corporate profits all time high, wages all time low

[45-70.gov]

BOTTOM LINE


the rich keep getting richer because they adapt
the poor keep getting poor because they don't


pass a law to attack the rich.....they will just adapt...
.that might mean leaving... or reading the fine print of the law.....but they will adapt...
.and the poor  won't  adapt and will remain poorer

[scootrd]

BOTTOM LINE


the rich keep getting richer because they adapt
the poor keep getting poor because they don't


pass a law to attack the rich.....they will just adapt...
.that might mean leaving... or reading the fine print of the law.....but they will adapt... (they adapt all right by passing legislation through paid for politicians).
.and the poor  won't  adapt and will remain poorer

The gap keeps widening because there has been no true Tax reform to provide a level playing field for all. Period.
A decade ago corps were paying 30% , now 8.9. Who do you think has been picking up the tab (including all bailouts) to close the gap for years while wages have stagnated or declined over the same period of time.?

Hey that reminds me , isn't it time for the bought and paid for legislators to approve BP taxpayer subsidies again for 2013.
So much for free market capitalism. 

The hypocrisy throughout these threads that support big corp screwing the American taxpayer and are just so ridiculous.
Thank you sir may I have another !!!



Again dont pee on my shoes and tell me it's raining.

[SHOOTALL]

BOTTOM LINE


the rich keep getting richer because they adapt  yep
the poor keep getting poor because they don't  they have been taught to wait for govt. to support them.


pass a law to attack the rich.....they will just adapt...yep
.that might mean leaving... or reading the fine print of the law.....but they will adapt...well they want to keep what they worked for
.and the poor  won't  adapt and will remain poorer and vote for more hand outs .........

until the rich leave and the hand outs stop then it will all fall apart and start over again ...................

[Gary G]

The reason for the income gap is your government and the federal reserve. By keeping interest rates so low, the federal reserve creates an environment where ordinary people can't get a return on their money. Wealthy people invest their money where it will grow. Also, when the Fed prints money as they are now, it becomes a tax on the poor who's money shrinks in value causing them to have less purchasing power and thus they are  poorer. Again, the wealthy invest in tangible assets that grow with or greater than the inflation. The poor get poorer. The debt is the cause.  Austrian Economics 101.


To tax anyone more is to make everyone poorer. Every dollar taxed is a dollar that cannot be used in the private economy for capital expansion of machinery or labor.

[45-70.gov]

The reason for the income gap is your government and the federal reserve. By keeping interest rates so low, the federal reserve creates an environment where ordinary people can't get a return on their money. Wealthy people invest their money where it will grow. Also, when the Fed prints money as they are now, it becomes a tax on the poor who's money shrinks in value causing them to have less purchasing power and thus they are  poorer. Again, the wealthy invest in tangible assets that grow with or greater than the inflation. The poor get poorer. The debt is the cause.


To tax anyone more is to make everyone poorer. Every dollar taxed is a dollar that cannot be used in the private economy for capital expansion of machinery or labor.

well  i have adapted........i have been buying realestate
now that the price is right
i am  now  out of cash..BECAUSE,,  i know it won't be worth much  soon
at this point   i look forward to inflation!!
yeppy  RENT IS GOING UP!........with inflation
in the future  i will get 10x as many devalued dollars as a bought the property for


i quit   worrying a long time ago about the financial desparity between  my boss and me

[scootrd]

or even tracking the missing Pentagon 2.3$ trillion which would come in handy about now. 
..TM7

Not ignoring your other points just a comment on this one line that can be discussed in another thread.
The 2.3 trillion is not missing . Never has been.
It's funding covert ops around the world off the congressional books so military need not continue to ask congress for more $$.

JMHO


Back on topic  -

The gaps in after-tax income between the richest 1 percent of Americans and the middle and poorest fifths of the country more than tripled between 1979 and 2007 (the period for which this data are available), according to data the Congressional Budget Office (CBO). 

Legislation enacted under the Bush Administration provided taxpayers with about $1.7 trillion in tax cuts through 2008.  Because high-income households received by far the largest tax cuts — not only in dollar terms but also as a percentage of income — the tax cuts have increased the concentration of after-tax income at the top of the spectrum.

Median earnings for full-time, year-round male workers: 1972—$47,550 2010—$47,715. That not a typo.
In thirty-eight years, the annual earnings of the typical male worker, adjusted to 2010 dollars, have risen by
a whopping $165, or $3.17 a week.

Productivity has surged, but income and wages have stagnated for most Americans. If the median household income had kept pace with the economy since 1970, it would now be nearly $92,000, not $50,000.

Whats needed is true tax reform and a level playing field.

Semper Fi

[mcwoodduck]

The tax system is so skewed in favor of finance capitalist and other players that the government can no longer collect taxes from corps.  Corps and finance capitalist have taken tax evasion to a science. Thusly, expect to see more tax mythology and trial balloons floating around that shift the burden of taxes to those that the governmnet can actually collect the tax from.....that means you Mr. Middle Class and poor guy! What?  Prices of goods include the cost of taxes.  Coperations send Billions and billions to DC in the form of taxes on profits and in the forms of payroll taxes.  The higher the taxes go the higher the prices are and the less you can afforsd and the fewer people are working. 
The myth that coperations pay nothing so we should tax them more is the complete opposite. Also as profits are taxed they are then taxed again as the owners are given their share as income. 
.
So you will see flat tax, fair tax, zero corp tax, social net program cutting, etc concepts floating around. Already corps have shifted burden of HC cost to the worker.  Do not expect to see cutting huge mega defense spending, or even tracking the missing Pentagon 2.3$ trillion which would come in handy about now.  Actually a fair tax will make people do what they think is in their best interest and not what is best to pay as little tax as possible set by Congress in Social engineering and graft for their corperate friends and contributors.  Billions in corperate loans and rebates for solar energy that only put millions in the hands of the Doners.  The only real fair tax is to cut taxes and make a single rate based on the poverty rate in specific areas.  Clearly the poverty rate is different in LA than in New Orleans but the Federal Government treats everyone the same.  The Poverty rate or three times it would be your deduction, coperations would not have a deduction. 
.
Any knew tax schemes despite rhetoric will amount to a shift to those that the taxes can actually be collected...This tax burden will collapse the USA and kill the middle class as real wages continue to plummet and the common citizen will be forced subordinate to this economic oppression. Upward mobility will be mostly a thing of the past.  Those that caused the mega debt will escape paying it off....this will be shifted to your grand kids kids...Say Hello to NWO and the new medieval USA. The current system is Broken and will be the down fall of our country in less than 20 years when our debt service will exceed all collected taxes and at that poiunt no one will lend us any more money and the whole system will collapse.  We need to change the tax system to encourage growth, encourage personal responsiblity, and to curb spending and meet the needs of the nation not the wants of the nation.  While people have disposable income the nations shoould not have disposable income.   
My Questions is why is a spending cut a cut in the growth not the actual budget, why are tax cuts put on a dead line and taxes increases are never with an end date?  Why do we have a gocvernment that works for us and is willing for the citizens to go with out but it is not willing to go with out?
.
.
..TM7

[Redtail1949]

Yep thats the truth!
most miss the reason why. globalization of the work force. it was started many years ago. a definate plan carried out by both Democrats and Republicans. Remember NAFTA and Clintons part in it. Well it has finaly done what it was designed to do. drive American workers down to compete with the poverty levels of other nations. of course we are paid more than most overseas however we can not compete realisticaly. even the unions those bastions of the American Worker signed up for it. They saw the millions upons millions in Union dues if they could just get in on it. the corperations love it they are rolling in the cash. the unions love it they are getting more dues paying member and the potential to gain expotentialy even more.
the joke is on all of us, our turn in the barrel so to speak. greed that good old fashioned way of getting more and more is the rallying call of both the corporations and the unions and we the American suckers are paying the price.

[rio grande]

or even tracking the missing Pentagon 2.3$ trillion which would come in handy about now. 
..TM7

Not ignoring your other points just a comment on this one line that can be discussed in another thread.
The 2.3 trillion is not missing . Never has been.
It's funding covert ops around the world off the congressional books so military need not continue to ask congress for more $$.

JMHO

"Covert" ops..... What a joke!  It's 'covert' all right, hidden from the taxpayers, that's for sure....used for only God and the devils at the Pentagon know.   And used for dark purposes that Americans just may not approve of if they did know.
 
And you act like that's all OK, as long as regime characters like Hillary and Biden oversee it...along with nameless, faceless beings in the so-called 'Defense' Dep't.
 
And how comforting to know the military need not be troubled by having to 'ask for' more of our tax money....they have a 2.3 trillion dollar blank check!
 
LMAO, it may not be 'missing' to you, but it certainly appears to have disappeared!

[scootrd]

...all taxes should be corporate and capital gains based_ _just as The Founder's envisioned. That way id I don't buy their junk I'm not taxed or continue to have taxes shift to me since corps increasingly avoid taxes. If you like paying taxes for other people and corps avoiding taxes than continue with the system of taxing wages and simple incomes while corps and wealthy avoid taxation spreading the burden to poor and middle class souls.
.
..TM7

+1

[Cuts Crooked]

...all taxes should be corporate and capital gains based_ _just as The Founder's envisioned. That way id I don't buy their junk I'm not taxed or continue to have taxes shift to me since corps increasingly avoid taxes. If you like paying taxes for other people and corps avoiding taxes than continue with the system of taxing wages and simple incomes while corps and wealthy avoid taxation spreading the burden to poor and middle class souls.
.
..TM7

+1

Moronic!!!!!!!!! In the end the little guy always pays the taxes. Tax the Coporations......the little guy will end up paying it. Always have, always will. It will simply be passed on as a cost of doing business.

[scootrd]

...all taxes should be corporate and capital gains based_ _just as The Founder's envisioned. That way id I don't buy their junk I'm not taxed or continue to have taxes shift to me since corps increasingly avoid taxes. If you like paying taxes for other people and corps avoiding taxes than continue with the system of taxing wages and simple incomes while corps and wealthy avoid taxation spreading the burden to poor and middle class souls.
.
..TM7

+1

Moronic!!!!!!!!! In the end the little guy always pays the taxes. Tax the Coporations......the little guy will end up paying it. Always have, always will. It will simply be passed on as a cost of doing business.

Moronic??? ... Tell that to Jefferson and the founders.
Perhaps a brush up on history is in order.

[45-70.gov]

...all taxes should be corporate and capital gains based_ _just as The Founder's envisioned. That way id I don't buy their junk I'm not taxed or continue to have taxes shift to me since corps increasingly avoid taxes. If you like paying taxes for other people and corps avoiding taxes than continue with the system of taxing wages and simple incomes while corps and wealthy avoid taxation spreading the burden to poor and middle class souls.
.
..TM7

unless it prices their product out of business

+1

Moronic!!!!!!!!! In the end the little guy always pays the taxes. Tax the Coporations......the little guy will end up paying it. Always have, always will. It will simply be passed on as a cost of doing business.

[m-g Willy]

  Those that live and benefit the most in this country need to pay their fair share rather than avoid paying  and shifting it to common wage earning citizens.
.

.
..TM7

EXACTLY!
Everyone should pay their fair share.
And that means everyone should pay the SAME %  on every dollar they earn.

[Gary G]

Actually, TM, the founding fathers did not believe that a man should be taxed for the sweat of his brow and hence you had the impetus of a revolutionary war. The progressive income tax came with the socialist movement in America. It was to be on millionaires and thus the people did not fight it, a mistake.


No rich man got rich without helping others, even if the has the heart of a scrooge. He had to buy resources from others (creating jobs) and he hired others to work for him (creating jobs). Wealthier people means more wealth for others. Now if you want to see more poor people, screw the rich people and if you do it enough, everyone will be poor (former Soviet Union).


Now as for income disparity, it first can be traced to mercantilism. In today's world that is government corruption in bed with corporatism. The second factor is the fiat money system. The Federal reserve is working very hard at this very moment to make the poor and middle class that much poorer while the rich have ways of escape.


The poor tend to be poor because of their own bad habits; consuming more than they are able or willing to produce. However, and this will be a radical though for many of you, we would have a much better economy with fewer poor if there was no government and no tax.

[Cuts Crooked]

And why should I have taxes shifted to me, and all citizens, from corps avoiding tax when I might not even buy any of the stuff any corp produces and sells?.

Ah now you are trying to be overly simplistic.

At some level you will do business with someone who does business with the "corp". Then you will be paying their tax indirectly.

In the end the end consumer ALWAYS pays it, always have, always will.

[ChungDoQuan]

So, we'll pay another 3 cents on the dollar for the commerce we have with the big corps. If it bothers you that much, find non-corporate people to do business with. What we're talking about here is, for instance, if your net income, after taxes, is $350,000 for the year, your income will be $347,000 without the tax cuts. I do not find much sympathy for you, whether you're a corporation or an individual.

(Here's where all the business "experts" will jump in and correct me, ignoring the words "net income" and try to obscure the truth with tall tales about local taxes and obscure business expenses. Go for it.)

[Cuts Crooked]

So, we'll pay another 3 cents on the dollar for the commerce we have with the big corps. If it bothers you that much, find non-corporate people to do business with. What we're talking about here is, for instance, if your net income, after taxes, is $350,000 for the year, your income will be $347,000 without the tax cuts. I do not find much sympathy for you, whether you're a corporation or an individual.

(Here's where all the business "experts" will jump in and correct me, ignoring the words "net income" and try to obscure the truth with tall tales about local taxes and obscure business expenses. Go for it.)

Not gonna "correct you" just pointing out that you cannot avoid it.....tax the corps or the rich....you pay it. They just figger it into the cost. You can claim to avoid it by refusing to do business with them, but at some point you will do business with someone who does......and then you pay. It may be a tiny percentage, but it adds up to you paying it. Always have Always will.

[Cuts Crooked]

Cuts...no, not exactly, if I don't buy a corps drugs, cars, appliances, entertainment...I'm not paying tax at all,,,If I only buy a small amount of their stuff I only pay tax in proportion to what I purchased.  Essentially we are talking about a form of 'consumption tax' with corp tax. Right now corps avoid taxation and the burden is shifted to those that the governmnet can actually easily collect from.

..TM7

Sorry TM as I have already pointed out you will at some point do business with someone who does business with them.......and part of the price will be the tax that they paid.......you can't escape it unless you don't purchase anything........ever.

That has always been the bottom line, and it always will be. You buy a pretzel from the guy with the cart on the corner, you pay his tax bill figured into his costs, he bought his cart from a small business owner that makes carts, his tax is figured into the costs, he bought the steel from a corp that produces steel, their tax is figured into the cost. The end consumer always pays in the end.....increase taxes on the corps and rich.... the end users just ends up paying more. This is really simple.

[m-g Willy]

[
.
.
 Right, fair share.!!...fair share is one of those terms open to discussion. In capitalistic systems people pay more for better seats in the theater or ball park....pay more for a better car, etc. If you have a better seat in the game of life...then pay alittle more.
.
.
..TM7

By "open for discussion" you mean that if I bust my ass to make more money than the guy that does nothing but holds his hand out , I should be penalized for working harder or smarter?
 

[ChungDoQuan]

A working man is only one notch above a welfare queen in the big picture. So, the people on the dole get, as individuals, about .00001% of what those corporate execs make. If you're working for a living, you MIGHT get .0001- .0002%. And they do not work for it--- they start with lots of money and use it to make lots more money. Oh, and even though you identify with them, they don't identify with you, no matter what they say to get you to vote for their guy.

[jhm]

     FAIR well if I have a better seat at the game it is because I chose to do so, If I drive a nicer car it is because I chose to do so, not because someone else thinks I should because someone else chose not to and waste their life on other venues.  Get a life and quite looking for SOMEONE ELSE to make it easier for you.  Jim

[ChungDoQuan]

Most so-called liberals work just like most rightys work. In fact, in the red states, more rightys get some kind of gov't assistance than liberals.

[Gary G]

Most so-called liberals work just like most rightys work. In fact, in the red states, more rightys get some kind of gov't assistance than liberals.

You are right! And there is only one way to correct this problem. A government that has nothing to trade for votes and favors, as it once was many years past.

[45-70.gov]

WOW ... 9 pages of people professing their envy....real productive!

[Cuts Crooked]

Right Cuts...the corpo-consumption tax would only be on me in proportion to the commerce I did in the community...among those business' paying tax....instead of avoided by corps entirely and shifted and spread to us citizens in some kind of 'socialistic' fashion. And if I don't buy certain products or services I'm not paying tax for corps at all..
...TM7

Well, yer gonna get almighty hungry and cold if you avoid it at all.

[jhm]

     It boils down to this, we have gave away too much in this country to the ones who contribute the least to the economy and freedom, close the boarders to a minimum # so as to have some kind of control who is here and WHY , limit the UNEMPLOYMENT to a respectable time frame, 2 years is getting out of hand, ETC ETC.  We all know where the waste is but we hide are heads and dont want to get involved for fear af being called a BIGOT, RACIEST any of the LIBERAL name tags they use.  Jim

[Gary G]

To take from the productive in society and to give it to the unproductive is like killing the strong animals in the herd to make more for the weaker animals. It doesn't work out well for the herd, as former communist countries can testify; and it only hurts the poor.

[scootrd]

To take from the productive in society and to give it to the unproductive is like killing the strong animals in the herd to make more for the weaker animals. It doesn't work out well for the herd, as former communist countries can testify; and it only hurts the poor.

Ridiculous analogy.

A working man is productive and should not be required to pay more taxes than anyone else thus weakening his opportunity for growth.

Should I split my goat herd and only allow a select few to graze good pasture?
No -  all should have an opportunity to remain healthy and graze the same pasture to achieve their highest potential.


True corporate tax reform and a level playing field is what is required so all have a chance to succeed.

[45-70.gov]

To take from the productive in society and to give it to the unproductive is like killing the strong animals in the herd to make more for the weaker animals. It doesn't work out well for the herd, as former communist countries can testify; and it only hurts the poor.

GREAT ANALOGY


the welfare recipients  breed like rabits and stray cats
while the educated  hold off on multiplying until productive  and then  not so prolific
sorry  guys  but  i am a evolutionist.........and the government  has go it BACKWARDS