Author Topic: Another "ScoutScope" Question (Read 987 times)

Jeff H · « **on:** March 10, 2013, 01:59:20 PM »

I've been through the FAQs a number of times and cannot figure out if anyone has found a scope base that works on the slender, lightweight barrels. From what I can tell, the ones others have done here have all been on the fatter barrels.

nanuk-O-dah-Nort · « **Reply #1 on:** March 11, 2013, 01:06:53 AM »

are you refering to scout style?

I thought all the barrels were same diameter at the breech

Jeff H · « **Reply #2 on:** March 11, 2013, 04:29:30 AM »

Yes, Scout-Scope mount, "forward mount,"...

The barrel on my .223 is very slender compared to other H&R/NEFs I have/have had. The chamber area has been the same on all of them but the rest of the barrel on my.223 is different. A traditionally mounted scope makes it handle somewhat less gracefully and most stocks are too long, making me crane my neck to get a good sight picture but the stock on this one is so short that I have to hold my cheek way back on the stock - very unnaturally. The forward mount solves either issue in addition to having other benefits I have come to appreciate on my short to medium range rifles.

This little .223 shoots cast 50 grain Ranch Dog Outdoors bullets extremely well and this will be a short to medium range rifle using those exclusively.

Like this:

rdlange · « **Reply #3 on:** March 11, 2013, 07:41:51 AM »

there was an earlier post about using a TC contender mount in the mid barrel sight holes on a handi barrel, and showed a Bushnell Phantom II scope on a 44 mag I think. Also below...

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,109692.msg1098329101.html#msg1098329101

Still collecting parts to give it a try.

Jeff H · « **Reply #4 on:** March 11, 2013, 08:44:31 AM »

Quote from: rdlange on March 11, 2013, 07:41:51 AM

there was an earlier post about using a TC contender mount in the mid barrel sight holes on a handi barrel, and showed a Bushnell Phantom II scope on a 44 mag I think. Also below...

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,109692.msg1098329101.html#msg1098329101

Still collecting parts to give it a try.

Thanks. I've been through that thread a number of times and it seems all have been done on the fatter barrels.
I have used the Bantam Contender mount on the reciever of a Ruger Standard Auto and Weaver Contender bases on the next to the last step on a Swedish M96/M38 and I am certain a Weaver Contender base will work on the beefier H&R barrels, but the barrel I have is much more slender.

For comparison, my .357 Max barrel is pretty stout at .907" diameter at the forearm stud.

My .223 barrel is only .718" at that same point, which also coincides with the location of the rear sight. I did not remove the forearm from the .223 but am farily certain I got 180 degrees apart on the contact points of the calipers. If not quite, it's pretty close and significantly smaller than the .357 barrel.

So, from all the nformation I have seen here to date, it seems as though Contender bases on Handi barrels has been on the beefier Handi barrels and not the slender Youth or Superlight models.

If anyone has done a barrel-mount scope on one of the skinny barrels, I'm missing it.

Catshooter45 · « **Reply #5 on:** March 11, 2013, 12:25:49 PM »

Jeff,

I've mounted a scout scope rail on my old skinny style .30-30. Barrel can't be any larger than yours and the hole in the center is bigger. I've fired several hundred rounds through it from very light to full.

What's your question? A .718 barrel minus .225 (bore) divided by two equals a barrel wall thickness of .246 and in my book that would be plenty for drilling and tapping. I used four 8x40 screws and used both a taper and a plug tap to get the threads as deep as possible. Once you have the same depth of threads as the screw diameter you're as strong as that screw will attach (as long as the materials are all equal).

Cat

spruce · « **Reply #6 on:** March 11, 2013, 12:33:33 PM »

I think what the OP is asking is whether or not the Contender base and the slim profile barrel will match up in contour? And if not, what base would have the correct contour.

Catshooter45 · « **Reply #7 on:** March 11, 2013, 12:44:52 PM »

Oh nuts. Sorry, I cant help with that question at all.

Cat

rdlange · « **Reply #8 on:** March 11, 2013, 12:55:27 PM »

Measured a contender barrel - about .825.

Jeff H · « **Reply #9 on:** March 11, 2013, 01:39:09 PM »

Guys, I certainly appreciate all the effort but it's apparent that I did not describe the problem very well.

The barrel I want to mount a pistol scope on is a Synthetic Youth, which has a very slender barrel in comparison to the "normal" barrel profile. Several people have posted that they have mounted Contender bases on the normal barrels but I was trying to determine if anyone has found a base that would fit on the slender barrels. The Contender base would have too large a radius to mount on my skinny barrel.

Ten Ring · « **Reply #10 on:** March 11, 2013, 01:42:21 PM »

That's pretty easy to fix if you have the time and some sandpaper, Ive done several.

Jeff H · « **Reply #11 on:** March 15, 2013, 07:14:52 PM »

Quote from: Ten Ring on March 11, 2013, 01:42:21 PM

That's pretty easy to fix if you have the time and some sandpaper, Ive done several.

Going from a smaller radius'd base to a larger radius'd reciever/barrel, I wouldn't hesitate, but not the other way around.

I'd end up with it shooting off to one side, in the dirt or with one of those tapered bases the long-range boys use when they run out of elevation on their scope adjustment. More likely, it would shoot both high and right or low/left - who knows?

I found a post on an optics site where someone posted an old Weaver base dimension chart that shows the radii of the bottoms of the bases. I may find something using that. Hopefully a one-piece.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #12 on:** March 16, 2013, 01:35:05 AM »

Why not simetalized bedding or liquid aluminum or even simply ''MAKE'' the radius correct? First mount the base you want and build up a ''dam'' and fill with a liquid metal. Say liquid aluminum. For that matter It dosent need to be metal bedding compound.

CW

Ten Ring · « **Reply #13 on:** March 16, 2013, 02:08:23 AM »

Where there is a will there is a way.

Jeff H · « **Reply #14 on:** March 16, 2013, 03:12:34 AM »

Quote from: Ten Ring on March 16, 2013, 02:08:23 AM

Where there is a will there is a way.

Hey, I have the remote tail switch on a weapon light duct-taped to the forearm - and it's not even a blacl plastic forearm!

CW, that's not even close to being ruled out - it's part of the plan. I want to exhaust all possible resources on the base and have the best closest fit possible before doing any sanding, shimming or bedding. Even if I find one that fits perfectly at the back, it will still need shimming and/or bedding at the front. It's just kind of cool to find a part that fits something it's not made for too.

Jeff H · « **Reply #15 on:** March 16, 2013, 05:56:04 AM »

From what I have gathered so far, the Weaver #21 base (this is one short base from a two=piece set) has a mounting diameter of .710".

Right at the middle of my rear sight, I measure .713".

Weaver's base #22 has a mounting diameter of .700". Either would work or maybe both, depending on the amount of taper in the barrel between the two, but I think it's more than the difference between the two. I think it woul dbe best to buy four of the same base so when (not if) I screw one up, it won't matter which one I screw up.

I am not thrilled about having to use two bases but I am going to think about this for a while and decide which way to go.

If I could hold everything still, re-center a scope and mount rings and bases to the scope, then shim, glue, tape, rubber-bad it to the barrel and bore sight it before the "glue" sets (silicone caulk works very well) and then gently remove the rings/scope, I could spot the holes. I have access to a scope ring reamer and lap but have never tried it on the Weaver rings with the steel top strap (my personal preference) so, I would possibly another type of ring so the reamer is not trying to cut two materials with different properties at once. I can deal with steel, I can deal with amuminum, but I don't know if I would try both at the same time on either side of a hole. I used some lightweight Warne aluminum rings on my CZ 452 with which I have been pleased so maybe I will look at them.

This may never materialize because I have to find time to do it, but I shot it with some cast 50 grain FPs over a starting charge of Unique yesterday and it's just the neatest little rifle, so I have some incentive to not get bored with the dream and then sell it. I have had a couple opportunities to move it lately and I decided not to, so the project has some hope. The easier it is, the more likely it will get done and a one-piece base would have sealed the deal. I am NOT ruling out any other ideas at the moment, in fact, I have to measure the barrel on the Rossi pictured above and see if maybe that base might not be the one. That just occured to me.

However this works out, I will share here. I have had horrible trouible with this site lately - taking up to seven minutes to load a page, so be patient. I won't be posting minute-by-minute. No other site I have been to does this and I have not figured it out yet.

Winter Hawk · « **Reply #16 on:** March 17, 2013, 02:54:11 AM »

Maybe Catshooter45 can tell what mounts he used?

-Kees-

cwlongshot · « **Reply #17 on:** March 17, 2013, 03:05:31 AM »

I mounted a Aimpoint on black powder barrel with a single Weaver base. Using factory threaded rear site holes. Sorry I do not remember the base number. I used one ring as the Aimpoint was short. This would work OK for small est scopes not so good for lone or even std length models.

I also used it on a long Weaver base mounted all the way forward.

CW

Jeff H · « **Reply #18 on:** March 17, 2013, 04:55:48 AM »

Winterhawk,
I will see if I can find what Catshooter did. May PM him if I can get a chance today. Thanks!

CW,
You got me to thinking now. I read years ago about a fella (famous writer) who mounted a scope on a Charter Pathfinder with one ring. That gun belongs to one of the Quinn boys now and I spoke briefly with A. K. Church once about the same setup once. Seems it worked well enough. The scope I have in mind is about 8" long and I would worry it would be vulnerable to torsion with the extra radius, BUT, maybe if I mount one of the regular H&R bases over the chamber and a singlle base at the rear sight holes - that may put the front end of the rear (long base - the one that came with the rifle) about where a rear ring needs to be and the short base abouit where the fron ring needs to be. I can cut slots anywhere I want or drill new holes too. Hmmmmmm.....

I appreciate the help, guys - a bunch. It's back to school tomorrow and the last half of the spring semester is always a booger, so I may get no farther than this until mid-May - when the grass starts growing and the garden needs planting and the.....

We'll get something figured out. With the cost and scarcity of powder, primers and projectiles right now, lead cast in that little .223 is going to be what I likely spend the most time with this summer, so I need to get it worked out.

Catshooter45 · « **Reply #19 on:** March 17, 2013, 11:01:01 AM »

Oh Lord. The base I used. Well, I'm pretty sure that I just picked a base outa my grab bag of scope rails/bases/rings. I'll look but I'm pretty sure I've no idea the number. I'll get back to y'all.

Cat

Jeff H · « **Reply #20 on:** March 17, 2013, 03:15:13 PM »

Quote from: Catshooter45 on March 17, 2013, 11:01:01 AM

Oh Lord. The base I used. Well, I'm pretty sure that I just picked a base outa my grab bag of scope rails/bases/rings. I'll look but I'm pretty sure I've no idea the number. I'll get back to y'all.

Cat

Thanks, Cat'.

You shoulda bought a lottery ticket that day!

hoytcanon · « **Reply #21 on:** March 17, 2013, 03:50:58 PM »

Short on time... didn't read the whole thread, so this may have been said... "shim it."

blind ear · « **Reply #22 on:** March 17, 2013, 05:16:50 PM »

If you don't find a fit do what CW said and dam it. ear