Fired for refusing to wear "666" sticker

[keith44]

Figuratively, not literally.
Many years ago my first real job was working for a steel erector. My idols used the expression all the time and it stuck.

I had to ask, 'cause we have hung that moniker on a guy at work.  Upper limit failed on a 100 ton over head...60 ton load missed a guy on a scooter by 6 feet.

[nw_hunter]

There may be more to the story; there may not be.  Nobody should be forced to wear a sticker that goes against their religion.  Still, the company has a right to fire who they want.  Honestly, it sounds like a place I wouldn't work at anyways.  Hope the guy finds a better job out of all of this.

I agree!As Paul Harvey use to say (Rest his soul) We need to hear "The rest of the story"
BTW! Welcome to the forum, and I just got to know......From the avatar, Are you really Robert D.?

[BBF]

Safety nazis !!! ROFLMBO!  So there are actually good nazis, whodathunckeddat.

[keith44]

Safety nazis !!! ROFLMBO!  So there are actually good nazis, whodathunckeddat.

never said they were good, I've seen people fired for walking through a gate in a walkway and not ensuring it closed behind them (it's a simple bar on a post with the hinge set at an angle so gravity should pull it closed)


and yes that was the only thing in their file

[KNIFE_NUT_1981]

I can see both sides of the argument here. As the employer: Do what I say, or you don't have a job. As the employee: You can't make me do anything I don't want to do, especially something that is against my beliefs as a Christian, even if it means me losing my job. Either way, too many people are filing lawsuits for foolish reasons. Lawsuits are the root cause for many of this country's shortfalls, and suing over something like this is foolish! Why not take the same amount of time it takes to file the lawsuit and follow up on it in court, and apply that toward looking for a better job, and come out ahead in the long run? Sounds to me like he's just trying to get out of work, and likely, not well liked by his supervisors for similar behavior in the past. If that weren't the case, and he was a good employee and dedicated to his job, he probably would've still had a job after returning from his 3 day suspension... Just my opinion.

[BBF]

I've got fired from a job when the entire family except one young lad was down with a massive case of flu that was so severe nobody could even get out of bed much less to work.
 
Sometime later I heard from a neighbor who was working in the same place that he was told I should apply to work there again and they would hire me back and that my termination was just to let me know I can't be to sick to work.
 
I didn't bother to go back !!

[Dee]

As I said before, I think there is probably more to this than the fire-ee is reporting. Employment is a funny thing. Being a former owner of two businesses, one very successful, and the second killed by the housing market crash, I understand what makes one (business) tick.
BBF's firing from his job was unfortunate for he, and his family, but I would be more interested in an explanation from the boss, than I would BBF's friend. It may have been for a far different reason than what BBF was told.
If I'm running a business and it's success is dependent on BBF's attendance and for what ever reason he can't be there for multiple days, I may have to make an employment move to make my business work, and survive. Unfortunate for BBF, but there are others also dependent on that position being filled immediately.
This 666 deal is a little suspicious, and not knowing the "alleged victim" or the "company", it is hard to make a judgement on a very one sided story.jmtc

[keith44]

Dee,
IMO no one employee should be so critical to the success of a business that sick days cannot be absorbed.  (the exceptions to this being the owner, and site managers)


Everyone else should be replaceable, inconvenient sure, but not that critical.

[keith44]

I've got fired from a job when the entire family except one young lad was down with a massive case of flu that was so severe nobody could even get out of bed much less to work.
 
Sometime later I heard from a neighbor who was working in the same place that he was told I should apply to work there again and they would hire me back and that my termination was just to let me know I can't be to sick to work.
 
I didn't bother to go back !!

I've seen several attendance policies from several different employers, none that allow the firing of an employee who is under a doctors care. 

[Dee]

Dee,
IMO no one employee should be so critical to the success of a business that sick days cannot be absorbed.  (the exceptions to this being the owner, and site managers)


Everyone else should be replaceable, inconvenient sure, but not that critical.

keith, you or I do not know what the attendance rate is. Some companies such as the one I work for does not have sick days. You don't work, you don't get paid. Sick days are a "courtesy" of the employer, not a given.
If you have a small construction company with say 10 employees, and only one is trained and qualified to run a backhoe, he can shut a project down if he doesn't show up. The real world would not agree with your synopsis. There are many instances where one person is critical of the operation running smoothly.

[keith44]

running smoothly sure, running or not due to one person??  I would not have it so tight. A back hoe operator (a really good one) should (again My OPINION) have a person he is training.  On a 10 man crew if one is out sick yes it hurts the project, but should not hurt the company.  Temp agencies are plentiful. 


"Sick days" are a fact of life, everyone gets sick, paid sick days...those are rare in my world.

[Dee]

I don't think we're that far apart keith, but small companies hire what they can, and can't usually afford more than one "premium operator" on some jobs. Construction is just one example. I see a lot of paving crews where I deliver, and trust me. Not very many there can operate the machinery side of it.
Small machine shops are but another example. There are instances where "the best" is off for one reason or another, and the project shuts down.

[Gus McCrae]

BTW! Welcome to the forum, and I just got to know......From the avatar, Are you really Robert D.?

Lol.  No!  I'm Gus McCrae!  I did see Blue Duck is on the board too.  Y'all should steer clear of him.  I've been chasin' him. He stole a woman and I'm tryin to get her back.

[45-70.gov]

what is the big  issue


both men decided the princable is more important than the  job

[Cuts Crooked]

Hyatt said he accepted the three-day suspension, but when he returned to work on March 17 he was fired.
He filed a complaint with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, and his attorney, Stephen Mixon, told the Associated Press that the agency granted him the right to sue the company in August.
The company did not return calls and emails seeking comment, and has not responded yet in court.

This has me puzzled. I'm thinking there is more too it than is stated in the article too, because ....he was already punished and then they fired him. If it is exactly as presented, he will win his suit if based on the above and if it if is factual. However, if he continued to be insubordinant upon returning to work, that' a whole 'nuther kettle of fish.

[magooch]

I don't know if it was mentioned whether, or not the subject was a union member, or not.  And the fact is it might not make any difference at all if the case were taken to the last step.
 
I've seen cases where workers were fired for flimsy reasons and got taken to an NLRB (National Labor Relations Board) hearing, only to be tossed out with the ruling that any employee can be fired at any time for no reason at all.  It might make a difference which regime is in power at the time, but probably not unless it became a big news item.  Some states might have rules that have some bearing on it, but in the end, the employer always has to have the right to determine who he will employ.  In truth, even now days with a lot of unemployed people, it is very difficult to find qualified workers who can be relied on to do the job right.  When you do find one, you're not likely to let them go without very good cause.

[keith44]

I don't think we're that far apart keith, but small companies hire what they can, and can't usually afford more than one "premium operator" on some jobs. Construction is just one example. I see a lot of paving crews where I deliver, and trust me. Not very many there can operate the machinery side of it.
Small machine shops are but another example. There are instances where "the best" is off for one reason or another, and the project shuts down.

No not far apart at all, and yes when the best XXXX'er is off all work centers/projects suffer.  My only point is it should not be critical to the company, even a small one needs to have a back up plan for absences.

[45-70.gov]

i  am a land lord


and when people try to tell me  ''what the law is''


i give then a 3 day eviction notice  and explain to them   how many times i have done this


no tenant  knows the law...unless they have already had a brush with it
and will be an ongoing problem....so  i replace them ASAP


if  i had  employees  i would handle them in the same or similar way


problem people are a dime a dozen
we   have to bend over backwards to keep the good ones
turn  over  is how  i find the good ones

[keith44]

problem people are a dime a dozen
we   have to bend over backwards to keep the good ones
turn  over  is how  i find the good ones

100% YES!!!

[SHOOTALL]

running smoothly sure, running or not due to one person??  I would not have it so tight. A back hoe operator (a really good one) should (again My OPINION) have a person he is training.  On a 10 man crew if one is out sick yes it hurts the project, but should not hurt the company.  Temp agencies are plentiful. 


"Sick days" are a fact of life, everyone gets sick, paid sick days...those are rare in my world.

Training cost $$$$$$$$$ something the market dosen't allow these days in construction in some areas. Temp agencies are infact plentiful. But would you hire an operator from one to dig next to say a fiber optic line that if disrupted could put you out of business ?

[BBF]

I've had one or two occasions when I was asked to train someone else...............................only to find out this person was a friend or drinking buddy of the owner's son and the trainee was getting my job.
 
One of the "benefits" for working non-union.

[SHOOTALL]

People who are not in a trade often ask why tradesmen are so hard on new guys . I always reply because we are teaching them to take our jobs. So they need to prove worthy .

[Sourdough]

the Boss was probably looking for an excuse to fire the guy anyway.  This provided the means.  End os story as far as the Boss is concerned.

[Curtis]

People who are not in a trade often ask why tradesmen are so hard on new guys . I always reply because we are teaching them to take our jobs. So they need to prove worthy .

"Grasshopper.  Snatch the pebble from my hand and it will be time for ME to leave!"  LOL
Curtis

[SHOOTALL]

People who are not in a trade often ask why tradesmen are so hard on new guys . I always reply because we are teaching them to take our jobs. So they need to prove worthy .

"Grasshopper.  Snatch the pebble from my hand and it will be time for ME to leave!"  LOL
Curtis

I guess we feel the need to make sure the trade is filled with quality as much as possible. If you got to see the help that applies that can't read a ruler, do basic math , come in on time , work OT as needed, refrain from drug use or excessive drinking , etc. You would understand the statement better. Trust me we need the help , well aleast before the last few years..........

[Curtis]

Shootall I understand completely, I was just trying to be humorous.  In the early 80s I served a four year electrical apprenticeship in the IBEW.  I sometimes suffered under the stern hand of some of the "old school" Journeymen.  Some were just plain mean, but the majority believed they were building our character and giving us the thick skin we would need in order to thrive.  There were some great mentors among them.
 
I left the IBEW in 1987 when the oil money dried up and construction virtually ceased in DFW.  Since then I've worked in manufacturing in a maintenance role, and for the last eighteen years my focus has been industrial automation and instrumentation.  It is now time for me to mentor the young talent coming up, but for about the last ten years or so qualified people have been very hard to come by.  Now companies will start to lure each other's talent away since they can't fill openings with qualified applicants from the street.  My fear is that my company will stick their head in the sand like they have with so many other issues.  Instead of grooming someone to take over when I leave, I will face a revolving door of mediocre trainees for the last ten years of my career.  Of course all maintenance may be outsourced by then, so trying to hand my skills down while hoping they will continue to benifit my company could be a moot point.
 
Curtis

[SHOOTALL]

I see the same thing here in construction.

[45-70.gov]

Shootall I understand completely, I was just trying to be humorous.  In the early 80s I served a four year electrical apprenticeship in the IBEW.  I sometimes suffered under the stern hand of some of the "old school" Journeymen.  Some were just plain mean, but the majority believed they were building our character and giving us the thick skin we would need in order to thrive.  There were some great mentors among them.
 
I left the IBEW in 1987 when the oil money dried up and construction virtually ceased in DFW.  Since then I've worked in manufacturing in a maintenance role, and for the last eighteen years my focus has been industrial automation and instrumentation.  It is now time for me to mentor the young talent coming up, but for about the last ten years or so qualified people have been very hard to come by.  Now companies will start to lure each other's talent away since they can't fill openings with qualified applicants from the street.  My fear is that my company will stick their head in the sand like they have with so many other issues.  Instead of grooming someone to take over when I leave, I will face a revolving door of mediocre trainees for the last ten years of my career.  Of course all maintenance may be outsourced by then, so trying to hand my skills down while hoping they will continue to benifit my company could be a moot point.
 
Curtis

i left the carpenter union after 12 years  for  SUPPORTING DEMOCRATS


I WENT ONTO MY FIRST UNION JOB AS A FORMAN....NO APPRENTICESHIP