Author Topic: Gun show loophole (Read 1427 times)

mcbammer · « **on:** December 20, 2012, 11:29:43 AM »

Walkin ,walkout transaction between buyer & seller. Does closeing the loophole matter to you?

RevJim · « **Reply #1 on:** December 20, 2012, 11:33:13 AM »

Yes. It means one law abiding citizen cannot sell or trade or gift a firearm to another law abiding citizen w/o a govt' Background check. i.e. regerstered.

Ranger99 · « **Reply #2 on:** December 20, 2012, 11:47:55 AM »

there is no loophole.
if i am a criminal, and i wanted a gun,
i'll go steal it somewhere.
i could have bashed the armored truck
courier in the head with a can of peas
and taken his gun when at the grocery
store earlier today. the truck driver
was so busy playing with his cell phone
he could have never intervened in time
and by the time he got off his a$$ i'd
have had the other gun and popped him
then i'd have two free unregistered
guns without the mythical mystical "loophole"

BUGEYE · « **Reply #3 on:** December 20, 2012, 11:55:55 AM »

Quote from: Ranger99 on December 20, 2012, 11:47:55 AM

there is no loophole.
if i am a criminal, and i wanted a gun,
i'll go steal it somewhere.
i could have bashed the armored truck
courier in the head with a can of peas
and taken his gun when at the grocery
store earlier today. the truck driver
was so busy playing with his cell phone
he could have never intervened in time
and by the time he got off his a$$ i'd
have had the other gun and popped him
then i'd have two free unregistered
guns without the mythical mystical "loophole"

LOL. I could have done something similar the other day. I followed the guy with the money in the door, he had the money in his gun hand, I was 6ft behind him with a concealed firearm.

Ranger99 · « **Reply #4 on:** December 20, 2012, 12:04:27 PM »

if i had a bag of money in my
crime-ridden not-quite-a-war-zone
neighborhood, i damn sure wouldn't
be sending any text messages, and if
i were behind the wheel of an armored
truck i'd be watching what my outside man
was doing, not dallying with a cell phone.
i guess i just think different.
the illegals around here all seem to come
up with a gun to shoot up in the air for
new year's without attending a gun show
for any loophole benefits. maybe we should
crack down on illegals?
i can't believe i wrote that. . . .
something that makes sense? no %^&*@ way! ! !

mcbammer · « **Reply #5 on:** December 20, 2012, 01:13:02 PM »

Honest ,Law abideing people are the only ones that are loseing their freedoms .

mechanic · « **Reply #6 on:** December 20, 2012, 01:24:26 PM »

I don't know about other states, or gunshows but here the dealers are all set up to do background checks. Individual to individual sales can be done anywhere, without the gunshow participating.

I just never understood what they considered a "loophole". If I willingly and knowingly sell a gun to a person who should not own one, I could be in big poop.

Ben

BUGEYE · « **Reply #7 on:** December 20, 2012, 01:34:30 PM »

Quote from: mechanic on December 20, 2012, 01:24:26 PM

I don't know about other states, or gunshows but here the dealers are all set up to do background checks. Individual to individual sales can be done anywhere, without the gunshow participating.

I just never understood what they considered a "loophole". If I willingly and knowingly sell a gun to a person who should not own one, I could be in big poop.

Ben

I think their goal is to eliminate all private sales or gifts without going thru a ffl.
that's a first step to confiscation.

tobster · « **Reply #8 on:** December 20, 2012, 02:14:31 PM »

As near as I can tell the antis like to give the general public the impression that all gun dealers are exempt from conforming to gun laws if they are at a gun show. Nothing could be further from the truth. As we all know,legal sales between private individuals are also legal at a gun show. The so called gun show loophole is the biggest farce portrayed by antis to the general public imaginable.

kynardsj · « **Reply #9 on:** December 20, 2012, 02:18:28 PM »

I've wondered lately what loopholes BHO brags about closing at gunshows. There just ain't none. The background checks are just like a gun store. I agree with what was said earlier, they're looking to stop private transactions without a FFL check.

mcbammer · « **Reply #10 on:** December 20, 2012, 04:13:19 PM »

Quote from: kynardsj on December 20, 2012, 02:18:28 PM

I've wondered lately what loopholes BHO brags about closing at gunshows. There just ain't none. The background checks are just like a gun store. I agree with what was said earlier, they're looking to stop private transactions without a FFL check.

A father passing his guns down to his children might become illegal.

Ranger99 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 20, 2012, 04:18:25 PM »

most likely.
their argument might be " a low-income
dad doesn't have any guns to pass down to his
children. why should folks better off be able
to pass down guns to their children? that's
not fair, and we'll be looking into taking
guns from the wealthy to redistribute to
the poor of this country."

kennyd · « **Reply #12 on:** December 20, 2012, 05:02:02 PM »

Colorado "closed" the loophole. Before I could buy a gun from a private individual face to face. He didn't even have to have a table, could be one of the guys with a gun to trade or sell if he made a deal. Now, if I find something like a .22 smoothbore Winchester (did), I have to pay to have the background check done by a bank of dealers set up for that. We have ALWAYS, like before had to do the paperwork with a FFL dealer. I have not found anything much I wanted at the last shows, so seldom go now. I know where the component dealer has his inventory, so can go there during the week and get what I need without having to pay admission. Right now bachground checks are taking over a day, so this will cause problems if someone finds something he likes that is offered by a dealer from out of town. You CANNOT do parking lot transactions. The downside is that this adds $20 to the price of any privately held gun as these guys can't do the check.

I did have a fellow looker hint strongly that he was lonesome for his 1911 that was home in Alaska, and wished someone would do a straw purchase for him. My only mistake then was not going directly to the management.

AND FOR ANY LOOKERS: the last time I bought a gun at a dealer I filled out the paper work and waited for the OK. This same dealer is also the one that received an online purchase (according to law) and did the background check for a fee. I have also seen this shop turn away purchasers because they didn't like their nervous attitude.

corbanzo · « **Reply #13 on:** December 20, 2012, 06:11:19 PM »

That would piss me off if they stopped private transactions. Alaska has a lot of people trading guns. It's always nice to be able to sit down and talk with somebody about guns for a little bit and get perspective and trade things of value to each other.

Everyone outside looks at this kind of thing is "under the table" dealings and such. Which is bull. A community that is more open about their firearms and willing to openly trade and buy and sell with each other is more trusting of one another and more transparent.

If the only thing about a gun transfer is just a piece of paper it is more forced.... stupid.

I agree that there is no loophole. No matter where it takes place a private transaction is a private transaction. An individual to individual transaction is in no way "distribution" of firearms for any purpose, it's just a trade or a sale of a good. End of story.

Whatever happened to I don't answer government questions about my life, they answer my questions about them?

Brett · « **Reply #14 on:** December 21, 2012, 01:30:50 AM »

By the time that the Gov. closes this "gun show loophole" a surviving spouse or children will not be permitted to receive your guns. The ATF will be at your widows door the day after you die to confiscate your guns.

mcbammer · « **Reply #15 on:** December 21, 2012, 03:21:35 AM »

Quote from: corbanzo on December 20, 2012, 06:11:19 PM

That would piss me off if they stopped private transactions. Alaska has a lot of people trading guns. It's always nice to be able to sit down and talk with somebody about guns for a little bit and get perspective and trade things of value to each other.

Everyone outside looks at this kind of thing is "under the table" dealings and such. Which is bull. A community that is more open about their firearms and willing to openly trade and buy and sell with each other is more trusting of one another and more transparent.

If the only thing about a gun transfer is just a piece of paper it is more forced.... stupid.

I agree that there is no loophole. No matter where it takes place a private transaction is a private transaction. An individual to individual transaction is in no way "distribution" of firearms for any purpose, it's just a trade or a sale of a good. End of story.

Whatever happened to I don't answer government questions about my life, they answer my questions about them?

I join you in the pissed off congregation

Mikey · « **Reply #16 on:** December 21, 2012, 03:38:45 AM »

First, I don't consider it a 'loophole'; it is a legitimate purchase, especially if not a interstate purchase or deal.

Second: as with Corbanzo, I would be whizzed at having to pay yet another 'fee' and then have to sit through the delay of waiting to be either 'delayed' or 'denied' if somebody on the other end doesn't like how you spell your name. The last 3 times I have purchased a firearm, from a dealer at his placae of business, I have been delayed (1 week), and it is usually on a Friday during the nics personnel afternoon nap or doughnut break. It doesn't matter that my carry permits allow me reciprocity in 41 states, if they don't like how I spell my name they can make me wait - wait for what, to commit some crime with a registered gun.

yellowtail3 · « **Reply #17 on:** December 21, 2012, 04:14:41 AM »

Yep - gun show loophole is mostly shorthand for, "we'd like everyone at gunshows - [/size]and then later we'll change it to anywhere/everywhere? -[/size] to [/b][/size]go through NICS for a purchase."

powderman · « **Reply #18 on:** December 21, 2012, 04:24:06 AM »

Quote from: mcbammer on December 20, 2012, 11:29:43 AM

Walkin ,walkout transaction between buyer & seller. Does closeing the loophole matter to you?

YES, it would bother me. The only thing the feds want to eliminate is private sales, it has nothing to do with crime control. POWDERMAN.

BUGEYE · « **Reply #19 on:** December 21, 2012, 04:29:56 AM »

It's amazing to me that there is a bunch of hussein supporters here on a mainly "gun site" knowing what his agenda really is.
they have to be "moles" reporting to the BATFE, and do not own guns.

Brett · « **Reply #20 on:** December 21, 2012, 04:38:58 AM »

Anyone who can't see this coming has their head buried in the sand.... or some dark orafice.

guzzijohn · « **Reply #21 on:** December 21, 2012, 04:51:45 AM »

Quote from BUGEYE:
"It's amazing to me that there is a bunch of hussein supporters here on a mainly "gun site" knowing what his agenda really is.they have to be "moles" reporting to the BATFE, and do not own guns."

Oh No! Bug has blown my cover!

I think the BATFE can do enough damage without us "moles". BUGEYE, if I had your address I would be happy to ship you my custom made just for you tin foil hat just in time for Christmas.

GuzziJohn

RevJim · « **Reply #22 on:** December 21, 2012, 06:12:58 AM »

Liberal owned www.KSL.com has already started their own "pre-emptive" 'stopping easy access to guns". They removed the Firearms and Ammo section from their heretofore free online Classifieds. Many of us here in Utah have enjoyed just scanning what's for sale, trade and buying/trading through the years. Not now. They are "waiting" to see what the Politicians come up with.
I wish I had the smarts to start my own gun classifieds website, even being charged a Dollar an ad would make someone a lot of money right now! Criminals have their own network, this just hinders (infringes) on Law abiding people.

corbanzo · « **Reply #23 on:** December 21, 2012, 09:09:50 AM »

Quote from: RevJim on December 21, 2012, 06:12:58 AM

Liberal owned www.KSL.com has already started their own "pre-emptive" 'stopping easy access to guns". They removed the Firearms and Ammo section from their heretofore free online Classifieds. Many of us here in Utah have enjoyed just scanning what's for sale, trade and buying/trading through the years. Not now. They are "waiting" to see what the Politicians come up with.
I wish I had the smarts to start my own gun classifieds website, even being charged a Dollar an ad would make someone a lot of money right now! Criminals have their own network, this just hinders (infringes) on Law abiding people.

Anybody who thinks a criminal is going to openly post on a public website to procure firearms is an idiot. There is a reason there are so many criminals out there - they know how to not get caught! No matter what the law changes to.

dwalk · « **Reply #24 on:** December 21, 2012, 12:40:50 PM »

i remember very clearly, stopping at a roadside booth set up near Mcalester, OK, and looking at some rifles (i was interested in the SKS's he had) and accessories that were being sold...and...seeing a police cruiser go by at least twice...without so much as a second glance...

now, i'm certain, the vendor had no way to run a background check on anyone who wanted to purchase one of his firearms...

Land_Owner · « **Reply #25 on:** December 21, 2012, 01:32:49 PM »

When, through no fault of my own, they LEGISLATE me into being a criminal because of my guns, I can become that animal in that instant - with a vengence. It will be the time to stand up in protection of the 2nd Amendment. When that Amendment is protected, we'll return to work on the the rest of the Constitution...

BBF · « **Reply #26 on:** December 22, 2012, 07:22:13 AM »

Up her Kijiji will not accept ads for firearms or components. Since the long arm registry got nixed there is no more paperwork or reporting to be done when selling private although I am encouraged to ensure that the buyer has a valid firearm license.

45-70.gov · « **Reply #27 on:** December 22, 2012, 11:29:08 AM »

Quote from: mcbammer on December 20, 2012, 11:29:43 AM

Walkin ,walkout transaction between buyer & seller. Does closeing the loophole matter to you?

line 19 on the 4427 is the closest thing i can think of thats a ''gun show loophole''
on page 2
http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf

any other definition comes from an idiot with out a clue
there is no loop hole....reagan passed this ''loop hole'' in 1986
prior to that FFL had to do business at the lisenced premisses

tunnug · « **Reply #28 on:** December 22, 2012, 11:58:46 AM »

The Antis favorite catchphrase I see is "Private Dealer", there is no such thing, people are either a Private seller selling their own guns or Dealer with a license and business, anyone buying and selling guns for profit without the proper license would be committing a federal felony, so this "loophole" is another catchphrase that is nonexistent, does the saying "repeat a lie enough times and it becomes the truth" ring any bells.

45-70.gov · « **Reply #29 on:** December 22, 2012, 12:03:29 PM »

maybe i can use the ''gun show loophole'' and sell cocaine there

wow i might get caught that way....better just stick to my word of mouth business