Author Topic: 445 supermag ?  (Read 1681 times)

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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« on: February 11, 2004, 10:46:36 AM »
Can the 44 mag be hand ream to 445 supermag or is it a lathe job. I assume it is a hand job like the 357 mag to 357 max. Next ?. Can you still shoot 44 mag thru it occasionally. Has anybody seen caseing for the 445. I have a Natchez book and they do not list them. (Going to have to get me a Midway catalog) The only reloading dies I seen were made by Lyman and they list the 44 mag as the same part #. So again I am assuming you can use any 44 mag dies to load the 445.

BBF
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Offline 22KHornet

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2004, 11:18:45 AM »
Ohhhh nice one.  Not sure on the machineing but you can shoot a 44mag through a supermag.  I shot a custom 357max blachawk that had been redone to the supermag and basically it is like the max, just a longer case over the 44mag.           :biggun:  :biggun:  :biggun:
I must be crazy.

Offline perklo

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445 Supermag
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2004, 11:44:38 AM »
Starline makes .445 Brass, and it (sometimes) is available through Midway.

www.starlinebrass.com/

www.midwayusa.com

- perklo

Offline JPH45

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2004, 03:01:38 PM »
Yes, rechambering a 44 Mag Handi to a 445 Super Mag chamber without a lathe is very doable. Note that the Super Mag probably operates at a higher presure than the Mag does, adding case volume alone rarely increases velocity by as much as 20%, which is what some 445 Super loads are doing. this is ok, H&R once chambered thHandi in 444 Marlin, and the 44 Mag has a case diameter very similar to the 30-06/308 family. Presure is not a problem.  But also note that there is nothing in a Handi that the 445 Super Mag offers that cannot be achieved with the 444 Marlin and starting loads for the same, and brass is much cheaper. Starline is the only supplier of 445 brass and it starts at $32.00 for 50. A bit pricey for what could be considered 44 Mag basic brass.

My solution to more big bore performance from a Handi was to simply get a 45-70 Handi. This chambering is capable of giving 44 Magnum heavy bullet performance(300 grain at 1200 fps and better), 454 Casuell and 475 Linebaugh performance (400 grain at 1400 fps and better), and 45-110 performance (500 grain at 1600 fps). I looked at different chamberings, paper stats, etc. for a year, and finally decided on the 45-70 simply because there is more component availability and cost effectiveness than with any other big bore chambering that can be readily stuffed into a Handi out there. Your choice, but I would not choose a 445 Super Mag. over a 45-70. The latter just simply offers too much potential at half or less the cost. The 44 mag Handi remains a great rifle with a definte niche, but a rechambering to the 445 SM would be a step backwards.
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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2004, 01:56:35 AM »
Thanks for the replies and advice. I would like to ream a 44 to something. Maybe the 444 marlin is a better choice. It's not a matter of pushing big bullets. I have a 450 marlin and it will push anything I would want to shoot. JPH45 I have been thinking of a 45-70 for some time even though I have a 450. I might just get a 45-70 barrel when I send my 30-30 receiver back for the 38-55 barrel.-----Thats what I could do. Send in for a 45-70 barrel $82.00 / 38-55 barrel $103.00 (Total  $185.00) Huh, cheaper than buying another gun. Thanks guys. By the way Perklo added those sights to my favorites list. :agree:

BBF
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Offline JPH45

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2004, 01:48:18 PM »
BBF, Spend the $82.00 on molds, bullets, brass, powder, primers,  anything but a 45-70 barrel. You have that already. The 450 will use ANYTHING made for the 45-70, and will easily and readily handle any loading from 45-70 Class 2 data. I would suggest laying in a store of brass, but these days Hornady seems to be hanging in there with ammo and brass for all the ammo they have made, no matter if the chambering is defunct, witness 32 H&R Magnum...You have as good a 45-70 as has ever been made, just uses a different name.
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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2004, 02:24:50 AM »
You make a good point JPH45. I diffently am getting the 38-55 barrel. If I do not get the 45-70 barrel I'' be getting a extra 44 mag barrel. I want one for both my boys. So many guns and so little time and money.


BBF
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Offline Ditchdigger

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2004, 03:59:06 PM »
Hey Big Bore Fan ; I'm thinking about going the 445 route myself as soon as my barrel gets here. If the 44 mag. does not shoot to suit me,I will rechamber to the 445. The velocitys should be about halfway between the 44 and the444.That spells less kick than the 444 and more punch than the 44.  Midway did have the reamer for it awhile back. The brass was $30 per 100 at Midway also.  Let me know if you want to do it, maybe we can split the cost.    Digger
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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2004, 03:52:27 AM »
Well I would like to try it. I guess if you want to let me know. There maybe others out there who would like to do it also. 308 said something about doing a 444 marlin. He might be interested in doing the 445 super mag. I was wanting something in between the 44 and 444. Wanted to stay in the pistol class cartidge. I have a 450 marilin and I am still thinking about the 45-70. Guess if you decide to do it I will to.

BBF
LETS GO STEELER'S. BIG BEN JUST KEEPS ON TICKEN. STEELER'S IN JACKSONVILLE THIS YEAR!

Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2004, 04:32:39 AM »
Quote from: BIGBOREFAN
308 said something about doing a 444 marlin. He might be interested in doing the 445 super mag. Guess if you decide to do it I will to.
BBF

I would definitely consider the .445. 8) If the .44 Mag. does suffer from the 'long throat' the .357 Mag. suffers from and we don't do a project on the .444 Marlin, then why not the Super? Shoot yeah. 8)

Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2004, 04:36:18 AM »
Good that could be three lined up. Just need to get me set of the Lee carbide dies for 44 mag. I really like the idea behind these dies.


BBF
LETS GO STEELER'S. BIG BEN JUST KEEPS ON TICKEN. STEELER'S IN JACKSONVILLE THIS YEAR!

Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2004, 05:17:56 AM »
Can you do the Super with Mag. dies like you do the Max with the Mag. dies?  :?

Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2004, 05:22:24 AM »
I seen that Lyman list the 445 SM dies as the same part # as the 44 mag dies. So I would have to say so.

BBF
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Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2004, 05:32:01 AM »
I copied the below text about the .445 Super Mag. from the Reload Bench site:

As with any load, work up to maximum loads with care. The case is a shortened 444 Marlin and is not safe to shoot 44 Magnums in guns so chambered.

Sounds like if you rechamber a .44 Mag. to .445 Super Mag you can't shoot both in it. I looked at the drawing of the .44 Mag. and the .444, the diameter of the rim of both cases is the same, but I noticed on the .444 case there is an extractor groove. Is this a problem for a rechamber of a .44 mag. barrel to either the .445 Super or the .444 Marlin? There isn't a photo of the .445 Super case, but if it's the .444 case shortened it stands to reason the .445 would have the groove too. Maybe some of ya'll can answer that for me.  :? Thanks...

Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2004, 05:34:10 AM »
Quote from: BIGBOREFAN
I seen that Lyman list the 445 SM dies as the same part # as the 44 mag dies. So I would have to say so.

BBF


Excellent, I have RCBS carbide .44 mag. dies on hand.  :grin:  8)

Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2004, 05:38:25 AM »
I think we better give DJ a call. I'm bettin he knows.


BBF
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Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2004, 05:42:52 AM »
Yep, my thoughts too, or maybe he'll stop by. :wink:

Offline Ditchdigger

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2004, 06:05:35 AM »
My Sierra handgun book say's the 44mag. can be fired in the 445 Dan Wesson and the contender with no loss in accurcey, even the 44 special.for plinking. It does state that you should not reduce the loads in the 445 case below the listed loads.   Looks like a winner in my reloading book.   If you did not like it you could always ream it out to 444.  Digger
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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2004, 06:38:08 AM »
I was on the Accurate powder site and it says the 445 SM is a lengthed 44 mag. It did not say anything about if you could shoot 44's through it. I need to do some research.

BBF
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Offline Jarhead Ed

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2004, 06:59:00 AM »
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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2004, 07:05:51 AM »
Thanks for the info Jarhead Ed.

BBF
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Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2004, 08:18:14 AM »
Appreciate the info guys. Kinda worried me, and I wasn't sure if I were reading it right anyhow. :oops: Heres a link to the place I took the quote from:

http://www.reloadbench.com/cartridges/w445supmag.html

Thanks again. :wink:

Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2004, 08:50:39 AM »
Well I diffently want to do it if:

1. I can drive 250 or 265 grain bullets around 2000 Fps.

2. Option of shooting 44 mag through in a have to case. Probally will not but the option would be nice.

3. From what I read the 445 SM is 300 FPS faster than the 44 mag in a pistol. So in a rifle (and I'm just theorising) it should only be 300 to 350 FPS behind the 444 marlin. Which means less kick than the 444 and you should be able to load more 445's than 444's since the 445 uses less powder.

If anybody has any other info please let us know. Thanks

BBF
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Offline 22KHornet

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2004, 09:03:54 AM »
The pure joy of having a round that most people have not even heard of and even fewer own  :grin:  but hey that's just me.
I must be crazy.

Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2004, 09:04:14 AM »
308 I found out 2 things. You can diffently use 44 mag carbide dies to load 445 SM. The other is (I read on the net) this one sight recommended Federal 210 rifle primers for 445 SM and the 357 SM/357 maximum.


BBF
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Offline Ditchdigger

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2004, 09:08:12 AM »
BBF my book gives 2050 with the 240 gr. and the 250gr.  1850 with the300gr. out of a 14in. contender. I plan on using the 270 gr. G.D. probably around  1900 to 1950 fps.  Should be a killer hog gun. If the ladies want's to use it put 44's in it for whitetail's.   680 pdr. give's the most velocitys.  Digger
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Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2004, 09:29:58 AM »
Excellent, I would like to drive a 265 grainer at 2000 FPS and 22KHornet you are exactly right. I want to be differnt also. Hey it's what makes the world go around. :-D


BBF
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Offline lostchild

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445sm
« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2004, 12:45:18 PM »
I have a 445sm in a tc contender ( I know it's not a nef) and I use the Contender reloading manual imformation. I use lee and rcbs regular 44 mag dies to reload and I shoot normal to warm 44 mag loads in mine.  I've been told that you can even shoot 44 russian in this chamber. hope this helps. ....lost

Offline BIGBOREFAN

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2004, 04:09:38 AM »
Well I checked Midway and they did not list a reamer for the 445. Does anybody else know were we can get one at a reasonable price.

BBF
LETS GO STEELER'S. BIG BEN JUST KEEPS ON TICKEN. STEELER'S IN JACKSONVILLE THIS YEAR!

Offline .308

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445 supermag ?
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2004, 04:27:26 AM »
Quote from: BIGBOREFAN
Well I checked Midway and they did not list a reamer for the 445. Does anybody else know were we can get one at a reasonable price.
BBF

If I'm not mistaken DJ got the .357 Max reamer here:

http://www.mansonreamers.com/

You might give them a try. :wink: