Author Topic: Romney dosen't want to win this election  (Read 2066 times)

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Offline guzzijohn

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Romney dosen't want to win this election
« on: September 18, 2012, 03:19:58 AM »
Lets see....Romney is a bit behind in most polls so he needs all the votes he can get yet he has just insulted about half the American people with his 47% comments. This guy NEEDS a teleprompter or maybe just a muzzle.
GuzziJohn

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2012, 03:29:41 AM »
I thought he sounded kinda Reaganesque.  you know, speaking the truth.
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Offline Swampman

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2012, 03:43:45 AM »
Lets see....Romney is a bit behind in most polls so he needs all the votes he can get yet he has just insulted about half the American people with his 47% comments. This guy NEEDS a teleprompter or maybe just a muzzle.
GuzziJohn

All he did was tell the truth, I think 47% is too low.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline EastKY_DO

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2012, 03:51:28 AM »
Well, like he said, the freeloaders aren't going to vote for him anyway.  Call a spade a spade.  Biting truth is much more refreshing than the dishonest doublespeak most politicians are spewing. >:(
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Offline billy_56081

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2012, 03:53:21 AM »
We will see in November. I had a little talk with my nephew. He is a student in Iowa, he will vote Romney there instead of MN. 
99% of all Lawyers give the other 1% a bad name. What I find hilarious about this is they are such an arrogant bunch, that they all think they are in the 1%.

Offline guzzijohn

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2012, 03:56:34 AM »
Okay, I guess he does not need any of "those" votes. I am glad my mother is too senile at 98 years old so that she was not insulted by Romney since she has not had to pay income taxes for about the last 15 years due to low income. Guess she is a parasite along with many other elderly that no longer pay taxes but worked their butts off most of their lives and paid taxes. Well you say Romney wasn't talking about them. Well, they are included in that 47% figure. Obama's reelection is about sewed up.
GuzziJohn

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2012, 04:30:38 AM »
Okay, I guess he does not need any of "those" votes. I am glad my mother is too senile at 98 years old so that she was not insulted by Romney since she has not had to pay income taxes for about the last 15 years due to low income. Guess she is a parasite along with many other elderly that no longer pay taxes but worked their butts off most of their lives and paid taxes. Well you say Romney wasn't talking about them. Well, they are included in that 47% figure. Obama's reelection is about sewed up.
GuzziJohn
typical liberal spin.  the only people who would include your dear momma in the parasite column is a liberal who is trying make conservatives look bad.
tell us some more big-uns.
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Offline Swampman

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2012, 04:31:18 AM »
The elderly vote for Obama because they want free stuff.  There is no question about that.  The 47% are bought votes using my money.
"Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?" Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca

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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2012, 04:34:09 AM »
The elderly vote for Obama because they want free stuff.  There is no question about that.  The 47% are bought votes using my money.
I'm elderly and I'd rather have my hand cut off than use it to vote for hussein.
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2012, 04:34:57 AM »
keep in mind while liberals are being polled consertives are working  ;) .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2012, 04:46:21 AM »
47% Do not PAY income tax.  That is a FACT.  45 million are on food stamps.  25 million are unemployed or UNDER employed.  50% of college students can't find jobs.  Green jobs are a joke.  It costs more energy for some green jobs than you get out of it, thus it costs more.  Mining, drilling, pipeline construction will cut the unemployment about 1%.  Removing excessive regulations on small business could cut another 1% of unemployment.  Simple solutions that Obama doesn't want to do.  There is no utopia, there never was, there never will be in this life.  Obama's pie in the sky green jobs, and the government taking care of more people will not last.  We are headed over the clift to bankrupcy.  There is no one in the world to bail us out.  Romney being a business man and having executive experience brings more experience to the White House than Obama's elitism.  They are now having a dramatic increase in disability numbers so he can get more on the government dole.  I know a guy who worked in construction.  He fell out of a tree stand and broke his back.  He chose unemployment even though my company offered him a dispatch job and offered to train him.  Dispatch pays $25 an hour here with full medical and dental benefits.  I think if a job is offered to someone who can qualify for disability, they should be required to take it in leu of a government check.  It would be cheaper to pay for a 2 year trade or community college degree for a disabled person to get a job, than pay disability forever.  This guy was about 35-40.  20 years of disability at $1,500 a month vs paying taxes after a couple of year of training.  Stupid waste of taxpayer dollars. 
 
Something else, you guys know that seeds and I think fertilizer can be paid for with food stamps.  People could actually grow some of their own food.  This should be manditory.  My grandmother worked a garden until she was 87.  Some people can't and I know that, but there are a lot of people on the dole who shouldn't be there. 
 
Government is the problem, not the solution. 

Offline mechanic

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2012, 05:48:08 AM »
Romney missed it.  The real number is 49%.
 
Ben
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Offline streak

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2012, 06:19:02 AM »
You can probably lay most of the blame on the " Great Society" program started by " LBJ"!! Every since this program was activated the numbers have grown
with more people getting on the government dole. Generations of these people on the dole are now reproducing more generations which will follow the same scenario! Most of them have no concept of what will happen in a few years when all of the money starts to decline to support all of these programs! Yes there will be alot of wailing and knashing of teeth and hand wringing when the funds run out! But they have only themselves and the government to blame!!
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Offline two-blocked

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2012, 06:30:38 AM »
GOP Hypocrisy on the 47% That Doesn't Pay Taxes
  You might have heard, if you've been watching cable news at any point in the last 72 hours, that 47 percent of Americans will not owe income taxes this year. Conservatives argue that this is just one more way the economy is slipping into a social-egalitarian morass in which more Americans live off the productivity of the few elite who are actually busy putting the capital into capitalism. But if the 47% figure is a monster, it is also a monster that Republicans have helped to create.

To understand why that's true, it's important to understand why half of Americans aren't paying federal income taxes. Most of them receive generous tax credits -- the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC), child-care credits, subsidies for college and savings -- worth more than their tax burden, according to the Tax Policy Center.

When Republicans rail against the 47% figure, they're railing against features like the EITC.  What is the EITC? It's a refundable tax credit that rewards work and offsets the burden of payroll taxes for low-income payers by returning a fixed percent of income up to a maximum credit based on factors like number of children. But the EITC is a Republican creation. It was enacted in 1975 under President Ford (a Republican), and expanded numerous times over the last 35 years by Republicans. President Reagan (Republican) expanded it in 1984 and 1986. President Bush (Republican) expanded it against in 1990 and added supplemental credit for families with more than one child. President Clinton expanded it for childless claimants in 1993. President Bush (Republican) expanded it again in 2001.

Today this $50 billion program is one of the largest component of our welfare system. But rather than appear on the budget (or in the news) as a spending program, it appears as tax relief, and the headline we see is "How the Other Half Lives: No Federal Taxes!" Do you see what's happening here? Both moderate and conservative pols are reluctant to announce new spending programs for fear they will look like socialists. So they execute spending programs through the tax system. As a result, more and more Americans appear to be paying no federal taxes!

This is not to say that Republicans were wrong to expand tax credits for low- and middle-income families. On the contrary, wages have grown painfully slowly for many Americans since the 1970s while payroll taxes have crept higher. The EITC is an easy way to mitigate the burden of payroll taxes for low-income Americans while rewarding work. Rather, Republicans are in the strange position of having eroded the tax base with credits for decades, and now they're complaining that not enough Americans are paying taxes.

America's political/entertainment climate has scared politicians from announcing welfare programs as spending programs. So instead, many of them appear in the budget as tax relief. One inevitable result is that fewer Americans today appear to be paying taxes.
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/04/gop-hypocrisy-on-the-47-that-doesnt-pay-taxes/38919/

Offline two-blocked

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2012, 06:34:47 AM »
Who Doesn’t Pay Federal Income Taxes (Legally) By BRUCE BARTLETTToday's EconomistBruce Bartlett held senior policy roles in the Reagan and George H.W. Bush administrations and served on the staffs of Representatives Jack Kemp  and Ron Paul.
Conservatives are fond of railing against those who are able to legally avoid paying federal income taxes. The Wall Street Journal routinely refers to them as “lucky duckies.”
Senator Orrin Hatch of Utah, the ranking Republican on the Senate Finance Committee, recently asserted that it was appalling that about half of all those who file federal income tax returns pay nothing and said this was proof that income taxes must not be raised to reduce the deficit, because the burden would necessarily fall on just half of households.
But the growth of the non-income-taxpaying population is largely a result of Republican tax policies. The earned-income tax credit is the main reason those with low incomes are largely exempted from federal income taxes. Originated by Gerald Ford, it was expanded by both Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush as a better way to help the working poor than raising the minimum wage, which they believed would increase unemployment.
According to the Tax Foundation, in 1974, before the earned-income tax credit was instituted, 19.2 percent of tax filers had no federal income tax liability. This rose to 25.2 percent in 1975 when the credit took effect.
During the 1990s, about 24 percent of filers had no income tax liability, but this number took a big jump during the George W. Bush administration as Republicans added a large child credit to the tax code. The percentage of filers with no income tax liability rose to 36.3 percent in 2008, from 25.2 percent in 2000.
 
 According to new data from the Tax Policy Center, this year 46.4 percent of tax filers will have no federal income tax liability. The following table presents the data.Tax Policy CenterAs one can see, almost all of those in the bottom income quintile — those with incomes below $16,812 — will have no federal income tax liability this year. About three-fifths of those in the second income quintile will also have no liability, 30 percent of those in the middle quintile, and 7.3 percent of those in the fourth quintile. It is not only the poor who are exempt from federal income taxation; substantial numbers of households in the middle class are also exempted.
Surprisingly, a not insignificant number of those who are clearly well off are also among the “lucky duckies.” There are 78,000 tax filers with incomes of $211,000 to $533,000 who will pay no federal income taxes this year. Even more amazingly, there are 24,000 households with incomes of $533,000 to $2.2 million with zero income tax liability, and 3,000 tax filers with incomes above $2.2 million with the same federal income tax liability as most of those with incomes barely above the poverty level.
It is not because of the earned-income tax credit or the child credit that the ultra-wealthy are paying no federal income taxes.
One reason, undoubtedly, is that capital gains are a huge percentage of their income and they may have losses from previous years to offset any realized gains this year. Perhaps some chose to invest all their wealth in tax-free municipal bonds.
And, of course, a large industry of tax lawyers make their living advising the wealthy on how to minimize their tax liability by exploiting existing provisions of the tax law.
These data look only at legal tax avoidance; they do not account for illegal tax evasion, which is quite extensive, especially at the top and the bottom of the income distribution. Those in the middle class who have only wage income are much more limited in their opportunities for evasion.
The phenomenon of large numbers of non-federal income tax payers has long been a subject of debate. Those on the left emphasize that other taxes, such as payroll taxes, are paid by those with no income tax liability, a point I discussed last week. Those on the right often complain that it is fundamentally undemocratic for such a large percentage of the population to pay nothing to offset the federal government’s general operations. After all, everyone benefits from national military spending and other federal programs.
Perhaps the right and left can at least agree that it is unseemly for those in the top 1 percent of income distribution, with incomes at least 10 times the median income, to pay no federal income taxes. It’s not socialism to ask them to pay something.
 
http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/06/28/who-doesnt-pay-federal-income-taxes-legally/

Offline two-blocked

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2012, 06:41:08 AM »
The Data Behind Romney’s 47% Comments
 
In his comments to fundraisers captured on video, Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney said 47% of Americans would almost automatically vote for President Barack Obama because they were “dependent” on the government, in part because they received government benefits and paid no federal income taxes.
In a press conference late Monday, Mr. Romney said his comments were “not elegantly stated” while at the same time reiterating the main point. Our translation: If you don’t pay federal income taxes, you may not be swayed by a candidate that wants to cut them.
Here’s a rundown of the data behind Mr. Romney’s argument, some of which he correctly stated and other parts of which don’t hold up so well.
Entitlements:
According to the Census Bureau, 49% of Americans in the second quarter of 2011 lived in a household where at least one member received a government benefit. (The total population at the time was 305 million).
That’s up from 30% in the 1980s and 44.4% in the third quarter of 2008, a recent growth in part attributable to the bad economy of President Obama’s first term.
The Census Bureau broke the data down like this:
  • 26.4% of U.S. households had someone enrolled in Medicaid (the health-care program for low-income Americans)
  • 16.2% of households had at least one member receiving Social Security.
  • 15.8% lived in a household receiving food stamps
  • 14.9% had a member with Medicare benefits
  • 4.5% of households received assistance with their rent
  • 1.7% had a member receiving unemployment benefits.
The large majority of Medicare and Social Security recipients have paid payroll taxes in many cases for decades to qualify for those benefits.
There can be a lot of overlap in which programs benefit certain households. For example, millions of people receiving Social Security benefits also receive Medicare health benefits. Many Americans covered by Medicaid are also receiving food stamp benefits.
Mr. Romney implied that anyone receiving government benefits wouldn’t likely be one of his voters. But there’s no clear partisan split among beneficiaries, especially for broad-based federal retirement and health-care programs.
Taxes:
Mr. Romney correctly noted that nearly half of Americans pay no federal income tax. Who are all these people? And how did we get here?
Here’s a quick answer. Roughly half of U.S. households that pay no federal income tax are exempted because of basic provisions such as limitations on tax for low-income earners, according to a 2011 study by the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center. The other half benefit from targeted breaks (known to tax geeks as “tax expenditures”), such as assistance for the working poor and for children in moderate-income families. Seniors also benefit from some of these targeted breaks.
To analyze which breaks are most important in moving people off the income-tax rolls, the TPC study arranged these tax expenditures into eight categories:
  • Elderly tax benefits (the extra standard deduction for the elderly, the exclusion of a portion of Social Security benefits, and the credit for the elderly);
  • Credits for children and the working poor (the child tax credit, the child and dependent care tax credit, and the Earned Income Tax Credit);
  • Exclusion of other cash transfers (such as welfare and disability payments);
  • Tax-exempt interest and some other deductions, such as for retirement savings;
  • Itemized deductions;
  • Education credits;
  • Other credits; and
  • Reduced rates on capital gains and dividends (zero rate on gains and dividends that would otherwise be taxed at 10% or 15%, 15% rate combined with credits).
The TPC found that of the 38 million households that are made nontaxable by tax expenditures, “44% are moved off the tax rolls by elderly tax benefits and another 30% by credits for children and the working poor.”
So how did we get to the point where almost half of American households pay no income tax? Since the 1970s, Congress and successive presidents have begun creating more and more tax breaks to benefit broad swaths of the population (and some very narrow gauges too). Democrats generally have been more supportive of the particular breaks that push people off the income-tax rolls, but Republicans have supported a few too, and they also have pushed breaks that benefit higher-income people.
The basic exemptions for very low-income people have been around for a while and are pretty non-controversial. Many of the breaks that benefit the elderly also have been supported by members of both parties, who realize older Americans are among the most consistent voters. Breaks for military personnel – such as the exemption for combat pay – also are widely popular.
The real partisan division has come over the growing number of other breaks, particularly those for children and for the working poor. Democrats in the 1970s pushed through the first and still arguably the most important of these, the Earned Income Tax Credit. Essentially, it’s an income supplement for the working poor, and can provide several thousand dollars in extra cash each year for a typical eligible family.
Over the years it’s been significantly expanded, most recently in the 2009 stimulus bill. While Republicans generally have been supportive of the EITC in practice, they have opposed several of the expansions and also are concerned about relatively high levels of erroneous payments under the highly complex EITC rules.
Conservatives tend to focus on the number of people not paying federal income taxes to make a case about the state of American democracy. For example: If half the country has no financial stake in decisions made in Washington, they’ll inevitably end up supporting expensive federal policies. And the burden will fall on everyone else. (That tends to overlook the fact that nearly two-thirds of households that paid no income tax still paid payroll tax, according to the Tax Policy Center.)
Republicans, however, did help push through another big break—the child credit. It’s been aimed at helping moderate-income families, including one-earner couples, afford to have kids. Like the EITC, it’s a “refundable” credit – meaning that it is paid to eligible taxpayers even when their tax liability has been erased. Democrats have pushed to make it more broadly available to lower-income people, often over GOP objections.
 
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2012/09/18/the-data-behind-romneys-47-comments/

Offline two-blocked

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2012, 06:44:24 AM »

Offline nomosendero

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2012, 05:11:09 PM »
Lets see....Romney is a bit behind in most polls so he needs all the votes he can get yet he has just insulted about half the American people with his 47% comments. This guy NEEDS a teleprompter or maybe just a muzzle.
GuzziJohn

Probably not intentional on your part, but he did not suddenly make the statement to get behind. He said this months ago, the Lib dirtbags were holding this to use at the right moment. So your post is based on a false premise.
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Offline gypsyman

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2012, 06:20:48 PM »
Why do some of you worry about how much some pay in tax's?? If they don't pay any tax, but don't collect any benifits, it's a break even. At least they're not sucking off the teat of govt. It's the spending stupid!!. Millions in foreign aid, millions in govt. agency's that are worthless. Benifits to govt. workers, way over what a person might get if in the private sector. How much did M.Obama and family spend on airfare,N.Polosi, H.Reid. Farm subsidies to major ag corporation's. Bridge's to nowhere. Military spending $800 for a toilet seat. $90 or so for a hammer. How much is the United Nations costing us??  The list goes on. With the billions that go into this govt right now, if spending was where it should be, we wouldn't be in nearly as bad a shape. Will Romney help, just slow the car down alittle before going over the cliff. gypsyman
We keep trying peace, it usually doesn't work!!Remember(12/7/41)(9/11/01) gypsyman

Offline srussell

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2012, 03:09:26 AM »
i found it odd that he was secretly taped.sounds like another leftest ploy

Offline magooch

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #20 on: September 19, 2012, 04:03:03 AM »
I'm still opposed to any American over the age of 18 getting out of paying some income tax--even if it is only a piddling amount.  If you don't pay, you shouldn't be allowed to vote.  Everyone 18 and older and even some yutes should have to file an income tax return.  That's not because I enjoy that task, but I believe the misery should be shared by all and maybe, just maybe someday it will be simplified and made more fair.
The more salient point is that our system cannot be sustained as it now is comprised.  Romney knows that; Obama either doesn't understand that, or doesn't care.  So "wailing conservatives" are just giving voice to what is going to slam us all in the face.  The country is bankrupt and the liberals and ignorant masses are stuck on stupid thinking that all we have to do is tax the rich.  The rich being anyone who has a couple of bucks saved up.  The numbers just don't compute and the only way to fix it is to cut spending to the bone.
Swingem

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2012, 04:26:14 AM »
I'm still opposed to any American over the age of 18 getting out of paying some income tax--even if it is only a piddling amount.  If you don't pay, you shouldn't be allowed to vote.  Everyone 18 and older and even some yutes should have to file an income tax return.  That's not because I enjoy that task, but I believe the misery should be shared by all and maybe, just maybe someday it will be simplified and made more fair.
The more salient point is that our system cannot be sustained as it now is comprised.  Romney knows that; Obama either doesn't understand that, or doesn't care.  So "wailing conservatives" are just giving voice to what is going to slam us all in the face.  The country is bankrupt and the liberals and ignorant masses are stuck on stupid thinking that all we have to do is tax the rich.  The rich being anyone who has a couple of bucks saved up.  The numbers just don't compute and the only way to fix it is to cut spending to the bone.
that makes too much sense to work in our political environment.  unless we come up with a way to eliminate all liberals.
Give me liberty, or give me death
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Give me liberty, or give me death
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Offline ironglow

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2012, 04:38:26 AM »
After all the blather, it boils down to one question..what do you want?
  Do we want free enterprise as represented by Romney?  Or do we want communism as represented by Obama?
   In 1998, obama endorsed "wealth redistribution"..  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_4V-LWByFI
  In 2008 he reassured the world he wanted to put his plan into effect:
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtYMcMYvW9Q
 
   Communism?  ...you ask..
   One of the primary focuses of Marxism/communism (by Karl Marx, 1875) is:
  " From each, according to his ability..to each, according to his need."  Sound familiar?
 
     How much of your weekly paycheck should be handed to the guy across town who would rather avoid working and sell drugs from his porch?
  How about the guy who does work..but collects from "under the table" and still pulls down a welfare check?
   Perhaps the drug dealer already makes more money on some days.. than you make in a week... ;)
If you don't want the truth, don't ask me.  If you want something sugar coated...go eat a donut !  (anon)

Offline magooch

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #23 on: September 19, 2012, 05:00:52 AM »
Ironglow, you've just made the case for basing federal revenue on a sales tax rather than income tax.  However, I would caution that tweaking a sales tax upward is a well known and practiced prescription.  So the sales tax in my opinion is not the final solution.
Swingem

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #24 on: September 19, 2012, 05:18:20 AM »
Ironglow, you've just made the case for basing federal revenue on a sales tax rather than income tax.  However, I would caution that tweaking a sales tax upward is a well known and practiced prescription.  So the sales tax in my opinion is not the final solution.
would a constitutional amendment forcing a public vote on ANY tax increase work in this case??
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #25 on: September 19, 2012, 05:57:58 AM »
Better to allow those who own property or pay taxes to vote  ;)  like back in the day the country was founded .
If ya can see it ya can hit it !

Offline streak

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2012, 06:37:28 AM »
Better to allow those who own property or pay taxes to vote  ;)  like back in the day the country was founded .
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Offline ironglow

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #27 on: September 19, 2012, 06:43:11 AM »
Better to allow those who own property or pay taxes to vote  ;)  like back in the day the country was founded .
BINGO!!
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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2012, 07:14:50 AM »
47% not paying taxes? That sounds like the pot calling the Kettle black. I wonder why ol Mitt had most of his money in off shore accounts? :o

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Re: Romney dosen't want to win this election
« Reply #29 on: September 19, 2012, 07:53:01 AM »
47% not paying taxes? That sounds like the pot calling the Kettle black. I wonder why ol Mitt had most of his money in off shore accounts? :o
Long ago it was determined in federal court that a citizen could conduct his business in a way to minimise his tax debt. I would suggest that's why .
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