Scope Rings

[dlhumphrey]

 I could use some help with scope rings for the 45-70 Handi. What are people using?
 
I bought some Weaver mediums and they were too short. It looks like they need to be 1/4" or more higher. Thought about getting some see through rings. They look to be quite a bit taller however I can't find any specifications on the net.
 
Any help will be appreciated.
 
Thanks
 

[44 Man]

I just go to Wally World and buy the Weaver Quad Loc rings for $12.95.  Their 'high' are really a medium hight but work well with a scope that is short or has a small ocular bell.  If you have a large bell or the scope os of a length that puts the bell right over the hammer, you will need the 'extra high' rings.  I like 'em; they are inexpensive and do a good job for me.  44 Man

[dlhumphrey]

Thank you. The Ocular bell sits right over the hammer. I will try the extra highs.
 
Thanks a gain for the quick response. On my way to Wall World now.

[revbc]

Biggest problem is the scope.  Purchase something with a smaller ocular if possible.  Mine sports one like this.

[kc5gxc]

Don't forget your hammer spur extention so you can cock it with the scope in the way. I just got one off ebay, but it is not the good one. It's a small aluminum one. Not good as the round steel ones I wish I could have found.
Good luck with it.

[gcrank1]

It is up to you, but few people who try them like or really use the see-thru mounts; they perch your head up too high for cheeking the stock and if you have a scope on you dont look under it for sights. Seems to be one of those solutions for a nonexistent problem. Of course somebody will probably sing their praises, but any gun with them that I have handled has been awkward.
I cant remember which scope it is but several here have nice scopes that sit just forward of the hammer spur.
Bear in mind that the scope rails are differing thicknesses so it affects the clearance heights of the rail/ring combo.
I have a set of Talley rings on mine. I just mixed and matched the bases and rings to get my old El Paso Weaver 2.5x  to clear the hammer by about 1/8"; I like 'em only about that high is all.

[dlhumphrey]

I have to agree with you gcrank1. I put the see through rings on and had plenty of clearance for the scope however I don;t like the looks. The reason I wanted to put a scope on is due to my eye sight not being what it once was and the fact that the Handi has such a short sight radius. That being said, I was wondering if a peep sight would work. I have been looking at one from Midyay (see below). My question is, will it work with the factory front sight? It looks like because it sits on and angled ramp that there would be plenty of adjustment, just not sure??
 
Williams WGRS-H&R Guide Receiver Peep Sight H&R 158, 258 Topper Single Shot Rifles, Ruger Mark II Aluminum Black
 
http://media.midwayusa.com/productimages/880x660/primary/698/698217.jpg

[quickdtoo]

The WGRS peep needs a taller front sight since it sits on the chamber swell which is well above the barrel sight position, see Peep and Firesights in the FAQs for specific front sight needs for your 45-70 as well as the current 223 Superlight thread which is related.

Tim

[dlhumphrey]

Yea,
I was afraind you would say that. I have looked at the Peep and Firesights section and am even more confused. Trying to figure out what I need for a front sight is beyond me. Guess I will stick with the scope.
 
Thanks

[quickdtoo]

The shorty ramp and firesight Midway links in the Peep and Firesights discussion are the exact combination I used with the WGRS on one of my 45-70 Handis, the one in the pic.  Target below was shot at 100yds with 28gr 2400 under a 350gr Hornady RN, sight was adjusted after shot #2 and #3.

Tim

[dlhumphrey]

So we are talking the followimng three items (rear sight, front ramp, fire sight insert)
 
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=698217
 
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=570364
 
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=292636
 
 

[gcrank1]

My eyes are certainly not what they once were (memory isnt what I remember it being either  ), bifocals, astigmatism, floaters, etc. so I know what you mean. Peeps work fairly well now, though the rear hole appears egg shaped, not round, and I can still score reasonably good. The oft repeated 30% better groups with peep than open sights is as good a guess as any. But when I really want to see (pun intended) what the rifle or ammo is capable of, I use a scope. I have a few that I put scopes on intending to 'work 'em out' and then switch to iron sights, but the scopes have stayed on. I think that once you settle on a scope/ring/height combo you like that you will be pleased.
Remember, if you cant see it, you cant hit it! 

[quickdtoo]

So we are talking the followimng three items (rear sight, front ramp, fire sight insert)
 
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=698217
 
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=570364
 
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=292636

Bingo!  Be aware of the different front sight mounting screw sizes, if t'were mine with the #3 mounting hole, I'd either drill and tap it to 6-48 or at least add some Loctite Black Max to secure it with the factory #3 screw.

But as gcrank says, a scope is a better choice for old eyes, being 65 I'll only hunt with a peep scope given a choice, I've used that same combination on my 44 mag and now on my Huntsman, optics aren't an option during muzzleloader seasons here.  See the low profile hammer mods in the FAQs which allow use of scopes that aren't Handi friendly, IE large ocular bell and/or power rings, fixed power scopes help.

Tim

[dlhumphrey]

I thank you folks for all the input.
At this point I am going to continue with the scope project. I am going to try some high or extra high rings in place of the see through. Also going to try the weaver # 82 base mod and cut another slot so that I can move the scope rearward about an inch. I’ll try this before I give up on the scope as I really do need to compensate for deteriorating eye sight. I might also try the Bushnell shot gun scope for the added (6") eye relief. That way I wouldn't have to move the scope rearward. Thanks again, you all have been very helpful.

[quickdtoo]

The Weaver 82 is a poor choice because that silly flat spot effectiving making the rear 1" useless for the rear ring to be mounted as far back as possible, the factory base or any of the others are far better in that respect. That flat spot is nice for mounting a low power shotgun scope ahead of the hammer in low rings tho. 

Tim

[gcrank1]

FWIW, on the 82 you can locate the rear ring crossbolt in the 'cutout' butted up against the forward edge, you dont have to use the much farther forward slot. The rifle/scope recoil is rearward thus the crossbolt inertial load is forward.
I wish they would just put another set of holes in the other end so we could use it either way  .

[dlhumphrey]

Thanks gcrank1.
I cut another slot in the mount (used the table saw) and now can move the scope rearward. I will remember the trick you mentioned about the "cutout" if I need to go further. As it is, I think it will be about right. All I have to do now is get some lower rings (lower than the see throughs) and I should be set.
 
Thanks again to all for the help. Greatley appreciated.