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Author Topic: Obeservations on new .45-70  (Read 2298 times)

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Offline geezerbiker

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Obeservations on new .45-70
« on: January 21, 2013, 12:15:01 PM »
First off I have to say if all the new H&R's are this nice, they've been listening to our complaints and got their sh*t together.  The fit and finish is better than any other Handi I've handled and the trigger is far better.  I'm hopping I didn't get lucky because I want to by one more Handi this year...

I want to put a Lyman target knob rear sight on it and from the looks of the sights, I shouldn't have to change the front sight.  The front sight is 2x as high as the one on my old .44 barrel and the rear sight looked like it sits up as high as a the Lyman peep I want.  Anyone here try the lyman sight with the factory front bade?

Tony
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Offline teleman

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2013, 12:36:12 PM »
Not sure if you can fit a Lyman but Skinner makes a nice aperture sight for a Handi
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Offline Drock15

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2013, 04:06:10 PM »
Just bought my first new handi!  45-70 with synthetic stock, like you said, the fit and finish are awesome.  Great little gun for $269!  Can't wait to knock down my first deer with it.  Thinking about mounting a 2-7x32 on mine, anyone else mounted one?
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2013, 05:24:35 PM »
Lay a straightedge across the top of the sights to see where the peep at low position will need to sit to get you the same -0-.
IIRC, the target knob Williams I had some years ago (ordered from H&R) had a higher low position than the basic model, but on the 38-55 TM I had no open rear to straightedge on. It worked out OK with my tall orig. globe for the target work at 100+ yd. that I used it for, though it would have needed to be a pretty tall gut-hook replacement front for a dovetailed sight (a ramp set up would have been nicer).
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2013, 06:17:59 PM »
I'll try that later tonight.  It sure would be nice if I didn't have to mess with the front sight. 

This rifle is a fun shooter for me and I doubt I'll try deer hunting with it.  On the other hand black tail hunting is so difficult, I'm about ready to give it up and focus on salmon fishing at that time of year.

Oregon has a special hunt for first time young hunters.  When my twin grandsons turn 12 and can go, I'll offer one of them the .45-70 with cast loads if they like it.  By that time I'll probably have a .223 super light that other one can use.

Tony
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Offline Ol BW

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2013, 07:45:17 PM »
 8) Blacktail hunting or Salmon fishing.  Decisions, decisions.  I wish I had problems like that Geezer!  ;D
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2013, 09:53:04 PM »
If it was white tail deer hunting the decision would be easy, deer.  Black tail deer are so elusive and nocturnal, it's hardly worth the effort.

I ran a straight edge over the sights and it looks like there is clearance for Lyman peep without changing the front sight.  When I have the cash, I'll order the sight and a bullet mold from Midway.  In the meantime I suppose all I can do is play with my new rifle...

Tony
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Offline Winter Hawk

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2013, 06:57:59 AM »
Tony,

Which sight is that from Lyman?  I was not aware that they had one to fit the H&R/NEF.  Or are you thinking of the Williams with target knobs?  If so, I had one on a .308 with a Remington 700 front ramp & sight.  It is an extractor barrel and I found that the peep got in the way of removing the cases with my fat little fingers.

-Kees-

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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2013, 07:30:10 AM »
Here's a thread from the FAQs Peep and Firesights link on the Williams FP-TK-H&R, Bernie has added the gib lock screw to make adjustments without a screwdriver. As WH said the sight hangs over the chamber making manual extraction a bit harder with gloves on, I had no problems at the range tho.

Tim

 http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,72579.msg446036.html#msg446036
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2013, 08:54:43 AM »
My mistake, yes I was referring the Williams sight.  For me it's a peep or a scope and I have too many scoped rifles already...

I put a peep on my model 94 Win and it made it like a different rifle.  I went from 6 to 8" groups to 3 to 4" groups.  Now it's well within minute of deer.  I'm hoping a peep will do the same for this rifle.

Tony
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2013, 06:24:05 PM »
I swung by Bi Mart the other day and pick up some fishing sinkers in preparation for slugging the bore on a few of my rifles and I just got around to doing it.  The .45-70 slugged out to .4565" and I cleaned it prior to slugging and the bore is so shiny that it looks like it was lapped. 

I can hardly wait to get some loads made up and get it out to the range.  I'll be awhile before I can get a peep put on it so I'll have to make do with the standard open rear sight.

Tony
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2013, 03:27:51 AM »
Even with a sub-.457 groove dia. if the chamber throat allows you to fit something like a .458 or more bullet in a fully fire-formed case neck you should probably do so for successful cast bullet shooting.
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2013, 06:59:58 AM »
I was thinking the same, .0005" oversize isn't enough for a tight seal with a lead bullet.  The Lee sizer for the .45-70 is .457 so I will have to go another rout or custom order one.  Either will have to wait as I'm going to be broke for a while.  :(

Tony
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Offline dlbarr

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2013, 09:53:28 AM »
I just had a buffalo classic 45/70 fitted to my HR, it came w/o sights. I installed the williams FP knob aperture on it and the Lyman 17 globe sight in .494" height. I cannot speak to the factory blade but I can tell you that the globe sight I got was too short - I should have got that sight in .582" height.
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2013, 11:03:36 AM »
Tony, it is not unusual to not have to size the cast bullets, but use them as cast. You can choose to 'pan-lube' them (if unfamiliar, Google it up) or use the Lee Liquid ALOX to 'tumble lube'. Im known to seat the base ring into the mouth of the fully fire-formed case mouth and smear some TC Bore Butter, or other soft lube on with a finger and seat 'em down. Its slow but effective. Were I you I wouldnt spend the money on a sizer (way too easy to have a drawer full of wrong size sizers) until I KNOW what size the gun really likes.
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We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
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12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2013, 10:38:43 PM »
I usually tumble lube in Alox but I'm getting serious about learning to paper patch.  I've been reading the old messages in the paper patching forum and they consistence seems to be to run them through a sizer die after patching.  I'll shoot a few and see how it does without sizing.  It's cheaper that way anyhow...

Tony
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Offline JimP.

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2013, 03:15:31 AM »
i had that sight on my handi, worked great,  took it off and added scope rail with Bushnell red dot using the small cross hair. now that works better for me. My handi luvs the Lee 500 gr bullet with 26  grs of aa5744.
JimP.
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Offline Norminator

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2013, 06:30:55 AM »
I put on a Williams rear sight and an NECG barrel band sight with hood on the front.
Looks good and works great.


Norm from Canuckistan
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2013, 08:50:34 AM »
My Williams target peep sight arrived yesterday but I was on my way to the city so I had to put it aside for later.  I got home at a quarter to 11 and by midnight I had it installed.  I was like a kid at Christmas.  It was a small box from Midway but it had all .45-70 goodies in it...

Anyway with the sight all the way down the original rear sight blocks the view to the front sight.  I don't think I'm going to have a problem with the front sight height...

Anyway now I need to get out and shoot it... 

BTW, any one here want the old rear sight?  Free + postage...

Tony
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2013, 11:40:37 AM »
I'll take it, Tony
Thanx  ;D
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"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline dlbarr

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2013, 12:20:20 PM »
Quote from: Winter Hawk on January 22, 2013, 06:57:59 AM
Tony,
 I had one on a .308 with a Remington 700 front ramp & sight.
-Kees-

Kees - is that Rem 700 front sight a simple bolt-on to the HR barrel? Or did you have to do some mods to it? Trying to decide what front sight to replace the factory sight with on mine....
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2013, 01:22:11 PM »
Quote from: gcrank1 on March 09, 2013, 11:40:37 AM
I'll take it, Tony
Thanx  ;D

It's yours...

One more observation.  My .45-70 was made in Gardner, MA.  I guess it was an old stock at that gun shop...

Tony
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Offline Winter Hawk

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2013, 04:48:27 PM »
Quote from: dlbarr on March 09, 2013, 12:20:20 PM
Kees - is that Rem 700 front sight a simple bolt-on to the HR barrel? Or did you have to do some mods to it? Trying to decide what front sight to replace the factory sight with on mine....

I had the barrel D&Ted for the Remington ramp.  This was on a barrel without factory sights.  The factory sights use one screw, the Remington takes two.

-Kees-
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Offline hoytcanon

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #23 on: March 09, 2013, 06:47:24 PM »
I think that you are on to something... a couple weeks back, my son and I were at the range with a batch of Handi's... I was shooting for awhile when I began to notice something... I gave my son two guns and told him to shoot two groups with each and give me his impressions... After the final shot he said; "the trigger on this one is much nicer." Which is exactly what I had noticed... the group we had were with stock triggers... the two with noticeably better triggers were purchased new in the fall of 2012... just a fluke??? 
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #24 on: March 09, 2013, 09:11:18 PM »
Here's a pic of the nearly completed project and the shotgun I snagged the stock from...



Later on I will sand the stock down for a smoother transition from steel to wood and refinish it to better show the grain  (this pic doesn't really do justice to the stock.)  Other than that, it's the way I want it...

Tony
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2013, 05:13:01 AM »
IIRC the muzzleloading supplies have 'grain enhancers' to make that grain 'pop' after you strip it. Maybe check out www.trackofthewolf.com ?
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"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2013, 06:00:33 AM »
Quote from: gcrank1 on March 10, 2013, 05:13:01 AM
IIRC the muzzleloading supplies have 'grain enhancers' to make that grain 'pop' after you strip it. Maybe check out www.trackofthewolf.com ?

That would be Aquafortis Reagent, good for Beech and Birch as well as maple.  ;)

Tim

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/categories/partdetail.aspx/1025/1/aquafort-2

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/pdfs/aquafortis.pdf
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Offline geezerbiker

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2013, 10:37:29 AM »
Thanx guy, I just ordered a bottle of that stuff.  I'm going to practice on my .223 since it's staining looks like crap and I don't want to do my .45-70 first.  Actually I expect I'll be shooting my .45-70 more than my other center-fire rifles this year so barring any unforeseen problems,  I'm going to wait for the end of the season to do any more work on it.

About the rear sight, I bought the target knob model so I wouldn't have to carry a screwdriver to adjust it but that's not the case.  The old Redfield peep I have on my Model 94 Winchester, all I need is a dime to adjust it and the peep on my Martini is finger adjust only...  I suppose they just don't make them like they used to...

Tony

 
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Offline gcrank1

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #28 on: March 10, 2013, 10:52:12 AM »
Well Tony, that Williams didnt cost near what a Lyman or Redfield does now either! I suspect you mean you need a small screwdriver to unlock the screws to adjust? Do they really need to be locked down?
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"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Obeservations on new .45-70
« Reply #29 on: March 10, 2013, 11:00:29 AM »
Order a knobbed Gib lock screw from Brownell's, there's a link with pic in the FAQs Peep and Firesights thread, then you can lock/unlock the elevation adjustment with no tools.

Tim

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,72579.msg446036.html#msg446036
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