 2)  The child has his/her own blood type.
 
 3)  The child has his/her own DNA.
 
 3)  The child does breathe.. amniotic fluid until exposed to air.
 
  ........What do you think the "fetus" is, if not a human?
if swampman developed a lung disease and had to be put in a coma and have his lungs flooded with an oxygen rich fluid similar to amniotic fluid in the womb.  would he revert back to a blob of cells with no soul??  if so, he could be killed with no ramifications.
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Give me liberty, or give me death
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Offline ironglow

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Re: "Natural family planning", ie. the Catholic method??
« Reply #29 on: September 12, 2012, 03:58:52 AM »
Where is the munching popcorn icon when you need it. ;D
GuzziJohn
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
 
  Guzzi;
  Since you claim Christian connections..I do hope you are not making light of this holocaust which has taken 60,000,000 American lives alone.
 
   Some try to deny that these are human babies being murdered.. 
   
      What do those pictures look like below... a woodchuck or perhaps a Toyota?
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)