Author Topic: .357 Handi groove diameter  (Read 805 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dh260

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9
.357 Handi groove diameter
« on: April 01, 2013, 06:21:12 AM »
Hav any of y'all slugged your Handi .357 barrels? I picked up a slug I had pushed thru mine when I first got it (over a year ago)
and remeasured the slug. To my surprise it shows a groove dia. of .355! I WILL slug it again. Just wondered what others may have found theirs to be. Thanks

Offline gcrank1

  • Trade Count: (24)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7644
  • Gender: Male
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2013, 06:33:00 AM »
A lot depends on just where that .355 is in the barrel. Ideally it will be at the muzzle. I want the biggest dia. at the chamber throat.
"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43301
  • Gender: Male
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2013, 06:59:50 AM »
Slug it near the muzzle from the muzzle, and do another near the throat and see whatcha get, a slug pushed all the way thru the bore will only reveal the tightest part of the bore which on H&Rs is near the throat where the barrel outside diameter is larger, I've slugged a bunch, although I don't recollect doing a 357mag, all are ~.0005" more open at the muzzle because barrels aren't stress relieved before they're turned to contour which allows the thinner section of the barrel to relax a bit and the bore open a little.

Tim
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline Dinny

  • Moderators
  • Trade Count: (268)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5524
  • Gender: Male
  • "Medics Save"
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2013, 07:13:59 PM »
Tim,
  That sounds like another good reason to make our Handis shorter. :)

Thanks, Dinny
Handi Family: 357 Max, 45 LC, 45-70, 300 BLK, 50 cal Huntsman, and 348 Win.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day that my child may have peace"
Thomas Paine

Offline quickdtoo

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (149)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43301
  • Gender: Male
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2013, 08:13:55 PM »
 ;D
"Always do right, this will gratify some and astonish the rest" -  Mark Twain

Offline theratdog

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 405
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2013, 09:17:15 PM »
my first 357 handy measured 357 would not shoot that good sent it back for replacement i haven't measured the new one but it shoots great .lead real good.i tryed all the fixes on the first barrel to avail. :)

Offline nanuk-O-dah-Nort

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 701
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2013, 03:24:10 AM »
I think I'm going to have to slug my bores... 

now you guys got me thinking.

I sure noticed the restriction at the welded lug on my 45/70's

also, I'm going to shorten one of my 357's    shortest we can go is 18".   I'll practice on a spare used barrel I have first!.

Offline dh260

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2013, 04:13:58 AM »
I drove the slug from the throat just into the rifling. I remember doing it (slugging) as that is the first thing I do with any rifle I may shoot lead through but apparently put it out of my mind. Saw the slug on the shelf and measured it. Must be the one from the .357 Handi as that is the only ".35" barrel I have but I can't fathom that groove diameter being correct at the leade of the rifling. Guess I better do it over and record the results. I will also slug at the muzzle. Jacketed bullets are dumb but even hard lead alloys don't like bigger muzzles. There are tricks tho...

Offline gcrank1

  • Trade Count: (24)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7644
  • Gender: Male
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2013, 04:37:10 AM »
I used to slug and record all that. For some time now I clean a bore, visually check the rifling, and fire form some brass in it. I fit as large a dia. cast bullet into the fully fire-formed case mouth as comfortably fits and shoot it for results. This methodology has worked (as in, shoots lead well) on every gun I have used it on (as long as the bore is decent); YMMV but try it and tell me so.
My objective was to get guns shooting lead where I was looking without a bunch of messing about. If the lead fills the case mouth it will fill the all important throat as well as possible, thus minimizing blow-by and gas cutting, swage down to the barrel (whatever it is) then down & out.
I take no credit for developing this method; it has been used for years by others and I am glad I found it.
"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974

Offline cudatruck

  • Trade Count: (25)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 680
  • Gender: Male
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2013, 05:38:33 AM »
Gcrank1, i really like the method, one issue... how to aquire all the needed sizer dies and or molds. where do you start? what would you buy? custom molds and dies? how would a guy do this from the start without goin broke?

Offline gcrank1

  • Trade Count: (24)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7644
  • Gender: Male
Re: .357 Handi groove diameter
« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2013, 08:59:08 AM »
I have the advantage of having spent the small fortune.....short that you do the following and be smarter than I was.
Fire form the brass, this can be by actually shooting a couple of correct cal. rounds you have.
Do NOT resize these cases, save for reference and use a belling die or even the rounded back of a nicely fitting needle-nose pliers to roll any residual crimp out of the case mouth. This only needs to be enough to be sure it is not rolled in even a tad.
Now trial fit whatever bullet dia.'s you have on hand,; most likely any jacketed sizes for caliber will 'fall right in'. Since they are pretty uniform and standard for caliber you now know quite a lot, but mostly that your cast bullets need to be 'bigger'. Many commercial cast bullets are bigger than jacketed but still may not be big enough., and to know what size you really bought you need to measure them, not just depend upon what the package says. I shoot quite a lot of 'as cast 'dia. bullets, not sized at all, because they fit the case mouth decently. Note here: if a bullet takes too much to fit them into the case mouth the upsizing of the brass will likely cause hard chambering and/or difficult extraction/ejection. Then you know that dia. is too big.
I like a snuggish 'finger fit' into the case mouth, or even lightly using the press to seat, as long as it will extract. As you can tell, this takes a little futzing about, but is really quite intuitive and simple.
But, you may ask, what if I have nothing to trial fit? Take anything cylindrical that you have about, and try the fit. This will give you a 'plug' to measure. If nothing fits, take a common hardware store dowel, cut a short length and chuck it in your electric drill or drill press and file it's dia. until you get that fit. Once you have it you are ever so much closer to picking a proper size bullet from the offerings. It is nice to try some actual bullets, and some companies will send you some samples, say .357, 358, and 359. Other than that, you will need to ante up for a mould and pick a sizer. I would almost say pick one a thou' smaller than you think you need because it isnt hard to lapp one out a tad to perfect and/or there are some manufacturing tolerances meaning the one you get may be a tad bigger than you need (say a .359 that ends up being .3595 or .360; it has happened).
FWIW, I happen to really like the Lee Push Through Sizing Die set up. It comes with some 'tumble lube' too. The fancy Lyman and RCBS are too rich for me anymore unless used on a G.S. table. Lee will also do custom sizes for a small additional fee.
"Halt while I adjust my accoutrements!"
      ><   ->
We are only temporary caretakers of the past heading toward an uncertain future
22Mag UV / 22LR  Sportster
357Mag Schuetzen Special
45-70  SS Ultra Hunter with UV cin.lam. wood
12ga. 'Ol' Ugly OverKill', Buck barrel c/w  SpeedStock  and swap 28" x Full bird barrel, 1974