Musket Cap Cannon Lock

[de_lok]

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Just ordered a 7/16 piloted counter bore for this. I will probably never use it again, but I want to do this right.

You need to make sure the diameter of the pilot on your counter bore is not larger than the diameter of your tap drill. Most musket nipples are 5/16-24. Tap drill for that thread pitch is letter L or .272, if the pilot diameter is smaller than .272 your good. 1/4 inch (counterbore) has a counter bore of 7/16 and a pilot diameter of .278 which is still closr enough. A 7/16 has a counterbore of 11/16 which will be way to big. Most standard counterbores are made for sockethead capscrews (SHCS). I usually use interchangable pilot counterbores. Hope you didn't order the wrong one. Before you do anything to your barrel you can PM me and I will give you my cell phone number and guide you thru the steps. I have built several hundred cannon barrels and offer my help if want it. I am retired and usually have lots of time on my hands, sorry I wasn't able to get more pictures up today, had a lot of irons in the fire and will have a lot of friends over tomorrow (ATV ride and SEC Championship game- ROLL TIDE), so Sunday or Monday I will try to post some pics of the cannon lock setup.

Yup thought of that. Bought a tap that takes the interchangable pilot and a 3/16 (.1875) pilot to use with it. I appreciate all your help/input, along with everyone else's!  Also is there a standard size bit that would be close enough for me to use, or should I buy the "letter" drill? Bet I wont find those at Home Depot!!Drilling shouldn't be an issue. First the pilot hole (only deep enough for counter bore depth), then counter bore, followed by tap hole. Am I missing anything?

Sounds like your on the right track. I have found the best deal on drill bits is a 118 pc set. They cover fractional, number, and letter drills. For home shop use I buy the import sets in the $30 to $50 range. I made a typo on the drill size, it is not L(L is .290) it is an I drill (.272) assuming your musket nipple is 5/16-24, sorry for the typo. Once you drill for tap size you can chuck up a center drill (if you have one) and touch it just enough to give your tap a nice lead. I really dont recomend using a fractional drill for that size, they are just too far apart. Drill it oversize and the nipple has a loose fit(not safe), drill it undersize and you run the risk of breaking a the tap in your barrel which would be a pain in the butt to fix Some auto parts stores keep drill bit bins.
 
Another option is to use a 6mm or 1/4-28 nipple for using #10 or #11 percussion caps. The advantage is if anything happens to the threads (crossthread, stripped) it can easily be stepped up to 5/16-24. Some argue the smaller caps are not hot enough, but I have used them for years on small cannons with no problems.

[tombegood]

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Just ordered a 7/16 piloted counter bore for this. I will probably never use it again, but I want to do this right.

You need to make sure the diameter of the pilot on your counter bore is not larger than the diameter of your tap drill. Most musket nipples are 5/16-24. Tap drill for that thread pitch is letter L or .272, if the pilot diameter is smaller than .272 your good. 1/4 inch (counterbore) has a counter bore of 7/16 and a pilot diameter of .278 which is still closr enough. A 7/16 has a counterbore of 11/16 which will be way to big. Most standard counterbores are made for sockethead capscrews (SHCS). I usually use interchangable pilot counterbores. Hope you didn't order the wrong one. Before you do anything to your barrel you can PM me and I will give you my cell phone number and guide you thru the steps. I have built several hundred cannon barrels and offer my help if want it. I am retired and usually have lots of time on my hands, sorry I wasn't able to get more pictures up today, had a lot of irons in the fire and will have a lot of friends over tomorrow (ATV ride and SEC Championship game- ROLL TIDE), so Sunday or Monday I will try to post some pics of the cannon lock setup.

Yup thought of that. Bought a tap that takes the interchangable pilot and a 3/16 (.1875) pilot to use with it. I appreciate all your help/input, along with everyone else's!  Also is there a standard size bit that would be close enough for me to use, or should I buy the "letter" drill? Bet I wont find those at Home Depot!!Drilling shouldn't be an issue. First the pilot hole (only deep enough for counter bore depth), then counter bore, followed by tap hole. Am I missing anything?

Sounds like your on the right track. I have found the best deal on drill bits is a 118 pc set. They cover fractional, number, and letter drills. For home shop use I buy the import sets in the $30 to $50 range. I made a typo on the drill size, it is not L(L is .290) it is an I drill (.272) assuming your musket nipple is 5/16-24, sorry for the typo. Once you drill for tap size you can chuck up a center drill (if you have one) and touch it just enough to give your tap a nice lead. I really dont recomend using a fractional drill for that size, they are just too far apart. Drill it oversize and the nipple has a loose fit(not safe), drill it undersize and you run the risk of breaking a the tap in your barrel which would be a pain in the butt to fix Some auto parts stores keep drill bit bins.
 
Another option is to use a 6mm or 1/4-28 nipple for using #10 or #11 percussion caps. The advantage is if anything happens to the threads (crossthread, stripped) it can easily be stepped up to 5/16-24. Some argue the smaller caps are not hot enough, but I have used them for years on small cannons with no problems.

My neighbor owns a tool liquidation store and I was able to get the drill bit from him. I almost bought a lathe while I was there!

[tombegood]

Decided to make a spring loaded lock. This will go over the musket nipple and will come down on the cap when the pin is pulled.

[tombegood]

Decided to make a spring loaded lock. This will go over the musket nipple and will come down on the cap when the pin is pulled.

Not my prettiest work, but it is definitely functional. 

Added an old brass cabinet knob to add a little more striking force.

 

[Double D]

My  past experience a hunnert years ago with theses pull devices; slap hammers and plungers is that they do move barrels when fired.  This shows up on target just like jerking the trigger on you favorite rifle or hand gun.

Despite that one fault, I applaud you gentlemen. I admire your skill and ingenuity in building these devices.  If they work for your specific purposes then do indeed build them.

I think every one would appreciate close up detailed pictures of you builds. 

Some of these device you guys have built are very clever...to bad you haven't posted pictures, you might even earn a kewpie!

Attachments are not posted pictures...kewpie can only be posted to pictures.



 

[tombegood]

My  past experience a hunnert years ago with theses pull devices; slap hammers and plungers is that they do move barrels when fired.  This shows up on target just like jerking the trigger on you favorite rifle or hand gun.

Despite that one fault, I applaud you gentlemen. I admire your skill and ingenuity in building these devices.  If they work for your specific purposes then do indeed build them.

I think every one would appreciate close up detailed pictures of you builds. 

Some of these device you guys have built are very clever...to bad you haven't posted pictures, you might even earn a kewpie!

Attachments are not posted pictures...kewpie can only be posted to pictures.

Already tested this out. The pin pulls effortlessly with a quick snap of the string (not pictured). The cannon weighs close to 50 pounds and pulling the string from the side (not directly behind the cannon) should cause no movement at all. When fired with 600 grains of BP the cannon hardly flinches with a recoil...Not planning on it ever being shot for perfect accuracy.

The lock is made with a brass plumbing nipple and two end caps drilled out to size needed. The firing pin/bolt is a 1/4" 20 3" bolt and the spring is a compression spring I bought at True Value Hardware. Drilled a small hole through the bolts shaft for the pin. That's pretty much it. Still havent decided how I wish to attach it to my cannon. Probably just use hose clamps for now. I hate doing anything too permanent in case I want to change things up some other time. I will break it down and take an "exploded" picture of all the parts later today.

[tombegood]

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,266135.60.html

[Artilleryman]

Has anyone tried to measure the "trigger pull" of these devices.

[de_lok]

" Still havent decided how I wish to attach it to my cannon. Probably just use hose clamps for now. I hate doing anything too permanent in case I want to change things up some other time".

 
Here is a lock attached to a cannon with a leather strap. Sorry I don't have a better pictire, this one was taken 16 years ago on 35mm film and scanned into my pc.................
 
 

[de_lok]

 

Some of these device you guys have built are very clever...to bad you haven't posted pictures, you might even earn a kewpie!

Attachments are not posted pictures...kewpie can only be posted to pictures.

DoubleD, how do you post pictures without clicking the attachment option? I have tried to copy/paste pictures but they don't show up.

[tombegood]

Still havent decided how I wish to attach it to my cannon. Probably just use hose clamps for now. I hate doing anything too permanent in case I want to change things up some other time.

 
Here is a lock attached to a cannon with a leather strap. Sorry I don't have a better pictire, this one was taken 16 years ago on 35mm film and scanned into my pc.................

That's a serious strap!

[tombegood]

Has anyone tried to measure the "trigger pull" of these devices.

Doubt it. These things are not exactly sniper rifles.

[jeeper1]

I have tried to copy/paste pictures but they don't show up.

You need a picture hosting site such as 
 http://www.myhostedpics.com 
You upload your photos to there, then copy and paste the BB code of the pic into your post.

[Double D]

De_loc that looks like a leather vent cover for traveling.

Tombegood,  took offense to my post.  Not my intent.  You can look at his post as he quoted me...I guess I can under understand why he was offended..so i have deleted my post....

[tombegood]

No hard feelings.

[tombegood]

De-Lok, Thanks so much for all your input in this string. I would not have been able to do half as good a job without it.

Very, very much appreciated!

[Double D]

 
Impressive.
I just built mine to have fun. Sorry I'm not a purest, as probably many others are on here. Very few people have ever had anything negative to say about my design. Most people like it in fact. The company who machined my barrel told me I should market it. Of course I know how you feel about them also. You made that very clear in response to the very first time I posted anything in these forums. DD If you are annoyed with what I have to post on here, do me a favor, avoid me. You will never see anything I make to be designed for any more than fun. I don't mind constructive criticism, but I hate condescending.

I use this forum to get ideas from people. Good ideas, so that I can enjoy this hobby in a safe way. Not to build something that has the accuracy of a 50 cal rifle with a holographic scope.

I have removed my remarks that you found offensive, I can understand your response.

[de_lok]

De-Lok, Thanks so much for all your input in this string. I would not have been able to do half as good a job without it.

Very, very much appreciated!

You are very welcome . I have made many cannons over the past 20 years or so (300+) and always did it for "fun". Many were made to sell but not as a business. I always worked full time jobs in specialty job shops and tool&die shops and "moonlighted" cannons on the side and used the profits to tool my shop up. In July 2009 (at age 46) I was forced into disability retirement from a chemical injury (brain and cns dammage that affects motor control) and since sold most of my equipment. After 3 years of recovering and lots of time on my hands I have become interested in the artillary hobby again, and hobbies are always more fun when shared with others with the same interest .
 
I did take time to make pictures of how I install a flip lock/musket nipple combo. The first three pics are the nipple before during and after drilling out. The next three show how the vent pick works. the next two show a properly cut nipple seat and an installed lock. Thats a .40 S&W on top for scale !
 
 OOPS, only six pics per post, the last two come next........................
 

[de_lok]

The last two pics........... Thats a .40 S&W in the pic for scale

[tombegood]

The last two pics........... Thats a .40 S&W in the pic for scale

Good stuff! I always wished I had access to a machine shop. Instead, if I need something I have to make due with Home Depot... I have a  wood shop in my house, unfortunately no more room for metal working. I got all sorts of awards for it in high school...1,000,000 years ago, but never persued it. My Dad was a "toolmaker by trade" in the old Boston Navel Shipyard and he was actually assigned to work on restoring Old Ironsides many years ago. He fabricated a tool to pull the ribs away from the hull so they could repair rotting wood behind them. He managed to take home with him a piece of the original lumber from the ship (complete with water stains). Since then I have inherited it. I have often thought of doing something with it, but never had any idea what I could make with it to do it any justice. Now I'm thinking of making a small replica of one of her cannons using this wood in the process. Think it would be kind of cool to have it "feel" a cannon being fired once again. Don't worry DD this wouldn't be a hybrid!  But on the flip side I will have a very hard time puting a blade to a piece of history, so it may just remain on display in the "nautical room" of my house.

[Double D]

I believe GGaskil can furnish you with a drawing of an Ironside cannon. I know he has built one.

I checked my files and I don't have a drawing.  Round shot and Rammers has a drawing.

I withdrew my remarks that you found offensive, you should try to do the same.

[GGaskill]

I have in the past recommended that persons wishing plans for the various guns carried on the Constitution get the CD-ROM from the NHC - Detachment Boston so they would be supporting that worthy task.  However, the last time I asked about the CD, they told me that they were changing formats and the old CD was no longer available.  I have been unable to find any reference to the material on any of the Constitution-related web sites, so I have decided that I will make copies of my copy of the CD for $15 including shipping with the excess beyond that required for shipping to be donated to the Constitution museum.

If you want a copy, PM me.

[tombegood]

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